Evidence That The Family Is Under Attack

[california boy]

I doubt that's the premise of the thread.

 

 

Then is the title of this thread and the OP just fear mongering?  There really is no threat to the family because some woman hates babies after all??  

[bluebell]

Then is the title of this thread and the OP just fear mongering?  There really is no threat to the family because some woman hates babies after all??

 

This as been explained a few times, so i'm not really sure why it's hard to understand.  The threat isn't that some woman hates babies. The threat is to the family unit in a society that values people who hate babies  

 

This is how Kevin G explained it-

 

"Baby Haters are not a direct threat to the family.  However the movement to gain acceptance of this anti-social behavior is a reflection of the hardening of hearts and increase in self-centered behavior."

 

This is how Busybee explained it-

 

"If you can't understand that people feeling it's ok to voice their hatred of children on a public forum is evidence that the value of families is being undermined by society then I can't help you...Society is becoming more comfortable with ideas and practices that are the antithesis of what family is about."

 

This is how Storm Rider explained it-

 

"When an individual feels completely comfortable attacking children - hating them - when they are innocent of any wrong-doing;... it is easy to understand how a member of that society could determine that the fundamental building block of society - the only entity that propagates children-could rightly assume that families are under attack."

 

This is how Meadowchick explained it-

 

"Hating what is essentially the next generation seems like a threat to the family as a cultural value.  The more there are attitudes like this, the less society becomes as a cohesive, connected network of people helping each other."

 

This is how I explained it-

 

"I think [the article is] troubling because it illustrates the existence and growing popularity of an evil mind-set. I don't believe the article is an attack on the family but rather, that it is evidence of satan's attack on the family."

 

"When hating babies becomes a valid way to live your life, then that's a sign to me that things are starting to take a turn for the worse in our society in that regard.  I don't think that we're there yet, but when people start feeling safe enough to try to make it valid, then that says something to me about the direction our society is facing."

 

To sum it all up-this woman's mindset (which is held by many others as well as her) is a sign of the growing disdain for children in our society, and that growing disdain can reasonably be interpreted to be a satanic attack on the importance of family by those who believe that satan is real and that He wants to thwart God's plan of salvation (of which families are key).

Edited October 10, 2015 by bluebell

[Scott Lloyd]

Then is the title of this thread and the OP just fear mongering?  There really is no threat to the family because some woman hates babies after all??  

I think KevinG expressed it well:

 

Baby Haters are not a direct threat to the family.  However the movement to gain acceptance of this anti-social behavior is a reflection of the hardening of hearts and increase in self-centered behavior.

 

It was prophesied that in the latter days the love of many would wax cold. I think this is in fulfillment of that prophecy. (See Doctrine and Covenants 45:27 and note the cross references.)

[Scott Lloyd]

 

This as been explained a few times, so i'm not really sure why it's hard to understand.  The threat isn't that some woman hates babies. The threat is to the family unit in a society that values people who hate babies  

 

This is how Kevin G explained it-

 

"Baby Haters are not a direct threat to the family.  However the movement to gain acceptance of this anti-social behavior is a reflection of the hardening of hearts and increase in self-centered behavior."

 

This is how Busybee explained it-

 

"If you can't understand that people feeling it's ok to voice their hatred of children on a public forum is evidence that the value of families is being undermined by society then I can't help you...Society is becoming more comfortable with ideas and practices that are the antithesis of what family is about."

 

This is how Storm Rider explained it-

 

"When an individual feels completely comfortable attacking children - hating them - when they are innocent of any wrong-doing;... it is easy to understand how a member of that society could determine that the fundamental building block of society - the only entity that propagates children-could rightly assume that families are under attack."

 

This is how Meadowchick explained it-

 

"Hating what is essentially the next generation seems like a threat to the family as a cultural value.  The more there are attitudes like this, the less society becomes as a cohesive, connected network of people helping each other."

 

This is how I explained it-

 

"I think [the article is] troubling because it illustrates the existence and growing popularity of an evil mind-set. I don't believe the article is an attack on the family but rather, that it is evidence of satan's attack on the family."

 

"When hating babies becomes a valid way to live your life, then that's a sign to me that things are starting to take a turn for the worse in our society in that regard.  I don't think that we're there yet, but when people start feeling safe enough to try to make it valid, then that says something to me about the direction our society is facing."

 

To sum it all up-this woman's mindset (which is held by many others as well as her) is a sign of the growing disdain for children in our society, and that growing disdain can reasonably be interpreted to be a satanic attack on the importance of family by those who believe that satan is real and that He wants to thwart God's plan of salvation (of which families are key).

You pre-empted me, bluebell!

 

But thanks for explaining it so well and showing that KevinG is not the only one who has explained it. Like you, I don't see why it should be so hard to understand.

[california boy]

I have read these statement.  I get that the latest fad Mormons seem to have is that everyone and everything is attacking the family.  That satan is behind it all and the family is doomed for all time.  Society is headed for complete imploding and the family is going to go the way of the dinosaur.  I am just amazed at all the fear mongering that seems to be so prevalent among Mormon  circles.  (Read the thread on fear for more of this kind of discussion.)  

 

I am sorry, but anyone who wants to have a family is free to do so.  People don't decide to get married and have a family because it is popular or because society approves of this idea.  They get married because they find someone to share their life with and want to have children.  It is that simple.  The thing that threatens families is like economics (mentioned and mostly ignored in this thread) is a much bigger threat to the family than a segment of society that has no interest in raising children.  Divorce is a bigger threat to the family than any other single issue.  People having children that don't really want them is a bigger threat to families than this woman who hates babies.  

 

So let me go through each of these statement and give you my take on them.  See Red.

 

 

 
This as been explained a few times, so i'm not really sure why it's hard to understand.  The threat isn't that some woman hates babies. The threat is to the family unit in a society that values people who hate babies  

 

This is how Kevin G explained it-
 
"Baby Haters are not a direct threat to the family.  However the movement to gain acceptance of this anti-social behavior is a reflection of the hardening of hearts and increase in self-centered behavior."

 

Where is there any proof that this "movement" is gaining acceptance?  It is one article.

 

This is how Busybee explained it-

 

"If you can't understand that people feeling it's ok to voice their hatred of children on a public forum is evidence that the value of families is being undermined by society then I can't help you...Society is becoming more comfortable with ideas and practices that are the antithesis of what family is about."

 

We live in a country where free speech is an integral part of our belief system.  People can say and believe just about anything.  Just because someone says something doesn't make it true, nor does it make it a movement.  Show me some proof that people feel it is ok to hate children. What are the actual statistics.  How big of problem is this??   If is all it takes is one magazine article to prove something to be true, we have a  lot bigger issues to worry about than people not wanting children.

 

This is how Storm Rider explained it-

 

"When an individual feels completely comfortable attacking children - hating them - when they are innocent of any wrong-doing;... it is easy to understand how a member of that society could determine that the fundamental building block of society - the only entity that propagates children-could rightly assume that families are under attack."

 

Why shouldn't people feel completely comfortable voicing their opinion about hating children.  We live in a free society.  People daily say things about hating blacks, homosexuals, Muslins, or anyone else that is not exactly like them.  This has been going on for centuries  It doesn't mean that society accepts or supports that hate.  Show me where there is any indication that society tolerates hatred for babies. 

 

This is how Meadowchick explained it-

 

"Hating what is essentially the next generation seems like a threat to the family as a cultural value.  The more there are attitudes like this, the less society becomes as a cohesive, connected network of people helping each other."

 

HUH?  Hating babies is now a cultural value?  This woman and whatever others that are out there that hate babies is going to completely unravel how people connect?  Really? Just how far does the fear mongering go?  Are we really looking at the last generation of children on the face of the earth?  

 

This is how I explained it-

 

"I think [the article is] troubling because it illustrates the existence and growing popularity of an evil mind-set. I don't believe the article is an attack on the family but rather, that it is evidence of satan's attack on the family."

 

"When hating babies becomes a valid way to live your life, then that's a sign to me that things are starting to take a turn for the worse in our society in that regard.  I don't think that we're there yet, but when people start feeling safe enough to try to make it valid, then that says something to me about the direction our society is facing."

 

So give me your best estimate here.  What percentage of the population hates babies?  Just how popular is this attitude?  How fast is this trend catching on?  Hating babies has ALWAYS been a valid way for some people to live their lives.  But that number has always been a very small percentage of the population.  Do you really think that this is the first time in recent history where someone didn't want anything to do with children?  Do you have any statistical evidence that this attitude is increasing?  Just how many baby haters do you know?  I will look at any proof that you think is valid.  Or do you think a single magazine article confirms your greatest fears.  Cause if that is the case, you must be terrified to read any magazine.  There are some pretty scary articles out there.  

 

To sum it all up-this woman's mindset (which is held by many others as well as her) is a sign of the growing disdain for children in our society, and that growing disdain can reasonably be interpreted to be a satanic attack on the importance of family by those who believe that satan is real and that He wants to thwart God's plan of salvation (of which families are key).

 

To sum it up, this is one article in one magazine.  It is a woman who has expressed her attitudes towards babies.  We have absolutely no idea why she even hates babies.  But some Mormons take this one kernel of information and manage to pop an entire bag of popcorn of fear and doom of the family unit with it.  Predictions that society is headed in this direction.  It is a threat to the institution of the family.  Satan is going to destroy everyone's family.  The plan of salvation is doomed.  Men's hearts have waxed cold.  This article is exactly what the writers of the Bible saw happening right before the end of the world.  Oh the calamity.  Why?  Oh yeah.  Some woman hates babies and some magazine thought that attitude was so bazaar that they wanted to do an article about it.  

 

Hey.  I am just trying to provide a little perspective on how insignificant this whole idea is.  For some reason, I believe in the bright future for my children and their children than Mormons do.  I have total confidence that they will fall in love and want to form their own family.  Yes they will have struggles.  Yes society will not share the same values as they do.

 

If you want to believe that the family is under attack because some magazine prints an article about some woman who hates children, and you think that is a rational thought, then be my guest.  I am certainly not going to stop you.That is not news.

[rodheadlee]

You really do need to familiarize yourself with who is on welfare.

Oh I see them cash their checks every month. The lady in front of me at the bank got more money from welfare than I got for working a month.

[rodheadlee]

Ok,I will bite.  Where is the future fo families as a culture headed because some magazine found a woman who hates babies?

Selfies.I mean selfish and it's not just one woman.

[bluebell]

If you want to believe that the family is under attack because some magazine prints an article about some woman who hates children, and you think that is a rational thought, then be my guest. I am certainly not going to stop you.

Thanks for your permission. Means a lot.

[sunstoned]

I have read these statement.  I get that the latest fad Mormons seem to have is that everyone and everything is attacking the family.  That satan is behind it all and the family is doomed for all time.  Society is headed for complete imploding and the family is going to go the way of the dinosaur.  I am just amazed at all the fear mongering that seems to be so prevalent among Mormon  circles.  (Read the thread on fear for more of this kind of discussion.)  

 

I am sorry, but anyone who wants to have a family is free to do so.  People don't decide to get married and have a family because it is popular or because society approves of this idea.  They get married because they find someone to share their life with and want to have children.  It is that simple.  The thing that threatens families is like economics (mentioned and mostly ignored in this thread) is a much bigger threat to the family than a segment of society that has no interest in raising children.  Divorce is a bigger threat to the family than any other single issue.  People having children that don't really want them is a bigger threat to families than this woman who hates babies.  

 

So let me go through each of these statement and give you my take on them.  See Red.

 

 

 

To sum it up, this is one article in one magazine.  It is a woman who has expressed her attitudes towards babies.  We have absolutely no idea why she even hates babies.  But some Mormons take this one kernel of information and manage to pop an entire bag of popcorn of fear and doom of the family unit with it.  Predictions that society is headed in this direction.  It is a threat to the institution of the family.  Satan is going to destroy everyone's family.  The plan of salvation is doomed.  Men's hearts have waxed cold.  This article is exactly what the writers of the Bible saw happening right before the end of the world.  Oh the calamity.  Why?  Oh yeah.  Some woman hates babies and some magazine thought that attitude was so bazaar that they wanted to do an article about it.  

 

Hey.  I am just trying to provide a little perspective on how insignificant this whole idea is.  For some reason, I believe in the bright future for my children and their children than Mormons do.  I have total confidence that they will fall in love and want to form their own family.  Yes they will have struggles.  Yes society will not share the same values as they do.

 

If you want to believe that the family is under attack because some magazine prints an article about some woman who hates children, and you think that is a rational thought, then be my guest.  I am certainly not going to stop you.That is not news.

Thank you CB for providing some grounding to this thread.  It seems some people go looking for anything they possibly spin as a threat to their way of thinking.  

[Tacenda]

http://www.theguardian.com/film/filmblog/2014/may/20/scary-moments-childrens-films-kids-movies-creepy-toy-story-horror

The child catcher on Chitty Chitty Bang Bang wasn't fond of children also.

[Meadowchik]

I have read these statement.  I get that the latest fad Mormons seem to have is that everyone and everything is attacking the family.  That satan is behind it all and the family is doomed for all time.  Society is headed for complete imploding and the family is going to go the way of the dinosaur.  I am just amazed at all the fear mongering that seems to be so prevalent among Mormon  circles.  (Read the thread on fear for more of this kind of discussion.)  

 

I am sorry, but anyone who wants to have a family is free to do so.  People don't decide to get married and have a family because it is popular or because society approves of this idea.  They get married because they find someone to share their life with and want to have children.  It is that simple.  The thing that threatens families is like economics (mentioned and mostly ignored in this thread) is a much bigger threat to the family than a segment of society that has no interest in raising children.  Divorce is a bigger threat to the family than any other single issue.  People having children that don't really want them is a bigger threat to families than this woman who hates babies.  

 

So let me go through each of these statement and give you my take on them.  See Red.

 

 

 

To sum it up, this is one article in one magazine.  It is a woman who has expressed her attitudes towards babies.  We have absolutely no idea why she even hates babies.  But some Mormons take this one kernel of information and manage to pop an entire bag of popcorn of fear and doom of the family unit with it.  Predictions that society is headed in this direction.  It is a threat to the institution of the family.  Satan is going to destroy everyone's family.  The plan of salvation is doomed.  Men's hearts have waxed cold.  This article is exactly what the writers of the Bible saw happening right before the end of the world.  Oh the calamity.  Why?  Oh yeah.  Some woman hates babies and some magazine thought that attitude was so bazaar that they wanted to do an article about it.  

 

Hey.  I am just trying to provide a little perspective on how insignificant this whole idea is.  For some reason, I believe in the bright future for my children and their children than Mormons do.  I have total confidence that they will fall in love and want to form their own family.  Yes they will have struggles.  Yes society will not share the same values as they do.

 

If you want to believe that the family is under attack because some magazine prints an article about some woman who hates children, and you think that is a rational thought, then be my guest.  I am certainly not going to stop you.That is not news.

 

"Hating what is essentially the next generation seems like a threat to the family as a cultural value.  The more there are attitudes like this, the less society becomes as a cohesive, connected network of people helping each other."

 

HUH?  Hating babies is now a cultural value?  This woman and whatever others that are out there that hate babies is going to completely unravel how people connect?  Really? Just how far does the fear mongering go?  Are we really looking at the last generation of children on the face of the earth? 

 

 

You're the one doing the sensationalizing.  I qualified my words and didn't make horrible mass predictions.

 

Personally, I'm not seeing this attitude from the partisan lens of "attack on the family," but moreso of the problems posed by the attitude itself...me making a comment doesn't represent some wholesale agreement with one side of some imagined binary battle.

 

For me, "hating" babies and children whether you're a woman or man, seems like such a horrible disconnect from the nature of self, of being human and social, of being part of a big connected, interdependent world.  I really don't get it.

[thesometimesaint]

Oh I see them cash their checks every month. The lady in front of me at the bank got more money from welfare than I got for working a month.

 

Driving away in her big black new Cadillac.

[Zakuska]

http://www.theguardian.com/film/filmblog/2014/may/20/scary-moments-childrens-films-kids-movies-creepy-toy-story-horror

The child catcher on Chitty Chitty Bang Bang wasn't fond of children also.

Neither was the Trunchable.

 

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0117008/

[AddamS]

The author isn't saying she wants to grab every baby she sees and stomp it into paste.

 

She's just saying she doesn't like being around them.

 

Just be happy she's making the choice not have children and giving voice to help other women who shouldn't have children permission to feel OK about it.

 

There are more than enough people out there having kids that shouldn't be.

[Gray]

 

To sum it all up-this woman's mindset (which is held by many others as well as her) is a sign of the growing disdain for children in our society, and that growing disdain can reasonably be interpreted to be a satanic attack on the importance of family by those who believe that satan is real and that He wants to thwart God's plan of salvation (of which families are key).

 

I'm not convinced it's a sign of growing disdain. Is it obnoxious and narcissistic? Yes. Plus a heavy dose of trolling.

[jkwilliams]

I'm not convinced it's a sign of growing disdain. Is it obnoxious and narcissistic? Yes. Plus a heavy dose of trolling.

Yep. I'm not surprised that there are nutjobs like this woman out there or that someone at Salon thought giving her a soapbox would bring in readers (mission accomplished), but I am surprised that people are extrapolating a societal trend from this woman's rantings. Salon is trolling us, big time.

[Gray]

The author isn't saying she wants to grab every baby she sees and stomp it into paste.

 

She's just saying she doesn't like being around them.

 

Just be happy she's making the choice not have children and giving voice to help other women who shouldn't have children permission to feel OK about it.

 

There are more than enough people out there having kids that shouldn't be.

 

The good news is she won't be passing anything on to her kids. 

[bluebell]

Yep. I'm not surprised that there are nutjobs like this woman out there or that someone at Salon thought giving her a soapbox would bring in readers (mission accomplished), but I am surprised that people are extrapolating a societal trend from this woman's rantings. Salon is trolling us, big time.

 

My only evidence is anecdotal.  I read a couple of blogs on this topic every week (not on hating babies, but on not wanting babies because it means the person can't be selfish).  It wasn't like that a few years ago.

 

I'm sure there have always been a lot of women who didn't want babies for that reason, but from my perspective, it's only been in the last couple of years that they have felt safe enough to tell the world that.

 

I know this is only my opinion, but that seems like a social trend to me.

[jkwilliams]

My only evidence is anecdotal. I read a couple of blogs on this topic every week (not on hating babies, but on not wanting babies because it means the person can't be selfish). It wasn't like that a few years ago.

I'm sure there have always been a lot of women who didn't want babies for that reason, but from my perspective, it's only been in the last couple of years that they have felt safe enough to tell the world that.

I know this is only my opinion, but that seems like a social trend to me.

I hope it isn't.