BYU Devotional Address: Flashes of Light

[Okrahomer]

I enjoyed this devotional address by Elder Lund (YM General President).  His bridge story at the beginning reflects in a significant way how I have encountered the love and direction of my Father in Heaven.

”As we drive through life’s journey, there will be flashes of light! The Lord promised Isaiah, “I will make darkness light before them” (Isa. 42:16).”

Edited February 10 by Okrahomer

[bluebell]

That was an amazing talk. Thank you for sharing it. 

[Rain]

I've felt like I've had those flashes of light.  But how do I deal with this? One year I wasn't sure how we were going to get my son to scout camp.  Long story short I had a "flash of light" that helped me have faith in answers to prayers only to find out years later that the boys from our ward were treated horribly.  I don't think I've heard yet how badly things went.  Why would God give me that light if it put my son in such danger?

[Okrahomer]

14 hours ago, Rain said:

Why would God give me that light if it put my son in such danger?

I have started and stopped a response about a dozen times.  I claim no special or deeper knowledge than you, and I don’t think there is a simple answer.

For me, your experience represents a spiritual paradox:  something that is an apparent contradiction, by which the Lord can work His miracles.

I rather suspect that you have asked the question as a wise teacher:  with sincerity but already with your own “answer” in mind.  I would love to know how you have made sense of the paradox.

Edited February 14 by Okrahomer

[Rain]

1 hour ago, Okrahomer said:

I have started and stopped a response about a dozen times.  I claim no special or deeper knowledge than you, and I don’t think there is a simple answer.

For me, your experience represents a spiritual paradox:  something that is an apparent contradiction, by which the Lord can work His miracles.

I have also had the experience of taking something to the Lord and “wrestling” with Him to find a way.  And just as quickly as the “way” seemed to be made known, realizing that I might be forcing the Lord to grant me something that was not necessarily right — in spite of the fact that it was “good.”

Just to be clear, I wasn't trying to force the Lord.  I told Him I would accept it either way and I would be willing to do the extra work if needed.

1 hour ago, Okrahomer said:

I think it is foundational to the purposes of the Father for us to have these experiences of looking “through the glass darkly”; and to learn to do it with a “perfect brightness of hope” for that future day when “we shall see things as they really are.”

I rather suspect that you have asked the question as a wise teacher:  with sincerity but already with your own “answer” in mind.  I would love to know how you have made sense of the paradox.

I haven't made sense of it.  It actually really bothers me.  It bothered me even more when I used it to teach my son how God answers prayers and then finding out later that my answered prayers brought him so much pain and put him in an abusive situation.  I feel bad that I unknowingly caused him more pain sharing that with him. So I really don't know what to do with it. 

[Tacenda]

deleted

Edited February 14 by Tacenda

[Okrahomer]

3 minutes ago, Rain said:

Just to be clear, I wasn't trying to force the Lord.

Oh my goodness!  I‘m sorry.  I will edit the post to make it clearer.  I rarely post, so it’s a bit disheartening that I so often come across like this.
 

Note to self:   Silence is golden.

[Okrahomer]

45 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

deleted

It’s OK, Tacenda.  I know your kind heart was disappointed in my response.  I hope the edited version is better?

[Okrahomer]

1 hour ago, Rain said:

I haven't made sense of it.  It actually really bothers me.

My brother forwarded this talk by Francine Bennion recently.  It’’s long and It’s about “suffering”; but I think ultimately, this theology is related to the thing that is troubling you — at least it resonates with me.  Maybe you will find some value in it too.

[Tacenda]

7 hours ago, Okrahomer said:

It’s OK, Tacenda.  I know your kind heart was disappointed in my response.  I hope the edited version is better?

Not at all I was responding to Rain and used her story of getting a light about something and it not turning out. I was using her story to complain about some members or feeling like the church membership believe that we know all the answers and sometimes that doesn't come off well when comforting those that lose loved ones or going through horrible situations. Such as telling someone it's okay, their loved ones are going to ? or ? fill in the blanks. And most of the time it isn't helpful. I don't know why I wanted to compare what Rain was going through, and immediately deleted. I wonder why you thought I was responding to you Okrahomer. But you're sure kind for saying I have a kind heart. I'm feeling less kind more than ever, and grumpy.

[Rain]

16 hours ago, Okrahomer said:

My brother forwarded this talk by Francine Bennion recently.  It’’s long and It’s about “suffering”; but I think ultimately, this theology is related to the thing that is troubling you — at least it resonates with me.  Maybe you will find some value in it too.

I appreciate it.  I'll listen to it.

I also appreciate your original post.  It's literally those moments of light that keep me going except this particular one. 

I don't know why this talk brought this experience to mind. I don't know why I shared it except that maybe I felt safe here? Those moments of light definitely exist.  I have seen it though Elder Scott's talk as well. 

Edited February 14 by Rain

[Okrahomer]

5 hours ago, Tacenda said:

I wonder why you thought I was responding to you Okrahomer. But you're sure kind for saying I have a kind heart. I'm feeling less kind more than ever, and grumpy.

I thought probably you saw my response to Rain as problematic -- which it was.  My sense is that you are a very kind person -- that fundamental kindness is not difficult to sense from your posts. 

Hoping your day improves.  I'm looking out my window (I work from home) and I see snow everywhere!  That makes me smile.>

Edited February 14 by Okrahomer

[Okrahomer]

2 hours ago, Rain said:

I don't know why I shared it except that maybe I felt save here? 

I agree -- this is a safe place; except when a lame brain (like yours truly) is slow on the uptake.  I seldom post, and I think it should be even rarer in the future.

[manol]

On 2/13/2023 at 9:24 AM, Rain said:

I've felt like I've had those flashes of light.  But how do I deal with this? One year I wasn't sure how we were going to get my son to scout camp.  Long story short I had a "flash of light" that helped me have faith in answers to prayers only to find out years later that the boys from our ward were treated horribly.  I don't think I've heard yet how badly things went.  Why would God give me that light if it put my son in such danger?

 

I had a few somewhat similar experiences (though not similar in all respects).  I won't bore you with the details, but it took the wind out of my sails for a long time, and at one point I tried becoming an atheist as a matter of principle.

I now very seldom, if ever, make “I KNOW that...” statements. In particular, I'm aware of my susceptibility to “feeling right about” my hidden agendas.  So I make a deliberate effort to find and disable my hidden agendas, but don't really know whether I'm successful or not, hidden agendas being inherently very good at hiding. 

Thus far I haven't found anything which works better for me than “following the light” to the best of my perception and ability.  One adaptation is that I now expect to have unforseen and not necessarily straightforward “learning experiences” which call for course-corrections, sometimes small and sometimes big. 

An idea which has been useful for me is this:  I think I'm supposed to bring as much light as I can in the moment into whatever situation I find myself in.  And a painful recollection from the past would constitute "a situation in the present".  Sometimes all I can do in the moment is deliberately intend to "see this differently", without having any idea what "seeing this differently" might look like.  My experience has been that active seeking is required, and then sooner or later "seeing this differently" shows up, and sometimes it looks very different from what I would have expected.  

 

 

Edited February 14 by manol

[Rain]

3 hours ago, Okrahomer said:

I agree -- this is a safe place; except when a lame brain (like yours truly) is slow on the uptake.  I seldom post, and I think it should be even rarer in the future.

Actually by "here" I was talking about on the social board and with you as the OP of the thread. When you talked about forcing the issue it didn't bother me because I feel safe with you.  I just wanted to clarify it.

[Okrahomer]

5 minutes ago, Rain said:

Actually by "here" I was talking about on the social board and with you as the OP of the thread. When you talked about forcing the issue it didn't bother me because I feel safe with you.  I just wanted to clarify it.

Thank you!  I'm glad you feel safe in my OP.

[bsjkki]

@Rain Those experiences are really hard. I've had a few. Sometimes, it gives me a feeling of being 'forsaken.' But, since even Christ had those feelings, I think it is okay to acknowledge them and work through them in a very honest way. Sometimes being obedient and doing the right thing seems to produce a very negative outcome. Especially, when it seems answers to prayer lead the decision and tiny miracles paved the way to...ruin. 

Edited February 15 by bsjkki

[Calm]

dup

Edited February 15 by Calm

[Calm]

5 hours ago, Okrahomer said:

Thank you!  I'm glad you feel safe in my OP.

Ii would be disappointed if you posted even less. I think you are much harsher judging your own posts than you need to be. I find your contributions valuable. 

[Okrahomer]

9 hours ago, Calm said:

Ii would be disappointed if you posted even less. I think you are much harsher judging your own posts than you need to be. I find your contributions valuable. 

Thank you...very kind of you to say.

[Calm]

1 hour ago, Okrahomer said:

Thank you...very kind of you to say.

Selfish actually. 

[MustardSeed]

Rain I think this happens a lot.  Look at marriages:  People get inspiration all the time That they should marry a certain person and then down the road there are bumps etc. sometimes mountains and people might ask “What was that confirmation all about?”

I can’t have an answer for you because your relationship with God is your own to navigate. I can share with you how I navigate those things? Take it or leave it.

I told all of my kids that when they get confirmation on a possible life mate that really what they are receiving is a clarity of their own understanding that they themselves care enough about this other person that they are willing to work through all the hard stuff when the hard stuff comes up. It’s not a predictor of whether or not their partner will betray them or hurt them or rob a bank or whatever. It is only what is in their own lane- which is, understanding themselves well enough to know that they can make that commitment (given the information they have at the time.)

In situations similar to yours I may have told myself, “the confirmation I received was a knowledge of my own mind” (ie. stating that “scout camp is a good thing and can be positive in my son’s life/ or, he’s ready for this experience based on recent evidence of his resilience etc) 
 

Keep in mind my personal philosophy of life, that God is not as involved on the daily as I notice other people believe He is.  That has a lot to do with how I see these issues. ❤️

[Tacenda]

5 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

Rain I think this happens a lot.  Look at marriages:  People get inspiration all the time That they should marry a certain person and then down the road there are bumps etc. sometimes mountains and people might ask “What was that confirmation all about?”

I can’t have an answer for you because your relationship with God is your own to navigate. I can share with you how I navigate those things? Take it or leave it.

I told all of my kids that when they get confirmation on a possible life mate that really what they are receiving is a clarity of their own understanding that they themselves care enough about this other person that they are willing to work through all the hard stuff when the hard stuff comes up. It’s not a predictor of whether or not their partner will betray them or hurt them or rob a bank or whatever. It is only what is in their own lane- which is, understanding themselves well enough to know that they can make that commitment (given the information they have at the time.)

In situations similar to yours I may have told myself, “the confirmation I received was a knowledge of my own mind” (ie. stating that “scout camp is a good thing and can be positive in my son’s life/ or, he’s ready for this experience based on recent evidence of his resilience etc) 
 

Keep in mind my personal philosophy of life, that God is not as involved on the daily as I notice other people believe He is.  That has a lot to do with how I see these issues. ❤️

I heard someone say something similar, the most He can do is relay somehow to someone else to help. Not sure I even believe that. I do however believe in angels, or those from the other side possibly coming in spirit and able to physically help. I'm strange I know. Oh dear, the movie Ghost comes to mind. 

Edited February 15 by Tacenda

[Rain]

11 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

Rain I think this happens a lot.  Look at marriages:  People get inspiration all the time That they should marry a certain person and then down the road there are bumps etc. sometimes mountains and people might ask “What was that confirmation all about?”

I can’t have an answer for you because your relationship with God is your own to navigate. I can share with you how I navigate those things? Take it or leave it.

I told all of my kids that when they get confirmation on a possible life mate that really what they are receiving is a clarity of their own understanding that they themselves care enough about this other person that they are willing to work through all the hard stuff when the hard stuff comes up. It’s not a predictor of whether or not their partner will betray them or hurt them or rob a bank or whatever. It is only what is in their own lane- which is, understanding themselves well enough to know that they can make that commitment (given the information they have at the time.)

In situations similar to yours I may have told myself, “the confirmation I received was a knowledge of my own mind” (ie. stating that “scout camp is a good thing and can be positive in my son’s life/ or, he’s ready for this experience based on recent evidence of his resilience etc) 
 

Keep in mind my personal philosophy of life, that God is not as involved on the daily as I notice other people believe He is.  That has a lot to do with how I see these issues. ❤️

I felt he was very involved till we moved here 10 years ago. I felt almost constantly he was guiding me. Then all the sudden here I am in Arizona and he went missing.   For awhile I felt completely lost.  Then I started to get on my feet again, but it is in ways that I never would have been ok with for the other 45 years of my life.  

[Chum]

12 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

I told all of my kids that when they get confirmation on a possible life mate that really what they are receiving is a clarity of their own understanding

I married the first person who didn't say no. Like most everyone, I suppose.

Edited February 16 by Chum