SL Tribune Suspends Robert Kirby

[smac97]

Here:

Quote

SALT LAKE CITY — The Salt Lake Tribune suspended columnist Robert Kirby Friday for three months without pay following an investigation into his conduct at a conference two months ago, the newspaper reported.

Provo-based blogger Courtney Kendrick appeared with Kirby at a Sunstone Symposium in July.

She posted on social media last week that she felt “belittled and embarrassed” after Kirby "made sexually tinged comments," talked her into consuming an edible dose of marijuana, then mocked her in front of the audience by saying she was high, according to the Tribune.

According to her FB post, Kirby approached her in the convention center hallway and said  "Let's pretend I picked you up from an escort service and we'll walk over to that table over there together and sit down and chat," then after they sat down he "insisted" that she eat an "edible" (a marijuana brownie) to "calm {her} nerves," which she did (despite not being nervous), then later in the session he announced to everyone else that she was high because he had given her "weed," and he was "rewarded with huge laughs" from the crowd. 

Quote

Tribune Editor Jennifer Napier-Pearce said in a statement Friday that managers looked into “multiple complaints,” and concluded that Kirby's actions violated company policy.

“We believe that Kirby’s agreement to suspend employment, undergo coaching and attend training reflects his sincere commitment to change,” Napier-Pearce's statement said in part.

Kirby apologized in a written statement. According to the Tribune, part of his statement said, “I’m profoundly sorry that my actions have offended people in the community. I have a lot of work to do in understanding the pain I have caused."

Kendrick told the Deseret News that she hopes some good can come from it.

"As I've said all along, my posting was never about apologies or punishments, it was about making my community aware of problematic behavior by so-called progressive men," Kendrick said.

"I hope good comes out of this — that more women can find their voices when it matters most. I also hope men reconsider their reactions to women when they tell the truth. It's not a joke and it's not entertainment," the Deseret News quoted her as saying.

Salt Lake City public radio station KUER first mentioned both Kendrick's story and Kirby's apology on Thursday.

Kirby has been a columnist for the Salt Lake Tribune for 25 years, the newspaper reported.

From KUER:

Quote

Kendrick said Kirby then offered her a marijuana edible, which she accepted.

“I would like to say that at that point I had the wherewithal to have some sense in me,” Kendrick wrote. “The truth is, I was still stunned and shocked, and inside me remained that voice, ‘Just please him,’ and ‘He's a big deal, you don't want to reject him.’”

The edible led to the most embarrassing moment for Kendrick of the evening, something Kirby shared with the Sunstone audience as the panel was concluding.

“She’s high,” Kirby told the laughing audience. “I’m serious, she really is. I gave her some weed.”

Kendrick laughed it off saying, “It’s true. He’s like, ‘You seem really nervous, would you like one of these candies?’”

Kedrick said she didn’t want to embarrass Kirby, a columnist whom she deeply respected. But after the night was over she said the events didn’t sit well with her.

...

{Kendrick was} surprised to find out that at the end of the day [Kirby] is as problematic as any other ignorant man in our patriarchal community.”

"Any other ignorant man?"  How many men normally subjected to accusations of "patriarchy" think it's okay to make "sexually tinged comments" to a virtual (female) stranger?  How many such men "insist" on a newly-met female acquaintance consuming marijuana?  How many thereafter think it's okay to hold this woman up for ridicule before a "laughing audience?"

From the Deseret News:

Quote

Longtime Salt Lake Tribune columnist Robert Kirby apologized Thursday for his behavior toward Utah writer and blogger Courtney Kendrick at a symposium earlier this summer.

The link doesn't work.  Did Kirby take down his FB page?  It's excerpted and paraphrased by the DNews this way:

Quote

"I owe Courtney Clark Kendrick a sincere apology," Kirby wrote, in part. "I had no idea that I made her feel this way back when I was joking around at Sunstone. Much of what she describes in her account took place, albeit without some of the more sinister intentions many have alluded to. The simple fact is that she deserves an apology from me and I herewith offer it to her — now that I’m aware of how I made her feel."

...

Kirby notes in his posting that he believes the incident could have been resolved "amicably" if Kendrick had contacted him sooner. He also underscores that his comments were meant to be humorous.

"Given the abrupt nature of our meeting, I misjudged how she would take my sense of humor," Kirby wrote. "For that and any discomfort I’ve caused her, I deeply apologize."

It sounds like Kendrick doesn't care for Kirby's apology:

Quote

Kendrick told the Deseret News that Kirby's insistence that he was joking, and that she didn't get the joke, isn't a viable excuse.

"Saying that the victim doesn’t understand humor is a tired tactic that no longer stands," Kendrick said. "First of all, my sense of humor is not negated by not wanting to be called an escort. And second of all, it’s not even funny in the first place. How is calling a woman an escort funny?"

That's a fair question.  

And marijuana brownies as Sunstone?  Is that a normal, regular thing now?

And what are we to make of the Sunston audience laughing along with Kirby about Kendrick being high on "weed?"

Speaking of Sunstone (from the DNews article):

Quote

While Sunstone did not respond to inquiries from the Deseret News Thursday, the organization posted a notice to its Facebook page on Friday announcing Kirby will not be invited to participate in future symposiums.

"Sunstone was recently made aware of an incident where Robert Kirby, who was one of our final presenters, made a comment in a private conversation that violated our anti-harassment policy at the 2018 Salt Lake Sunstone Symposium. All presenters are made aware of our policy against harassment. We have since communicated with all parties, and the Sunstone board has decided that for the foreseeable future, Mr. Kirby will not be invited to present at future Sunstone events," the statement says.

So it looks like Sunstone is "unperson"-ing Kirby.  That's an understandable response.

What a weird story.

-Smac

Edited September 16, 2018 by smac97

[Robert F. Smith]

1 hour ago, smac97 said:

...............................................

It sounds like Kendrick doesn't care for Kirby's apology:

That's a fair question.  

And marijuana brownies as Sunstone?  Is that a normal, regular thing now?

And what are we to make of the Sunston audience laughing along with Kirby about Kendrick being high on "weed?"

Speaking of Sunstone (from the DNews article):

So it looks like Sunstone is "unperson"-ing Kirby.  That's an understandable response.

What a weird story.................

While Kirby was certainly rude and insensitive, Kendrick gave him all the signals that it would be O.K. with her.  Both of them misread the actual situation at Sunstone symposia, where many ignorant, wannabe anti-Mormons assemble.  This points up the danger of allowing sleaze to replace maturity in SLC, and is reminiscent of the "fun" which UofU students have in getting drunk and cussing at BYU students and alumni during game night.

Then, when the jape-fest gets out of hand, everyone loiters in aftershock wondering what happened, the consquences (and not the truth) arrive at their own sad homecoming.

Hey, go along to get along.  It'll all be O.K.  It's just a little sin.

[Calm]

Quote

r — now that I’m aware of how I made her feel."

So the only problem was she didn't respond the way he expected her to, there was no inherent disrespect or other problem with what he did apparently.

That concerns me for a man who is often held up as a standard of how things should be done by those who consider themselves "progressive Mormons" 

[Gray]

He really should have been fired.

[SeekingUnderstanding]

I was sad to read this story. Kirby behaved like a jerk. If he was there on behalf of the tribune, the unpaid suspension seems reasonable. Firing him would also be reasonable. That said, I have a real problem with the implied comparison to Bishop and Denison in the Facebook write-up. This was an interaction between two adults on equal footing. Was this jerky behavior- no doubt. Anything approaching sexual assault or grooming, or an MTC president taking a young sister missionary to the basement to show them porn? No way. 

Edited September 16, 2018 by SeekingUnderstanding

[Scott Lloyd]

Last I heard, possession of marijuana was illegal in Utah. Is that no longer the case? 

[provoman]

.............

Edited September 16, 2018 by provoman

[katherine the great]

He's publicly admitted (almost bragged) about using marijuana but the "escort" scenario is just bizarre. Why would anyone think that a young woman walking beside him at a conference was an escort and not simply a participant or lecturer? So strange...

[Exiled]

31 minutes ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

I was sad to read this story. Kirby behaved like a jerk. If he was there on behalf of the tribune, the unpaid suspension seems reasonable. Firing him would also be reasonable. That said, I have a real problem with the implied comparison to Bishop and Denison in the Facebook write-up. This was an interaction between two adults on equal footing. Was this jerky behavior- no doubt. Anything approaching sexual assault or grooming, or an MTC president taking a young sister missionary to the basement to show them porn? No way. 

I think this story is better understood in the context of the medical marijuana initiative. Kirby, a proponent of the initiative, publicly outing the DN contributor for taking an edible was certainly poor conduct and it is correct that he was punished. But her claiming that she couldn't just refuse to take the marijuana edible and be an adult is troubling and seems contrived to justify her use of an illegal substance. I wonder if she was coached to cast this as a "me-too" scenario? Her story seems too much like a morality play where a babe in the woods gets tricked by an evil marijuana pusher and perhaps porn addict to use the illegal substance. So, be aware.

[juliann]

32 minutes ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

I was sad to read this story. Kirby behaved like a jerk. If he was there on behalf of the tribune, the unpaid suspension seems reasonable. Firing him would also be reasonable. That said, I have a real problem with the implied comparison to Bishop and Denison in the Facebook write-up. This was an interaction between two adults on equal footing. Was this jerky behavior- no doubt. Anything approaching sexual assault or grooming, or an MTC president taking a young sister missionary to the basement to show them porn? No way. 

Kirby is a celebrity of sorts which means they weren't on equal footing. I think the key phrase from the Trib was that there had been other complaints. Apparently, this woman had the social media presence to make it public. Which doesn't say much for the Trib, but hey, he is probably a big money maker for them. 

I have two take aways from this. There has been a growing movement against sexist progressive/former Mormon men who use feminist causes for their own benefit while still holding the same views on women. The first excuses I saw were that they had learned it when Mormon.  Uh huh. But that seems to have gone by the wayside in order to take them on directly. 

Second, it is too early to expect this but at some point women who are well educated in this problem have to start standing up to these guys when it is feasible to do so. I totally understand her reaction. Everyone has had situations where they were so stunned that they didn't react normally. No matter how often we run into situations like these, they are rarely the same and we tend to react as she described. (I do think ingesting something was a bit much, though, but I wasn't there.) Women will almost always try to defuse and get along with men who have power or standing like this jerk. It is the safest thing to do, especially when she has to go on stage with him. Had he not humiliated her publicly, he likely wouldn't find himself in this situation because she would have let it go.  So I hope the MeToo movement spends as much time in training women to be ready for these situations as they do in calling out the offenders. 

[Exiled]

8 minutes ago, juliann said:

(I do think ingesting something was a bit much, though, but I wasn't there.)

I think this is the heart of the story and her outing by Kirby. He certainly was a jerk to do this and he should have been punished. Also, the escort comment is inexcusable. However, could she be coopting the "me-too" movement to rehabilitate herself for taking an illegal substance? She must have been incredibly embarrassed/betrayed for being caught so publicly. I wonder if traffic to her site went down as a result?

[juliann]

1 hour ago, Exiled said:

I think this is the heart of the story and her outing by Kirby. He certainly was a jerk to do this and he should have been punished. Also, the escort comment is inexcusable. However, could she be coopting the "me-too" movement to rehabilitate herself for taking an illegal substance? She must have been incredibly embarrassed/betrayed for being caught so publicly. I wonder if traffic to her site went down as a result?

Lets not go down the blame the victim with speculation path. This is about him and those like him not her. The problem with ingesting things is that you cannot trust what some men will put in it.

 Further, I don’t see how publicizing this would solve what you mention. I didn’t even know Kirby was at Sunstone prior to this. I don’t hear much about Sunstone anymore at all aside from announcements it is going to happen. 

Remember that throwaway phrase, there have been other complaints. It’s not about her. 

[Exiled]

2 minutes ago, juliann said:

Lets not go down the blame the victim with speculation path. This is about him and those like him not her. The problem with ingesting things is that you cannot trust what some men will put in it.

 Further, I don’t see how publicizing this would solve what you mention. I didn’t even know Kirby was at Sunstone prior to this. I don’t hear much about Sunstone anymore at all aside from announcements it is going to happen. 

Remember that throwaway phrase, there have been other complaints. It’s not about her. 

I don't think she is a victim with respect to the edible. She willingly took it. She isn't some child that has no resistance.

[Calm]

From her FB post:

Quote

There have been many, many times since that interaction I have asked myself why he felt like he could say that to me. Did he think that would flatter me? That maybe pretending I was a prostitute picked up by the great Robert Kirby was going to make me feel special?

I can't understand what Kirby would be getting out of others thinking he was with a prostitute.  "Ha, ha, the joke's on you, she was my colleague presenting with me"?

Establishing their relationship is one of sexual dominance from the getgo....it does that in a weird and twisted way.  Demonstrating to himself he can manipulate people into doing things they really don't want to do?  Does that too.

[Exiled]

2 minutes ago, Calm said:

From her FB post:

I can't understand what Kirby would be getting out of others thinking he was with a prostitute.  "Ha, ha, the joke's on you, she was my colleague presenting with me"?

Establishing their relationship is one of sexual dominance from the getgo....it does that in a weird and twisted way.  Demonstrating to himself he can manipulate people into doing things they really don't want to do?  Does that too.

This is where I have to question the narrative. I think she willingly took the edible, was rightfully upset when Kirby outs her in front of the sunstone crowd, and waited for her chance to get back at a jerk. Kirby was a jerk and deserved what he got but I think she willingly took the edible. Surely we should presume that an adult knows what she is doing.

[Calm]

9 hours ago, Exiled said:

I don't think she is a victim with respect to the edible. She willingly took it. She isn't some child that has no resistance.

I don't think you understand how women may feel when the relationship with a man is framed as a sexual dominance footing.  He in essence told her "I am thinking of you as someone I am going to have sex with not because you want to have sex with me, but because you as a person have no value for me, it is only your body and I can buy that for a handful of dollars."  That is a mental blow to the stomach, complete blindside.  And then she gets to debate in her mind as she is walking next to him 'is this just a joke or does he really see me only as an object for sex and if so, what will he do next if I upset him?'

Quote

And as I've told this story to men close to me, they've have had similar reactions, "You? You went with him? You didn't call him out?" because it sounds out of character for me. And I've tried explaining to them that my reaction at this point is almost biological, or evolutionary. My instinct is to ignore any discomfort or anger and do as you've been conditioned to do--put your head down and agree.

 

Edited September 17, 2018 by Calm

[CV75]

13 hours ago, smac97 said:

Here:

According to her FB post, Kirby approached her in the convention center hallway and said  "Let's pretend I picked you up from an escort service and we'll walk over to that table over there together and sit down and chat," then after they sat down he "insisted" that she eat an "edible" (a marijuana brownie) to "calm {her} nerves," which she did (despite not being nervous), then later in the session he announced to everyone else that she was high because he had given her "weed," and he was "rewarded with huge laughs" from the crowd. 

And marijuana brownies as Sunstone?  Is that a normal, regular thing now?

And what are we to make of the Sunston audience laughing along with Kirby about Kendrick being high on "weed?"

This is how yahoos think they are sophisticated.

[Jeanne]

both are guilty...and I am so disappointed.

[Calm]

7 minutes ago, Exiled said:

This is where I have to question the narrative. I think she willingly took the edible, was rightfully upset when Kirby outs her in front of the sunstone crowd, and waited for her chance to get back at a jerk. Kirby was a jerk and deserved what he got but I think she willingly took the edible. Surely we should presume that an adult knows what she is doing.

I don't think you understand how many women think about sexual dominance, especially when shocked by it.  All sense of being safe, on solid ground disappears.  It is similar to the saying that when men think of the worst thing that can happen on a date, they generally go to "she will laugh at me"; for women it is "he could rape and kill me".

Edited September 16, 2018 by Calm

[Calm]

3 minutes ago, Jeanne said:

both are guilty...and I am so disappointed.

Why are both guilty in your view?

[Scott Lloyd]

2 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Last I heard, possession of marijuana was illegal in Utah. Is that no longer the case? 

I see no one here has yet addressed the question. I wonder why. If nothing else, he was in violation of the law by distributing marijuana. And she by receiving and consuming it. 

And Smac raised a good point. What does it say about Sunstone that this kind of thing goes on openly at its conferences, apparently with widespread approval? 

[Calm]

12 minutes ago, Exiled said:

This is where I have to question the narrative. I think she willingly took the edible, was rightfully upset when Kirby outs her in front of the sunstone crowd, and waited for her chance to get back at a jerk. Kirby was a jerk and deserved what he got but I think she willingly took the edible. Surely we should presume that an adult knows what she is doing.

She presents herself as not having a problem with marijuana.  If she was not acting spaced out, what would it matter if she had consumed any?  

Quote

When we sat down at the table he insisted I take an edible to "calm my nerves" (which is weird because I don't recall being especially nervous). And here's the thing, I would like to say that at that point I had the wherewithal to have some sense in me. The truth is, I was still stunned and shocked, and inside me remained that voice, "just please him" and "he's a big deal, you don't want to reject him." And let me say, I have no moral conflicts with edibles, but I do find it terribly frustrating that I took it because I felt pressured to please this person with his "old man charm".

This is not a woman who worries that her blog will go down because she took marijuana, imo.  I doubt her market sees that as much of a negative.

Quote

But I do desperately understand we have to calculate the risks of posting these things. We might lose our jobs, our relationships, our credibility. And it is worth noting, it is much harder to tell your truth the closer you are to the patriarchal structure. It would've been tremendously harder to have written this if I were talking about mistreatment by my bishop, or mission president--and let's not pretend that these things don't run rampant in that paradigm.

 

Edited September 16, 2018 by Calm

[Scott Lloyd]

3 minutes ago, Calm said:

I don't think you understand how many women think about sexual dominance, especially when shocked by it.  All sense of being safe, on solid ground disappears.  It is similar to the saying that when men think of the worst thing that can happen on a date, they generally go to "she will laugh at me"; for women it is "he could rape and kill me".

She wasn’t on a date. And from what I can tell, not under his control. 

The whole scenario seems really weird to me. 

[Exiled]

5 minutes ago, Calm said:

I don't think you understand how women may feel when the relationship with a man is framed as a sexual dominance footing.  He in essence told her "I am thinking of you as someone I am going to have sex with not because you want to have sex with me, but because you as a person have no value for me, it is only your body and I can buy that for a handful of dollars."  That is a mental blow to the stomach, complete blindside.  And then she gets to debate in her mind as she is walking next to him 'is this just a joke or does he really see me only as an object for sex and if so, what will he do next if I upset him?'

 

So an escort comment lowered her powers of resistance to such a level that she couldn't resist the marijuana edible? Is that common? Or is she coopting the "me too" movement like other exposed perpetrators do in other contexts? Sure, Kirby was a jerk and should have been punished for his deplorable behavior. However, Ms. Kendrick claims to have had no resistance. Is that really how it is?

[Exiled]

6 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I see no one here has yet addressed the question. I wonder why. If nothing else, he was in violation of the law by distributing marijuana. And she by receiving and consuming it. 

And Smac raised a good point. What does it say about Sunstone that this kind of thing goes on openly at its conferences, apparently with widespread approval? 

The story reminds me kind of like this one out of Spokane, WA some time ago, prior to legalization up there. So, there was this young man that went into the police department to make a complaint. It seems someone stole his bong (a marijuana smoking device). The police listened intently, asking questions, advising this young man that he could have a lawyer present and one cop asked about how much marijuana the young man had at his house. The young man thought for a minute and then said that the person who stole his bong had also stolen 1/8 oz of his best pot and that he now only had a little less than an 1/8th left. He then asked the cops what they were going to do and to his surprise, the cops slapped the cuffs on him. 🤣