Ayla Stewart "Infuriated" by LDS Church's Condemnation of White Culture

[katherine the great]

This lady doesn't even make any sense.  There is no such thing as "white" culture. No one is being asked to forsake their Danish roots and havarti cheese. No Scots are being asked to stop playing the bagpipes and wearing kilts for cultural celebrations. No Germans or German Americans are being asked to forsake their love of art or Mozart. It is obvious to anyone with a brain that it is the culture of racism that is under the microscope here--not "white culture" because there is no such thing. There isn't even a "European American" culture because culture requires some kind of shared experience or belief system and Americans of European descent are very diverse in their backgrounds. African Americans on the other hand have the shared history of having ancestors who were brought here by force and kept as property in a way that is unprecedented in human history. That collective memory and the fighting spirit that often comes with it makes them a cultural group. There's also no "Asian" culture. Koreans and Cambodians have vastly different cultures and yet they are both Asian. The only cultural practice that I can observe that is shared by those who claim "White culture" is the practice of racism.

[halconero]

3 hours ago, katherine the great said:

This lady doesn't even make any sense.  There is no such thing as "white" culture. No one is being asked to forsake their Danish roots and havarti cheese. No Scots are being asked to stop playing the bagpipes and wearing kilts for cultural celebrations. No Germans or German Americans are being asked to forsake their love of art or Mozart. It is obvious to anyone with a brain that it is the culture of racism that is under the microscope here--not "white culture" because there is no such thing. There isn't even a "European American" culture because culture requires some kind of shared experience or belief system and Americans of European descent are very diverse in their backgrounds. African Americans on the other hand have the shared history of having ancestors who were brought here by force and kept as property in a way that is unprecedented in human history. That collective memory and the fighting spirit that often comes with it makes them a cultural group. There's also no "Asian" culture. Koreans and Cambodians have vastly different cultures and yet they are both Asian. The only cultural practice that I can observe that is shared by those who claim "White culture" is the practice of racism.

Yup. I would note that many new immigrants from areas of the Congo, Sudan, etc identify more as Congolese or Sudanese than African American. African American refers primarily to descendants of slaves who can't trace their heritage back beyond being taken from somewhere in West Africa.

[thesometimesaint]

23 hours ago, Darren10 said:

"...tasty things(people)..."

You cannibal you!

I'm an old hard a crusty crouton, I prefer the soft and tender ones.

Edited August 27, 2017 by thesometimesaint

[Darren10]

4 hours ago, thesometimesaint said:

I'm an old hard a crusty crouton, I prefer the soft and tender ones.

Heh!

[Darren10]

8 hours ago, katherine the great said:

This lady doesn't even make any sense.  There is no such thing as "white" culture. No one is being asked to forsake their Danish roots and havarti cheese. No Scots are being asked to stop playing the bagpipes and wearing kilts for cultural celebrations. No Germans or German Americans are being asked to forsake their love of art or Mozart. It is obvious to anyone with a brain that it is the culture of racism that is under the microscope here--not "white culture" because there is no such thing. There isn't even a "European American" culture because culture requires some kind of shared experience or belief system and Americans of European descent are very diverse in their backgrounds. African Americans on the other hand have the shared history of having ancestors who were brought here by force and kept as property in a way that is unprecedented in human history. That collective memory and the fighting spirit that often comes with it makes them a cultural group. There's also no "Asian" culture. Koreans and Cambodians have vastly different cultures and yet they are both Asian. The only cultural practice that I can observe that is shared by those who claim "White culture" is the practice of racism.

Oh, I think there actually is a white culture. in face Danes, Scots, and Germans all make up a part of "white culture". Eating Havarti cheese, playing the bagpipes, listening to Mozart, etc. are parts of white culture. In fact, these are all culturing enriching. It's that these should not be excluded from others who are non whites from fully participating. Nor should they be viewed as inherently "superior" to other cultures.

Quote

The only cultural practice that I can observe that is shared by those who claim "White culture" is the practice of racism.

Correct. and that is why I think the church placed white culture in quotations in their condemnation of those who promote it. It's the racist element which the Church condemns, not the cultural compliments whites have made in the world.

[katherine the great]

14 minutes ago, Darren10 said:

Oh, I think there actually is a white culture. in face Danes, Scots, and Germans all make up a part of "white culture". Eating Havarti cheese, playing the bagpipes, listening to Mozart, etc. are parts of white culture. In fact, these are all culturing enriching. It's that these should not be excluded from others who are non whites from fully participating. Nor should they be viewed as inherently "superior" to other cultures.

Correct. and that is why I think the church placed white culture in quotations in their condemnation of those who promote it. It's the racist element which the Church condemns, not the cultural compliments whites have made in the world.

I think you are confusing cultures that exist among white people with "white culture". There is no shared culture among all white people because we come from very different countries with different cultural beliefs and practices. For instance, my husband's ancestors came from Denmark and mine came predominantly from England. Therefore, I'm an Anglophile and he shares Danish humor and love of Havarti, a certain type of bread, etc with the Danish people. He and I don't share a "white culture". We relate more to one another within LDS culture and American culture in general.

[Avatar4321]

2 hours ago, Darren10 said:

Oh, I think there actually is a white culture. in face Danes, Scots, and Germans all make up a part of "white culture". Eating Havarti cheese, playing the bagpipes, listening to Mozart, etc. are parts of white culture. In fact, these are all culturing enriching. It's that these should not be excluded from others who are non whites from fully participating. Nor should they be viewed as inherently "superior" to other cultures.

Correct. and that is why I think the church placed white culture in quotations in their condemnation of those who promote it. It's the racist element which the Church condemns, not the cultural compliments whites have made in the world.

I'm sorry but wearing kilts are superior

[Calm]

3 minutes ago, Avatar4321 said:

I'm sorry but wearing kilts are superior

Only if you have the legs for it.

[katherine the great]

8 minutes ago, Avatar4321 said:

I'm sorry but wearing kilts are superior

Well its definitely sexier!

[Darren10]

5 hours ago, katherine the great said:

I think you are confusing cultures that exist among white people with "white culture". There is no shared culture among all white people because we come from very different countries with different cultural beliefs and practices. For instance, my husband's ancestors came from Denmark and mine came predominantly from England. Therefore, I'm an Anglophile and he shares Danish humor and love of Havarti, a certain type of bread, etc with the Danish people. He and I don't share a "white culture". We relate more to one another within LDS culture and American culture in general.

You're correct and what you described is not only normal but good. "Cultures that exist among white people" is not condemned by the Church but I think Ayla Stewart and White Nationalists and Nazis portrays the Church's condemnation as such. "Cultures that exists among white people" is definitely different than "white culture" which the Church condemns in the sense that "white culture" proponents seek to establish a "whites only" or white superiority over non whites. 

Within England, not England collectively, is there "no shared white culture" or white cultures? Within Denmark, not Denmakr collectively, is here "no shared white culture" or white cultures? How could that be if these cultures are predominantly white? 

Note that I had previously qualified my distinction in this manner. That there is a difference between white culture and "white culture". 

[Darren10]

3 hours ago, Calm said:

Only if you have the legs for it.

Or you need to scale castle walls. 

Edited August 28, 2017 by Darren10

[Darren10]

3 hours ago, katherine the great said:

Well its definitely sexier!

Kilts.... HUBBA HUBBA!

[Darren10]

Avatar needs to play us some bagpipes. Hit it Avatar!

Edited August 28, 2017 by Darren10

[Avatar4321]

20 minutes ago, Darren10 said:

Avatar needs to play us some bagpipes. Hit it Avatar!

I would prefer not to kill anyone

[Darren10]

38 minutes ago, Avatar4321 said:

I would prefer not to kill anyone

People in kilts are dangerous.

[Kenngo1969]

8 hours ago, Avatar4321 said:

I'm sorry but wearing kilts are superior

 

8 hours ago, katherine the great said:

Well its definitely sexier!

Why ... Katherine!  

 

[Kenngo1969]

5 hours ago, Avatar4321 said:

I would prefer not to kill anyone

Don't you mean, kilt anyone?  

Sorry.   Couldn't resist.  

[Avatar4321]

5 hours ago, Darren10 said:

People in kilts are dangerous.

Especially with swords

[Gray]

14 hours ago, katherine the great said:

I think you are confusing cultures that exist among white people with "white culture". There is no shared culture among all white people because we come from very different countries with different cultural beliefs and practices. For instance, my husband's ancestors came from Denmark and mine came predominantly from England. Therefore, I'm an Anglophile and he shares Danish humor and love of Havarti, a certain type of bread, etc with the Danish people. He and I don't share a "white culture". We relate more to one another within LDS culture and American culture in general.

Are you sure this isn't an example of white culture?

 

 

[bluebell]

16 hours ago, Darren10 said:

Oh, I think there actually is a white culture. in face Danes, Scots, and Germans all make up a part of "white culture". Eating Havarti cheese, playing the bagpipes, listening to Mozart, etc. are parts of white culture. In fact, these are all culturing enriching. It's that these should not be excluded from others who are non whites from fully participating. Nor should they be viewed as inherently "superior" to other cultures.

Correct. and that is why I think the church placed white culture in quotations in their condemnation of those who promote it. It's the racist element which the Church condemns, not the cultural compliments whites have made in the world.

No, they aren't.  I'm white for example, and none of those things are a part of my culture.  So those things are not a part of white culture, otherwise they would also be a part of my culture (since i'm a white person).

They are specifically a part of Scottish culture, not white culture.  Danish culture, not white culture.  German culture, not white culture.  

[Kenngo1969]

"Hello.  My name is Inigo Montoya.  You keelted my fatherrrr.  Prepare to die."

 

[Darren10]

51 minutes ago, bluebell said:

No, they aren't.  I'm white for example, and none of those things are a part of my culture.  So those things are not a part of white culture, otherwise they would also be a part of my culture (since i'm a white person).

They are specifically a part of Scottish culture, not white culture.  Danish culture, not white culture.  German culture, not white culture.  

Correct. They are not part of my culture neither but they are part of a predominately white culture when you qualify the practice according to the dominant race it occurs under.

Could you tell me the race makeup of Scotland, Denmark and Germany. *Of course* there are mixed races there but isn't there a predominant culture? And each culture is made up of subcultures, including white culture which incorporates differing races. Ad just because you are white does not mean you necessarily have anything to do with any cultural practices. That's not at all what I am saying.

 

[Darren10]

47 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

"Hello.  My name is Inigo Montoya.  You keelted my fatherrrr.  Prepare to die."

 

Bwahahahahaha!!!

[Calm]

21 minutes ago, Darren10 said:

when you qualify the practice according to the dominant race it occurs under.

But that is not how culture is defined or you would be categorizing Scottish, English, and Irish culture as the same culture...

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/05/science/05cnd-brits.html

[bluebell]

49 minutes ago, Darren10 said:

Correct. They are not part of my culture neither but they are part of a predominately white culture when you qualify the practice according to the dominant race it occurs under.

Could you tell me the race makeup of Scotland, Denmark and Germany. *Of course* there are mixed races there but isn't there a predominant culture? And each culture is made up of subcultures, including white culture which incorporates differing races. Ad just because you are white does not mean you necessarily have anything to do with any cultural practices. That's not at all what I am saying.

 

Like Calm said, that's not how culture is defined.  It's not defined by what the dominate race is of the people who practice it.   It doesn't matter what the dominate racial make up is of any culture, it doesn't mean that the culture can be described as that race's culture.