Reinstatement

[Bexyboo]

Hi, 

 

I'm wondering if anyone can tell me what to expect from asking to reinstate my membership? I'm not exactly sure how i feel about the church, i just know i wish i hadn't resigned. On impulse and under some duress i sent in my resignation paper 2ish months ago and now i'm regretting it. I'm a convert to the church and went inactive approx 6 months after joining, i grew up in a ultra orordox church and so belonging to any church makes me feel hideously uncomfortable, I was inactive for 3 and a bit years when i started visiting with the missionaries and asking questions again, i had even attended church a few times, but after reading the church was once again attacking LBGTI rights,i made the impulse decision to resign. I don't have a problem with the churches position on LBGTI lifestyles, the church is free to believe as they choose, but trying to force the political and human rights of non members makes me sick. It's non of the churches business, they wouldn't like it if sharia law became federal law would they???? Anyway i decided on impulse to remove my name but two months later i am regretting it because i am neither sure the church is false or true. I have been doing research via mormon think and finding inconsistencies and logically fallacies to the anti mormon arguments presented. Don't get me wrong mormons theology is loopy but i am not finding sufficient evidence at this stage to decide for myself that jo smith was a charlatan. Hence i wanted to ask to cancel to resignation, but is that even possible????

 

Many Thanks

 

Becca 

[Tacenda]

One thing you don't want to do is call Joseph, jo.

Other than that your first step is to call some missionaries, or look in the phone book to find your ward meeting house and talk to the bishop, or church office building. Pretty sure they'll give you another chance to join, unless you've got ulterior motives.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Tacenda

[Bexyboo]

Really, you can't call Joseph Jo? why not? I'll pop into my local ward Sunday or else call the missionaries tomorrow and see how i go. I don't have ulterior motives i just really can't decide how i feel, and now i'm wishing i hadn't made such a permanent decision. I might not have been attending church for the past 3ish years but i've always kept up with church literature online and conference etc...

[rodheadlee]

Cool, come on back. Just look up your local meetinghouse on the Church website and go see the Bishop. We all have things we need Jesus Christ to set straight for us.

[bluebell]

Calling Joseph "Joe" will instantly make active members uncomfortable because anti Mormons call him that in an attempt to be disrespectful and show disdain and contempt.

If you don't want to deal with giving the wrong impression then it's best to call him by his full name.

As for returning, you should get a hold of your bishop ASAP to discuss it. If it has already gone thru you will probably have to wait a year to be rebaptized, which could be a good thing since you don't have a testimony right now.

Good luck!

[Bexyboo]

Interesting i didn't realize that about Joseph Smith, i tend to abbreviate everything, goodness knows how many times i've already offended people. I wonder why no one ever mentioned it before, oh well. 

 

My resignation has gone through already, i just logged onto my account to check, and it'd gone through. A year isn't a bad thing, at least i won't be pressured to hurry up and get baptized. In retrospect i wish i hadn't gotten baptized when i did, i wasn't ready for the commitment.

 

Thanks

[Garden Girl]

Hello Bexyboo...

Let me encourage you, as have others, to see your bishop ASAP... talk honestly and openly to him... and then, I hope you will use the year waiting period to study with the missionaries again, and on your own... Let me share an experience with you that I've told here on the board previously but I hope others will be patient with my repeat...

I've been participating on this Board since 2005 and sometimes the board can become quite lively.  There was one discussion where a couple critics made some good points, and while my faith was not actually shaken, they did give me pause.  So much so that it bothered me for a couple of weeks... it was time for Oct 2009 Gen Conf.  I was settling down to watch the Saturday morning opening session... the Choir was singing a beautiful hymn ... my mind was clear and only on the beautiful music... All of a sudden into my mind and heart came the words:  Do Not Be Afraid... The gospel is correct... Stay faithful... Stay true... and then I felt this wonderful joy along with a sense of peace and assuredness.  So I say to you, do not be afraid... read, study, pray and fast... and good luck...

 

GG   

[thesometimesaint]

Interesting i didn't realize that about Joseph Smith, i tend to abbreviate everything, goodness knows how many times i've already offended people. I wonder why no one ever mentioned it before, oh well. 

 

My resignation has gone through already, i just logged onto my account to check, and it'd gone through. A year isn't a bad thing, at least i won't be pressured to hurry up and get baptized. In retrospect i wish i hadn't gotten baptized when i did, i wasn't ready for the commitment.

 

Thanks

 

We will always welcome you back. That being said you do have a number of issues with the Church that need to be resolved before you recommit to baptism Take your time, study, pray, seek guidance from spiritual leaders in the Church.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

but after reading the church was once again attacking LBGTI rights,i made the impulse decision to resign. I don't have a problem with the churches position on LBGTI lifestyles, the church is free to believe as they choose, but trying to force the political and human rights of non members makes me sick.

Many Thanks

 

Becca 

 

 

Um yeah............, were are going to need you to come in on....... Sunday..... Mmmmmmmmmm Kay?

 

The church never tried to "trying to force the political and human rights of non members".

 

It has no power or authority to do so.

 

 

On another note, welcome back.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Mola Ram Suda Ram

[Kenngo1969]

It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the price of [herbal ] tea in China; I'm just curious.  It may be too personal for you to share publicly [albeit anonymously], but what, exactly, do you mean when you say you resigned "under some duress"?  

 

And, while I don't wish to sow contention (especially not here in the Social Hall, where such a thing is verboten, I would like to point out that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is hardly alone among churches (or even among a broader category of social groups favoring a conservative position on marriage, which includes, but is not limited to, churches) in believing that traditional marriage is ordained of God and that sex outside of marriage is contrary to God's commandments.  And the concept that homosexual marriage is a human right is of extremely recent vintage.  Applying that concept to heterosexual marriage, since I have a "right" to get married, solving my long-term bachelor status ought to be a simple for me as finding someone who I think would be a suitable candidate, bopping her over the head, having the requisite ceremony performed while she's unconscious, and ... well, she'll get used to the idea eventually after she wakes up! Voila! Previously confirmed, long-term bachelorhood resolved!  

 

It seems to me that we ought to make a serious effort to understand why a boundary delineating acceptable conduct (traditional marriage) from previously unacceptable conduct (same-sex marriage) was erected before rushing to remove such a boundary. While no one wishes to be considered by his fellows to be "on the wrong side of history," to be a "bigot," and so on, it does seem to me ... consistent with the position of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on the issue ... that not nearly enough consideration of why society so long has favored traditional marriage while historically eschewing forms of more recent vintage has occurred.  My $0.02.  I wish you well.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Kenngo1969

[thesometimesaint]

It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the price of [herbal ] tea in China; I'm just curious.  It may be too personal for you to share publicly [albeit anonymously], but what, exactly, do you mean when you say you resigned "under some duress"?  

 

And, while I don't wish to sow contention (especially not here in the Social Hall, where such a thing is verboten, I would like to point out that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is hardly alone among churches (or even among a broader category of social groups favoring a conservative position on marriage, which includes, but is not limited to, churches) in believing that traditional marriage is ordained of God and that sex outside of marriage is contrary to God's commandments.  And the concept that homosexual marriage is a human right is of extremely recent vintage.  Applying that concept to heterosexual marriage, since I have a "right" to get married, solving my long-term bachelor status ought to be a simple for me as finding someone who I think would be a suitable candidate, bopping her over the head, having the requisite ceremony performed while she's unconscious, and ... well, she'll get used to the idea eventually after she wakes up! Voila! Previously confirmed, long-term bachelorhood resolved!  

 

It seems to me that we ought to make a serious effort to understand why a boundary delineating acceptable conduct (traditional marriage) from previously unacceptable conduct (same-sex marriage) was erected before rushing to remove such a boundary. While no one wishes to be considered by his fellows to be "on the wrong side of history," to be a "bigot," and so on, it does seem to me ... consistent with the position of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on the issue ... that not nearly enough consideration of why society so long has favored traditional marriage while historically eschewing forms of more recent vintage has occurred.  My $0.02.  I wish you well.

 

It is a bit more complicated than that.

SEE http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/12/michigan-house-stalls-gay-rights-bill-after-pastor-testifies-there-are-no-lgbt-water-fountains/

[Guest]

Hi, 

 

I'm wondering if anyone can tell me what to expect from asking to reinstate my membership? I'm not exactly sure how i feel about the church, i just know i wish i hadn't resigned. On impulse and under some duress i sent in my resignation paper 2ish months ago and now i'm regretting it. I'm a convert to the church and went inactive approx 6 months after joining, i grew up in a ultra orordox church and so belonging to any church makes me feel hideously uncomfortable, I was inactive for 3 and a bit years when i started visiting with the missionaries and asking questions again, i had even attended church a few times, but after reading the church was once again attacking LBGTI rights,i made the impulse decision to resign. I don't have a problem with the churches position on LBGTI lifestyles, the church is free to believe as they choose, but trying to force the political and human rights of non members makes me sick. It's non of the churches business, they wouldn't like it if sharia law became federal law would they???? Anyway i decided on impulse to remove my name but two months later i am regretting it because i am neither sure the church is false or true. I have been doing research via mormon think and finding inconsistencies and logically fallacies to the anti mormon arguments presented. Don't get me wrong mormons theology is loopy but i am not finding sufficient evidence at this stage to decide for myself that jo smith was a charlatan. Hence i wanted to ask to cancel to resignation, but is that even possible????

 

Many Thanks

 

Becca

The Bishop first.

[rpn]

If I were in your place, I would send a letter to the same place you sent your resignation and tell them what you told us (at least the part about your doing in a mixed up time and under duress) and ask if there is a way to rescind your resignation?   

 

They may write back and tell you that you'll have to go through the teaching and baptism process.   But the reason that they typically wait 30 days is that some do change their mind.    Would be help for you to ask.

[Kenngo1969]

It is a bit more complicated than that.

SEE http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/12/michigan-house-stalls-gay-rights-bill-after-pastor-testifies-there-are-no-lgbt-water-fountains/

I'm not sure how your link is responsive to my post.

[Avatar4321]

Follow the counsel there been given. We have would love to have you back. I would encourage you to study your scriptures and say your daily prayers so you can know for yourself that the church is true.

[Bexyboo]

It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the price of [herbal ] tea in China; I'm just curious.  It may be too personal for you to share publicly [albeit anonymously], but what, exactly, do you mean when you say you resigned "under some duress"?  

 

The short explanation is, i felt "obligated" by members of the church to have a big emotional spiritual experience and pressured by my ex mo friends to "make up my mind" and of course by make up my mind, what they really meant was "accept Joesph Smith was a fraud and evolution is a fact"  My problem now is i've been doing personal research on the "facts" they gave me about they church and why left, but personally i don't feel those "facts" are valid. For example I have begun reading Mormon think for myself and I am finding many inconsistencies and “cherry picked” arguments. For example, my friend and Mormon think claim Joseph was a great story teller and thus the book of Mormon is just another work of fiction like for example Lord of the Rings. But after checking for myself I find the “great stories” they claim, Joseph’s mother talked about, were in fact BOM stories and only started after the first vision. They also claim Joseph copied much of the BOM from the book “View of the Hebrews” but then claim that book was only released 5 years before the BOM. The arguments make no sense, either Joseph began citing BOM stories as a kid after the first vision, as his mother claimed or, he copied the whole BOM from another book. They also claim Joseph could not have been as illiterate as Emma and others stated because both Joseph Snr and Hyrum were part time school teachers, but why then did they not also teach him proper grammar. I am yet to meet a teacher who isn’t a “grammar nazi”

 

Mormon think and my friend claim that if one problem can be found then surely that brings into question the whole LDS teachings, by that definition I can apply the same theory to Mormon think and my friends’ logic. Currently I am not personally sure what to believe, I was a Jehovah witnesses till the age of 24 and spent 7 years in full time preaching service to them. Losing my faith was one of the most traumatic experiences of my life, I would not wish that loss and subsequent emptiness on anyone, but for the same reason I am hesitant to blindly follow another religious organisation. I have often felt that I was baptised too soon and before I had a proper knowledge and foundation in the LDS faith, but similarly I am not now comfortable to hastily remove my name from LDS membership records on what now appears to be the illegitimate hearsay. 

 

I have said exactly this in my letter to the bishop and SLC asking for reinstatement.

[Bexyboo]

Hello Bexyboo...

Let me encourage you, as have others, to see your bishop ASAP... talk honestly and openly to him... and then, I hope you will use the year waiting period to study with the missionaries again, and on your own... Let me share an experience with you that I've told here on the board previously but I hope others will be patient with my repeat...

I've been participating on this Board since 2005 and sometimes the board can become quite lively.  There was one discussion where a couple critics made some good points, and while my faith was not actually shaken, they did give me pause.  So much so that it bothered me for a couple of weeks... it was time for Oct 2009 Gen Conf.  I was settling down to watch the Saturday morning opening session... the Choir was singing a beautiful hymn ... my mind was clear and only on the beautiful music... All of a sudden into my mind and heart came the words:  Do Not Be Afraid... The gospel is correct... Stay faithful... Stay true... and then I felt this wonderful joy along with a sense of peace and assuredness.  So I say to you, do not be afraid... read, study, pray and fast... and good luck...

 

GG   

 

Hey GG, Thank you so much for this experience, it is comforting to read. <3

[Bexyboo]

If I were in your place, I would send a letter to the same place you sent your resignation and tell them what you told us (at least the part about your doing in a mixed up time and under duress) and ask if there is a way to rescind your resignation?   

 

They may write back and tell you that you'll have to go through the teaching and baptism process.   But the reason that they typically wait 30 days is that some do change their mind.    Would be help for you to ask.

 

Thanks Rpn, i've done just that and i've sent a copy to my local Bishop

[Bexyboo]

Um yeah............, were are going to need you to come in on....... Sunday..... Mmmmmmmmmm Kay?

 

The church never tried to "trying to force the political and human rights of non members".

 

It has no power or authority to do so.

 

 

On another note, welcome back.

 

According to a recent article in the dessert news, the church along with other churches are applying to the supreme court in the USA to abolish lbgti marriage in the states,not just Utah. I don't have a problem with any church refusing to marry any person including LBGTI people inside thier own churches, but no church should have the authority petition government to abolish the rights of others because they believe they own the rights to the marriage rite. Under that pretense, any non religious heterosexual person should also be refused marriage rites. I believe religions have the right to defend their religious freedoms but those freedoms should not be enforced upon non-members. 

[Calm]

Btw...

School teachers back then weren't even close to what is expected now. I have a great great great grandmother who attended schools for maybe five years and then at the age of 14 or so "graduated" and became a school teacher herself. I suspect if we looked at today's level she probably did not have more than a grade 6 level, basic math and reading....she said she was an excellent speller, but that does not always indicate a lot of education, just a focus on spelling or a natural talent. My grandmother had a high school degree and won many a spelling competition, otoh my husband has a Ph.D and before spell check his spelling IMO was worse than most middle schoolers.

If you are interested in research, be sure and check out Fairmormon.org (if you havent already) which does quite well IMO of summarising both the criticisms and the evidence against them. We will also be happy to answer any question you can't find a response for or wish to go into more depth with.

For specific instances dealing with the inaccurate methodology of Mormon Think, see: http://en.fairmormon.org/Criticism_of_Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink

Edited December 5, 2014 by calmoriah

[Calm]

According to a recent article in the dessert news, the church along with other churches are applying to the supreme court in the USA to abolish lbgti marriage in the states,not just Utah. I don't have a problem with any church refusing to marry any person including LBGTI people inside thier own churches, but no church should have the authority petition government to abolish the rights of others because they believe they own the rights to the marriage rite. Under that pretense, any non religious heterosexual person should also be refused marriage rites. I believe religions have the right to defend their religious freedoms but those freedoms should not be enforced upon non-members.

To me it is quite interesting that the LDS Church has put significant effort into the legal discussion of same sex marriage in the States while not doing very much in other countries. I have also talked to some lawyer friends who have been keeping a very close eye on stated positons and arguments made who view the Church's involvement as more preparation for future legal arguments that will potentially put the Church into difficult legal positions (think arguments against BYU and other church owned endeavours as much or more than religious ceremonies).

However if someone disagrees politically with the Church's position, there should be no penalty on anyone in terms of holding a temple recommend as long as one does not go to the extreme of publicly pushing for the Church itself to change its standards, attacking leadership, etc. Socially there may be members who are offended, unfortunately many mix political beliefs with religious ones to the point of labelling other faithful members as apostates, but in my experience this type of member is the exception though they may be vocal.

My personal hope would be for government to get out of the marriage business and instead just subsidize behaviours that have been demonstrated to benefit society in general directly (rather than pushing marriage because it produces stable families for raising future taxpayers, reward stable families with two long term caregivers, ie. parents or even just relatives such as grandparents or two siblings who have combines resources to raise children together, who stay together for 5 years get a tax benefit, 10 years increases it, etc.). Have civil contracts that are the same across the board and let the churches have whatever rules they want for performing marriages. This is different from the LDS Church's official position, but I have never run into any problem with members or leaders for holding it.

Btw, Social Hall isn't the best place for political discussions as it will get threads shut down (debate is not allowed for this part of the board, it is meant to be informative and supportive and fun only, debate is reserved for the other forums). There is an extensive thread on same sex legal discussions in the In The News section and various others in the General Discussions as well. When you get to 25 posts, besides editing your posts you will also be able to start threads in those sections if you would like to discuss politics, but moderators keep a close eye on those types of discussions and generally shut them down if someone starts proclaiming a faithful Saint must hold 'this' particular political position or only a certain political party aligns with the Gospel, etc.

Edited December 5, 2014 by calmoriah

[Bexyboo]

If you are interested in research, be sure and check out Fairmormon.org (if you havent already) which does quite well IMO of summarising both the criticisms and the evidence against them. We will also be happy to answer any question you can't find a response for or wish to go into more depth with.

For specific instances dealing with the inaccurate methodology of Mormon Think, see: http://en.fairmormon.org/Criticism_of_Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink

 

Wow Calmoriah, thanks for the tips,i'm looking up fair mormon now. :-)

[Bexyboo]

Wow Calmoriah, thanks for the tips,i'm looking up fair mormon now. :-)

 

Fair Mormon is supposed to be impartial but from what i've read it's passive aggressive and bias, it's a transparent agenda imo is to discredit the LDS church. Suffice to say i have not found it impartial enough to behelpful

[Bexyboo]

To me it is quite interesting that the LDS Church has put significant effort into the legal discussion of same sex marriage in the States while not doing very much in other countries. I have also talked to some lawyer friends who have been keeping a very close eye on stated positons and arguments made who view the Church's involvement as more preparation for future legal arguments that will potentially put the Church into difficult legal positions (think arguments against BYU and other church owned endeavours as much or more than religious ceremonies).

However if someone disagrees politically with the Church's position, there should be no penalty on anyone in terms of holding a temple recommend as long as one does not go to the extreme of publicly pushing for the Church itself to change its standards, attacking leadership, etc. Socially there may be members who are offended, unfortunately many mix political beliefs with religious ones to the point of labelling other faithful members as apostates, but in my experience this type of member is the exception though they may be vocal.

My personal hope would be for government to get out of the marriage business and instead just subsidize behaviours that have been demonstrated to benefit society in general directly (rather than pushing marriage because it produces stable families for raising future taxpayers, reward stable families with two long term caregivers, ie. parents or even just relatives such as grandparents or two siblings who have combines resources to raise children together, who stay together for 5 years get a tax benefit, 10 years increases it, etc.). Have civil contracts that are the same across the board and let the churches have whatever rules they want for performing marriages. This is different from the LDS Church's official position, but I have never run into any problem with members or leaders for holding it.

Btw, Social Hall isn't the best place for political discussions as it will get threads shut down (debate is not allowed for this part of the board, it is meant to be informative and supportive and fun only, debate is reserved for the other forums). There is an extensive thread on same sex legal discussions in the In The News section and various others in the General Discussions as well. When you get to 25 posts, besides editing your posts you will also be able to start threads in those sections if you would like to discuss politics, but moderators keep a close eye on those types of discussions and generally shut them down if someone starts proclaiming a faithful Saint must hold 'this' particular political position or only a certain political party aligns with the Gospel, etc.

 

Interesting i have never given any thought to why the church is only attempting legal discussion in the USA. I'll have to give that some thought, that is after all the bigger picture. 

 

Thanks for the tip on social hall, i will remember that in the future. 

[Ham Clam]

Fair Mormon is supposed to be impartial but from what i've read it's passive aggressive and bias, it's a transparent agenda imo is to discredit the LDS church. Suffice to say i have not found it impartial enough to behelpful

FAIRMormon is our largest apologetics group out there. As an apologetics group, I wouldn't call it totally "unbiaist", but it's a good place to look at the positive and springboard into more learning. Frankly, Mormonism takes a heck of a long time to understand. Check out their bookstore for some good recommendations.

There is also the Mormon History Association (MHA) publication. They have many issues archived.

Greg Kofford Books is a great Mormon book publisher.

And don't forget BYU Studies or the Maxwell Institute!

 

Good Luck.