Good for you Pres. Nelson!

[Scott Lloyd]

12 minutes ago, ALarson said:

I guess this is making the rounds on FaceBook (it was emailed to me by a friend.....I don't have a FaceBook page).  I don't like the title of the video, but it is interesting to hear President Hinckley's words vs. President Nelson's.  I am making every effort to adhere to this request by our Prophet, but to be honest, I doubt it will catch on for those who are not active members (and even many of them will continue using the word Mormon or Mormons as an identity, IMO).

From Youtube:

 

Sounds like your intent to follow President Nelson’s instruction is rather grudging. 

By the way, the disrespect shown in this link title is quite offensive to me. Just so you know. 

[ALarson]

41 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

CFR.** Show us one instance in which “Newsroom” called it “the Mormon Church.” 

On the contrary, “Newsroom” for many years has carried a boilerplate style guide explicitly asking journalists and others NOT to call it “the Mormon church.”

** In case you are new here, CFR means “call for references.” It means you have to document a claim or assertion or withdraw it. It’s in the board guidelines that you must agree to as a condition for posting on this board. 

Here's a link where they refer to the church as "Latter-day Saint" and the members as "Mormons":

https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/what-to-expect-at-church-services

Here's a link where they state a "Mormon church building", "Mormon chapel" and "Mormon meetinghouses", and repeatedly refer to the members as "Mormons":

https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/what-you-will-find-when-you-step-inside-a-mormon-chapel

They link to an article in the Desert News where they use the Mormon Church" here:

https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/despite-challenges,-church-aid-reaching-needy--more-is-on-the-way

Here's a quote from this page on the Mormon Newsroom:

https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/members-of-the-church-part-of-the-fabric-of-texas

Quote

Disaster struck in duplicate during the 2005 hurricanes, Katrina and Rita. Members of the Mormon church, often identified by yellow “Helping Hands” shirts, convoyed on weekend work parties to the storm-damaged areas on the Gulf. A group of 160 volunteers from Beaumont, subsequently tagged as “The Get-R-Done Boys,” made a 330-mile trip from Texas to Mississippi. The cleanup crews traveled Friday night, worked for two days, and then returned home Sunday night, arriving in time for Monday morning jobs.

 

Edited October 11, 2018 by ALarson

[The Nehor]

7 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Why do we need a new nickname? 

Because our name is a mouthful. To describe my religious faith I now have to say “I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints”. That is incredibly awkward and I have been doing it since conference because I am trying to be obedient but I do not think it is going to stick in the news or in the popular mind. If the objective is to put Christ in the forefront (and that is President Nelson’s explicit goal) then it should be in whatever nickname comes out of this.

Maybe I am wrong and it will catch on but I doubt it. If this is just a way of making us more peculiar and is not meant to catch on then I am all for that.

[ALarson]

21 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Sounds like your intent to follow President Nelson’s instruction is rather grudging. 

Nope....not at all.  I'm very much going to make every effort to adhere to his request (and have already done so).  But, let's not deny what other Prophets have stated in the past and pretend that they all have agreed on the usage of the word "Mormon" and "Mormons", because they haven't.  This is something that President Nelson very obviously feels strongly about and I believe we should honor his request (which I will do). 

Quote

 

By the way, the disrespect shown in this link title is quite offensive to me. Just so you know. 

 

Yes, I already pointed that out and I don't like it either.  But I found the words and the contrast interesting to hear.

Edited October 11, 2018 by ALarson

[Scott Lloyd]

5 minutes ago, ALarson said:

Nope....not at all.  I'm very much going to make every effort to adhere to his request (and have already done so).  But, let's not deny what other Prophets have stated in the past and pretend that they all have agreed on the usage of the word "Mormon" and "Mormons", because they haven't.  This is something that President Nelson very obviously feels strongly about and I believe we should honor his request (which I will do). 

What I’m specifically denying is that President Hinckley contradicted his Brethren about what the Church itself should be called. He never encouraged calling it “the Mormon church” instead of “the Church of Jesus Christ.” 

I’m glad you have announced your intent to use the proper name of the Church. I wonder if you would have made every effort to do so before now. The directive has been in place for years. 

[ALarson]

20 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I’m glad you have announced your intent to use the proper name of the Church. I wonder if you would have made every effort to do so before now. The directive has been in place for years. 

I did refer to the church by it's proper name most of the time (especially when conducting meetings and publicly speaking), but I admit I did still refer to it in conversations as the Mormon Church or to the members as Mormons.  

I doubt my past experience is much different from most other active members.  I feel most non members did almost always use the term "The Mormon Church" and they probably will still do that.  All we really have control over though is what we choose to do.  I'm certainly not going to go around correcting others, but will definitely make an effort to follow Pres. Nelson's request.

Edited October 11, 2018 by ALarson

[The Nehor]

I worry this will ruin one of my mission stories. While passing a pub a young guy denigratingly yelled out to a missionary: “Look! A Mormon!”

The Elder was a little smart-mouthed and called back: “Yeah! More a man then you will ever be.” A physical altercation ensued and the Elder needed medical attention.

 

No, it was not me. Why would you think that? 

“smart-mouthed”

Oh......right, good educated guess.

[Exiled]

On 10/9/2018 at 4:46 PM, Calm said:

I would be more likely to mention new temples.

Why temples over the name change?  Temples are announced routinely.

[Jamesglendell]

On 10/7/2018 at 1:35 PM, Jane_Doe said:

"LDS Christian" has been my preferred quick descriptor of myself this last year or two.  Pres Nelson knocked home the point today, and I'll have to figure out how to best implement it in my life.  It's going to take some feeling out. 

 

On 10/7/2018 at 4:50 PM, The Nehor said:

I work in an administrative calling so I might be biased.

I for one  am excited about it. As member in the southern US I have often felt the the use of Mormon church lead to many thinking we were not a Christian church.

[MiserereNobis]

2 hours ago, The Nehor said:

How about Jesusian (also taken) except we use the hispanic pronunciation: Hay-sussian. Nah, too derivative

Well, you know in Spanish the nickname for Jesus is Chuy. So, how about Chuyian? Or (given the LDS propensity for this suffix): Chuyite?

[Navidad]

2 hours ago, The Nehor said:

We are going to need a new nickname. The name is too long. Christian is taken. Jesuit is taken.

How about Jesusian (also taken) except we use the hispanic pronunciation: Hay-sussian. Nah, too derivative.

Or we can focus on our restorationism. I am a RestoraChristian. RestoraChrist? I like that one. I am a RestoraChrist.

I think the Restored Church got the best one "The Community of Christ" - what a great name!

[The Nehor]

3 minutes ago, MiserereNobis said:

Well, you know in Spanish the nickname for Jesus is Chuy. So, how about Chuyian? Or (given the LDS propensity for this suffix): Chuyite?

That sounds like a Chewbacca cult which would undoubtedly have its advantages but is not what we are going for.

[The Nehor]

3 minutes ago, Navidad said:

I think the Restored Church got the best one "The Community of Christ" - what a great name!

I still call them the reorganites.

[Gray]

2 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I’ve read both talks, and I quite disagree. President Hinckley never encouraged people to call it “the Mormon church” instead of the Church of Jesus Christ. 

 

RMN: Others wondered why, with all that’s going on in the world, it was necessary to emphasize something so “inconsequential.”  And some said it couldn’t be done, so why even try?

GBH: He replied, “You can’t. The word Mormon is too deeply ingrained and too easy to say.” He went on, “I’ve quit trying. While I’m thankful for the privilege of being a follower of Jesus Christ and a member of the Church which bears His name, I am not ashamed of the nickname Mormon.”

GBH:  Ever since, when I have seen the word Mormon used in the media to describe us—in a newspaper or a magazine or book or whatever—there flashes into my mind his statement, which has become my motto: Mormon means “more good.”.. We may not be able to change the nickname, but we can make it shine with added luster.

 

 

RMN: Taking the Savior’s name upon us includes declaring and witnessing to others—through our actions and our words—that Jesus is the Christ. Have we been so afraid to offend someone who called us “Mormons” that we have failed to defend the Savior Himself, to stand up for Him even in the name by which His Church is called?

GBH: I testify that the Book of Mormon is the word of God and that when people speak of us by the name of this book, they will compliment us, if we will live worthy of the name, remembering that in a very real sense Mormonism must mean that greater good which the Lord Jesus Christ exemplified. - GBH

 

RMN: What’s in a name or, in this case, a nickname? When it comes to nicknames of the Church, such as the “LDS Church,” the “Mormon Church,” or the “Church of the Latter-day Saints,” the most important thing in those names is the absence of the Savior’s name. To remove the Lord’s name from the Lord’s Church is a major victory for Satan. When we discard the Savior’s name, we are subtly disregarding all that Jesus Christ did for us—even His Atonement.

GBH: Anyone who comes to know the man Mormon, through the reading and pondering of his words, anyone who reads this precious trove of history which was assembled and preserved in large measure by him, will come to know that Mormon is not a word of disrepute, but that it represents the greatest good—that good which is of God. -

 

 

 

 

Edited October 11, 2018 by Gray

[JAHS]

2 hours ago, ALarson said:

Watch the video I just posted.  I found it interesting and I really do believe they did disagree on at least some things regarding this issue.  President Hinckley most definitely did not seem to mind being called a Mormon and even praised that name.

But it's definitely not the first time that Prophets have not fully agreed on a topic.

I think in general they are not contradictory. President Hinckley was trying to make the best of what the world would continue to call the church and President Nelson was telling us that the Lord says now is time to make the full change to the correct name and encourage the use of the name. Both messages are useful.

[Calm]

3 hours ago, rockpond said:

 Now, each of those efforts had specific goals, I'm confident, that do not tie specifically to the name Mormon but they all still promote the name Mormon.

I see this as a contradiction.

"Promote" has the connotation of specific intention attached to it, imo, which is why I believe Scott is strongly protesting comments that use this term and other terms that have this connotation 

Quote

 

further the progress of (something, especially a cause, venture, or aim); support or actively encourage.

synonyms:encourage, advocate, further, advance, assist, aid, help, contribute to, foster, nurture, develop, boost, stimulate, forward, work for

"an organization promoting justice"

 

I am trying to find a term that works for it, popularizing as an acceptable side effect, but don't have time now.

[Calm]

29 minutes ago, JAHS said:

I think in general they are not contradictory. President Hinckley was trying to make the best of what the world would continue to call the church and President Nelson was telling us that the Lord says now is time to make the full change to the correct name and encourage the use of the name. Both messages are useful.

I agree in general as well.  The only thing I am having a problem processing is the comments about "major victory for Satan" in the talk.  That feels like a contradiction.  Working on that.

I do think posting it as a oneliner in this thread in conjunction with Church uses in the past is not contributing to understanding, but more of an effect of shutting it down.

Edited October 11, 2018 by Calm

[Navidad]

I know it doesn't matter, but I really like "LDS Christian." That is perfect moniker for an individual Saint. It would have a great impact (positively) on non-Mormons. If you would use the word Christian, you would create an immediate bond and make many Christians think. There will always be naysayers, but we non-LDS Christian folks get that all the time from our LDS-Christian friends! 😊

[rockpond]

15 minutes ago, Calm said:

I see this as a contradiction.

"Promote" has the connotation of specific intention attached to it, imo, which is why I believe Scott is strongly protesting comments that use this term and other terms that have this connotation 

I am trying to find a term that works for it, popularizing as an acceptable side effect, but don't have time now.

I think what was done with the I'm a Mormon campaign fits the promote definition.  "Mormon" was the single most dominate feature of the campaigns.  So, whether one believes that the Brethren's intention with the campaign was to promote the name Mormon or not, they were doing it.  And, the campaigns didn't happen on accident - they were intentional.  If the Lord was offended by the use of the word Mormon to describe members of the Church, He could have told President Monson.  If describing ourselves as Mormon (which is what these campaigns did) was a victory for Satan, why didn't President Monson put a stop to them?

[JAHS]

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints butterfly  (aka Mormon butterfly) 
Lepidopterists will have to revise their books. 

[Scott Lloyd]

3 hours ago, Navidad said:

I think the Restored Church got the best one "The Community of Christ" - what a great name!

Do you mean the Reorganized Church? Their title wasn’t the Restored Church. 

Edited October 12, 2018 by Scott Lloyd

[Scott Lloyd]

2 hours ago, rockpond said:

I think what was done with the I'm a Mormon campaign fits the promote definition.  "Mormon" was the single most dominate feature of the campaigns.  So, whether one believes that the Brethren's intention with the campaign was to promote the name Mormon or not, they were doing it.  And, the campaigns didn't happen on accident - they were intentional.  If the Lord was offended by the use of the word Mormon to describe members of the Church, He could have told President Monson.  If describing ourselves as Mormon (which is what these campaigns did) was a victory for Satan, why didn't President Monson put a stop to them?

The problem comes when you make flat but false assertions like “they spent millions promoting the name Mormon.” You now appear to admit that was not their intent, yet you are still doubling down on your inaccurate statements. 

Edited October 12, 2018 by Scott Lloyd

[Hamba Tuhan]

11 hours ago, rockpond said:

I get that past prophets aren’t accountable for knowing current instructions.  But this is something that “offends the Lord” and was a “victory for Satan”... should we expect the Lord to not let prophets do such things?

Was it a 'victory for Satan' when the Prophet Joseph let Martin Harris borrow the Book of Lehi?

Quote

Do they not converse?

Did the Lord converse with Moses? Why was it then Joshua who led the Children of Israel into the Promised Land?

 

[Hamba Tuhan]

5 hours ago, The Nehor said:

To describe my religious faith I now have to say “I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints”. That is incredibly awkward ...

That is exactly what I have always said. I literally said this yesterday at a conference when a participant asked me what church I attend. I have occasionally shortened it to, 'I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ'. I don't get why this is awkward. 

[Navidad]

39 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Do you mean the Reorganized Church? Their title wasn’t the Restored Church. 

Yep, oh and I didn't mean the resyored church either (oh you fixed it)! Ha! Although at their history conference they did tell me they are the true restored church! No, they didn't - just kidding.