Scott Lloyd Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 (edited) The Face to Face broadcast featuring Elder Gong and Primary, YM, YW general presidents talking in detail about the new programs for children and youth was presented tonight. If you missed it, it is archived on the Church website. This is a thread to discuss the new programs more or less in detail. I’ll start things out by saying I like the changes. I like the elimination of “check lists.” I like the focus on personal goal setting and flexibility within the framework of gospel values and traits we want to instill in our children and youth. I like that this focus has supplanted the cookie-cutter approaches of yesteryear. For instance, not every boy is enthused about competitive sports, and that’s OK. Each, however, should be interested in personal fitness and self-reliance with habits and practices suited to his own interests and aptitude. The new program, from what I can tell, is flexible enough to allow for that. I like that adult leaders are not to micro-manage but to leave it to the youth to carry out their own program. One of my fondest memories from youth was being a patrol leader in Scouts with a significant degree of autonomy exercised by our patrol members. I’m glad I was encouraged as a child in Primary to memorize the Articles of Faith, and I like that this practice was continued over the years. I fear that it will now fall by the wayside. At the same time, I can see a potential for an individual child to choose to set his or her own goal to memorize the articles, so that’s good. I like the For the Strength of Youth (FSY) conferences that are emulating the successful EFY programs and increasing the availability of such events. I think the newly redesigned CTR ring, and the new ring that boys get at age 12 and the consecrated oil vial they get at age 18 are cool. I wish I could have one of each for myself. I’m less than excited about the new theme for Young Men and the revised one for Young Women. I thought the Young Women values statement, or whatever it’s called, from before was too long, wordy and unwieldy, and these new versions are no improvement. But that’s just me. Thoughts and observations? Edited November 18, 2019 by Scott Lloyd
MustardSeed Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 I liked the changes. I thought the presentation was terribly stiff and awkward. 2
Scott Lloyd Posted November 18, 2019 Author Posted November 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, MustardSeed said: I liked the changes. I thought the presentation was terribly stiff and awkward. I get what you’re saying. Not everybody is cut out for show biz. But it seemed to connect with my 14-year-old daughter, and that’s good enough for me. And that reminds me. I do like the use of appealing music in the internet rollout of these programs. I’m glad we have David Archuleta and that he’s remained a solid, faithful and loyal Latter-day Saint.
Duncan Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 10 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: I get what you’re saying. Not everybody is cut out for show biz. But it seemed to connect with my 14-year-old daughter, and that’s good enough for me. And that reminds me. I do like the use of appealing music in the internet rollout of these programs. I’m glad we have David Archuleta and that he’s remained a solid, faithful and loyal Latter-day Saint. and umarried 1
InCognitus Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 11 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: 20 minutes ago, MustardSeed said: I liked the changes. I thought the presentation was terribly stiff and awkward. I get what you’re saying. Not everybody is cut out for show biz. But it seemed to connect with my 14-year-old daughter, and that’s good enough for me. I also liked the changes, but I'm still trying to get used to these youth conferences looking like a TED Talk. And now they are even including an app. I work in a technology field, but I feel like I'm generations away from where the youth are today. I'm glad to hear of your daughter's connection with the broadcast because I watched it on my own and I was wondering how it went over with the youth. 2
bsjkki Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 23 minutes ago, MustardSeed said: I liked the changes. I thought the presentation was terribly stiff and awkward. I like the changes...the presentation, not so much. I will rewatch with my teenager and see it through her eyes. It felt a little slick and too much of a “time out for women” feel. It could be my own personal issue...there is no need to “sell” me on the idea. I don’t need a “production” and don’t really care for them. 2
Peacefully Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 The new information for me: 1. recognition and awards 2. YM theme 3. new youth and Primary songs I thought everyone did a great job with the presentation. It did sound scripted but I don’t think we want them improvising. They got a lot of info into 1 1/2 hrs. 1
bluebell Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 Initially they said they weren't going to do any recognition or rewards so I was really excited to see that changed. 4
Scott Lloyd Posted November 18, 2019 Author Posted November 18, 2019 1 hour ago, bluebell said: Initially they said they weren't going to do any recognition or rewards so I was really excited to see that changed. The approach (self-directed goal setting, flexibility, etc.) reminds me somewhat of the old Pursuit of Excellence program, which I’ve wish had continued. Of course, that was aimed primarily at the age group now categorized as young single adult and took the place of the earlier Master M Man and Golden Gleaner awards.
Popular Post rockpond Posted November 18, 2019 Popular Post Posted November 18, 2019 I think back to the early 2000's when they rolled out the new Duty to God program. Members didn't take much notice. I was YM president at the time and felt like I was needing to work really hard just to make YM and their parents aware of what the program was. I love that the Church has become so much better at introducing new programs. Maybe it was a little "stiff" but last night's format is still new to them. While I love the traditional conference talks given from behind the massive pulpit made from the Hinckley family's black walnut tree, I think this way of presenting on a topic is more likely to get the youth's attention. And, as a fan of EFY, I'm happy to see what seems a bit like incorporating some of the good techniques from EFY into a program that will run all year long (and into FSY conferences). Of course, all that is "the box". But the pearl, this great goal setting program, makes me happy. My dad basically did this with me when I was a kid/teen and sat with me at the beginning of each month to help me evaluate how I was doing and to set new goals. I tried doing it with my own kids but failed to stick with it. I'm so glad that this program will now get me going on it again. My only question from last night is: why are the boys "sons of God" and the girls are "sons of Heavenly Parents"? 7
bluebell Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, rockpond said: My only question from last night is: why are the boys "sons of God" and the girls are "sons of Heavenly Parents"? I noticed that this difference has created a lot of really angry people online, which surprised me and makes me roll my eyes a little bit (because it's starting to seem a little like some people are only care about something as far as they can be upset about it not being how they want it to be). My only thought on why the difference (beyond them probably being written by two different groups of people) is that the Aaronic Priesthood theme is mostly focused on the young men's duties as Aaronic priesthood holders and as such, it focuses on their relationship with Him who's priesthood it is. As I said someone where else, we sometimes forget that it's not really Young Women and Young Men, but Young Women and Quorums of the Aaronic Priesthood. The two organizations have a lot in common, most of which being the age of the participants and weekly activities, but they are not completely the same. There are valid differences between the two and the themes seem to illustrate that. 4
rockpond Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 1 minute ago, bluebell said: I noticed that this difference has created a lot of really angry people online, which surprised me and makes me roll my eyes a little bit (because it's starting to seem a little like some people are only care about something as far as they can be upset about it not being how they want it to be). My only thought on why the difference (beyond them probably being written by two different groups of people) is that the Aaronic Priesthood theme is mostly focused on the young men's duties as Aaronic priesthood holders and as such, it focuses on their relationship with Him who's priesthood it is. As I said someone where else, we sometimes forget that it's not really Young Women and Young Men, but Young Women and Quorums of the Aaronic Priesthood. The two organizations have a lot in common, most of which being the age of the participants and weekly activities, but they are not completely the same. There are valid differences between the two and the themes seem to illustrate that. When my wife mentioned it, I suggested that maybe they are trying to emphasize the right role model: for YM it's Heavenly Father, for YW it's Heavenly Mother or Heavenly Parents. She feels that the boys need to be more aware of Heavenly Mother. And I get that. I'm trying to stay focused on the positive and I'm really happy that Heavenly Mother is coming back into our lexicon as Latter-day Saints. 4
Popular Post ksfisher Posted November 18, 2019 Popular Post Posted November 18, 2019 (edited) 35 minutes ago, rockpond said: I think back to the early 2000's when they rolled out the new Duty to God program. Members didn't take much notice. I was YM president at the time and felt like I was needing to work really hard just to make YM and their parents aware of what the program was. I was a YM president as well at the time. The I felt the difficulty with Duty to God at that time was scouting. We're doing scouting. We're doing Duty to God. While there was crossover between the two, it seemed like trying to do both ended up with not really doing either well. With the discontinuation of scouting I think the new program will be a success. Edited November 18, 2019 by ksfisher 6
ksfisher Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 27 minutes ago, rockpond said: My only question from last night is: why are the boys "sons of God" and the girls are "sons of Heavenly Parents"? Are you understanding God here to mean only Heavenly Father? The title god could be applied to any member of the godhead as well as a heavenly mother. The two themes use different words, but really have the same meaning.
rockpond Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, ksfisher said: I was a YM president as well at the time. The I felt the difficulty with Duty to God at that time was scouting. We're doing scout. We're doing Duty to God. While there was crossover between the two, it seemed like trying to do both ended up with not really doing either well. With the discontinuation of scouting I think the new program will be a success. I agree. There were times where I wished that our leaders would have just said to each YM: Pick one -- Scouting or DtG and dedicate yourself to it. I guess I got my wish, in a way. 1
ksfisher Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 1 minute ago, rockpond said: I agree. There were times where I wished that our leaders would have just said to each YM: Pick one -- Scouting or DtG and dedicate yourself to it. I guess I got my wish, in a way. Does anyone know how well Duty to God worked in areas where there was no scouting? 1
rockpond Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 5 minutes ago, ksfisher said: Are you understanding God here to mean only Heavenly Father? The title god could be applied to any member of the godhead as well as a heavenly mother. The two themes use different words, but really have the same meaning. True. It could apply to Heavenly Mother but I don't think a teenage boy is going to see it that way (and I have two of them in my home). I would have liked for both themes to start out with a nod to "Heavenly Parents" but I'm not going to lose sleep over it. I'm pleased with the changes and direction we're headed. 1
rockpond Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 Just now, ksfisher said: Does anyone know how well Duty to God worked in areas where there was no scouting? Great question! I'd love to hear from some of our international participants on this.
Scott Lloyd Posted November 18, 2019 Author Posted November 18, 2019 (edited) 34 minutes ago, ksfisher said: Are you understanding God here to mean only Heavenly Father? The title god could be applied to any member of the godhead as well as a heavenly mother. The two themes use different words, but really have the same meaning. The problem is that Scouting was never primarily a religious movement. It is a secular program with an optional religious component. The Church needed a structure in which Scouting was an instrument to fulfill the Church’s overarching, faith-related mission (or as it was frequently expressed over the years, “the activity arm of the Aaronic Priesthood). I don’t think Scouting ever saw itself in such an ancillary or subordinate role. So when secular interests grew more and more to take over Scouting, the conflicts with the Church’s purposes became intolerable. —— Pardon, I meant this to be in response to your previous post. Edited November 18, 2019 by Scott Lloyd 1
InCognitus Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 I liked that the videos used subtitles all through the presentation. But it made me chuckle, because it reminded me of this sketch: Iraq Insurgent Subtitles | Sketch Comedy | SkitHOUSE 3
Scott Lloyd Posted November 18, 2019 Author Posted November 18, 2019 51 minutes ago, rockpond said: When my wife mentioned it, I suggested that maybe they are trying to emphasize the right role model: for YM it's Heavenly Father, for YW it's Heavenly Mother or Heavenly Parents. She feels that the boys need to be more aware of Heavenly Mother. And I get that. I'm trying to stay focused on the positive and I'm really happy that Heavenly Mother is coming back into our lexicon as Latter-day Saints. Do you agree with me that a Mother in Heaven is an important doctrinal concept even though there is no specific mention of it in scripture?
rockpond Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: The problem is that Scouting was never primarily a religious movement. It is a secular program with an optional religious component. The Church needed a structure in which Scouting was an instrument to fulfill the Church’s overarching, faith-related mission (or as it was frequently expressed over the years, “the activity arm of the Aaronic Priesthood). I don’t think Scouting ever saw itself in such an ancillary or subordinate role. So when secular interests grew more and more to take over Scouting, the conflicts with the Church’s purposes became intolerable. I don't know how it was in Utah, but here in Colorado there has always been some animus from the non-LDS scout leaders toward the LDS scout leaders (often felt at the monthly round-table meetings). The criticism was that we weren't doing scouting "right" or fully. Something like that. I was always bothered because while LDS troops poured tons of money into the local councils, they would still plan BSA activities and campouts on Sundays. Drove me nuts. And yet, I'm still sad that we're parting ways with the BSA. Not that I think it's the wrong decision - just a little sad that it needs to happen. 2
hoo rider Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 The devotional was well done overall and I think most people left feeling excited about the new program. A couple thoughts: - It was interesting to hear applause during a devotional on a Sunday. I was under the impression that applause was usually discouraged for Sunday meetings and other spiritual meetings (e.g. Saturday sessions of General Conference), but maybe this one was an exception or our culture is changing. - The song by David Archeluta was very well done, but I was surprised at how much "rock" (as in rock n' roll) it had in it. If someone had played the tune (no words) in isolation I would have put it more similar to Christian rock on the radio than church music. - The only major miss was not having the new app (can't remember the name of it) available yet. When Elder Gong introduced the app and showed it, several young women near me immediately went to download it and were disappointed to find it unavailable.
rockpond Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 9 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: Do you agree with me that a Mother in Heaven is an important doctrinal concept even though there is no specific mention of it in scripture? Yes.
ksfisher Posted November 18, 2019 Posted November 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, hoo rider said: - The only major miss was not having the new app (can't remember the name of it) available yet. When Elder Gong introduced the app and showed it, several young women near me immediately went to download it and were disappointed to find it unavailable. It's not quite ready for the public yet. Give it a month.
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