thatjimguy Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 You know, I have been going to BYU-I now and am about to graduate soon. Of course, you know we have all heard about the honor code and how it is our duty to report violations. I would like to know you guy's experience with BYU schools and the honor code, specifically sex related stuff, and getting kicked out of school. The reason I am asking is because it is always being brought up in our classes by students in our "what if / cast study" scenarios (even outside religion classes) Kids are always asking questions like "should I turn my friend in to the bishop?". Obviously the would, but they seem scared more of the Bishop kicking their friend out of school than anything else. My question is what is usually the end result of a bishop finding out a student is having sex at the BYU schools? Are they toast?
Popular Post omni Posted March 30, 2014 Popular Post Posted March 30, 2014 You can get a fine education at BYU, but this policy of requiring adults to narc on each other really rubs me the wrong way. 5
Avatar4321 Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Depends. If they are married, i doubt the bishop will be too worried. 2
Kenngo1969 Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 (edited) Alas, I only have experience at apostate (albeit formerly LDS ) schools:University of Utah (g. 2005) (fka University of Deseret)Weber State University (g. 1995) (fka Weber Stake Academy)Dixie College (now Dixie State University) (g. 1993) (fka St. George Stake Academy) I'm not sure if this would violate any policies at BYU-P, BYU-I, or BYU-H. If not, what I would do is I would go to the person and I would tell him or her that I have knowledge that s/he has engaged in conduct that is in violation of the Honor Code, and that s/he has 24 hours to go to his/her Bishop, or I would go to the Honor Code Office. I think that would satisfy any obligation I have under the Honor Code without making me a "total narc." My $0.02. P.S.: In answer to the question, if I can draw an analogy, I used to do drug testing on court-ordered clients, and that's the approach I followed: if they tested positive, I told them that it was usually better if they told the judge/probation officer/etc. that they had tested positive themselves, rather than waiting for me to do it. That gave them the opportunity to frame what happened in terms fair to them, whereas the only thing I knew is that they tested positive while knowing nothing about the circumstances surrounding their use. I think there's value in that approach when it comes to confession, as well. I think it depends on a lot of things: Has one of the parties served a mission? Been to the Temple? Grown up in the Church? Et cetera. Edited March 30, 2014 by Kenngo1969
Buzzard Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Most-I emphasize most-Bishops will work with students who are having problems. There is a difference between an 18 year old sophomore who gets carried away with his girlfriend one night and a returned missionary who goes all Don Juan and seduces several women. (You can reverse the genders if you want.)The reputation of Ricks (IMHO, there is only one BYU, and it's not in Rexburg) is that the honor code and compliance with it are more strictly enforced than at the Lords University (that's the one in Provo). I do know there are additional items in the Ricks honor code that are not found at BYU.
BCSpace Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 There is a difference between an 18 year old sophomore who gets carried away with his girlfriend one night and a returned missionary who goes all Don Juan and seduces several women. (You can reverse the genders if you want.) If a woman can claim seduction, does she get a pass?
strappinglad Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 (edited) In most cases it is best to take care of your own sins and not "adam's transgressions" . I prefer the ' Sgt. Shultz ' solution. I have seen not a few occasions in which some well intentioned defender of the honor of the school, just completely messed up and in doing so wrecked the life of innocents. The caveat comes when predators are involved. Edited March 30, 2014 by strappinglad
BCSpace Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 You can get a fine education at BYU, but this policy of requiring adults to narc on each other really rubs me the wrong way. Have to agree. I attended Ricks back in the day and felt that the Student Life organization were a bunch of self-righteous jack-booted thugs even though I never became entangled with them. But then again, I don't disagree with the Honor Code. So how does one enforce or should one enforce it at all?
Garden Girl Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 I remember the case of Brandon Davies of BYU-Provo, a star on the basketball team, was suspended from playing on the team for a period of time for violating the Honor Code (I understand it involved his girlfriend). He did not play, but sat on the bench wearing suit and tie. He was able to play the next season as a starter because he agreed to follow the Honor Code as required of all students. Brandon graduated and now plays profession NBA basketball... There have been others. GG
thatjimguy Posted March 30, 2014 Author Posted March 30, 2014 Most-I emphasize most-Bishops will work with students who are having problems. There is a difference between an 18 year old sophomore who gets carried away with his girlfriend one night and a returned missionary who goes all Don Juan and seduces several women. (You can reverse the genders if you want.)The reputation of Ricks (IMHO, there is only one BYU, and it's not in Rexburg) is that the honor code and compliance with it are more strictly enforced than at the Lords University (that's the one in Provo). I do know there are additional items in the Ricks honor code that are not found at BYU. You wouldn't happen to be biased against the Vikings would'ja?
thatjimguy Posted March 30, 2014 Author Posted March 30, 2014 In most cases it is best to take care of your own sins and not "adam's transgressions" . I prefer the ' Sgt. Shultz ' solution. I have seen not a few occasions in which some well intentioned defender of the honor of the school, just completely messed up and in doing so wrecked the life of innocents.The caveat comes when predators are involved. Thing is, It was taught that a worthy Priesthood holder does not avoid the issue. I don't have the exact wording they used in class, but it drove the point home. They backed it up with words from leaders of course.
mormonnewb Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Thing is, It was taught that a worthy Priesthood holder does not avoid the issue. I don't have the exact wording they used in class, but it drove the point home. They backed it up with words from leaders of course.I once read a story in the Bible about some guy who got his whole bloodline cursed by informing his brothers about their father's drunkenness. I don't think it turned out well for ANYBODY involved . As the young rappers says, "Snitches get a pre-1978 priesthood ban!" (Sorry, I couldn't help myself)Seriously, unless its an issue of predation, my policy is "My name is Bennett and I ain't in it."
thesometimesaint Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 If you agree with the Honor Code of any school go there. If you don't; don't. As to "confessing" for someone else. That is not a good thing.
Truth 101 Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 If you agree with the Honor Code of any school go there. If you don't; don't. As to "confessing" for someone else. That is not a good thing. I agree, if you aren't even gonna live by the code of a school don't go there in the first place. But snitching is for lamers. 2
rpn Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Yes, the honor code requires chastity. Students do get their ecclesiastical endorsements withdrawn that amounts to being kicked out of school. I do not think there is any moral duty to go tell a bishop about someone else's sins. I think it doesn't help the repentance process, since repentance has to come from the heart. What it does do is make the person (particularly the ones who are trading sex for affection for reasons routed in past bad experiences) feel more lost and alone and irredeemable. And if they are kicked out, it will also have long term implications. Better to tell the person to withdraw from school on mental health reasons and go home to a different college. Now, if I knew of a student who was doing the conquest thing, I would turn them in, not for sins, but for being a predator, dangerous to the vulnerable. Probably to the police, not the bishop.
Truth 101 Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 I went to the U of U for a short time and worked at the Medical center, but decided that it was not the career for me, probably missed out.Hey Truth, I wish you'd tone it down. Especially work on not saying "retard". It's gotten to be all too common a word to say to people to put them down and is linked to the special needs people from long ago. Try hard to stop, let's put a stop to it, words do hurt! Also, I hate the use of "gay" to describe something/someone stupid. I'm working on my son on that one.Just let people go on a higher plane than you or maybe even myself. The LDS aren't hurting anyone, and if someone wants that strict lifestyle to be closer to what God would have them do, what's wrong with that? No matter if it's historical of fiction, maybe that's the only way the Lord can work with humans. Maybe His hands are tied. Inspiration is all he might have or wants us to have, plus some wonderful sidekicks, angels. Ya that's a perfectly reasonable request, unfortunately I've gotten used to culture using the words retarded and gay to describe something that is dumb or stupid, I will honestly try to change my choice in words. And yes you are right, LDS people aren't hurting anyone, I just feel like good honest people are being deceived by its leadership.
thesometimesaint Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Ya that's a perfectly reasonable request, unfortunately I've gotten used to culture using the words retarded and gay to describe something that is dumb or stupid, I will honestly try to change my choice in words. And yes you are right, LDS people aren't hurting anyone, I just feel like good honest people are being deceived by its leadership. But our leaders are LDS(good honest people). 1
BCSpace Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 What's the big deal? I mean really, and even then, it's the person's choice. The big deal is that the university and it's students represent the Church to the world. Hence one should expect that they live the values.
Tacenda Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 (edited) Ya that's a perfectly reasonable request, unfortunately I've gotten used to culture using the words retarded and gay to describe something that is dumb or stupid, I will honestly try to change my choice in words. And yes you are right, LDS people aren't hurting anyone, I just feel like good honest people are being deceived by its leadership.My husband and I are both working on it, so I'm guilty of saying retarded sometimes, and because I had a friend who works with "special needs" children, post something on FB about it, I thought of saying something. I should have mentioned that. Btw, I've been on the board for a couple of years, and said some fighting words, it doesn't work at all. Another reason to tone it down, experience! Been there, done that. Edited March 30, 2014 by Tacenda 1
thesometimesaint Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 My husband and I are both working on it, so I'm guilty of saying retarded sometimes, and because I had a friend who works with "special needs" children, post something on FB about it, I thought of saying something. I should have mentioned that.Btw, I've been on the board for a couple of years, and said some fighting words, it doesn't work at all. Another reason to tone it down, experience! Been there, done that. Retarded is a good psychological word for someone lower than 2 standard deviations from average on the IQ scale. It is unfortunate that in pop culture it has become an epitaph.
Truth 101 Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 My husband and I are both working on it, so I'm guilty of saying retarded sometimes, and because I had a friend who works with "special needs" children, post something on FB about it, I thought of saying something. I should have mentioned that.Btw, I've been on the board for a couple of years, and said some fighting words, it doesn't work at all. Another reason to tone it down, experience! Been there, done that. As I've seen. If you don't mind me asking are you yourself lds?
why me Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Hahaha clap clap clap clap clap clap CLAP, yes, go snitching! Any college where you get in trouble for having sex is well.... kinda dumb, it's human nature to want to be intimate with someone of the opposite sex (or the same sex, if that's what floats your boat). Don't get me wrong, sex is serious, and can have serious consequences such as unplanned pregnancy and STD's and whatnot. But if you have a GF or BF (and any self respecting person with a serious GF or BF should know that their S.O. doesn't have STD's) and use protection against pregnancy like an IUD or pills. What's the big deal? I mean really, and even then, it's the person's choice. I suppose what it comes down to is anybody should realize that BYU, while being not a bad place to get an education as someone else stated, is such a lamer school and just not go there. And to whoever called BYU-Provo "the lord's school".... lol. Well, I would think that if BYU was like NYU with students just sleeping around, it may just keep parents from sending their kids there. Parents send their kids to BYU because of its reputation...it is a church university and as such parents expect a certain standard. Of course, the church itself preaches sexual purity. Rather difficult to make allowances for its own university.
Truth 101 Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Retarded is a good psychological word for someone lower than 2 standard deviations from average on the IQ scale. It is unfortunate that in pop culture it has become an epitaph. Well I must be an anomaly then cause I'm in the top 2 percentile, at least according to the Wechsler IQ test (administered and interpreted by a Psychologist)
why me Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 And yes you are right, LDS people aren't hurting anyone, I just feel like good honest people are being deceived by its leadership.And what is so deceiving about the leadership of the lds church? It seems that they have encouraged mormons to live a christian life. And mormons are good people in most cases. The point is that if mormons are good and honest people, the church had something to do with it and how mormons have been raised to be good and honest.
Tacenda Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 As I've seen. If you don't mind me asking are you yourself lds?Yeppers, I was BIC, baptised, later endowed, and sealed to my husband. Happily lived the mormon life for a couple of decades, then the internet happened...and wonder why others know all of it and keep the faith, why couldn't I? But still active and trying, have good days and bad days. I don't think the leaders are decieving anyone, they believe, I think.
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