Bombarded With Virtual Church Meetings

[Ginger Snaps]

12 hours ago, Calm said:

I thought the announcement included discouraging trying to replicate the Sunday Church experience.

I think this varies by area. Our area authority specifically instructed us not to try to replicate church meetings online. But I know from some Facebook groups I belong to that members in other areas are very much doing so. 
 

We also happen to live in a very geographically large ward with members spread out and lots of rural area. Not everyone has reliable internet access, and a good chunk of the membership is elderly and not tech-savvy. We are pushing CFM and digital/phone ministering. 

[HappyJackWagon]

15 hours ago, amo said:

About a week after all church public meetings were suspended due to COVID-19, a new trend has seen the light in many of the units of my stake: VIRTUAL church meetings.

These meetings, according to one of the bishops who implemented them in his ward, are meant “to help individuals be fed by the good word of God”, and are part of a block of 2 Sunday meetings—a devotional by the bishopric (40 mnts.), followed by a Sunday school, priesthood or Relief Society meeting (40 mnts.)

Now, add to this newly born virtual block of Sunday meetings a weekly bishopric meeting, a biweekly WC meeting and a few other board meetings and the result is a real virtual church meeting bombarding… 🤪

 

How about in your units, are you getting bombarded as well ?  😁

 

Amo

We are experiencing absolute radio silence from church. There is nothing going on.

While there are some benefits to that, it's also somewhat unimpressive to me that local leaders have done so little to reach out and engage the membership in my area.

[Boanerges]

2 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

We are asked to report the number of people taking the sacrament in home each week.

 

 

Interesting. The Sunday before Conference we were instructed to no longer take the sacrament to anyone. We can continue to bless it in our homes with our immediate families but not invite others or take it to others. Prior to this we were encouraged to take the sacrament to or invite to our homes people who did not have the priesthood in the home. We were never asked to report.

[Boanerges]

28 minutes ago, Ginger Snaps said:

I think this varies by area. Our area authority specifically instructed us not to try to replicate church meetings online. But I know from some Facebook groups I belong to that members in other areas are very much doing so. 
 

We also happen to live in a very geographically large ward with members spread out and lots of rural area. Not everyone has reliable internet access, and a good chunk of the membership is elderly and not tech-savvy. We are pushing CFM and digital/phone ministering. 

Very much like what is happening in my area, and our ward is also rural with some areas having unreliable or non-existent internet and some members not having the tech or tech savvy. We have been encouraged to study and worship  at home.

[Mayor Defacto]

I had a virtual "Come, Follow Me," a virtual missionary lesson, and a virtual Family Home Evening last Monday. It was a bit excessive!

[Scott Lloyd]

On 4/15/2020 at 11:29 PM, amo said:

About a week after all church public meetings were suspended due to COVID-19, a new trend has seen the light in many of the units of my stake: VIRTUAL church meetings.

These meetings, according to one of the bishops who implemented them in his ward, are meant “to help individuals be fed by the good word of God”, and are part of a block of 2 Sunday meetings—a devotional by the bishopric (40 mnts.), followed by a Sunday school, priesthood or Relief Society meeting (40 mnts.)

Now, add to this newly born virtual block of Sunday meetings a weekly bishopric meeting, a biweekly WC meeting and a few other board meetings and the result is a real virtual church meeting bombarding… 🤪

 

How about in your units, are you getting bombarded as well ?  😁

 

Amo

Blessedly, we have not seen such heavy-handedness in our ward. I'm in high hopes we won't. We are doing just fine with our home-centered sabbath worship. We don't even have to be without the weekly sacrament administration, thanks to the authorization by our key holder, the bishop, to exercise our authority to administer the sacrament at home.

Edited to add: We do receive a very occasional inspirational message from our bishop via email. And, as a temple ordinance worker, I have received a few encouraging emails from our temple leadership. 

Though our bishop has not required it, I do report back to him weekly on the administration of the sacrament in our home, and he always graciously responds. It helps me to feel connected.

Edited April 18, 2020 by Scott Lloyd

[alter idem]

Our stake has not tried to micromanage us with virtual meetings, ours' is all in our home, which some may not like but I do.  I'm happy to use this opportunity to see how home church works. Given the pandemic lockdown, I think this was what the home church program was put in place for.

[amo]

23 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

Yes, I'm absolutely certain there are no mandatory meetings in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.  ...

To that statement I asked you :

 

" You sure about this (bold)...? 

"Mmm, could you get a temple recommend if you voluntarily didn't attend your meetings for a year...?"

 

And you haven't answered yet...

[amo]

20 hours ago, Boanerges said:

...We have been encouraged to study and worship  at home.

Indeed, and the timing couldn't have been better...!

[rongo]

1 hour ago, alter idem said:

Our stake has not tried to micromanage us with virtual meetings, ours' is all in our home, which some may not like but I do.  I'm happy to use this opportunity to see how home church works. Given the pandemic lockdown, I think this was what the home church program was put in place for.

We also have a laissez faire, non-regulated ward and stake, which I really appreciate. No online public meetings at all. We're just enjoying our home church.  The kids do have a weekly seminary Canvas meeting. 

Unfortunately, I think we need to settle in for a long lockdown as far as church goes. President Trump's guidelines for reopening see phase one as allowing groups of up to 10, phase two groups up to 50, and then phase three what we would consider church (a full ward with meetings). This probably won't happen until at least June, even in states like Utah and Arizona that aren't hard-hit. I'm certain that the Church (rightly) won't open full public meetings before the government okays it. 

[amo]

23 hours ago, juliann said:

Find it, there is official instruction to not replicate Sunday meetings. 

I have done my homework but to no avail, yet... Could you enlighten us, pls, and tell us what "official instruction" you have in mind  ?

Thx

[alter idem]

27 minutes ago, amo said:

I have done my homework but to no avail, yet... Could you enlighten us, pls, and tell us what "official instruction" you have in mind  ?

Thx

It was also my understanding that we were not to try to replicate church meetings. If you go back to the first guidelines that were put out, it was probably there.  When I suggested 'talks' in our home church my husband pointed out this directive, so I know he read it too.   It was likely from our bishop's or Stake Pres. email (we were authorized to have Sacrament in our homes each week) and I assume they got the directive from the area authority or 70 who is over our area.

[Rain]

1 hour ago, alter idem said:

It was also my understanding that we were not to try to replicate church meetings. If you go back to the first guidelines that were put out, it was probably there.  When I suggested 'talks' in our home church my husband pointed out this directive, so I know he read it too.   It was likely from our bishop's or Stake Pres. email (we were authorized to have Sacrament in our homes each week) and I assume they got the directive from the area authority or 70 who is over our area.

This was not instruction that we got.  We've heard nothing about this from our bishop or stake president.  As for our wider area - @rongo have you heard something that come from the area authority?

Edited April 17, 2020 by Rain

[alter idem]

23 minutes ago, Rain said:

This was not instruction that we got.  We've heard nothing about this from our bishop or stake president.  As for our wider area - @rongo have you heard something that come from the area authority?

This is what we got from our Stake Pres. March 12:

Quote

May we suggest that you consider having a home based worship service.  Many may choose to have this on Sunday at 10:00 AM when we would have otherwise been gathered together.  You may choose to begin with a song and prayer.  And, if you have a Melchizedek Priesthood holder or a Priest in the Aaronic Priesthood, we are pleased to authorize you to prepare, bless and pass the Sacrament in your home this Sunday.  Gospel study may follow and then be concluded with a closing song and prayer.

And this on Mar 21 from our Bishop;

Quote

As your bishop, during this period of time, I have authorized worthy priesthood bearers to prepare, bless and administer the sacrament, only on the Sabbath, to their families and for ministering brothers to do so for those who do not have worthy priesthood bearers in the home. Please remember that the sacrament is a very sacred ordinance and should be treated as such. As you prepare for the Sabbath and the sacrament tomorrow, I wanted to share important direction that I received from Elder Michael Dunn of the Seventy. 

“Under the direction of the bishop, worthy priesthood bearers can prepare, bless and administer the sacrament to their families. For those who do not have worthy priesthood bearers in their homes, bishops can reach out to ministering brothers or others for assistance. We have not suggested that Aaronic Priesthood bearers be organized in an expansive way as we want them to be with their families and we do not want elaborate systems to be created to take the sacrament to ward members. 

The pattern for administering the sacrament should follow what we always do in church meetings (kneeling to offer the prayers, using the standard wording, breaking of the bread, etc.). We are not suggesting that cups and trays be distributed to homes. They can use a simple plate and cups that they already have in their homes. The sacrament should be administered at least once a month, and no more than once a week, always on Sundays. Members should not gather in large groups. We are suggesting that YSA wards not gather in groups larger than a family home evening group (max around 20), yet prefer that it be in smaller settings and not in more than one apartment complex, always under the direction and delegation of their bishops. 

Finally, the sacrament should not be part of meeting or other activity. It should be a stand- alone ordinance, simple and sacred. We have approved that families start with a family prayer, singing of a sacramental hymn, and then the ordinance. We worry if there is a closing hymn and prayer as that start to look like a meeting and before long, we might have sacrament meetings being held in multiple locations in the ward. Remember, this is a temporary solution. Once the suspension of Sunday meetings is lifted, we want members to return chapels to partake of the sacrament.” 

"We worry if there is a closing hymn and prayer as that start to look like a meeting and before long, we might have sacrament meetings held in multiple locations in the ward. Remember t his is a temporary solution'.  I believe this is the part that suggested we not follow the standard program for a Sacrament meeting.  As you can see, we were given good instructions to know what to do, IMO.  We've been following these instructions for the past month.

[amo]

3 minutes ago, alter idem said:

This is what we got from our Stake Pres. March 12:

And this on Mar 21 from our Bishop;

"We worry if there is a closing hymn and prayer as that start to look like a meeting and before long, we might have sacrament meetings held in multiple locations in the ward. Remember t his is a temporary solution'.  I believe this is the part that suggested we not follow the standard program for a Sacrament meeting.  As you can see, we were given good instructions to know what to do, IMO.  We've been following these instructions for the past month.

Thx, alter idem, but it doesn't say  anything about what's going on in some units in my stake, I'm talking about Sunday virtual church meetings...

[bluebell]

2 hours ago, alter idem said:

It was also my understanding that we were not to try to replicate church meetings. If you go back to the first guidelines that were put out, it was probably there.  When I suggested 'talks' in our home church my husband pointed out this directive, so I know he read it too.   It was likely from our bishop's or Stake Pres. email (we were authorized to have Sacrament in our homes each week) and I assume they got the directive from the area authority or 70 who is over our area.

We got the same guidance from our area authority—that it was inappropriate to try to replicate a sacrament meeting at home. 

[alter idem]

21 minutes ago, amo said:

Thx, alter idem, but it doesn't say  anything about what's going on in some units in my stake, I'm talking about Sunday virtual church meetings...

I was responding to Rain, my stake does not do virtual church meetings, so I can't help you with that.  Personally, I feel that our home meetings have been very spiritual in nature.  I don't know how the virtual meetings would be.  I suppose your stake was authorized to do so.

[alter idem]

8 minutes ago, alter idem said:

I was responding to Rain, my stake does not do virtual church meetings, so I can't help you with that.  Personally, I feel that our home meetings have been very spiritual in nature.  I don't know how the virtual meetings would be.  I suppose your stake was authorized to do so.

I think  the problem is that your stake is doing 'virtual sunday meetings' and my stake is doing home church, we are having no virtual meetings.  So, what I shared the instructions given from Elder Michael Dunn of the 70 and he did say we should avoid following the sacrament meeting pattern, as some said.  Did your stake share with you the instructions they received?  If not, maybe you could ask them if they were given instructions on how to do their virtual meetings, or did they come up with these on their own?  I'm curious about that, anyway.

Edited April 17, 2020 by alter idem

[Calm]

4 hours ago, amo said:

I have done my homework but to no avail, yet... Could you enlighten us, pls, and tell us what "official instruction" you have in mind  ?

Thx

I have seen several bishops as well as others report this is what they were told by their area authority through their SP.  therefore it may not be consistent throughout the Church as any one of those levels could be adding to instructions from SL to withhold stuff or interpreting them in such a way to allow stuff that SL would prefer not to allow.  A problem with any sort of centralized authority, there are many ways this increases continuity between local units but unless they start coming down hard, locals do things their own way in many areas.  It is that way with governments, businesses, churches...any large human organization I would guess.

Edited April 17, 2020 by Calm

[Rain]

1 hour ago, alter idem said:

This is what we got from our Stake Pres. March 12:

And this on Mar 21 from our Bishop;

"We worry if there is a closing hymn and prayer as that start to look like a meeting and before long, we might have sacrament meetings held in multiple locations in the ward. Remember t his is a temporary solution'.  I believe this is the part that suggested we not follow the standard program for a Sacrament meeting.  As you can see, we were given good instructions to know what to do, IMO.  We've been following these instructions for the past month.

Michael Dunn is not over my area (at least from what I can find - it may have changed).  That's why I asked rongo if he knew anything because rongo lives in my area. 

[alter idem]

19 minutes ago, Calm said:

I have seen several bishops as well as others report this is what they were told by their area authority through their SP.  therefore it may not be consistent throughout the Church as any one of those levels could be adding to instructions from SL or interpreting them in such a way to allow stuff that SL would prefer not to allow.  A problem with any sort of centralized authority, there are many ways this increases continuity between local units but unless they start coming down hard, locals do things their own way in many areas.  It is that way with governments, businesses, churches...any large human organization I would guess.

I agree.  The only one I know of in this area that was attempting virtual meetings was a singles ward, and my nephew said that was the idea of the Bishop of their ward.  He wanted to do home church with his family, but the Bishop was trying to put together virtual meetings, which, because of his calling, would be obliged to participate in.  I'm just curious if the virtual meetings  others are talking about were an option or if they were the idea of local Bishops and Stake Presidents.  At least from what my nephew said, I gather the virtual meetings in his ward were the idea of local leaders.  

[Rain]

10 minutes ago, alter idem said:

I agree.  The only one I know of in this area that was attempting virtual meetings was a singles ward, and my nephew said that was the idea of the Bishop of their ward.  He wanted to do home church with his family, but the Bishop was trying to put together virtual meetings, which, because of his calling, would be obliged to participate in.  I'm just curious if the virtual meetings  others are talking about were an option or if they were the idea of local Bishops and Stake Presidents.  At least from what my nephew said, I gather the virtual meetings in his ward were the idea of local leaders.  

The one for our ward was from our bishop, but I know he talked to the SP about it.

[rongo]

39 minutes ago, Rain said:

Michael Dunn is not over my area (at least from what I can find - it may have changed).  That's why I asked rongo if he knew anything because rongo lives in my area. 

It's totally a matter of leader roulette/local area leadership; there is no central directive from Salt Lake on this. 

We've actually enjoyed having talks, lessons, etc. as a family, but we aren't judging others who aren't doing this. I'm surprised that some area authorities took it upon themselves to expand and add the "don't replicate" language, but it's fine. That happens in the Church sometimes . . .  

[Scott Lloyd]

7 hours ago, Rain said:

This was not instruction that we got.  We've heard nothing about this from our bishop or stake president.  As for our wider area - @rongo have you heard something that come from the area authority?

Area Seventy. 

[Scott Lloyd]

On 4/15/2020 at 11:29 PM, amo said:

About a week after all church public meetings were suspended due to COVID-19, a new trend has seen the light in many of the units of my stake: VIRTUAL church meetings.

These meetings, according to one of the bishops who implemented them in his ward, are meant “to help individuals be fed by the good word of God”, and are part of a block of 2 Sunday meetings—a devotional by the bishopric (40 mnts.), followed by a Sunday school, priesthood or Relief Society meeting (40 mnts.)

Now, add to this newly born virtual block of Sunday meetings a weekly bishopric meeting, a biweekly WC meeting and a few other board meetings and the result is a real virtual church meeting bombarding… 🤪

 

How about in your units, are you getting bombarded as well ?  😁

 

Amo

Some folks don’t know when to stand down.