rodheadlee Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 Was the Ark of the Covenant in the Temple at Jerusalem during Christ's ministry? When and where was the last known sighting of the Ark? Thanks in advance. 1 Link to comment
Popular Post Duncan Posted June 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 3, 2021 Unless it was a fake I saw it on Indiana Jones 5 Link to comment
OGHoosier Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 (edited) 14 minutes ago, rodheadlee said: Was the Ark of the Covenant in the Temple at Jerusalem during Christ's ministry? When and where was the last known sighting of the Ark? Thanks in advance. The Ark of the Covenant was not in the Temple of Zerubbabel nor it's successor the Temple of Herod. This was actually one of the major points by which the Temple of Zerubbabel was considered inferior to the Solomonic temple. In the Temples of Zerubbabel and Herod the ark's place was taken by a simple stone, if I am not mistaken. Most likely the ark was carried away to Babylon by Nebuchadnezzar and never made the return journey. John saw the Ark in heaven in Revelation 11:19 but whether that's the actual Ark or a symbolic representation is not known. Edited June 3, 2021 by OGHoosier 3 Link to comment
Calm Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 11 minutes ago, rodheadlee said: Was the Ark of the Covenant in the Temple at Jerusalem during Christ's ministry? When and where was the last known sighting of the Ark? Thanks in advance. Not really mentioned after the Babylonian conquest iirc and it is speculated it was either taken in conquest or hidden at that time, so highly unlikely it was kept in Herod’s Temple. While old, assuming this is still up to date in regards to what I am quoting: Quote The last mention of it is made during the days of the reform of King Josiah. From this point on, the scripture is silent as to the location and existence of the ark. The Jewish historian Josephus records that the temple of Herod in Jerusalem at the time of Christ did not contain the ark. https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/new-era/1973/05/q-and-a-questions-and-answers/what-was-the-ark-of-the-covenant-and-does-it-exist-in-any-form-today?lang=eng 1 Link to comment
JamesBYoung Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 Concern and mention of it declines after the Babylonians conquered Jerusalem. Link to comment
poptart Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 I'll just leave this here. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_Our_Lady_Mary_of_Zion Link to comment
JAHS Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 10 hours ago, OGHoosier said: The Ark of the Covenant was not in the Temple of Zerubbabel nor it's successor the Temple of Herod. This was actually one of the major points by which the Temple of Zerubbabel was considered inferior to the Solomonic temple. In the Temples of Zerubbabel and Herod the ark's place was taken by a simple stone, if I am not mistaken. Most likely the ark was carried away to Babylon by Nebuchadnezzar and never made the return journey. John saw the Ark in heaven in Revelation 11:19 but whether that's the actual Ark or a symbolic representation is not known. Maybe it's in the same place as the gold plates. 😉 Link to comment
JAHS Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 Some believe it is in this building in the African city of Axum If not there then it is here: Link to comment
poptart Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, JAHS said: Some believe it is in this building in the African city of Axum If not there then it is here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Lance More of a Catholic thing but still... Who knows, it was king Solomon who started to debase the work of the temple when he embraced degeneracy and worshiped false gods. Story is supposedly after God got tired of it and let the Jews be carried off into captivity some of the faithful temple workers fled elsewhere, taking their lore with them. That's more of a Masonic thing but still it meshes with the work of the temple and the ark story quite nicely. When I go home here in a few I'll pull out some of my stuff and see if I can find where this comes from, it's interesting. Edit, I didn't save the spot where a friend told me to look, thing is as thick as the bible. Grrrrr. I'll keep looking. Edited June 3, 2021 by poptart 1 Link to comment
Jamie Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 13 hours ago, OGHoosier said: John saw the Ark in heaven in Revelation 11:19 but whether that's the actual Ark or a symbolic representation is not known. I know. John saw the real ark, in his vision. The church keeps all of the really cool stuff up there. The ark, the original golden plates of the book of Mormon, and the original stone tablets with the 10 commandments that God gave to Moses, the second time, after Moses broke the first set. The sword of Laban and some candle sticks and a lot of other really cool stuff too. Heaven is a real place with real buildings and all kinds of good things in those buildings. And real plants outside of those buildings too. Just ask me the next time you don't know something. Link to comment
OGHoosier Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 1 minute ago, Jamie said: I know. John saw the real ark, in his vision. The church keeps all of the really cool stuff up there. The ark, the original golden plates of the book of Mormon, and the original stone tablets with the 10 commandments that God gave to Moses, the second time, after Moses broke the first set. The sword of Laban and some candle sticks and a lot of other really cool stuff too. Heaven is a real place with real buildings and all kinds of good things in those buildings. And real plants outside of those buildings too. Just ask me the next time you don't know something. Not sure how to respond to this tbh so I'm just gonna play the straight man. I believe that heaven (the celestial, the place where God dwells, the eternal abode of the sanctified and exalted) is a real place with real buildings and people and stuff. But I also know that a ton of the Revelation is super figurative and so I don't consider John's seeing the ark in heaven as a slam-dunk demonstration that it is in heaven in material reality. It could be but I don't see any particular reason for it to be as I don't think God is super sentimental about material objects. The plates and the sword of Laban had a role as witnessing artifacts so God maintaining them in heaven makes sense. The ark, maybe makes a little less sense, but then again I'm in no position to say what should or should not make sense to God. So the real ark could have been taken from Babylon to heaven, or even from Jerusalem to heaven, but I don't think we've got enough evidence either way. 1 Link to comment
Jamie Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 16 minutes ago, OGHoosier said: Not sure how to respond to this tbh so I'm just gonna play the straight man. I believe that heaven (the celestial, the place where God dwells, the eternal abode of the sanctified and exalted) is a real place with real buildings and people and stuff. But I also know that a ton of the Revelation is super figurative and so I don't consider John's seeing the ark in heaven as a slam-dunk demonstration that it is in heaven in material reality. It could be but I don't see any particular reason for it to be as I don't think God is super sentimental about material objects. The plates and the sword of Laban had a role as witnessing artifacts so God maintaining them in heaven makes sense. The ark, maybe makes a little less sense, but then again I'm in no position to say what should or should not make sense to God. So the real ark could have been taken from Babylon to heaven, or even from Jerusalem to heaven, but I don't think we've got enough evidence either way. Super sentimental? No, I don't either. Just regular sentimental, in my view. And I think he knows most of us are at least a little bit sentimental too and will want to see those things, someday. In some nice museum, somewhere. From earth to heaven, and then from heaven to earth. Something like what we have at the temple square in Salt Lake City, Utah, right now, if not in an even nicer building or collection of buildings with lots of nice tall trees and big bushes and pretty flowers. We have and will have a lot of things that we will keep around forever. 1 Link to comment
OGHoosier Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 10 minutes ago, Jamie said: Super sentimental? No, I don't either. Just regular sentimental, in my view. And I think he knows most of us are at least a little bit sentimental too and will want to see those things, someday. In some nice museum, somewhere. From earth to heaven, and then from heaven to earth. Something like what we have at the temple square in Salt Lake City, Utah, right now, if not in an even nicer building or collection of buildings with lots of nice tall trees and big bushes and pretty flowers. We have and will have a lot of things that we will keep around forever. Fair enough, I'm a museum geek so I'd really want to see them but I'm also not so sure the events of mortal life will loom as large in my mind when I'm, you know, exalted and extremely busy fulfilling the measure of my creation. I don't think "the same sociality that exists among us here will exist among us there" means that our attitudes about everything will be the same in the light of heaven. Nonetheless, I'd like for it to be there, so here's hoping you're right. Keep on keeping on. 1 Link to comment
Jamie Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 1 minute ago, OGHoosier said: Fair enough, I'm a museum geek so I'd really want to see them but I'm also not so sure the events of mortal life will loom as large in my mind when I'm, you know, exalted and extremely busy fulfilling the measure of my creation. I don't think "the same sociality that exists among us here will exist among us there" means that our attitudes about everything will be the same in the light of heaven. Nonetheless, I'd like for it to be there, so here's hoping you're right. Keep on keeping on. When you and your wife are raising your children in your mansion above I'm sure you'll still want to go out on some family excursions, sometimes, rather than always staying cooped up in your mansion. And if there were no museums I'm sure I would not be the only person to want to create some, at which point I and some others would then go look and find some things to put in them. We'll figure out entrance requirements later if there are still some details that will still need to be worked out. Link to comment
The Nehor Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 On 6/3/2021 at 12:18 PM, Jamie said: I know. John saw the real ark, in his vision. The church keeps all of the really cool stuff up there. The ark, the original golden plates of the book of Mormon, and the original stone tablets with the 10 commandments that God gave to Moses, the second time, after Moses broke the first set. The sword of Laban and some candle sticks and a lot of other really cool stuff too. Heaven is a real place with real buildings and all kinds of good things in those buildings. And real plants outside of those buildings too. Just ask me the next time you don't know something. They really should have taken the brazen serpent up there before they had to destroy it due to idolatry. Link to comment
The Nehor Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 On 6/3/2021 at 1:10 PM, Jamie said: When you and your wife are raising your children in your mansion above I'm sure you'll still want to go out on some family excursions, sometimes, rather than always staying cooped up in your mansion. And if there were no museums I'm sure I would not be the only person to want to create some, at which point I and some others would then go look and find some things to put in them. We'll figure out entrance requirements later if there are still some details that will still need to be worked out. Important to have entrance requirements when dealing with exalted patrons. It is important to separate the riff-raff from the worthy. Link to comment
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