Ginger Snaps Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 Title says it all 😊 https://www.lds.org/manual/handbook-1-stake-presidents-and-bishops?lang=eng 4
ksfisher Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 3 minutes ago, bluebell said: Yes! Now you to can know everything there is to know about the Perpetual Education Fund and Military Relations. 2
Popular Post bluebell Posted November 15, 2017 Popular Post Posted November 15, 2017 3 minutes ago, ksfisher said: Now you to can know everything there is to know about the Perpetual Education Fund and Military Relations. It just makes sense. There are things in the handbook that members don't know, but are expected to know (such as that they should consult with their bishop before making decisions about permanent birth control). Plus, when questions come up, members have been going to other online sources to look things up in the handbook because it's easier than going through the bishop. 6
HappyJackWagon Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 14 minutes ago, bluebell said: It just makes sense. There are things in the handbook that members don't know, but are expected to know (such as that they should consult with their bishop before making decisions about permanent birth control). Plus, when questions come up, members have been going to other online sources to look things up in the handbook because it's easier than going through the bishop. I agree that it makes perfect sense to make this available to everyone. There are examples of when a member should counsel with a leader about things like "considering a transsexual operation" or "cremation" or vasectomy etc, but the individual would never know they should talk to the leader I hope this was done on purpose and not just some glitch. 3
hope_for_things Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 31 minutes ago, Ginger Snaps said: Title says it all 😊 https://www.lds.org/manual/handbook-1-stake-presidents-and-bishops?lang=eng Makes sense to make this available to everyone, considering they haven't done well trying to keep it secret. Do you know if there were changes in this version, or if this is just the same version but made available to all? 1
ksfisher Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 3 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said: I agree that it makes perfect sense to make this available to everyone. There are examples of when a member should counsel with a leader about things like "considering a transsexual operation" or "cremation" or vasectomy etc, but the individual would never know they should talk to the leader I hope this was done on purpose and not just some glitch. All of the above are in Handbook 2 which has been available to all members (and everyone in the world with an internet connection) for several years. Much of the policy sections of Handbook 1 are just a cut and past of what is in Handbook 2 (or maybe the other way around). 1
Amulek Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 9 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said: I hope this was done on purpose and not just some glitch. I was wondering that myself, since it appears that there isn't yet a way to navigate to it without using a direct link. It's also missing the audio and download links which are present everywhere else, so my guess would be that they are still working on getting it completed (and this was just accidentally published a bit early).
hope_for_things Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 Just browsing through the church discipline section and its fascinating to see a list like this and see how odd that certain items are included in this list. These items all require First Presidency Approval to consider reinstating a member who has been disciplined. Quote Apply for First Presidency Approval (If Necessary) If the person was disfellowshipped or excommunicated for any of the following reasons, or if he committed any of these transgressions after being disfellowshipped or excommunicated, the approval of the First Presidency is required before he may be reinstated to full fellowship or readmitted by baptism and confirmation. For the purposes of Church discipline, some of the following terms are defined in 6.7.3. Murder Incest Sexual offense against a child or serious physical abuse of a child by an adult or by a youth who is several years older than the child Apostasy Committing a serious transgression while holding a prominent Church position An elective transsexual operation Embezzlement of Church funds or property I highlighted the two items that just don't seem to belong in this list. Crazy to me that these two items are essentially morally equivalent with the egregious crimes of the other items listed. Shows me how messed up priorities are with respect to certain topics.
Duncan Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 Somebody said once and I chuckle is that CH1 is answers to questions that nobody asks. Par example why on earth would a member go to a Bishop and ask about a vasectomy? unless the Bishop is doing it then why bother him with that or cremation-funerals aren't cheap and unless the Bishop is willing to fork over the dosh then if a member gets it done and how they pay for it is really none of his concern, IMO 1
Gray Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 8 minutes ago, hope_for_things said: Just browsing through the church discipline section and its fascinating to see a list like this and see how odd that certain items are included in this list. These items all require First Presidency Approval to consider reinstating a member who has been disciplined. I highlighted the two items that just don't seem to belong in this list. Crazy to me that these two items are essentially morally equivalent with the egregious crimes of the other items listed. Shows me how messed up priorities are with respect to certain topics. I could see embezzlement. Since members get callings all the time, you wouldn't want someone who embezzled church funds getting a calling that handled tithing or budgets. 2
MiserereNobis Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 Here's the equivalent for Catholicism: The Code of Canon Law It would be interesting to do a comparison thinking about how a large church and a small church approach religious law. 2
Jane_Doe Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 31 minutes ago, MiserereNobis said: Here's the equivalent for Catholicism: The Code of Canon Law It would be interesting to do a comparison thinking about how a large church and a small church approach religious law. Would you be interested in staring a new thread on the matter?
hope_for_things Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 1 hour ago, Gray said: I could see embezzlement. Since members get callings all the time, you wouldn't want someone who embezzled church funds getting a calling that handled tithing or budgets. I agree, embezzlement is a serious issue and I think it belongs on the list, not one of the items I highlighted. Apostasy and transgender surgery(they need to update their wording of that term).
Ginger Snaps Posted November 15, 2017 Author Posted November 15, 2017 2 hours ago, Amulek said: I was wondering that myself, since it appears that there isn't yet a way to navigate to it without using a direct link. It's also missing the audio and download links which are present everywhere else, so my guess would be that they are still working on getting it completed (and this was just accidentally published a bit early). I got the link when Dialogue Journal tweeted it this morning. When I go to LDS.org and search for Church Handbook 1, it comes up in what appears to be Danish, even when I search for it with English as a qualifier. English is set as my default language in the upper right corner but it comes up in Danish every time.
stemelbow Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 looks like it was a mistake and they have taken it down? I se handbook 2 when I click the link.
Ginger Snaps Posted November 15, 2017 Author Posted November 15, 2017 Huh. And now when I click the link in my first post, it takes me to handbook two. But on my phone it still takes me to handbook one. Maybe this was a glitch? 1
stemelbow Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 It is interesting though, how rule-oriented, letter of the law, the church has become. It's far more pharisaic then the Pharisees ever were. I notice how often at Church, we hear the very types of challenges Pharisees, sadduccees and scribes offered to Jesus. I wonder if the Church's intention is to shameless continue the pursuit of being more pharisaic then the Pharisees.
rockpond Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 2 hours ago, Duncan said: Somebody said once and I chuckle is that CH1 is answers to questions that nobody asks. Par example why on earth would a member go to a Bishop and ask about a vasectomy? It's funny that the same section indicates that birth control decisions should be left up to the parents and then it suggests involving the Bishop in your vasectomy decision. But... I know quite a few guys who have had vasectomies and never talked to the Bishop about it. 1
smac97 Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 2 hours ago, hope_for_things said: Makes sense to make this available to everyone, considering they haven't done well trying to keep it secret. It was never intended to be a secret. 2 hours ago, hope_for_things said: Do you know if there were changes in this version, or if this is just the same version but made available to all? The copyright is still 2010, so probably not. There was an amendment back in November 2015. 1
Popular Post rockpond Posted November 15, 2017 Popular Post Posted November 15, 2017 12 minutes ago, smac97 said: It was never intended to be a secret. It wasn't? One definition of secret is "not meant to be known or seen by others". The handbook itself states: “solely for use by general and local Church officers to administer the affairs of the Church. It should not be duplicated or given to any other persons.” The digital version remains accessible only to those in certain callings. I think this fits the definition of secret. 5
HappyJackWagon Posted November 15, 2017 Posted November 15, 2017 15 minutes ago, rockpond said: It's funny that the same section indicates that birth control decisions should be left up to the parents and then it suggests involving the Bishop in your vasectomy decision. But... I know quite a few guys who have had vasectomies and never talked to the Bishop about it. It's difficult for people to go to their bishop for council on issues like vasectomies when they don't have access to the handbook to know that they should go to the bishop to seek council on issues like vasectomies 2
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