Biblical Gender Roles

[Ahab]

11 hours ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

I am shocked at all the positive comments in the link to the OP blog.

Considering the fact that the blog has so many quotes from the Bible I'm a little surprised that more people aren't making more positive comments.

I see some "poisoning of the well" at hand here, targeted at what is written in the Bible. 

[Tacenda]

This thread/link gave me an epiphany.  Our church is much more lenient, for lack of a better word, than a lot of churches.  Meaning, if women do agitate for something they will usually get it. 

I think not enough women are agitating for the Priesthood, but the women who are like Ordain Women, felt the need to press, that says a lot!  Do you see it in churches like this blogger?  No, and that's the difference, if anyone gets my drift.  To even see women agitate for it.  That it even entered their mind.  So in this regard, I'm glad there is an Ordain Women group, that are LDS.  

Hopefully someone understands what I'm getting at, I don't have a good way to explain it.    

Edited February 23, 2016 by Tacenda

[bluebell]

34 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Considering the fact that the blog has so many quotes from the Bible I'm a little surprised that more people aren't making more positive comments.

I see some "poisoning of the well" at hand here, targeted at what is written in the Bible. 

Every criticism that i've seen (i could have missed some) has been focused on this crazy man's interpretation of the bible, and not the bible.

[halconero]

53 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Considering the fact that the blog has so many quotes from the Bible I'm a little surprised that more people aren't making more positive comments.

I see some "poisoning of the well" at hand here, targeted at what is written in the Bible. 

The Westboro Baptist church has a lot of Bible quotes too.

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, bluebell said:

Every criticism that i've seen (i could have missed some) has been focused on this crazy man's interpretation of the bible, and not the bible.

Seems to me that every criticism I've seen of that man's interpretation is likely more a misinterpretion of that man's interpretation than a correct understanding of his perspective. 

I don't have any daughters myself but I have a brother in law, a member of the Church, who raised his girls in the Church with what I think would agree with that man's perspective of how a woman should be. They and their Mom are some awesomely wonderful women. And my wife also has and values the same or a similar perspective.  Considering her family and her contributions as a wife and Mom and homemaker at home to be of greater value than any job she could have ever had away from home, and better than anything any (other) "employer" or company or corporation could have ever offered her.

Maybe It might help me to see your perspective better if you told me more about what you think is wrong with that man's perspective,  especially when women prefer things the same way of their own free will.

I don't see him forcing any women to be the way he thinks they should be.  Just promoting that perspective because he prefers it above all other ways a woman can be.

[Calm]

Ahab, You did not answer any of my questions.  Let us narrow it down to one.

Do you think that the wife should be the helper of the husband, but the husband should not be the helper of the wife?

Edited February 23, 2016 by Calm

[Ahab]

12 minutes ago, Calm said:

Ahab, You did not answer any of my questions.  Let us narrow it down to one.

Do you think that the wife should be the helper of the husband, but the husband should not be the helper of the wife?

No, and don't ever ask me any more stupid questions like that.

Would you like to give a better response to what I said to you before now?

[Mars]

ways this guy's message sucks and is way off and it's not just my lack of understanding of his position:

the title - "how to help women learn their place" - it's not your job to help women learn their place.  it's not the job of any one outside that woman learn their place.  if any woman recognizes the author as authoritative, then i suppose that's understandable. 

"we have women ... no deference or respect toward men" - this is a total BS statement. 

"wives routinely shame their husbands with impunity" - do they now?  routinely?  like, all 3 billion women on the planet?  utter crap.

all the biblical verses: completely in the context of quiet servitude of a woman.  it's utter crap.  all of it.  in terms of Priesthood, women are (for now) asked to yield to their husbands who yield to God.  but to do what this blogger did, and paint the picture of out of control women who hate marriage, hate their husbands, and are bitter spiteful wenches who need to be handled by the authority of the bible _through their husband_ ? 

utter crap

 

 

Edited February 23, 2016 by Mars

[USU78]

13 hours ago, The Nehor said:

It is cute how people imagine that 1950's gender roles and biblical gender roles are almost absolutely identical.

Uhhhh  ...  I lived through more than 1/2 of the '50s, and I don't know what the heck the redded stuff means.

[Ahab]

4 minutes ago, Mars said:

ways this guy's message sucks and is way off and it's not just my lack of understanding of his position:

the title - "how to help women learn their place" - it's not your job to help women learn their place.  it's not the job of any one outside that woman learn their place.  if any woman recognizes the author as authoritative, then i suppose that's understandable. 

"we have women ... no deference or respect toward men" - this is a total BS statement. 

"wives routinely shame their husbands with impunity" - do they now?  routinely?  like, all 3 billion women on the planet?  utter crap.

all the biblical verses: completely in the context of quiet servitude of a woman.  it's utter crap.  all of it.  in terms of Priesthood, women are (for now) asked to yield to their husbands who yield to God.  but to do what this blogger did, and paint the picture of out of control women who hate marriage, hate their husbands, and are bitter spiteful wenches who need to be handled by the authority of the bible _through their husband_ ? 

utter crap

 

 

Thank you for validating my perception that you're likely not considering his perspective in the proper context,  aka misinterpreting and misunderstanding his message.

Men and women, both, together, have and should have a role in helping other women and men understand how women and men should be.  

And if you don't think so then you are just wrong about that, because it is wrong to think we should say nothing at all about how women and men should be as if we don't really care at all either way, however they want to be.

And yes there are in fact some women who shame their husbands with impunity. Acting as if what he says doesn't really matter at all if he says something she doesn't want to be hearing. Even if it is good counsel that she should accept and be thankful for hearing. Being however she wants to be, dressing however she likes, immodest or not, doing whatever she wants to do regardless of whether or not it is right or wrong just as long it is whatever she wants to be doing.

He didn't say ALL wives act like that, shaming their husbands like that, and if you think no wife would do that then you are just wrong about that.

Women need good husbands just as much if not more than men also need to have good wives.  And men and women both, together, should help each other to be how they should be.

[Calm]

33 minutes ago, Ahab said:

No, and don't ever ask me any more stupid questions like that.

Then maybe you should go back and read the blog again because that is what he is saying there:

Quote

 

Her place

She embraces the fact that God made her to be the helper to her husband, not him to be her helper

 

Quote

Would you like to give a better response to what I said to you before now?

After you answer all the questions I first posted to you.

How about this one:

Do you believe that a woman should view her husband as her master and not her equal partner?

Edited February 23, 2016 by Calm

[Mars]

i think i understand exactly where this clown is coming from, ahab.

[thesometimesaint]

37 minutes ago, USU78 said:

Uhhhh  ...  I lived through more than 1/2 of the '50s, and I don't know what the heck the redded stuff means.

Maybe this will help.

https://www.google.com/search?q=1950%27s+gender+roles&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwijurus8I7LAhVH-2MKHRwOAOYQsAQILQ&biw=1366&bih=635

[mtomm]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

Thank you for validating my perception that you're likely not considering his perspective in the proper context,  aka misinterpreting and misunderstanding his message.

 

This author might want to consider how well he is doing at getting his point across then because there are a whole bunch of folks who aren't getting it (and they wouldn't be considered people with a low IQ). 

Edited February 23, 2016 by mtomm

[Ahab]

37 minutes ago, Calm said:

Then maybe you should go back and read the blog again because that is what he is saying there:

Okay...he said that a woman should embrace the fact that God made her to be the helper to her husband, "not him to be her helper".

Think about that, again,  for a minute.

He actually said there that God did not create man to be a woman's helper.

I think he mis-spoke when he said that.

Don't you? 

I get the impression that he wants women to realize that they DO need husbands to help them fulfill their roles as women AND that men also need their wives to help them.

It's not just a one-sided thing where only women should feel they are here to help men to be men. Women should also realize that they need some men, especially their husbands, to help them.

Any other stupid questions you want to ask now?

 

[Ahab]

19 minutes ago, mtomm said:

This author might want to consider how well he is doing at getting his point across then because there are a whole bunch of folks who don't aren't getting it (and they wouldn't be considered people with a low IQ). 

Yes I agree that he isn't very eloquent but most men I know aren't very eloquent either.

As a man with similar ideas I connect with him fairly well anyway,  though, and the Spirit helps a lot in bridging the gaps.

IQ vs spiritual perception , though?

Hmm.  That would be a good topic for another thread. 

 

[mtomm]

Where's the companion post on that blog for the men? I really don't want to comb through all of them to find it. 

Edit: I think I found something of a sort  here.

He does not redeem himself.

Edited February 23, 2016 by mtomm

[Ahab]

13 minutes ago, mtomm said:

Where's the companion post on that blog for the men? I really don't want to comb through all of them to find it. 

Edit: I think I found something of a sort  here.

He does not redeem himself.

Yes, again, he is still not perfectly eloquent and his ideas could be better phrased, but still he is sharing a very good message.

Men always doing whatever their women wanted them to be doing still wouldn't solve all of the world's problems. 

[Calm]

Try this one now, Ahab:

Do you believe that a woman should view her husband as her master and not her equal partner?

[Damien the Leper]

4 minutes ago, Calm said:

Try this one now, Ahab:

Do you believe that a woman should view her husband as her master and not her equal partner?

If he agrees with this man then he likely does.

[Damien the Leper]

I like this Twitter post. It made me laugh.

[Ahab]

14 minutes ago, Calm said:

Try this one now, Ahab:

Do you believe that a woman should view her husband as her master and not her equal partner?

I think the word he used was "lord" rather than master, but yes I do agree with that idea in the proper context. 

Noble men were once commonly referred to as lords while their wives were regarded as ladies. 

Haven't you been watching Downton Abbey?

[USU78]

1 hour ago, thesometimesaint said:

Maybe this will help.

https://www.google.com/search?q=1950%27s+gender+roles&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwijurus8I7LAhVH-2MKHRwOAOYQsAQILQ&biw=1366&bih=635

I don't recognize burlesques as reflecting reality 

[Damien the Leper]

9 minutes ago, Ahab said:

I think the word he used was "lord" rather than master, but yes I do agree with that idea in the proper context. 

Noble men were once commonly referred to as lords while their wives were regarded as ladies. 

Haven't you been watching Downton Abbey?

Perhaps using lord in the context of his writing is more appropriate than a t.v. show.

Lord in a biblical context is far from the same as the Downton Abbey context. And if humor was intended in your post...It was an epically epic fail.

[pogi]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

Thank you for validating my perception that you're likely not considering his perspective in the proper context,  aka misinterpreting and misunderstanding his message.

You seem to be the only one here defending his message.  Is it possible (I know this might be difficult to conceive) that you might be the one "misinterpreting and misunderstanding his message"?  Do you know the guy or something?  I think we all agree on the proper gender roles of women, but you seem to be in the minority (the single soul) in thinking that this guy agrees with us.