strappinglad Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 As I have said before, I am once again reading the Old Testament with notes from the NRSV . We believe the Bible to be the word of God. So far I find looking for the word of God in the OT is like " Finding Waldo " , and when I do see a statement attributed to God I have questions. Take Isaiah 20 for eg. God tells the prophet to walk around naked for 3 years as a metaphor or something. Eventually that kind of behavior would get the prophet written off as a nut case , no? There is some odd stuff in the OT .
Popular Post Calm Posted July 8, 2018 Popular Post Posted July 8, 2018 (edited) Do you want to talk about what the odd stuff is or how you can approach the OT in a useful spiritual way? If the latter, I would suggest when coming across odd stuff, try to translate it into something you can relate to...such as God not asking you to prance around naked, but has he asked you to do anything that feels unreasonable or humiliating that might further his work....like knocking on doors in shirts and ties in the middle of summer or dead of winter and ask the people inside are they interested in hearing God's Word knowing most will shut it in your face and possibly think you are an annoying idiot. That prophet was trying to convey God's teachings and warnings in a way that would lead the people who saw him to accountability and acceptance. The required genocide of enemies and destruction of all their property....is there anything God knows you need to completely remove from your life in order to prevent bad habits from sneaking back into your life after you have covenanted to stop (think going through your house and removing anything that was part of a smoking habit even if they are valuable like a solid gold, diamond encrusted ashtray, avoiding situations that trigger the need like a traditional friends' night out at a bar (perhaps one might even need to avoid friends who refuse to stop smoking around you even while recognizing they are good people, but not good for you at this time). Not saying these are the original meanings meant by the authors (nor am I justifying genocide as a way to keep one's own culture from being corrupted as that is something I place in the category of "have no clue"), but instead turn it into your own Testament with your own inspirations of God talking to you. If you want to make sense of the OT as close to the original meaning as we can this far removed from that time, place, and people, I would suggest scholarly commentaries and learning the history of an area...and reading multiple acclaimed scholars with different ideas. Not saying they are inherently right, but they can give more coherent and reasonable explanations of background than those less willing to invest in education and the work that is often recognized by academic acclaim. Edited July 8, 2018 by Calm 6
Robert F. Smith Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, strappinglad said: As I have said before, I am once again reading the Old Testament with notes from the NRSV . We believe the Bible to be the word of God. So far I find looking for the word of God in the OT is like " Finding Waldo " , and when I do see a statement attributed to God I have questions. Take Isaiah 20 for eg. God tells the prophet to walk around naked for 3 years as a metaphor or something. Eventually that kind of behavior would get the prophet written off as a nut case , no? There is some odd stuff in the OT . What about the Quakers walking around naked in old England? Were they crazy, or prophetic? They were, after all, radical Puritans, very serious about God and religion. Kenneth L. Carroll, “Early Quakers and ‘Going Naked As a Sign’,” Quaker History, 67/2 (Autumn 1978):69-87, online at https://www.jstor.org/stable/41946859?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents . The culture of the Bible is vastly differnt than anything familiar to us in our day. Naturally, as we become more conversant with the actual Bible text, we will realize this. Then come the questions. Edited July 8, 2018 by Robert F. Smith 1
Storm Rider Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 I love the OT because it is so great at demonstrating how God works with humans. It does not aggrandize prophets to be superhuman, godlike creatures that drip with perfection; rather it shows them as we are - very human, but willing to accept God's command without making them perfect in the process. It is a wonderful book of scripture for all humans that begin to think that they are more than human or who have expectations of leaders being more than human. 3
RevTestament Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 10 hours ago, strappinglad said: As I have said before, I am once again reading the Old Testament with notes from the NRSV . We believe the Bible to be the word of God. So far I find looking for the word of God in the OT is like " Finding Waldo " , and when I do see a statement attributed to God I have questions. Take Isaiah 20 for eg. God tells the prophet to walk around naked for 3 years as a metaphor or something. Eventually that kind of behavior would get the prophet written off as a nut case , no? There is some odd stuff in the OT . My appreciation for the OT has grown over the course of my life. What God is trying to communicate in this case is that Israel could not hide from Him. They are all naked before Him. He knows their shameful acts, and their thoughts. He is telling them as you see this man, humbled before you, so I see you. He is trying to communicate His irritation with them, and to let them know His warnings about Babylon were serious, and that Judah would not be able to hide behind Egypt, but that He would reveal all her misdeeds and whoredoms with other gods. He is telling them not to rely on Egypt or to try to escape there. Of course it seemed to go over their heads or be forgotten, and Zedekiah did just that - irritating Nebuchadnezzar in the process, and bringing about the destruction of Jerusalem in the process - making her desolate and naked of her God, YHWH - I think there can be several levels to this imagery. 3
Jeanne Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 Who is "WE"? And why is "WE" more important than the rest of "US"? Just askin'
strappinglad Posted July 8, 2018 Author Posted July 8, 2018 1 hour ago, Jeanne said: Who is "WE"? And why is "WE" more important than the rest of "US"? Just askin' If this is for me, I was simply quoting an article of faith , and I assume the ' we believe ' includes all Christians and Jews and any other groups who accept the OT as scripture. 9 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said: The culture of the Bible is vastly differnt than anything familiar to us in our day So true. The object lesson in Is. 20 apparently was lost on Israel . One would hope that Isaiah did more than just walk around naked for 3 years , but that he also spent his time explaining the meaning of his behavior. 10 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said: What about the Quakers walking around naked in old England? Were they crazy, or prophetic? I remember the Dukabores( sp?) doing the same in a protest in British Columbia. I wonder if the Quakers and Dukabores got their inspiration from Isaiah?
DennisTate Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 16 hours ago, strappinglad said: As I have said before, I am once again reading the Old Testament with notes from the NRSV . We believe the Bible to be the word of God. So far I find looking for the word of God in the OT is like " Finding Waldo " , and when I do see a statement attributed to God I have questions. Take Isaiah 20 for eg. God tells the prophet to walk around naked for 3 years as a metaphor or something. Eventually that kind of behavior would get the prophet written off as a nut case , no? There is some odd stuff in the OT . Being a Prophet is rough........ even Jonah may actually have been attempting to get away from being asked to do...... what he did not want to do....... Jonah did not want to warn the people who he believed would eventually take the northern ten tribes of Israel into captivity and so horribly treat so many of them.
Robert F. Smith Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 9 hours ago, Storm Rider said: I love the OT because it is so great at demonstrating how God works with humans. It does not aggrandize prophets to be superhuman, godlike creatures that drip with perfection; rather it shows them as we are - very human, but willing to accept God's command without making them perfect in the process. It is a wonderful book of scripture for all humans that begin to think that they are more than human or who have expectations of leaders being more than human. That is the singular advantage of the Bible: Unlike much of the pompous and pretentious literature of the ancient world, it portrays heroes warts and all. No pharaoh permitted himself to be seen in that way. 2
Robert F. Smith Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 4 hours ago, strappinglad said: ............................. So true. The object lesson in Is. 20 apparently was lost on Israel . One would hope that Isaiah did more than just walk around naked for 3 years , but that he also spent his time explaining the meaning of his behavior. Isaiah was by far and away the most high status and literary prophet of all, and key member of the king's court. For him to have walked around naked was all the more shocking. 4 hours ago, strappinglad said: I remember the Dukabores( sp?) doing the same in a protest in British Columbia. I wonder if the Quakers and Dukabores got their inspiration from Isaiah? Probably. 1
JAHS Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 18 hours ago, strappinglad said: As I have said before, I am once again reading the Old Testament with notes from the NRSV . We believe the Bible to be the word of God. So far I find looking for the word of God in the OT is like " Finding Waldo " , and when I do see a statement attributed to God I have questions. Take Isaiah 20 for eg. God tells the prophet to walk around naked for 3 years as a metaphor or something. Eventually that kind of behavior would get the prophet written off as a nut case , no? There is some odd stuff in the OT . Here'sfew more: Leviticus 11 and Deut. 14 says the hare is an animal that chews the cud. Gen.30:35--43 says that placing striped sticks in view of mating animals results in striped offspring. Of course science can easily prove these things wrong. Psalms and Proverbs have a lot of good word of God doctrine in them.
Exiled Posted July 9, 2018 Posted July 9, 2018 34 minutes ago, Thinking said: Deuteronomy 21:18-21 Maybe Jefferson had the right idea with his bible?
The Nehor Posted July 9, 2018 Posted July 9, 2018 Make sure to take everything ENTIRELY LITERALLY and do not allow the slightest thought that some of it may not have been inspired. Do either of these and you are a depraved apostate.
Tacenda Posted July 9, 2018 Posted July 9, 2018 12 hours ago, Thinking said: Deuteronomy 21:18-21 Which makes me wonder why Joseph Smith would even want some of the OT teachings restored. Especially since Jesus came to do away with such crud.
The Nehor Posted July 9, 2018 Posted July 9, 2018 5 hours ago, Tacenda said: Which makes me wonder why Joseph Smith would even want some of the OT teachings restored. Especially since Jesus came to do away with such crud. Jesus also gave them said crud.
Recommended Posts