Seriously Worried About The State Of Mind The Single & Married Young Adults Have!

[Saints Alive]

I agree tacenda, the brethren have addressed the fact that some reasons for postponing children are not in accordance with HF's plan. On the other hand, I will not tell someone how, when, and how many children someone else should have. The Brethren have spoke, they can choose to listen or not.

Now that I think about it, it wouldn't have been completely out of order for you as the "matriarch" to gently mention the Brethren's position on the matter.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Saints Alive

[BlueDreams]

Well...I am a young single adult. I certainly have concerns about getting married and having children. The reasons aren't based specifically about the end of time or some fear of a dictatorchip etc....not that grand in scale. They're two-fold:

1. Marriages seem fragile nowadys...or non-existant. There's no garuantee that things will work out. I'd like to believe that somehow I will be different from the many many people who've gotten divorced. I've so far dodged a number of common relationship problems at the moment, I'm working to have a good start to things, but there's simply no garuantee. I know people who've already been divorced that are around my age. I don't want to be one of them. In short, marriage is scary. I'm very aware of the problems that can occur both personally and statistically and it ain't pretty.

2. Children: I'm afraid I'll be a less-than-great parent. I love children, I get along with children, I want children. But to help them have the best outcomes in the future feels extremely difficult with what's coming today. I imaginge of all the pitfalls and traps and struggles that come these days and I worry that I won't be able to correctly address them. Just as much as I love kids and want them, they terrify me. I know I'll love them and I know they'll have the capability to break my heart. I know that there's plenty in the world to turn them from what is best. I've watched it happen before.

Basically, that ideal family: that one where mother and father are married and love their children and raise their kids right have become so much less common for my generation's families. Families are messy. I don't see all too big of a difference between me and the rest of humanity....especially when a good chunk of that messy familly is my own already.

That said, I want 4 children one day if/when I get married. And I want to get married.I don't know too many couples that only want 1 child, if that, who are LDS. The friends of mine that were most adament about not getting married....are now married. A good number of my friends have 1-2 children. They more often space them out, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. If I'd gotten married younger than I currently am, I would have waited a couple of years before having kids (right now, my desire for children is pretty strong...so that waiting period is growing shorter and shorter....though I still want at least 6 months)

With luv,

BD

Edited October 17, 2012 by BlueDreams

[Walden]

The world is getting worse and worse, based on what I know and remember from my own childhood to present.

With Halloween coming up, I'm reminded of when I first heard about razor blades being found in popcorn balls, which I used to get from some of my neighbors while doing trick or treating as a small child. And then they were found in candied or caramel apples, too. Not that I got nothing but those yummy treats, because I got a lot of store bought stuff too, but it wasn't long after that that people no longer gave stuff like that away because the people who gave that stuff didn't want to freak out the parents of those children who got it.

I also remember when it became more rare to see small children go out trick or treating, or at least not on their own, as they once usually did.

And then more and more people started locking their doors to their homes at night, and even during the day when they wanted to go out somewhere. And then they started worrying about leaving their keys in their cars.

And this stuff is just the tip of the iceberg!

It's getting to where I don't like to watch or listen to news stories anymore, because there is more and more bad news.

With all of this bad stuff going on more and more often, is it really any wonder to you that people aren't as excited about life in this world anymore? When people think more and more about having their own children, they think about wanting to keep them safe, and that is getting harder and harder to do.

I know we could all just try to block out the bad stuff, as if it wasn't going on or wouldn't happen to US, but more and more it is happening more to us.

Oh, and the lack of respect for the "marriage" thing is a direct result of people being more "free" with their bodies, as if they should be able to do whatever they want to do with it, anytime, anywhere, with whoever, whenever they feel like it, for whatever reason.

I know someone already pointed out the urban legend/hoax of the "razor blades in apples" story, but I thought it quite telling with regard to our current society, it's relationship with the media, and the never-ending premise that these are the last days.

If you look at the statistics and the facts, American society is safer now than it was even 30 years ago. FBI and numerous other law-enforcement statistics will tell you that major crimes in this country (murder, rape, etc.) have decreased significantly. According to a an August article in the Economist, violent crime has decreased 38% since 1992. We are actually safer now than we were just 20 years ago.

Likewise, more people in America and around the entire world have access to freedom than in any time in world history. Heck, in the 1950's (those good ol' days!) a black man had to drink water from a separate water fountain than his white counterpart. In the 1960's, American political leaders were assassinated at an alarming rate. In the 1970s and 1980s, gang crimes and murder rates increased exponentially, mostly the result of the increase in the drug trade, especially after the introduction of crack cocaine in the 1980s.

I get a chuckle out of those from my parent's generation (raised in the 50s & 60s) who lament the "good ol' days", when blacks suffered from segregation, crime rates were statistically much higher than they are today, and American political leaders were being shot and killed every few years (or multiple times a year in the mid to late 60s).....what a wonderful world!

So why all the glum faces with regard to the present and the future? Simply put, it is the result of a media machine that has grown exponentially over the past 30 years and has learned that the simple recipe for ratings success is fear. The media needs people to live in fear so that they will keep tuning in to their news outlets to find out where where the latest calamity has occurred and when and where they will be targeted by any number of murderers, rapists, kidnappers, etc. It doesn't matter that statistically, rates for violent crimes have dropped 38% in the past 20 years....the media needs you to think that crime is everywhere and peril is just around the corner, so that you will then tune in to see how much longer you have until disaster strikes. The media has learned the simple lesson that fear is our greatest motivator, and they use that fear like a hammer to stoke viewership.

Getting back to the original premise, why are young adults putting off marriage and opting to have smaller families? IMO, it is a result of greater competition in a global economy, increased costs of raising a family and the deterioration of the relationship between workers and companies/corporations. The increased competition in the new global economy requires workers to be more educated, and thus young adults are putting off children until after they have their educational goals realized. Likewise, costs for everything from fuel to college tuition have increased at an exponential rate, easily outpacing wage increases for the working class. Finally, the deterioration of the worker-corporate relationship over the last 40 years has transformed common attitudes and ideas about careers. In the 1950 & 1960s, one could get a job for a large corporation and be assured of a job security, regular wage increases and nice pension to retire with. Such things no longer exist in the new economy, which increases worker apprehension, and contributes to parent's being worried about being able to afford to have children.

These were the considerations that led my wife and I to marry at the ripe old age of 27, wait 4 years before having children (we waited until after we had bought a home and completed all of our degrees) and limit ourselves to having only two kids.

The fact is, there have been people lamenting, anticipating and prophesying the "end times" for centuries. Likewise, the view of the older generation that the younger generation is going to hell in a hand-basket is as old as time.

[ERayR]

I have similiar feelings too. But I've been working on doing the exact opposite. If the end is near, it's the end of wickedness. It means Christ will come and we will be happy. We will have a thousand years of peace and joy to raise our families.

It is the interim activities that cause some concern.

[Damien the Leper]

This is a complicated subject because it is further complicated by mindsets that contribute to delusion, disillusion and hopelessness. The phrase "The end is near" is only worth many glances so long as we continue this arms race, greed, political corruption, anti-proletarianism, etc. Humans need to understand that they are the source of their own redemption. As a humanist, I have every bit of confidence in the people of this world to overcome adversity, oppression, and poverty. When we lose hope in ourselves to do what is right and humane and claim to be a lost, fallen and broken people then we will have no choice but to accept that "the end is near". I don't mean this in a religious sense but in a human sense. We will destroy ourselves and there will be absolutely nothing left to redeem.

An LDS friend of mine let me know that he refuses to look at or look for the "signs of the times". He said that we are here and this is now and we should be doing all we can to save ourselves of self-annihilation.

Tacenda, it is a concern to me that your children have such bleak outlooks on the world. It is depressing to think that many have lost hope in our humanity and our ability to overcome.

As for the 1000 year reign of Christ, if it is real...then we haven't even begun to experience the full magnitude of what Revelation claims will happen. The Revelation is an ongoing catastrophic event that is meant to teach a lesson. That lesson hasn't even started.

[guerreiro9]

1. Marriages seem fragile nowadys...or non-existant. There's no garuantee that things will work out. I'd like to believe that somehow I will be different from the many many people who've gotten divorced. I've so far dodged a number of common relationship problems at the moment, I'm working to have a good start to things, but there's simply no garuantee.

2. Children: I'm afraid I'll be a less-than-great parent.

Hello BlueDreams,

I can understand many of your concerns, and had many of them myself before getting married and having children. I am sure I do not have as much advice to offer as many on this forum do as I am still relatively young, but I will offer what I can.

1) Marriage as an institution is not any more fragile now, than it has ever been; people just enter into it now with different expectations. There has never been a guarantee that a particular marriage would be successful, people are just more willing to abandon them now rather than work to make them successful.

I think people enter into marriages now expecting that everything will magically live up to their expectations, and become disillusioned when they do not. The truth is marriages require time and effort to become successful, and they are only as successful as the people in them are willing to make them. In times past, because people were less willing to divorce, by default they put in the time necessary to make the marriage successful, and the quality of their marriage was only a reflection of the amount of effort expended.

Early on in my marriage my wife and I experienced struggles and difficulties common to most newlyweds, and I will admit that I was a little disillusioned. This was not the happily ever after I had expected, but we were committed to each other and to improving our marriage, and slowly but surely it improved. I have learned over the years that on any given day I can affect the quality of my marriage by how much effort I am willing to put into it, and over time this effort adds up.

Of course there are exceptions to this where one spouse is completely unwilling to make the marriage successful either by their actions (abuse, infidelity) or their inactions, but the vast majority of marriages that end in divorce could have been successful if the participants had given it more time and effort.

My advice would be to enter into a marriage with no other expectations than that you love your spouse and are willing to do what is necessary to make the marriage a success. I know that if I would have had less expectations of a magical fairy tale marriage, it would have saved my wife and I both some heart ache.

2) As with marriage, you can be as good as a parent as you wish to be. No one and I repeat no one is innately born as a good parent, and they do not become one until they have gone through the experiences necessary and expended the effort required to become such.

I have never been more scared in my life than just prior to my first child’s birth. I knew nothing about being a parent, and had never really been around children (especially babies) and did not particularly enjoy them. I was very worried that I would not be capable of being the father that my son would need. Even when my son was born and I held him in the hospital, I did not instantly feel the “connection” that some claim to feel with their children. I just stood there in shocked fear that I was now responsible for this helpless infant, but slowly and surely as I began to spend time with my son and care for him the connection grew. As I made initial mistakes as a parent, but corrected those mistakes my confidence as a father grew also. More than anything I fell in love with my son and was willing to put in the time and effort required to become the father that he needs, rather than just assuming that it was something innately in born.

I make no claims to being a great parent, but the strides I have made have been tremendous, and I am willing to do what it takes to continue my improvement. Less than two months ago my third child and second son was born. As I held my new born son in my arms I have never felt a stronger connection to anyone or to my father in heaven as I did in that moment. I wept uncontrollable tears of joy, and am still emotional about the experience nearly two months later. I am no longer the person I once was, and I will be eternally grateful to my children and my wife for providing me the experiences required to make me a better person.

Fear not BlueDreams, if I can do it I am confident than anyone can. I was no more skilled as a parent than anyone else to begin with and probably less skilled than most. Really all that is required is a willingness to love your child and a willingness to improve yourself where necessary. It does not come quickly or without effort, but it does come.

-guerreiro9

Edited October 17, 2012 by guerreiro9

[Ahab]

You'll be happy to hear that the "razor blade in the apples" stories were just urban legends.

But that still doesn't stop me from going to Safeway every October 31 to buy a bag of apples and a box of razor blades, just to see the look on the cashier's face.

Urban legend or not, I heard it on the local news broadcast and apparently so did many of my neighbors who no longer gave out yummy popcorn balls and caramel or candied apples.

And as I said, that's only one of the many things I've witnessed showing the world has gotten worse since my childhood.

Heck, have you been to an airport lately? I no longer fly commercial airlines because I don't like even the possibility that I might get patted down like a criminal, and I won't subject my wife to that either. It's pitiful!

More and more the bad apples are making the world worse for all of the rest of us, collectively. That's a fact, even if you deny it.

[Tacenda]

This is a complicated subject because it is further complicated by mindsets that contribute to delusion, disillusion and hopelessness. The phrase "The end is near" is only worth many glances so long as we continue this arms race, greed, political corruption, anti-proletarianism, etc. Humans need to understand that they are the source of their own redemption. As a humanist, I have every bit of confidence in the people of this world to overcome adversity, oppression, and poverty. When we lose hope in ourselves to do what is right and humane and claim to be a lost, fallen and broken people then we will have no choice but to accept that "the end is near". I don't mean this in a religious sense but in a human sense. We will destroy ourselves and there will be absolutely nothing left to redeem.

An LDS friend of mine let me know that he refuses to look at or look for the "signs of the times". He said that we are here and this is now and we should be doing all we can to save ourselves of self-annihilation.

Tacenda, it is a concern to me that your children have such bleak outlooks on the world. It is depressing to think that many have lost hope in our humanity and our ability to overcome.

As for the 1000 year reign of Christ, if it is real...then we haven't even begun to experience the full magnitude of what Revelation claims will happen. The Revelation is an ongoing catastrophic event that is meant to teach a lesson. That lesson hasn't even started.

One of my children might feel a little better once 12/21/12 comes and goes with no problems! Ever since he heard the end will be on that day, according to the Mayans. I believe, even though he's 20, he might believe it. Or I'm jumping to conclusions since he won't come out and say it, only mentions it in passing.

[Biz]

I know someone already pointed out the urban legend/hoax of the "razor blades in apples" story, but I thought it quite telling with regard to our current society, it's relationship with the media, and the never-ending premise that these are the last days.

If you look at the statistics and the facts, American society is safer now than it was even 30 years ago. FBI and numerous other law-enforcement statistics will tell you that major crimes in this country (murder, rape, etc.) have decreased significantly. According to a an August article in the Economist, violent crime has decreased 38% since 1992. We are actually safer now than we were just 20 years ago.

Likewise, more people in America and around the entire world have access to freedom than in any time in world history. Heck, in the 1950's (those good ol' days!) a black man had to drink water from a separate water fountain than his white counterpart. In the 1960's, American political leaders were assassinated at an alarming rate. In the 1970s and 1980s, gang crimes and murder rates increased exponentially, mostly the result of the increase in the drug trade, especially after the introduction of crack cocaine in the 1980s.

I get a chuckle out of those from my parent's generation (raised in the 50s & 60s) who lament the "good ol' days", when blacks suffered from segregation, crime rates were statistically much higher than they are today, and American political leaders were being shot and killed every few years (or multiple times a year in the mid to late 60s).....what a wonderful world!

So why all the glum faces with regard to the present and the future? Simply put, it is the result of a media machine that has grown exponentially over the past 30 years and has learned that the simple recipe for ratings success is fear. The media needs people to live in fear so that they will keep tuning in to their news outlets to find out where where the latest calamity has occurred and when and where they will be targeted by any number of murderers, rapists, kidnappers, etc. It doesn't matter that statistically, rates for violent crimes have dropped 38% in the past 20 years....the media needs you to think that crime is everywhere and peril is just around the corner, so that you will then tune in to see how much longer you have until disaster strikes. The media has learned the simple lesson that fear is our greatest motivator, and they use that fear like a hammer to stoke viewership.

Getting back to the original premise, why are young adults putting off marriage and opting to have smaller families? IMO, it is a result of greater competition in a global economy, increased costs of raising a family and the deterioration of the relationship between workers and companies/corporations. The increased competition in the new global economy requires workers to be more educated, and thus young adults are putting off children until after they have their educational goals realized. Likewise, costs for everything from fuel to college tuition have increased at an exponential rate, easily outpacing wage increases for the working class. Finally, the deterioration of the worker-corporate relationship over the last 40 years has transformed common attitudes and ideas about careers. In the 1950 & 1960s, one could get a job for a large corporation and be assured of a job security, regular wage increases and nice pension to retire with. Such things no longer exist in the new economy, which increases worker apprehension, and contributes to parent's being worried about being able to afford to have children.

These were the considerations that led my wife and I to marry at the ripe old age of 27, wait 4 years before having children (we waited until after we had bought a home and completed all of our degrees) and limit ourselves to having only two kids.

The fact is, there have been people lamenting, anticipating and prophesying the "end times" for centuries. Likewise, the view of the older generation that the younger generation is going to hell in a hand-basket is as old as time.

Careful, believing some of these facts is a positive indicator that the devil is carefully leading you down to hell!

[cinepro]

Heck, have you been to an airport lately? I no longer fly commercial airlines because I don't like even the possibility that I might get patted down like a criminal, and I won't subject my wife to that either. It's pitiful!

Compared to what? Try to explain how things are worse to any human living before 1900:

You: Things are terrible in 2012. We have these huge machines that can fly you through the air to anywhere in the world within hours. The whole time, you can sleep, eat, read a book, or choose from dozens of entertainment programs which are like the plays and dramatic productions you are familiar with, only they can be viewed at any time. And the temperature is controlled so you're never too hot or too cold.

But the terrible thing is that before they let you get on this huge machine, they take 20 seconds to make sure you're not carrying anything dangerous since in the past, there have been people who brought weapons and hurt people.

Oh, and we've cured polio and can manage diabetes quite well.

Terrible. Just terrible.

Them:

Edited October 17, 2012 by cinepro

[Ahab]

One of my children might feel a little better once 12/21/12 comes and goes with no problems! Ever since he heard the end will be on that day, according to the Mayans. I believe, even though he's 20, he might believe it. Or I'm jumping to conclusions since he won't come out and say it, only mentions it in passing.

I'll probably feel a little better too, after I go through a period of disappointment, because I'm not really looking forward to all of the stuff associated with the end of the world.

It will get much better after that, though, so the thought of the world as it is coming to an end when our Lord returns kinda hits me with mixed emotions.

[Scott Lloyd]

Yesterday I had dinner with my very TBM niece. The subject of our national debt came up. My brother in-law described how it would be impossible to actually ever balance the budget since it is about 16 trillion. Can't remember the exact number he stated. And we were discussing the implications of it. My niece has a 2 yr.old and is married. She stated that she really doesn't feel good about bringing another child into the world. She even feels guilty for having her 2 yr. old son. My other nephew and his wife feel the same way with their 1 yr. old. Both of these couples are stopping at one!! What is going on? Also, my sons don't have a huge desire to marry very soon both are dating someone quite seriously. And the one son feels the end is near anyway so why bother too much with the future. It's not coming from me either, not sure where he's gettng his information, I continually tell him he'll have a family, grow old etc.

Is this just within my family or is it a trend that is happening? Have any of you seen this strange phenomenon amongst the young couples/singles you're around? It greatly concerns me and for the first time now I feel like the end might actually be near. Never really felt it before. I feel doom and gloom, help.

Please don't make this political k? Not that you would.

If I recall correctly, this is not the first generation in which young people have expressed pessimistic or fatalistic attitudes about the future.

I have wondered how much of it is simple grousing attributable to ordinary adolescent or early-post-adolescent reluctance to assume the responsibilities of adulthood.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Scott Lloyd

[The Nehor]

Well, I calculated the day for the end of the world a decade ago and we just passed it so I have given up on that. Society is physically safer now for just about everyone (although the improvement is much less for white anglosaxons then for others). The downside is moral permissiveness is way up. These things run in cycles. The roaring 20s was not so different. We are probably about to hit an era of clamping down a bit more.

I do not see being optimistic about the next few years as saying all is well in Zion. All is not well in Zion until we build Zion. It has nothing to do with the rest of the world. Things will continue to improve in some way and worsen in others in varying degrees until the end comes which could be in a decade or a century or five centuries. I am leaning towards one of the latter views. The prophets always raise a warning voice. It does not mean that things are worse then they have ever been. In fact compare Isaiah to General Conference today and our warnings are relatively mild. We still need to be careful but expecting the end endlessly is usually done by extreme optimists who want a better world, revenge fantasy nuts who want to be proven right right now (looking at you LeHaye), or by those looking for an excuse to just sit around and wait because what they do matters less as we get a blank slate soon (in itself doubtful).

I mean really....we are so hard up for threats to scare us they are trying to make us fear Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, and the comical glorious leader of North Korea. Yawn. Call me when the barbarians wake up and start storming or even vaguely threatening the gates. Meanwhile we should be up and building Zion in any case. The war is fought there not in political elections, economic forecasts, and Soviet-style realpolitick security concerns.

[Ahab]

Compared to what?

Compared to being able to fly on a commercial airline without having to go through a pat down or even a metal detector before going into the areas for boarding a plane. I used to actually walk in and out of those areas to the other areas of an airport without having to go through that kind of hassle, and without any fear of terror in the flight.

Try to explain how things are worse to any human living before 1900:

You: Things are terrible in 2012. We have these huge machines that can fly you through the air to anywhere in the world within hours. The whole time, you can sleep, eat, read a book, or choose from dozens of entertainment programs which are like the plays and dramatic productions you are familiar with, only they can be viewed at any time. And the temperature is controlled so you're never too hot or too cold.

But the terrible thing is that before they let you get on this huge machine, they take 20 seconds to make sure you're not carrying anything dangerous since in the past, there have been people who brought weapons and hurt people.

Heh, you sound like you've already accepted the security check, and all it can involve, as a normal and usual thing that just goes along with flying in an airplane. My point is that there was time when you didn't even have to go through that stuff to fly or meet someone in the area where they get off of the plane.

Oh, and we've cured polio and can manage diabetes quite well.

Those are good things, but there are still a lot of things that make the world worse as a whole to me, personally.

Them:

Yeah, I know... those who don't get it and think everything used to be the way it is now instead of remembering when times were better than they are now.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Ahab

[Walden]

Urban legend or not, I heard it on the local news broadcast and apparently so did many of my neighbors who no longer gave out yummy popcorn balls and caramel or candied apples.

And as I said, that's only one of the many things I've witnessed showing the world has gotten worse since my childhood.

Heck, have you been to an airport lately? I no longer fly commercial airlines because I don't like even the possibility that I might get patted down like a criminal, and I won't subject my wife to that either. It's pitiful!

More and more the bad apples are making the world worse for all of the rest of us, collectively. That's a fact, even if you deny it.

I can assure that that there have been nefarious, sadistic and deranged people who have attempted to hurt children long before the "razorblades in apples" became a popular urban legend.

The difference today is as you explained, "I heard it on the local news broadcast." Imagine the utter fear of the "end of times" or the ideal that "this current generation is going to hell in a hand-basket" had there been field reporters and dedicated, 24-hour news channels during the era of the bubonic plague epidemic in Europe, the Crusades, etc.

If looking at our current state of world affairs, and taking into consideration the overarching ideals of freedom, peace, technology, human rights, safety, etc., the world is in a much, much better state than it was in the past, despite the news media reports to the contrary.

[Calm]

Hello BlueDreams,

I can understand many of your concerns, and had many of them myself before getting married and having children. I am sure I do not have as much advice to offer as many on this forum do as I am still relatively young, but I will offer what I can.

1) Marriage as an institution is not any more fragile now, than it has ever been; people just enter into it now with different expectations. There has never been a guarantee that a particular marriage would be successful, people are just more willing to abandon them now rather than work to make them successful.

I think people enter into marriages now expecting that everything will magically live up to their expectations, and become disillusioned when they do not. The truth is marriages require time and effort to become successful, and they are only as successful as the people in them are willing to make them. In times past, because people were less willing to divorce, by default they put in the time necessary to make the marriage successful, and the quality of their marriage was only a reflection of the amount of effort expended.

Early on in my marriage my wife and I experienced struggles and difficulties common to most newlyweds, and I will admit that I was a little disillusioned. This was not the happily ever after I had expected, but we were committed to each other and to improving our marriage, and slowly but surely it improved. I have learned over the years that on any given day I can affect the quality of my marriage by how much effort I am willing to put into it, and over time this effort adds up.

Of course there are exceptions to this where one spouse is completely unwilling to make the marriage successful either by their actions (abuse, infidelity) or their inactions, but the vast majority of marriages that end in divorce could have been successful if the participants had given it more time and effort.

My advice would be to enter into a marriage with no other expectations than that you love your spouse and are willing to do what is necessary to make the marriage a success. I know that if I would have had less expectations of a magical fairy tale marriage, it would have saved my wife and I both some heart ache.

2) As with marriage, you can be as good as a parent as you wish to be. No one and I repeat no one is innately born as a good parent, and they do not become one until they have gone through the experiences necessary and expended the effort required to become such.

I have never been more scared in my life than just prior to my first child’s birth. I knew nothing about being a parent, and had never really been around children (especially babies) and did not particularly enjoy them. I was very worried that I would not be capable of being the father that my son would need. Even when my son was born and I held him in the hospital, I did not instantly feel the “connection” that some claim to feel with their children. I just stood there in shocked fear that I was now responsible for this helpless infant, but slowly and surely as I began to spend time with my son and care for him the connection grew. As I made initial mistakes as a parent, but corrected those mistakes my confidence as a father grew also. More than anything I fell in love with my son and was willing to put in the time and effort required to become the father that he needs, rather than just assuming that it was something innately in born.

I make no claims to being a great parent, but the strides I have made have been tremendous, and I am willing to do what it takes to continue my improvement. Less than two months ago my third child and second son was born. As I held my new born son in my arms I have never felt a stronger connection to anyone or to my father in heaven as I did in that moment. I wept uncontrollable tears of joy, and am still emotional about the experience nearly two months later. I am no longer the person I once was, and I will be eternally grateful to my children and my wife for providing me the experiences required to make me a better person.

Fear not BlueDreams, if I can do it I am confident than anyone can. I was no more skilled as a parent than anyone else to begin with and probably less skilled than most. Really all that is required is a willingness to love your child and a willingness to improve yourself where necessary. It does not come quickly or without effort, but it does come.

-guerreiro9

Very well put and insightful

[Markie]

Man is nothing, although most think they are something!

[Ahab]

I can assure that that there have been nefarious, sadistic and deranged people who have attempted to hurt children long before the "razorblades in apples" became a popular urban legend.

The difference today is as you explained, "I heard it on the local news broadcast." Imagine the utter fear of the "end of times" or the ideal that "this current generation is going to hell in a hand-basket" had there been field reporters and dedicated, 24-hour news channels during the era of the bubonic plague epidemic in Europe, the Crusades, etc.

If looking at our current state of world affairs, and taking into consideration the overarching ideals of freedom, peace, technology, human rights, safety, etc., the world is in a much, much better state than it was in the past, despite the news media reports to the contrary.

I hear this idea from some people and I wonder what it would take for them to see that the world is in fact getting worse, as a whole.

You speak of freedom. We've always had freedom, even if people would kill us for it.

Peace? When was the last time we have had peace on this Earth? Right now it's wars, wars, and rumors of wars. Do you think it has always been this way? I can't remember a time when I've heard of the world being at peace.

Technology, sure. We have some fancy gizmos now, and I generally like it, but it's not enough to make up for all of the bad stuff going on, especially when it's used to do a lot of the bad stuff.

Human rights, huh. Are you one of those people who thinks it's a good thing that gay behavior is more accepted in this world? I'm not, so to me that's one of the bad things that is making this world much worse.

Safety? At the expense of having to walk through metal detectors and sometimes getting pat down like a criminal? I don't like that stuff, either, so that's another thing that makes this world much worse than it once was.

Got any more ideas? What is it exactly that makes you think the world is better now than it once was, as a whole?

[cinepro]

Compared to being able to fly on a commercial airline without having to go through a pat down or even a metal detector before going into the areas for boarding a plane. I used to actually walk in and out of those areas to the other areas of an airport without having to go through that kind of hassle, and without any fear of terror in the flight.

Heh, you sound like you've already accepted the security check, and all it can involve, as a normal and usual thing that just goes along with flying in an airplane. My point is that there was time when you didn't even have to go through that stuff to fly or meet someone in the area where they get off of the plane.

Those are good things, but there are still a lot of things that make the world worse as a whole to me, personally.

Yeah, I know... those who don't get it and think everything used to be the way it is now instead of remembering when times were better than they are now.

Large-scale commercial air flight wasn't really viable until what, the 1950's or 1960's? And by the 1970's, terrorists had figured out that they could hijack the planes. So how long was this golden age of low-security public air travel? You can't say things are "getting worse" because there was a 20 year window of being able to board a plane without people wondering if it was going to get hijacked, while before that there was no air travel and after that you have far more choices than ever, at better prices than ever, but you have to take your shoes off before boarding and you can't bring a whole tube of toothpaste on board anymore.

And even with the inconvenience of the additional security, the convenience of being able to buy tickets over the internet more than makes up for it.

I admit things used to be different in the world, but let's not confuse nostalgia with data.

[BlueDreams]

Fear not BlueDreams, if I can do it I am confident than anyone can. I was no more skilled as a parent than anyone else to begin with and probably less skilled than most. Really all that is required is a willingness to love your child and a willingness to improve yourself where necessary. It does not come quickly or without effort, but it does come.

Thanks guerreiro,

Just so you know, my fears are not dibilitating, nor have they altered my plans negatively. God's given me more than enough experiences that are sacred that tell me very strongly that I will be a mother one day. The only thing my fears have done are help navigate a number of choices to avoid a number of pitfalls and prep for that potential role.

I just think jumping to the conclusion that the macro atrocities of the world are the determining factors for people's marriage/reproductive choices. It's more about money, world stressors/pressures (school/work), the propensity for families to split or fall apart, and the possible choices that children can make, IMO, that are more likely to delay families.

With luv,

BD

[Ahab]

Large-scale commercial air flight wasn't really viable until what, the 1950's or 1960's? And by the 1970's, terrorists had figured out that they could hijack the planes. So how long was this golden age of low-security public air travel? You can't say things are "getting worse" because there was a 20 year window of being able to board a plane without people wondering if it was going to get hijacked, while before that there was no air travel and after that you have far more choices than ever, at better prices than ever, but you have to take your shoes off before boarding and you can't bring a whole tube of toothpaste on board anymore.

You make your sentences long on purpose and mainly just to make it more difficult to respond to your comments, don't cha?

All I know is that until about 10 years ago I didn't have to deal with pat down searches with the possibility of being strip searched at airports, which means that for the first 40 years of my life things were much better for me in that regard. Now I don't even like the idea of flying commerical airlines anymore, so instead I make other arrangements. You can downplay it and try to think it's just supposed to be this way now, but I don't like it so to me it makes the world worse since it cuts down on how much I can enjoy. I won't even fly for free if it means I have to go through a security terminal with the possibility of getting pat down or strip searched. Maybe you're like David Letterman says he is and you get back in line for some more of that kind of treatment.

And even with the inconvenience of the additional security, the convenience of being able to buy tickets over the internet more than makes up for it.

Not for me, hence, the world is worse than it once was.

You do realize this is a personal preference isssue, don't you? What is worse to me may be something better to you.

I admit things used to be different in the world, but let's not confuse nostalgia with data.

It's all about how things are now compared to how things used to be, and not only that, but how much better they could be.

[Walden]

I hear this idea from some people and I wonder what it would take for them to see that the world is in fact getting worse, as a whole.

You speak of freedom. We've always had freedom, even if people would kill us for it.

Peace? When was the last time we have had peace on this Earth? Right now it's wars, wars, and rumors of wars. Do you think it has always been this way? I can't remember a time when I've heard of the world being at peace.

Technology, sure. We have some fancy gizmos now, and I generally like it, but it's not enough to make up for all of the bad stuff going on, especially when it's used to do a lot of the bad stuff.

Human rights, huh. Are you one of those people who thinks it's a good thing that gay behavior is more accepted in this world? I'm not, so to me that's one of the bad things that is making this world much worse.

Safety? At the expense of having to walk through metal detectors and sometimes getting pat down like a criminal? I don't like that stuff, either, so that's another thing that makes this world much worse than it once was.

Got any more ideas? What is it exactly that makes you think the world is better now than it once was, as a whole?

Ahab, you must be one of those "glass half empty" types

Working within the framework that we've established, here are my ideas of how the world is better than it was in the past.

Freedom....I'm not sure who the "we" are that you refer to when you state that "we have always had freedom," but it is certainly not the world community. Today, there are more people (even proportionately) living under democratic, elected governments than at any time in world history. Never in human history have such a large percentage of the world's population had the right to peacefully vote in democratic elections. Was it so much better when you were growing up, when America was under constant threat of communist invasion from Russia, and communism controlled all of eastern Europe and most of Asia? Likewise, these freedoms that "we have always had," well, that hasn't always been the truth, unless of course you are speaking exclusively of white, male Americans. One hundred years ago, women in this country couldn't even vote. Heck, fifty years ago, blacks had to sit at the back of the bus and attend segregated schools. You really consider previous generations to have more freedom?

Peace.....of course there are wars and rumors of wars and there will always be. However, when you look at the big picture, we are actually living in a rather peaceful age. Do you think it was more peaceful decades ago when the entire world was at war during WWI and WWII? Heck, going back to our hunter-gatherer days, or even to the Middle Ages, your chances of dying in a war/battle or one-on-one conflict are minsicule compared to those eras (see http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/006259.html). State sponsored violence has also fallen sharply (a 90% reduction in genocide since the end of the cold war) and state on state conflicts are dropping every decade. Yes, there are conflicts around the globe, but they occur less frequently and are of smaller scales than at any time in our past.

Technology....I think we take it for granted the technology that has propelled today's society. Medically, we have eradicated any number of diseases that once killed or crippled millions of people. We have the technology to remove everything from brain tumors to molars. The medical breakthroughs that have occurred in the past 50 years, as a result of technology, have helped tens of millions of people live longer, more productive lives. Likewise, we have the technology to access information at our fingertips. And how many pioneers who died crossing the plains might have been saved if they could catch a 737 from Chicago to Salt Lake City, but of course, there is the issue of those pesky TSA pat-downs (though given the choice, I think that even people who lived 100 years ago would deal with a pat-down if it meant that they could get to their destination safely in three hours time instead of 3 days time, or even 3 weeks time). With regard to technology, I could go on and on and on how we are so much better off than previous generations.

Human Rights.....I will not confuse the issue with your reference to gay rights, though I think that we can both agree that we can be grateful that gays are not subjected to the same type of violence and hatred that was heaped upon them by former generations. Whether you support gay marriage or not, I think everyone supports the fact that we have reached a level in American society where gays are not subjected to the same rates of violent attacks as they were in previous generations. But beyond the gay rights issue, more women on this planet have the right to vote and work than in any time in human history. Minorities have greater freedoms and safety in our society than in any time in our history. Children have greater protections than at any time in history, and don't tell me that you'd rather subject them to the practices of our country a hundred years ago, when child labor was commonly abused in this country. Likewise, incident rates for practices such as torture, unlawful detainment, etc. have decreased exponentially as humankind has advanced.

Safety....Everything today is safer now than it was even a generation ago. Travel is safer, the workplace is much safer, and according to the declining crime rates that I posted earlier, you are even safer in your community. Buildings are safer. Vehicles are safer. Regulations have made the medications that you take safer, the water that you drink and the food that you eat safer, and the world that you interact with safer.

These are the reasons that I think that our world today is better than it once was, and not vice versa.

[Deborah]

I'll tell you what I think is scary. When I hear person on the street interviews and how utterly ignorant people are of what is going on even today, much less historically. We are failing our kids and adults aren't much better. If this kind of ignorance grows we are doomed to extinction.

[Walden]

You make your sentences long on purpose and mainly just to make it more difficult to respond to your comments, don't cha?

All I know is that until about 10 years ago I didn't have to deal with pat down searches with the possibility of being strip searched at airports, which means that for the first 40 years of my life things were much better for me in that regard. Now I don't even like the idea of flying commerical airlines anymore, so instead I make other arrangements. You can downplay it and try to think it's just supposed to be this way now, but I don't like it so to me it makes the world worse since it cuts down on how much I can enjoy. I won't even fly for free if it means I have to go through a security terminal with the possibility of getting pat down or strip searched. Maybe you're like David Letterman says he is and you get back in line for some more of that kind of treatment.

Not for me, hence, the world is worse than it once was.

You do realize this is a personal preference isssue, don't you? What is worse to me may be something better to you.

It's all about how things are now compared to how things used to be, and not only that, but how much better they could be.

Actually, this clarification regarding your viewpoint being exclusive to "your" world, and not the world in general, goes a long way in explaining why you consider the world a worse place now than in the past. I thought that we were discussing the world, and humankind, in general, not in relation it's personal affects on you.

In essence, "your world" might be on the decline. But "the world" is certainly not.

[Ahab]

Ahab, you must be one of those "glass half empty" types

I don't think so. I tend to stay fairly positive about things, even though I can notice when some situations get worse.

Working within the framework that we've established, here are my ideas of how the world is better than it was in the past.

Freedom....I'm not sure who the "we" are that you refer to when you state that "we have always had freedom," but it is certainly not the world community. Today, there are more people (even proportionately) living under democratic, elected governments than at any time in world history. Never in human history have such a large percentage of the world's population had the right to peacefully vote in democratic elections. Was it so much better when you were growing up, when America was under constant threat of communist invasion from Russia, and communism controlled all of eastern Europe and most of Asia? Likewise, these freedoms that "we have always had," well, that hasn't always been the truth, unless of course you are speaking exclusively of white, male Americans. One hundred years ago, women in this country couldn't even vote. Heck, fifty years ago, blacks had to sit at the back of the bus and attend segregated schools. You really consider previous generations to have more freedom?

Freedom is something God-given to all of us. It's not dependent on whether or not other people consider us to be free. If I were to ever live in a tyrannical situation I may not live long, but I would live free as long as I lived. Maybe you're talking about permissiveness, rather than freedom, with people giving you their permission to live however you want to live.

Peace.....of course there are wars and rumors of wars and there will always be. However, when you look at the big picture, we are actually living in a rather peaceful age. Do you think it was more peaceful decades ago when the entire world was at war during WWI and WWII? Heck, going back to our hunter-gatherer days, or even to the Middle Ages, your chances of dying in a war/battle or one-on-one conflict are minsicule compared to those eras (see http://www.worldchan...ves/006259.html). State sponsored violence has also fallen sharply (a 90% reduction in genocide since the end of the cold war) and state on state conflicts are dropping every decade. Yes, there are conflicts around the globe, but they occur less frequently and are of smaller scales than at any time in our past.

Hmm. Maybe this is what the Lord was talking about when he said people would be saying something like "Peace, peace" before he comes back. Like getting into the eye of a hurricane, with some quiet in the storm before the storm moves on some more. I wouldn't call it peace just because it's not as bad as it has been, though. Things will get worse again before the end comes.

Technology....I think we take it for granted the technology that has propelled today's society. Medically, we have eradicated any number of diseases that once killed or crippled millions of people. We have the technology to remove everything from brain tumors to molars. The medical breakthroughs that have occurred in the past 50 years, as a result of technology, have helped tens of millions of people live longer, more productive lives. Likewise, we have the technology to access information at our fingertips. And how many pioneers who died crossing the plains might have been saved if they could catch a 737 from Chicago to Salt Lake City, but of course, there is the issue of those pesky TSA pat-downs (though given the choice, I think that even people who lived 100 years ago would deal with a pat-down if it meant that they could get to their destination safely in three hours time instead of 3 days time, or even 3 weeks time). With regard to technology, I could go on and on and on how we are so much better off than previous generations.

Fancier gizmos do not make for a better world. They do help us to be more at ease with some conveniences we didn't have before, but those things can and are being used for evil purposes too. For me, the technolgy doesn't make up for all the bad things that make the world worse to me, even though I and others get some good things from it.

Human Rights.....I will not confuse the issue with your reference to gay rights, though I think that we can both agree that we can be grateful that gays are not subjected to the same type of violence and hatred that was heaped upon them by former generations. Whether you support gay marriage or not, I think everyone supports the fact that we have reached a level in American society where gays are not subjected to the same rates of violent attacks as they were in previous generations. But beyond the gay rights issue, more women on this planet have the right to vote and work than in any time in human history. Minorities have greater freedoms and safety in our society than in any time in our history. Children have greater protections than at any time in history, and don't tell me that you'd rather subject them to the practices of our country a hundred years ago, when child labor was commonly abused in this country. Likewise, incident rates for practices such as torture, unlawful detainment, etc. have decreased exponentially as humankind has advanced.

I suppose it depends on how you look at it. I think people have never had the right to do bad stuff to other people, even though some people may have thought they once did, in some situations. Again it sounds to me like you're talking about permissiveness, rather than rights or freedom.

Safety....Everything today is safer now than it was even a generation ago. Travel is safer, the workplace is much safer, and according to the declining crime rates that I posted earlier, you are even safer in your community. Buildings are safer. Vehicles are safer. Regulations have made the medications that you take safer, the water that you drink and the food that you eat safer, and the world that you interact with safer.

Since I'm not a glass half empty kind of guy it's not easy for me to think of things that make our world less safe, but I know there are some things, and my main point was that during my life I have noticed a lot of things that make the world seem and feel worse to me than when I was younger.

Maybe, as I think you were saying earlier, it all stems from what we hear on news broadcasts, as we hear about how the world is.

These are the reasons that I think that our world today is better than it once was, and not vice versa.

You made some good points. I still think the world is worse than it once seemed to be, though, and I'm looking forward to much better days.