Religious Themes in new Star Wars movie.

[Rivers]

I watched the new Star Wars recently and noticed religious ideas(more than usual) worth thinking about.  And I needed a place to write them down. 

First there’s Luke who refuses the call to action. He tells Rey that it is erroneous to believe that he is expected to face down the whole first order with a laser sword.

This seems like a commentary on false messiah worship. It is pushing against the idea that one special person can set everything right.  

Later Luke teaches Rey that the Force is everywhere and in everything. The Jedi don’t own the Force. It is vanity to believe that the light dies if the Jedi die. 

In the case of religion, no one church or religious sect has a monopoly on God, spirituality, virtue, goodness, love, etc. It reminds me of AofF 13 which teaches us to seek for goodness wherever it is to be found.

In Luke’s second lesson, he teaches Rey of the Jedi’s past deeds. The Jedi have become deified but history teaches us their pride and hubris have brought the galaxy to ruin.  Luke’s recounts his own mistakes that helped throw the galaxy out of balance again. He now believes it is time for the Jedi to end.

We often speak of church leaders of the past with veneration while critics are quick to point out all their flaws and think that Mormonism or religion in general must end.

Luke has closed himself off from the Force and eventually opens himself back to it.  This allows Yoda to reveal himself to Luke and teach him some final lessons including  the importance of learning from failure.  

As we open ourselves to the spirit we can receive personal revelation from God and learn the things we need to learn. We can repent of our past sins and learn from them.

Finally Luke becomes the hero people needed him to be. He faces down the enemy, saves what is left of the resistance, and inspires people throughout the galaxy.

Our church leaders aren’t perfect now or in the past. Nor can they do everything for us.  But we can still look to them for inspiration. We can also be light to others.

There’s more but this post is probably long enough. 

And I’m out.

 

 

 

[bluebell]

I'm hopeful that the next installment will include themes of redemption.  I'm pulling for Rey and Kylo Ren to make it work.  

[Amulek]

13 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I'm pulling for Rey and Kylo Ren to make it work.

/bleh

Darth Pumba* is far and away my least favorite Star Wars villain. 

 

*Seriously, what is up with Disney and all of this 'putting your past behind you' nonsense? 

[bluebell]

20 minutes ago, Amulek said:

/bleh

Darth Pumba* is far and away my least favorite Star Wars villain. 

 

*Seriously, what is up with Disney and all of this 'putting your past behind you' nonsense? 

Isn't that the hope of the gospel?  That you can put your past behind you and become a new person?  Seems weird to call it nonsense.  

[Rivers]

1 hour ago, bluebell said:

I'm hopeful that the next installment will include themes of redemption.  I'm pulling for Rey and Kylo Ren to make it work.  

You must be a member of the Reylo fan club.

[cinepro]

1 hour ago, bluebell said:

I'm hopeful that the next installment will include themes of redemption.  I'm pulling for Rey and Kylo Ren to make it work.  

I think the message of Episode 8 was faith.

Because after seeing it, it's taking a lot of faith to think that JJ Abrams can salvage the wreckage in Episode 9.

[Rivers]

50 minutes ago, Amulek said:

/bleh

Darth Pumba* is far and away my least favorite Star Wars villain. 

 

*Seriously, what is up with Disney and all of this 'putting your past behind you' nonsense? 

Darth Pumba? Are you referring to Kylo Ren?  He’s actually a really interesting villain IMO.  He is growing from a Vader wannabe to his own man.  He’s going on a villain’s journey as opposed to a hero’s journey. It’s now up to episode 9 to make the whole thing work well.

Its interesting that you reference The Lion King.  I’ve noticed a lot of similarities between Lion King and Last Jedi.  Luke and Simba have very similar character archs.  They both feel guilty about something and go into exile. They both are needed to save the day while the bad guys take over. They are both visited in exile by a female character and refuse the call to action. They are both visited by an old wise mentor character who hit them with a stick and tell them to learn from the past. And finallt they both show up to save the day when all hope seems lost.

 

[Rivers]

8 minutes ago, cinepro said:

I think the message of Episode 8 was faith.

Because after seeing it, it's taking a lot of faith to think that JJ Abrams can salvage the wreckage in Episode 9.

JJ will probably just copy Return of the Jedi.  Copying other things is all he’s good at.

[Duncan]

I bought that movie the day it came out at Mal Wart and I must be an atheist because I didn't see any religious themes or God or anything in it! I thought Rogue One was the best of the post episodes 4-6 of Star Wars

[bluebell]

28 minutes ago, cinepro said:

I think the message of Episode 8 was faith.

Because after seeing it, it's taking a lot of faith to think that JJ Abrams can salvage the wreckage in Episode 9.

[bluebell]

17 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I bought that movie the day it came out at Mal Wart and I must be an atheist because I didn't see any religious themes or God or anything in it! I thought Rogue One was the best of the post episodes 4-6 of Star Wars

Oh man, that one was one of my least favorite of the newer ones (I prefer to pretend that episodes 1-3 don't exist though.  Those are just embarrassing).

[bluebell]

33 minutes ago, Rivers said:

You must be a member of the Reylo fan club.

Mostly just because it's funny to rile some people up. 

Not gonna lie though, I'd be happy if they end up together and he's solidly back on the good side.  I'm not that invested though.  My guess is that the next movie creates a bit of a love triangle between Rey, Ren, and Po.  Story righters can never resist a good love triangle.

[RevTestament]

1 hour ago, Amulek said:

/bleh

Darth Pumba* is far and away my least favorite Star Wars villain. 

 

*Seriously, what is up with Disney and all of this 'putting your past behind you' nonsense? 

How dare you sully the sacred name of Pumba! We got that movie for our oldest when he was a toddler, and he watched it until he virtually wore out the tape (video tape - the good ole days!)

Now Darth Scar would work perfectly.

P.S. I guess there are only so many good-evil motifs writers know how to fit into movies. It almost seems strange how that is so prevalent in the old comic books and in movies, and yet the good-evil motifs in the scriptures are routinely rejected these days by society.

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, Amulek said:

/bleh

Darth Pumba* is far and away my least favorite Star Wars villain. 

 

*Seriously, what is up with Disney and all of this 'putting your past behind you' nonsense? 

He is just not intimidating. I wish they hadn’t killed poor Snoke. I wanted to find out that he was Darth Plagueis and trained Palpatine and his power over the midichlorians to create life was not just bluster and he survived Palpatine’s betrayal.

Maybe they can still bring him back that way?

[RevTestament]

23 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I bought that movie the day it came out at Mal Wart and I must be an atheist because I didn't see any religious themes or God or anything in it! I thought Rogue One was the best of the post episodes 4-6 of Star Wars

Just in case you need emotional support against the weak-minded, I too really liked Rogue One - the characters anyway. And then they killed all these great characters off. I really would have liked to see a few survive and be worked back into the plot - or at least descendants or similar. 

On the other hand the death planet idea was really stupid and repetitive. A whole planet galavanting about the galaxy with a stable atmosphere above absolute zero - from a science fiction standpoint it was enough to make me hate it. I was like here we go again. Rogue One was the only one I liked enough to perhaps buy or watch again, although I did watch The Force Awakens again as a freebie - more out of nostalgia for the original characters than anything else. To make the series continue to work I predict Rey and Cylo Ren will get it on and have yet a new little Jedilet. Don't forget you saw it first here on MormonDialogue!

[Rivers]

And then Rey and Kylo could fight him together and then rule the galaxy as husband and wife.  And they will have lots of Skywalker/Kenobi babies. Because of course it will be revealed that Rey is Obi Wan’s grand-daughter.

[Rivers]

47 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I bought that movie the day it came out at Mal Wart and I must be an atheist because I didn't see any religious themes or God or anything in it! I thought Rogue One was the best of the post episodes 4-6 of Star Wars

I probably read too much into it.

[RevTestament]

11 minutes ago, Rivers said:

And then Rey and Kylo could fight him together and then rule the galaxy as husband and wife.  And they will have lots of Skywalker/Kenobi babies. Because of course it will be revealed that Rey is Obi Wan’s grand-daughter.

And a new Jedi order will arise without a vow of chastity and Star Wars will become rated R?

[smac97]

15 minutes ago, RevTestament said:

Just in case you need emotional support against the weak-minded, I too really liked Rogue One - the characters anyway. And then they killed all these great characters off. I really would have liked to see a few survive and be worked back into the plot - or at least descendants or similar. 

On the other hand the death planet idea was really stupid and repetitive. A whole planet galavanting about the galaxy with a stable atmosphere above absolute zero - from a science fiction standpoint it was enough to make me hate it. I was like here we go again. Rogue One was the only one I liked enough to perhaps buy or watch again, although I did watch The Force Awakens again as a freebie - more out of nostalgia for the original characters than anything else. To make the series continue to work I predict Rey and Cylo Ren will get it on and have yet a new little Jedilet. Don't forget you saw it first here on MormonDialogue!

I thought Starkiller base was stationary.  Its power source is the nearby star.

[cinepro]

58 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

He is just not intimidating. I wish they hadn’t killed poor Snoke. I wanted to find out that he was Darth Plagueis and trained Palpatine and his power over the midichlorians to create life was not just bluster and he survived Palpatine’s betrayal.

Maybe they can still bring him back that way?

I like the theory that Snoke could be Darth Plagueis.  And while he's immortal, every time he "dies"  and comes back he does so with battle damage, which is why he looked like he was chopped up in places.

Another fun theory is that Snoke could have made a Vader clone and kept it hidden somewhere, and it gets put into play after his death, so Hayden Christensen comes back and he's the bad guy and Kylo Ren and Rey have to defeat him.  Normally I would be horrified at such an idea, but after Episode 8, I'm more like "Hey, why not...?"

[RevTestament]

1 minute ago, smac97 said:

I thought Starkiller base was stationary.  Its power source is the nearby star.

That is because the true Starkiller was just too inconceivable. That was another thing that was totally stupid. This planet really sucks ALL the energy out of stars and kills them? Then they wouldn't need to shoot the planets - they would all go into a fairly instant deep freeze without their stars. And then the death ray somehow magically split into multiple parts - there was just so much totally wrong about that whole plot. Sucking the energy of a whole star and converting it into "dark energy" in this planet was just... well... lame. It was so totally over the top and completely ridiculous. The other thing was how this planet was supposed to get around the galaxy on mere rockets? Past light speed or something? Yeah, they skipped over that explanation. If it was as you thought, then the beam would take thousands of years to get to most of the planets in the galaxy, unless it too is somehow mysteriously able to defy the speed of light. It was all just stupid.

On an interesting note, Starkiller was apparently supposed to be Luke's name rather than Skywalker. Hmm.. I wonder if that got made up.

[bluebell]

7 minutes ago, cinepro said:

Normally I would be horrified at such an idea, but after Episode 8, I'm more like "Hey, why not...?"

[Calm]

Apparently they used hyperspace tech:

" The First Order viewed this ability as an evolution of the planet-destroying capabilities of the Galactic Empire's Death Stardesigns, with the weapon serving as the ultimate culmination of Old Empire research into dark energy translations and hyperspace tunneling...

In order for the weapon to fire, its weapons engineers would induce a breach in the containment field, allowing the collected dark energy to escape the core through the hollow cylindrical opening on the antipodes of the planet relative to the stellar collector. During this process, the dark energy transformed to a state known as "phantom energy", and left the planet behind, tearing a hole through hyperspace along a perfectly linear path. The people stationed at the Base called the dimension through which the phantom energy beam traveled "sub-hyperspace", and this method of delivering the payload was near-instantaneous across vast distances. The rotation and inclination of the planet had to be taken into account for the weapon to target something, and also the lack of obstacles between it and the target, as the phantom energy beam would only be intercepted by an object of sufficient mass (like a planet). When the phantom energy struck a planet, the interaction produced enough heat to ignite the planet's core, creating a pocket nova. The space-time disruption caused by the phantom energy's passage would make the nova instantaneously visible thousands of light years away, for a short time."

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Starkiller_Base

I had forgotten about this.  Had pretty much forgotten the whole movie.  Now I remember thinking "I have seen this all before".

Edited April 19, 2018 by Calm

[cinepro]

17 minutes ago, RevTestament said:

 

On an interesting note, Starkiller was apparently supposed to be Luke's name rather than Skywalker. Hmm.. I wonder if that got made up.

http://maddogmovies.com/almost/scripts/starwars_second1-75.pdf

[RevTestament]

4 minutes ago, Calm said:

Apparently they used hyperspace tech:

" The First Order viewed this ability as an evolution of the planet-destroying capabilities of the Galactic Empire's Death Stardesigns, with the weapon serving as the ultimate culmination of Old Empire research into dark energy translations and hyperspace tunneling"

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Starkiller_Base

I had forgotten about this.  Had pretty much forgotten the whole movie.  Now I remember thinking "I have seen this all before".

When I watched this movie again, I watched for this, and don't remember the first word about how this planet got around the galaxy. Since "dark energy" is a completely unknown and theoretical energy, I suppose a star's energy and matter could somehow be converted, but I for one am more inclined to believe that there is no dark energy, and that we simply do not understand the universe. In other words I view dark energy as an artificial theoretical construct designed to fill gaps in the current model for the creation of the universe. I believe that it is more likely we simply do not know all the properties of light, and that therefore the current model of the big bang is founded on false assumptions, and that there is no "dark matter" nor particularly "dark energy." But that doesn't make for interesting movie material... However, I do see this "dark energy" becoming a new staple as the origin for the dark side of the force. It is obvious that JJ is a closet Mormon, and is trying to introduce the idea of outer darkness into the minds of young viewers.