Has the Spirit ever told you to do Something that you Disagreed with?

[bluebell]

59 minutes ago, Senator said:

I’m just amazed/jealous, that you all have the ability to discern with certainty what the spirit is, and that it comes from God. I’m still trying to figure that out.

I definitely don’t have that ability 90% of the time. That 10% is nice though.  

[Stargazer]

On 4/8/2025 at 9:31 PM, The Nehor said:

Spirit told me to break one of the commandments once. I went ahead and did it. Still not sure what that was potentially about.

Also when I had to buy temple clothes after being called as a temple worker I was a broke college student. I told God He would have to cover it and put it on my credit card. The next day I won $200 from a scratch off lottery ticket my boss gave me. I have always wanted to use this one in a sacrament meeting talk just to see if the bishop will ask me to sit down.

Well, Peter went fishing and caught a fish with a silver coin in its mouth. That coin had belonged to someone, and they had lost it. Why didn't Peter try to track down the person who lost it in order to restore it to him? 

Not to rebel too much, but I've been kind of at a loss as to this gambling thing. There's no commandment, to the best of my knowledge, that forbids it. Yes, I know we have been counseled to avoid it, but the reason given is only pragmatic. It can be habit-forming. It can be dangerous. The idea of getting something from nothing is apparently bad, too. I see the pragmatism. I see the potential problem of something from nothing. But gambling still doesn't rise to the level of breaking commandments. 

A long time ago, one of my sons decided to investigate getting a job at a local Indian casino. He went to their training, and one night he asked if his brother, mother and I would help him out in his learning to deal blackjack. I didn't want to, but his mother insisted. So I did it reluctantly. I decided to just play conservatively, and after about a half hour I had nearly all the chips. Then I realized that I was doing it wrong if I wanted the ordeal to end. So I changed strategy and started making foolish bets. In ten minutes I had no chips left and could leave. He never took that job, mainly because when the casino called the house to ask him to come in for an interview, I never told him. Was I wrong to do so? 

After my winning all those chips years ago, I considered giving it a try for real at that local casino. Just to see if I could actually win at it. But I never did. Well, anyway, if I'm good enough at winning blackjack, it's not really gambling, is it? It's just skill playing a game. Some members of the church participate in bowling, and win money for playing well at it. I'm pretty sure some members participate in video game tournaments that win money, too. I once doubled my money trading stock market options. Betting that Cisco would gain in value over a couple of months time, I turned $300 into $600 in just two weeks. And if I had held on to that options contract to the end of the allotted time it would have been worth closer to $8,000, but I didn't know that at the time. Was that gambling? 

Some of things we think are commandments are just good business practice.

[Pyreaux]

I feel the spirit in the workings of the church, the leaders, the scriptures, in doing good. I don't hear the spirit of wisdom often, I feel I have different gifts. Know things and secrets, but not much divination and direction, I just get dashed hopes, I assume there is no clear direction, and the path will reveal itself in time. Or rather, I have a notion to believe the spirit talks to me often about such things, but I don't listen, and in that sense, I assume I'm then passively disagreeing with it, cause maybe I don't want to do something that is key to everything and I'm a fool for ignoring it. Like not focusing on my health (As my ailing parent's ends draw nigh, I foresee my possible futures in them and I already know how to start changing, despite other thing that I'd want).

[The Nehor]

3 hours ago, Stargazer said:

Well, Peter went fishing and caught a fish with a silver coin in its mouth. That coin had belonged to someone, and they had lost it. Why didn't Peter try to track down the person who lost it in order to restore it to him? 

Not to rebel too much, but I've been kind of at a loss as to this gambling thing. There's no commandment, to the best of my knowledge, that forbids it. Yes, I know we have been counseled to avoid it, but the reason given is only pragmatic. It can be habit-forming. It can be dangerous. The idea of getting something from nothing is apparently bad, too. I see the pragmatism. I see the potential problem of something from nothing. But gambling still doesn't rise to the level of breaking commandments. 

A long time ago, one of my sons decided to investigate getting a job at a local Indian casino. He went to their training, and one night he asked if his brother, mother and I would help him out in his learning to deal blackjack. I didn't want to, but his mother insisted. So I did it reluctantly. I decided to just play conservatively, and after about a half hour I had nearly all the chips. Then I realized that I was doing it wrong if I wanted the ordeal to end. So I changed strategy and started making foolish bets. In ten minutes I had no chips left and could leave. He never took that job, mainly because when the casino called the house to ask him to come in for an interview, I never told him. Was I wrong to do so? 

After my winning all those chips years ago, I considered giving it a try for real at that local casino. Just to see if I could actually win at it. But I never did. Well, anyway, if I'm good enough at winning blackjack, it's not really gambling, is it? It's just skill playing a game. Some members of the church participate in bowling, and win money for playing well at it. I'm pretty sure some members participate in video game tournaments that win money, too. I once doubled my money trading stock market options. Betting that Cisco would gain in value over a couple of months time, I turned $300 into $600 in just two weeks. And if I had held on to that options contract to the end of the allotted time it would have been worth closer to $8,000, but I didn't know that at the time. Was that gambling? 

Some of things we think are commandments are just good business practice.

With the silver coin you assume it was lost in a shipwreck or something and no one owns it.

When playing Blackjack the House has a 0.5% edge against a player that uses perfectly optimized strategy. If you can count cards and the casino doesn’t use methods that counter that the player can have a slight advantage but casinos throw out card counters when caught so it is hard to do.

[InCognitus]

5 hours ago, Stargazer said:

Not to rebel too much, but I've been kind of at a loss as to this gambling thing. There's no commandment, to the best of my knowledge, that forbids it. Yes, I know we have been counseled to avoid it, but the reason given is only pragmatic. It can be habit-forming. It can be dangerous. The idea of getting something from nothing is apparently bad, too. I see the pragmatism. I see the potential problem of something from nothing. But gambling still doesn't rise to the level of breaking commandments. 

I think there is one other thing to consider regarding gambling that would haunt me (personally) if I ever won the lottery or was a jackpot winner or whatever.  That thing is this:  My winnings would be at the loss of so many others.  And some of those people would be the habitual gamblers or poor people trying to get a lucky break, and I would be benefiting from their loss. 

I realize that the same people would be losing their money even if someone else won the lottery or the jackpot, but I couldn't handle taking their money myself.  It would weigh on my conscience.

[Rain]

6 hours ago, Stargazer said:

Well, Peter went fishing and caught a fish with a silver coin in its mouth. That coin had belonged to someone, and they had lost it. Why didn't Peter try to track down the person who lost it in order to restore it to him? 

Not to rebel too much, but I've been kind of at a loss as to this gambling thing. There's no commandment, to the best of my knowledge, that forbids it. Yes, I know we have been counseled to avoid it, but the reason given is only pragmatic. It can be habit-forming. It can be dangerous. The idea of getting something from nothing is apparently bad, too. I see the pragmatism. I see the potential problem of something from nothing. But gambling still doesn't rise to the level of breaking commandments. 

Perhaps being a hood steward.

6 hours ago, Stargazer said:

A long time ago, one of my sons decided to investigate getting a job at a local Indian casino. He went to their training, and one night he asked if his brother, mother and I would help him out in his learning to deal blackjack. I didn't want to, but his mother insisted. So I did it reluctantly. I decided to just play conservatively, and after about a half hour I had nearly all the chips. Then I realized that I was doing it wrong if I wanted the ordeal to end. So I changed strategy and started making foolish bets. In ten minutes I had no chips left and could leave. He never took that job, mainly because when the casino called the house to ask him to come in for an interview, I never told him. Was I wrong to do so? 

After my winning all those chips years ago, I considered giving it a try for real at that local casino. Just to see if I could actually win at it. But I never did. Well, anyway, if I'm good enough at winning blackjack, it's not really gambling, is it? It's just skill playing a game. Some members of the church participate in bowling, and win money for playing well at it. I'm pretty sure some members participate in video game tournaments that win money, too. I once doubled my money trading stock market options. Betting that Cisco would gain in value over a couple of months time, I turned $300 into $600 in just two weeks. And if I had held on to that options contract to the end of the allotted time it would have been worth closer to $8,000, but I didn't know that at the time. Was that gambling? 

Some of things we think are commandments are just good business practice.

 

[Calm]

1 hour ago, InCognitus said:

I think there is one other thing to consider regarding gambling that would haunt me (personally) if I ever won the lottery or was a jackpot winner or whatever.  That thing is this:  My winnings would be at the loss of so many others.  And some of those people would be the habitual gamblers or poor people trying to get a lucky break, and I would be benefiting from their loss. 

I realize that the same people would be losing their money even if someone else won the lottery or the jackpot, but I couldn't handle taking their money myself.  It would weigh on my conscience.

This would be my issue as well.  While I would hope for most it is simple entertainment, I have heard too many low income individuals speak of it as a financial backup.

[The Nehor]

2 hours ago, InCognitus said:

I think there is one other thing to consider regarding gambling that would haunt me (personally) if I ever won the lottery or was a jackpot winner or whatever.  That thing is this:  My winnings would be at the loss of so many others.  And some of those people would be the habitual gamblers or poor people trying to get a lucky break, and I would be benefiting from their loss. 

I realize that the same people would be losing their money even if someone else won the lottery or the jackpot, but I couldn't handle taking their money myself.  It would weigh on my conscience.

If you expand that to all forms of exploitation then it is very hard to have a clean conscience.

[BlueDreams]

On 4/6/2025 at 7:20 PM, bluebell said:

This is mostly just my curious mind wondering about random stuff.  I don't have any agenda.  The question popped into my mind when someone was speaking yesterday in conference (I don't remember who it was, we were driving back from Utah and were listening in the car) about the exclusivity of worship and how we don't have any other gods before God, even ourselves.

It made me wonder, how often are we are own gods without even noticing?

Yes. For much of my 20's. I found myself in several wrestles with God over it in prayer cuz I found what They were asking to be embarrassing and frustrating on a good day. On a bad day it felt like a waste of my life and in conflict with some of my biggest desires for my future. It often included me whining about how annoying this all was.

 One day it came to a head when I was prompted to think about what I wanted, giving a sense of choice to either follow God and trust or do my thing and still have a decent life. I wanted to follow God. It changed my sense of victimhood/shame to the will of God to one of choosing a harder path for better reasons I couldn't see at the time.  

Nowadays I think for me it's more being cautious with individual revelation, beliefs, and practices being balanced with communal revelation/policies. Sometimes a practice or need for me will conflict with common communal practice or belief. I don't usually think that means I'm right and the whole is wrong. That's too black and white for my usual mindset. But I try to be careful with what works and is needful for me and recognizing that may not hold up for a larger group of people with very different personalities and needs. And I try to be humble when I do get a sense that something is missing or off in a common teaching of some sort. 

 

With luv,

BD 

[Kenngo1969]

On 4/7/2025 at 10:33 AM, Stargazer said:

Because I have always been interested in the law, and used to go to the state law library to read court decisions for fun, I once thought about taking training to get into paralegal work. I prayed about it, and got an emphatic No.

I still love to read court decisions. 

Oddly, I'm comforted by the fact that I haven't ever gone way off the deep end and actually become a lawyer!      

[Stargazer]

On 4/10/2025 at 5:35 AM, InCognitus said:

I think there is one other thing to consider regarding gambling that would haunt me (personally) if I ever won the lottery or was a jackpot winner or whatever.  That thing is this:  My winnings would be at the loss of so many others.  And some of those people would be the habitual gamblers or poor people trying to get a lucky break, and I would be benefiting from their loss. 

I realize that the same people would be losing their money even if someone else won the lottery or the jackpot, but I couldn't handle taking their money myself.  It would weigh on my conscience.

I think some people get all tied into knots over making a reasonable profit at a legitimate business.