mfbukowski Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 On 3/18/2023 at 8:00 PM, Grug the Neanderthal said: No, I’m not suggesting this. All people have the light of Christ to help guide them, but there are serious limitations to how much guidance they receive from this. It’s really just a basic moral compass, that is easily overshadowed by false traditions, incorrect cultural norms, and the influence of the adversary. So no one who has the gift of the Holy ghost has ever been "overshadowed by false traditions, incorrect cultural norms, and the influence of the adversary. " Obviously incorrect 1
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 4 hours ago, Calm said: If you are saying we need to see something in our scriptures before we pray about it and experiment upon it, how does that work for those who don’t see the Book of Mormon as scripture or for those who don’t believe in the Bible? Are you saying that we need to plant the seed of faith and experiment about every teaching from every religion?
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 4 hours ago, mfbukowski said: So no one who has the gift of the Holy ghost has ever been "overshadowed by false traditions, incorrect cultural norms, and the influence of the adversary. " Did I say this? No, I did not. There are plenty of members of the church who have received the laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost who cast aside true teachings from the scriptures/prophets because of false traditions, culture norms, and the influence of the adversary. -1
MiserereNobis Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 8 hours ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: Can you show me from the scriptures where it says that we should venerate the Virgin Mary? Are you sola scriptura? Or do you believe religious truth is found outside the scriptures, too? 2
MiserereNobis Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 41 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: Are you saying that we need to plant the seed of faith and experiment about every teaching from every religion? How do you choose which teachings you experiment on? Remember, you said that to experiment on a teaching you must have faith that it’s true, act on that faith, and do it for a long time. That’s quite a commitment. Why should someone choose to do this with Mormonism instead of some other religion? 3
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 7 minutes ago, MiserereNobis said: Are you sola scriptura? Or do you believe religious truth is found outside the scriptures, too? I believe in proving all teachings by the word of God as found in the scriptures (the iron rod). Can you show me where the scriptures say to venerate the Virgin Mary? -1
MiserereNobis Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 1 minute ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: I believe in proving all teachings by the word of God as found in the scriptures (the iron rod). Can you show me where the scriptures say to venerate the Virgin Mary? Your question is meaningless unless you are sola scriptura. So I’ll ask again, are you sola scriptura? 1
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 4 minutes ago, MiserereNobis said: How do you choose which teachings you experiment on? Remember, you said that to experiment on a teaching you must have faith that it’s true, act on that faith, and do it for a long time. That’s quite a commitment. Why should someone choose to do this with Mormonism instead of some other religion? This discussion is once again going into the weeds. I’m talking about the specific teachings from the scriptures/prophets, not every single teaching from every religion, group, or individual in the world. If people want to experiment with non-scriptural teachings from these other sources, they are welcome to do it. But that’s not what I’m talking about.
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 1 minute ago, MiserereNobis said: Your question is meaningless unless you are sola scriptura. So I’ll ask again, are you sola scriptura? I believe in proving all teachings by the word of God as found in the scriptures (the iron rod).
MiserereNobis Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 1 minute ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: I believe in proving all teachings by the word of God as found in the scriptures (the iron rod). What about LDS teachings not found in the scriptures? 2
Calm Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: Are you saying that we need to plant the seed of faith and experiment about every teaching from every religion? Please answer my questions first. Then I will answer yours. If the reason to plant the seed of faith and experiment is because it is in our scripture, how does that work for those who do not have the Bible or Book of Mormon as scripture or have faith in other nonChristian scripture? Edited March 20, 2023 by Calm
pogi Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 47 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: I believe in proving all teachings by the word of God as found in the scriptures (the iron rod). A teaching not found anywhere in scripture. 2
mfbukowski Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 14 hours ago, MiserereNobis said: Will you experiment in this manner with the teachings about and devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary? She has been a most important part of my faith — the fruit from my devotion to Her has been most sweet. Without Her, I would not have become a Christian. I’m quite willing to share basic teachings about Her for you to have faith in and simple devotional practices for you to act on if you’d like. It is my personal belief that Mary is also the incarnation of Heavenly Mother. She must have been incarnated at some point in order to be a Goddess, why not as Mary? That also gives a simple solution to Christ's incarnation. I need not say more about that.
pogi Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 4 minutes ago, mfbukowski said: It is my personal belief that Mary is also the incarnation of Heavenly Mother. She must have been incarnated at some point in order to be a Goddess, why not as Mary? That also gives a simple solution to Christ's incarnation. I need not say more about that. What would that make Joseph and the siblings of Jesus?
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 4 hours ago, Calm said: Please answer my questions first. Then I will answer yours. Please answer my question first. I’m talking specifically about teachings in the scriptures or from the prophets, not all teachings throughout the world. Do you believe we should plant the seed of faith and test every single teaching throughout the world?
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 4 hours ago, pogi said: A teaching not found anywhere in scripture. The teaching to holding fast to the word of God in the scriptures (iron rod) to avoid deception isn’t found anywhere in scripture?
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 4 hours ago, MiserereNobis said: What about LDS teachings not found in the scriptures? 2 And, behold, and lo, this is an ensample unto all those who were ordained unto this priesthood, whose mission is appointed unto them to go forth— 3 And this is the ensample unto them, that they shall speak as they are moved upon by the Holy Ghost. 4 And whatsoever they shall speak when moved upon by the Holy Ghost shall be scripture, shall be the will of the Lord, shall be the mind of the Lord, shall be the word of the Lord, shall be the voice of the Lord, and the power of God unto salvation. D&C 68
mfbukowski Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 50 minutes ago, pogi said: What would that make Joseph and the siblings of Jesus? Don't know, probably does not work well in our paradigm. Did Jesus have descendants? We have a lot of historical claims to that, I think that raises the same kind of question. Figure one out and the other would follow, I suspect!
pogi Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 6 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: The teaching to holding fast to the word of God in the scriptures (iron rod) to avoid deception isn’t found anywhere in scripture? The word of God (iron rod) is not limited to scripture or the church. Same with the seeds. I have noted this several times. Nowhere does it say that the iron rod can only be found in scripture and that all things should be proven against it. That teaching is not in scripture anywhere. 1
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 8 minutes ago, pogi said: The word of God (iron rod) is not limited to scripture or the church. Same with the seeds. I have noted this several times. Nowhere does it say that the iron rod can only be found in scripture and that all things should be proven against it. That teaching is not in scripture anywhere. Prophets have said that the iron rod refers to the scriptures. God’s house is a house of order, not confusion. The true teachings from God are not going to contradict the word of God in the scriptures.
Calm Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 26 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: Please answer my question first. I’m talking specifically about teachings in the scriptures or from the prophets, not all teachings throughout the world. Do you believe we should plant the seed of faith and test every single teaching throughout the world? I asked first 1
pogi Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 14 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: Prophets have said that the iron rod refers to the scriptures. Not just the scriptures. 14 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: God’s house is a house of order, not confusion. The true teachings from God are not going to contradict the word of God in the scriptures. And? 1
CV75 Posted March 20, 2023 Posted March 20, 2023 14 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: Prophets have said that the iron rod refers to the scriptures. God’s house is a house of order, not confusion. The true teachings from God are not going to contradict the word of God in the scriptures. How does your view of the word of God in the scriptures comport with your view of Jospeh Smith teaching AGT (the other one, not "America's Got Talent")?
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, pogi said: 17 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: Prophets have said that the iron rod refers to the scriptures. Not just the scriptures. Where have latter-day prophets said that the iron rod includes teachings outside of the scriptures or the church? 3 minutes ago, pogi said: 18 minutes ago, Grug the Neanderthal said: God’s house is a house of order, not confusion. The true teachings from God are not going to contradict the word of God in the scriptures. And? Are you serious? Haven’t you been arguing that we should set aside teachings in the scriptures if we don’t think they bear fruit (aka don’t believe them)?
Grug the Neanderthal Posted March 20, 2023 Author Posted March 20, 2023 1 minute ago, CV75 said: How does your view of the word of God in the scriptures comport with your view of Jospeh Smith teaching AGT (the other one, not "America's Got Talent")? As a I said in a previous comment, the scriptures don’t give us a clear answer on Adam-God one way or the other.
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