What Constitutes A Modest Living Allowance?

[Thinking]

Once again the modest living allowances of the GA's are being discussed. One of the reasons that this topic is frequently resurrected is the ambiguity of the word modest. What do you think is a modest living allowance?

[ERayR]

Modest compared to what?  What is one expected to cover with this stipend?  Modest would be enough to cover the cost of adequate but not ostentatious housing, wholesome food and presentable clothing appropriate for what one does.  In some areas $100,000 would be modest.  In other parts of the world $300 would be modest. 

[saemo]

Ha, reminds me of a class I was in once, where the leader asked us to self-define our income bracket. Low income, lower middle class, middle class, upper middle calss rich. Almost everyone in the room said "middle class". The leader then went on to point out, that middle class is what everyone answers in her class, but when pressed for details, most people are lower middle class.

 

The median annual income in Utah, is ~$42K. In the US it is ~55K. If you are at that level, with a family of four, I pronounce you "modest"! (I'm using a fairy wand and everything.)

[Calm]

I am immodest then...

[ERayR]

I am immodest then...

 

You do have a way with words.

[Ahab]

Ha, reminds me of a class I was in once, where the leader asked us to self-define our income bracket. Low income, lower middle class, middle class, upper middle calss rich. Almost everyone in the room said "middle class". The leader then went on to point out, that middle class is what everyone answers in her class, but when pressed for details, most people are lower middle class.

The median annual income in Utah, is ~$42K. In the US it is ~55K. If you are at that level, with a family of four, I pronounce you "modest"! (I'm using a fairy wand and everything.)

Wow how did you do that??? And retroactively too!!!

I'd like to someday be a little more than modest but for now what I have will have to do.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Ahab

[saemo]

Wow how did you do that??? And retroactively too!!!

I'd like to someday be a little more than modest but for now what I have will have to do.

Sorry, I'd like to discuss how I did that but I'm under an NDA.

 

I've met very few people on online forums who are modest. The humble (as my family calls those in poverty), are even rarer online. They have no voice in our building the world via internet bartering and consensus.

[katherine the great]

In my world a thousand dollars a month per person is modest--two thousand dollars a month per couple. For a family of seven, seven thousand dollars a month would provide a modest living.

[Stargazer]

My first thought was: "Oh, fer cryin' out loud, not THIS again?"

 

After looking at your brackets, my next thought was: "Your brackets need more refinement on the low end."

 

I don't think that any GA who gets a stipend would get more than $200K per year.  

 

And no, my testimony wouldn't be damaged if any of them did get more than $200K.

 

The thing is, you have to recognize that in general, people who have responsibility over many valuable or important things get paid more than those who responsibilities are more limited.  The Church has employees, and they get paid by industry standards (or so I suppose).  I am a finance clerk, and a member of the branch is a church employee who has some largish responsibilities with respect to church properties.  He seems to be being paid respectably enough, judging by what he pays for tithing.  However, I have tried to be very circumspect concerning taking undue notice of what he pays in tithing, and so I haven't analyzed his donations in order to come up with a guestimate of his annual salary.  Nor will I, as this seems to be an invasion of privacy, even if I do have free access to the data.  But he is not driving a junker to church, nor are he and wife dressed in rags.  I assume he is being paid commensurate with his responsibilities and his performance.

 

And I assume the GA's are being paid according to the same standard.

 

And beyond that I am not worried about it.

[Kenngo1969]

I am immodest then...

Why, Cal!

 

[Calm]

Why, Cal!

 

You know someone had to say it, might as well be me.

[The Nehor]

Ha, reminds me of a class I was in once, where the leader asked us to self-define our income bracket. Low income, lower middle class, middle class, upper middle calss rich. Almost everyone in the room said "middle class". The leader then went on to point out, that middle class is what everyone answers in her class, but when pressed for details, most people are lower middle class.

 

The median annual income in Utah, is ~$42K. In the US it is ~55K. If you are at that level, with a family of four, I pronounce you "modest"! (I'm using a fairy wand and everything.)

 

I'M RICH!!!!!

 

 

Don't feel that way. Stupid financial responsibility.

[rpn]

Modest living allowance would legitimately be defined as sufficient for their needs (including recreation and play and retirement  and medical bills), and not more. 

[Kenngo1969]

I'M RICH!!!!!

 

 

Don't feel that way. Stupid financial responsibility.

"He that hath Eternal Life is Rich."  

 

P.S.: Compared to 90 percent of the people in the Third World, you probably are rich, even in strictly monetary terms.

Edited August 7, 2014 by Kenngo1969

[Kenngo1969]

I am immodest then...

 

Why, Cal!

 

 

You know someone had to say it, might as well be me.

 

Well, in your case, it's hard to be modest ... when you're so great!

[rpn]

I think paid church employees are in a completely different category than GA's.  Employees should be paid commensurate to their worth to the organization and enough to be rewarded as any competent and forward thinking business would reward employees.

[ERayR]

In my world a thousand dollars a month per person is modest--two thousand dollars a month per couple. For a family of seven, seven thousand dollars a month would provide a modest living.

 

In my world we get by on substantially less.  Modest for me is different than for you it seems.

[Calm]

When a comparable house is valued at $800,000 as opposed to $200,000, it can be a wee bit more expensive to live in the first area.

[VideoGameJunkie]

I'm so happy that we don't need money in heaven.

[VideoGameJunkie]

But then again, we must always tip the door guy.

[katherine the great]

In my world we get by on substantially less. Modest for me is different than for you it seems.

Maybe but I'm factoring in housing, food, clothing, tithing, utilities, transportation, insurance, savings, children's activities, college fund donations, repairs and maintenance on home and auto, gas, etc. I don't see getting by on much less than that.

[The Nehor]

"He that hath Eternal Life is Rich."  

 

   Oh....then I'm poor. 

[Kenngo1969]

   Oh....then I'm poor. 

Nay!  You're richer than you realize, My Young Padawan!

 

https://www.lds.org/scriptures/bofm/ether/12.4?lang=eng

[thatjimguy]

Modest compared to what?  What is one expected to cover with this stipend?  Modest would be enough to cover the cost of adequate but not ostentatious housing, wholesome food and presentable clothing appropriate for what one does.  In some areas $100,000 would be modest.  In other parts of the world $300 would be modest. 

 

How would the savior live? There's got to be a hint there. 

 

How did the apostles live after he died?

Edited August 7, 2014 by thatjimguy

[The Nehor]

How would the savior live? There's got to be a hint there. 

 

How did the apostles live after he died?

 

Well, if he was married and had children as some have suggested I suppose a lot of whatever money he acquired went there. He also allowed money to be ostentatiously spent on himself.

 

We have little data on the apostles living conditions outside of Paul. Paul traveled a lot but we do not know much about how he lived or if he acquired money and what he did with what he got.

 

Is it wrong for a prophet to own a house? Save some money instead of giving it to the poor? Live on a level above that of the impoverished?