Elder Sitati: Priesthood Ban Has Not Hindered Lds Growth In Africa

[Okrahomer]

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865638671/Major-LDS-growth-in-Africa-unaffected-by-priesthood-restriction-Elder-Sitati-says.html

Elder Sitati presented some interesting data during his presentation at the "Black, White and Mormon" conference at the University of Utah. One of the most interesting things he said was that in 2012 the First Presidency had implemented a "previously unreported" expansion of the Perpetual Education Fund in Africa called "Self-Reliance Services." The program is yielding major results. Among the several pieces of information Elder Sitati presented were the following:

1. The LDS Church has experienced "nearly exponential growth" in Africa since 1978.

2. 45,000 African immigrants have joined the Church outside of Africa since 1978: 15,000 in the US.

3. In the past 5 years, more than half of all convert baptisms in Europe are African immigrants.

4. New member retention rates are among the highest in the Church in Africa.

5. The Church is growing faster in Africa than it can train local leaders or build chapels.

6. "Self-Reliance Services" has expanded availabilty of PEF funds to all adults--no matter their age, and opened more funding options.

7. Those who complete the 12-week self-reliance training are significantly more likely to: save money, become debt-free, take the Sacrament weekly, pay tithing, and become temple worthy.

8. Most active adult African members joined the church after 1978 and are aware of the old priesthood restriction.

"The work of the church is largely unaffected by concerns about the past. Moreover, the Saints are not preoccupied by these issues."

Jermaine Sullivan, President of the Atlanta Georgia Stake also presented at the conference:

"I thought it was powerful to hear the perspective of Africans," Sullivan said of Elder Sitati's presentation. "It's quite different from the African-American experience, but I really appreciated it."

[Meadowchik]

Awesome.

[Saint Sinner]

#2 is highly influential in understanding. Considering the civil rights movement, apartheid in both nations deserve attention. I'm not taking sides but I suggest closer examination.

[Duncan]

There has to be more than 45,000 African Immigrants who've joined the Church since 1978! is that worldwide or? I know in our city they baptize a ton of African immigrants

[HappyJackWagon]

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865638671/Major-LDS-growth-in-Africa-unaffected-by-priesthood-restriction-Elder-Sitati-says.html

Elder Sitati presented some interesting data during his presentation at the "Black, White and Mormon" conference at the University of Utah. One of the most interesting things he said was that in 2012 the First Presidency had implemented a "previously unreported" expansion of the Perpetual Education Fund in Africa called "Self-Reliance Services." The program is yielding major results. Among the several pieces of information Elder Sitati presented were the following:

1. The LDS Church has experienced "nearly exponential growth" in Africa since 1978.

2. 45,000 African immigrants have joined the Church outside of Africa since 1978: 15,000 in the US.

3. In the past 5 years, more than half of all convert baptisms in Europe are African immigrants.

4. New member retention rates are among the highest in the Church in Africa.

5. The Church is growing faster in Africa than it can train local leaders or build chapels.

6. "Self-Reliance Services" has expanded availabilty of PEF funds to all adults--no matter their age, and opened more funding options.

7. Those who complete the 12-week self-reliance training are significantly more likely to: save money, become debt-free, take the Sacrament weekly, pay tithing, and become temple worthy.

8. Most active adult African members joined the church after 1978 and are aware of the old priesthood restriction.

"The work of the church is largely unaffected by concerns about the past. Moreover, the Saints are not preoccupied by these issues."

Jermaine Sullivan, President of the Atlanta Georgia Stake also presented at the conference:

"I thought it was powerful to hear the perspective of Africans," Sullivan said of Elder Sitati's presentation. "It's quite different from the African-American experience, but I really appreciated it."

I'm glad for the growth but this does seem a little bit like an "Of course" kind of moment.

 

1- "Nearly exponential growth" is a funny phrase. Compared to growth among black africans pre-1978 which would have been extremely low growth, wouldn't just about anything be exponential simply because we now proseletyze, baptize and ordain where previously that wasn't possible?

2&3- 45,000 since 1978 and in the last 5 years blacks are more than half the black convert baptisms. Those are some pretty low numbers. It doesn't look so hot for the baptismal rate for Europe in general.

4- Awesome!

8- Of course. Could it be any other way?

[Okrahomer]

#2 is highly influential in understanding. Considering the civil rights movement, apartheid in both nations deserve attention. I'm not taking sides but I suggest closer examination.

I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean by "highly influential"?

[Okrahomer]

There has to be more than 45,000 African Immigrants who've joined the Church since 1978! is that worldwide or? I know in our city they baptize a ton of African immigrants

My understanding is that this is worldwide. Of course, I was reading this in the wee hours of the morning when I couldn't sleep, so my comprehension and subsequent summary could definitely be faulty.

[Avatar4321]

In my former stake one of the wards had over four hundred baptisms. Almost all came from African immigrants

[Okrahomer]

I'm glad for the growth but this does seem a little bit like an "Of course" kind of moment.

1- "Nearly exponential growth" is a funny phrase. Compared to growth among black africans pre-1978 which would have been extremely low growth, wouldn't just about anything be exponential simply because we now proseletyze, baptize and ordain where previously that wasn't possible?

2&3- 45,000 since 1978 and in the last 5 years blacks are more than half the black convert baptisms. Those are some pretty low numbers. It doesn't look so hot for the baptismal rate for Europe in general.

4- Awesome!

8- Of course. Could it be any other way?

Yes, I agree that "nearly exponential" seems a given, since the starting point was basically nil.

I went to Germany on my mission (back when dinosaurs ruled the earth), and you are correct: it's tough work over there. But I wouldn't trade my experience for anything.

The real highlight of his presentation (at least for me) is the revelation of the expanded PEF and the great benefit it is to the members in Africa. I've felt for a long time that our contributions to the PEF are one of the best opportunities we have to make a real and lasting contribution to our brothers and sisters in developing areas of the world.

As I understood it, Elder Sitati was probably responding to a specific question about whether or not the African Saints were aware of the priesthood ban and whether it was causing any problems for them. His response indicates that the Saints view it as part of the larger history of colonialism on the continent, and the African Saints are not overly concerned with it.

The comment from President Sullivan, who is an African-American Stake President, is a good indication that the priesthood ban is much more of an issue for African-American Saints. So, these two brothers were providing an interesting and important contrast in experience.

Edited October 10, 2015 by Okrahomer

[HappyJackWagon]

Yes, I agree that "nearly exponential" seems a given, since the starting point was basically nil.

I went to Germany on my mission (back when dinosaurs ruled the earth), and you are correct: it's tough work over there. But I wouldn't trade my experience for anything.

The real highlight of his presentation (at least for me) is the revelation of the expanded PEF and the great benefit it is to the members in Africa. I've felt for a long time that our contributions to the PEF are one of the best opportunities we have to make a real and lasting contribution to our brothers and sisters in developing areas of the world.

As I understood it, Elder Sitati was probably responding to a specific question about whether or not the African Saints were aware of the priesthood ban and whether it was causing any problems for them. His response indicates that the Saints view it as part of the larger history of colonialism on the continent, and the African Saints are not overly concerned with it.

The comment from President Sullivan, who is an African-American Stake President, is a good indication that the priesthood ban is much more of an issue for African-American Saints. So, these two brothers were providing an interesting and important contrast in experience.

Any thoughts on why the church wouldn't make a bigger deal about the expanded PEF program in Africa? It sounds like a good program that should be advertized.

[Avatar4321]

We are told not to do our alms before the world.

[Sevenbak]

There's a half a million members in Africa, 30 missions, 100 Stakes and 3 temples. Sounds like great progress since '78!

[Okrahomer]

Any thoughts on why the church wouldn't make a bigger deal about the expanded PEF program in Africa? It sounds like a good program that should be advertized.

I didn't see anything about that in the article, only that the First Presidency had launched the program in 2012, and that it had previously not been announced or reported.

Two thoughts come to mind: Maybe this is a unique expansion intended for an area where the need is greatest; or perhaps it's still only in the "pilot program" stage?

[Meadowchik]

As more African countries gain their independence and adjust to it, like Mozambique, for example, we should be seeing all kinds of overall growth, economic included.  Right now the infant mortality rates in some sub-Saharan countries are among the worst in the world.  That should change as long as more conflicts resolve. I am excited about that!

 

I am sooo glad the Church has been able to be a part of this growth, especially helping people find a way out of extreme poverty. It's wonderful.

[Okrahomer]

As more African countries gain their independence and adjust to it, like Mozambique, for example, we should be seeing all kinds of overall growth, economic included.  Right now the infant mortality rates in some sub-Saharan countries are among the worst in the world.  That should change as long as more conflicts resolve. I am excited about that!

 

I am sooo glad the Church has been able to be a part of this growth, especially helping people find a way out of extreme poverty. It's wonderful.

I agree! My oldest brother and sister-in-law are presently serving a humanitarian mission in Africa. Their hearts have been broken by the poverty and suffering they've seen, and yet they've been renewed and uplifted by what they call the many miracles taking place through the church's humanitarian efforts there.

[HappyJackWagon]

We are told not to do our alms before the world.

When has that ever stopped the church from blowing it's own horn with charitable giving?

And they're making it known now, so they must not be too concerned about it.

 

It seems to be more like a pilot program they didn't want to announce until they could evaluate the success level. Maybe they didn't have confident in the success of the program or didn't have confidence in the acceptance of the program among members.

[Thinking]

1. The LDS Church has experienced "nearly exponential growth" in Africa since 1978.

 

Growth is typically exponential, although sometimes it can be linear (or seem to be linear).

 

Linear Growth: y = a + bx

• a is the beginning value and b is the slope. (Example: If a = 10 and b = 2, the pattern is 10, 12, 14, 16, 18...)

 

Exponential Growth: y = a·b^x

• a is the beginning value and b is the growth rate. (Example: If a = 10 and b = 1.2, the pattern is 10, 12, 14.4, 17.28, 20.736...)

 

If the value of b in exponential growth is close to 1, it may be difficult to see a difference between it and linear growth because there aren't fractions of people and real population data does not follow the model equation perfectly.

 

Suppose the growth rate is 1.01 and the beginning value is 1000.

These are the values rounded to whole numbers: 1000, 1010, 1020, 1030, 1041, 1051, 1062, 1072...

 

I'm not sure what nearly exponential means, but I hope this explanation helps.

[Okrahomer]

When has that ever stopped the church from blowing it's own horn with charitable giving?

And they're making it known now, so they must not be too concerned about it.

It seems to be more like a pilot program they didn't want to announce until they could evaluate the success level. Maybe they didn't have confident in the success of the program or didn't have confidence in the acceptance of the program among members.

I think you could be right about it being a pilot program; but I'm not convinced the church "blows its own horn" nearly as often as it could. The reasons for that are not entirely clear either.

Other than what one reads in the press, I do have some insight into the church's humanitarian and disaster relief efforts, because of what my brother and sister-in-law report from their mission. But I haven't seen anything in the press about what they've been up to--and in my view it's a lot! But I suspect that this is true for the the majority of these things.

Given the potential to appear to be "blowing its own horn", should the church be publicizing these things at all?

Edited October 10, 2015 by Okrahomer

[Okrahomer]

Growth is typically exponential, although sometimes it can be linear (or seem to be linear).

 

Linear Growth: y = a + bx

• a is the beginning value and b is the slope. (Example: If a = 10 and b = 2, the pattern is 10, 12, 14, 16, 18...)

 

Exponential Growth: y = a·b^x

• a is the beginning value and b is the growth rate. (Example: If a = 10 and b = 1.2, the pattern is 10, 12, 14.4, 17.28, 20.736...)

 

If the value of b in exponential growth is close to 1, it may be difficult to see a difference between it and linear growth because there aren't fractions of people and real population data does not follow the model equation perfectly.

 

Suppose the growth rate is 1.01 and the beginning value is 1000.

These are the values rounded to whole numbers: 1000, 1010, 1020, 1030, 1041, 1051, 1062, 1072...

 

I'm not sure what nearly exponential means, but I hope this explanation helps.

Yes, thank you! Apparently "exponential" was Elder Sitati's term. As was mentioned and agreed to earlier, it seems this kind of growth would be a given, when there were so few African members before 1978.

[BlueDreams]

I'm glad for the growth but this does seem a little bit like an "Of course" kind of moment.

 

1- "Nearly exponential growth" is a funny phrase. Compared to growth among black africans pre-1978 which would have been extremely low growth, wouldn't just about anything be exponential simply because we now proseletyze, baptize and ordain where previously that wasn't possible?

 

At first, yes.....I think the idea was more that it was becoming more and more rapid. There weren't any real plateaus on his graph that I remember. It also seemed more drastic when he pulled out the other stat comparing how long it took Africa to go from ~7,000 to ~500K (30-40 years) compared to the rest of the church (85 yrs). 

 

 

....

Oh, also, I went to a good chunk of the conference (Sitati's address, the one prior about being black mormon women, and the one right after about race and BYU).

On a side note, it's interesting to see what they picked up from the conference (both DesNews and SLTrib). I can kinda see the varying biases/stances based on it, because honestly that's not what I picked up from the varying sessions (which entailed more complexity in views and opinions).  

 

Unfortunately, I have to run now.

 

With luv,

BD

Edited October 10, 2015 by BlueDreams

[cinepro]

There has to be more than 45,000 African Immigrants who've joined the Church since 1978! is that worldwide or? I know in our city they baptize a ton of African immigrants

 

 

I'm not sure what your point is.  A ton of African immigrants would be about 12 or 13 people (maybe a few more if they're families with small children), which over the course of time isn't that many.

Edited October 10, 2015 by cinepro

[Duncan]

I'm not sure what your point is.  A ton of African immigrants would be about 12 or 13 people (maybe a few more if they're families with small children), which over the course of time isn't that many.

 

45,000 Africans baptized outside of Africa since 1978 seems a pittance, I would have thought it would have been more than that-is my point.

[Okrahomer]

At first, yes.....I think the idea was more that it was becoming more and more rapid. There weren't any real plateaus on his graph that I remember. It also seemed more drastic when he pulled out the other stat comparing how long it took Africa to go from ~7,000 to ~500K (30-40 years) compared to the rest of the church (85 yrs). 

 

 

....

Oh, also, I went to a good chunk of the conference (Sitati's address, the one prior about being black mormon women, and the one right after about race and BYU).

On a side note, it's interesting to see what they picked up from the conference (both DesNews and SLTrib). I can kinda see the varying biases/stances based on it, because honestly that's not what I picked up from the varying sessions (which entailed more complexity in views and opinions).  

 

Unfortunately, I have to run now.

 

With luv,

BD

It would be great if you could give us a bit more information about the presentations that stood out to you.

[BlueDreams]

Black Mormon women:

Reclaiming their blackness in their mormon faith – this brought some varied responses on this one but my favorite was probably Lashawn’s (who described it as being socialized as white and “doing all the right things” mormon-wise and then being brought back to a black ID by context….she worded it differently, but I can’t remember exactly how…her discussing this was like listening to free-verse poetry). Others noted the interesting brokering between their mormon faith and their racial community and how that altered over periods in their life. Some also noted finding respect and appreciation for the varying traditions to worship.

 

The ones who were in the church longer had more interactions with things like “cursed” language about skin. Everybody was extremely sharp in denouncing it. One noted specifically that the curse was about separation from God and had nothing to do with skin tone…this was met with heavy clapping.

 

Cathy Stokes told a story of re-opening missionary work in Ghana by Maxwell’s request. She was called to make a “detour” in her trip to Yugoslavia to go to Ghana, where missionary work had desisted because of government concerns about the mormons trying to take over. (She was very lively about how she was ready to push Elder Maxwell back, but he was so nice, she just couldn’t). She and another rep went to talk to the powers that be in Ghana where talked about the church. By the end they were told to resubmit the needed paperwork for entry and a couple months later it was opened up. She noted with gratitude the hand-written note from Maxwell.

 

There was also a wide interaction and discussion dealing with progressive thought, feminism, and patriarchy. On one hand Patriarchy and traditional ideology were critiqued within dialogues. On the other there was also sharp criticism (particularly by Tamu) about appropriation of some mormon progressives in describing their views or concerns in the church in parallel with Black struggles in and out of a LDS church context.  (side note: they also really were not fans of the #thugmormon thing that was running about for a while). 

 

 

I noted some patterns in dating and such….which differed by age of the person discussing it

 

Darius Gray (first black BYU student) hanging out with a group of friends and being called in by the Dean for it…he’d left BYU because of it.

 

Tamu Smith talked about being in a ward as the only active convert in her family as both a teen and a young girl. She noted the AA cultural factors that allowed this to happen (an extreme respect of following the Spirit, for example). She also noted the odd dating concerns that came up when she began getting rides from the counselor’s son, which had to stop because of the concerns about interracial dating. She basically never dated mormon in high school and made it clear that she was not interested in them/white boys. Which was funny because at the end of this she introduced her husband in the audience who was obviously white and stated he was “light skinned” as a joke.

 

Overall, you got the sense of the black women experience in the church is often unheard, but that these experiences will be heard if they have anything to say about it. Considering what many of them have done, I have no doubt that it will.

 

Elder Sitati’s

 

What’s not mentioned is that part of his address actually rubbed a number of the audience the wrong way, to say the least…particularly his part about reaching his understanding as to the priesthood ban, which to many there seemed incongruent with the Gospel Topics summary (and I assume most of their experience). The short version is basically that he felt better after studying the idea that at several times the priesthood had been restricted in varying ways throughout scripture in connection with the discrepancy of an open church acceptance in the NT and the statement that “all are alike unto God.” The problem for many is that it’s a bit of a non-answer and asserts that God brought forth the ban….which the official answer is usually we don’t know. Sitati noted that this is not a big issue for most Africans and the historical contexts/differences were in many ways apparent in both this session and a later session. But also local context. In many places in Africa, the local church is a black one. So their concerns would be in the context of their region and less about a policy that most new members only know as a basic, vague and distant fact than having any real effect on their church experiences. So at best, a number took it as a little naïve of the American experience or still in a period of learning and growth for him. At worst, it put a serious sour note for some with his address.

 

What I did enjoy was the talk of the main concerns surrounding poverty, literacy, and church growth. This stunts the development in areas that are more remote from urban centers. What would happen is that the church would be introduced and then these members would incorporate local religious/spiritual traditions into it that were false. The lack of education could also halt, considering they couldn’t read the BoM or other church materials. So some rural areas have had to wait for greater proselytizing.  He noted also the increase in humanitarian aid by the Church to largely non-lds populations.

 

I really liked his back story as well. He came off as a very humble and sincere man in a lot of ways.

 

Race at BYU

 

This was probably the most contentious session. To start, I should not that I have 2 big biases in how I saw this. 1.) I knew all but 2 of the people on this panel fairly well and love ‘em. 2.) I also agreed with them. Darius Gray kinda set the historical stage with his story of first coming to BYU in 1965 (a short tenure it sounded like, due to concerns by faculty that he was dating interracially) and then later working there. He noted some of the positive changes and, like Stokes, is highly respected in the Black LDS circles as a pioneer. They would call him Papa Gray a number of times.

 

They also noted that BYU, in many regards, is an LDS culture epicenter…in the sense that what comes from BYU will filter through the American church by the alumni. In a lot of ways BYU policy and thought really does feel isomorphic to LDS attitudes and beliefs surrounding diversity issues.

 

Maybeline noted her and her husband’s separate experiences of coming to UT and the difficulty that entailed. (ex. she was casually called the cutest N***** when she first arrived by the mother of the woman who brought her there). She noted that she was working to make she that her children  would not have a similar experience.

They noted the reduced resources and money given at BYU addressing diversity issues. There were a couple of positive notes, like having an Africana studies dept.

 

But it was littered with serious problems, including having an African-american studies lumped into this international studies dept. Others were the lack of black faculty (theres 1 currently and they’d lost a couple), the loss of several programs meant to help recruit minorities to BYU, the lack of care for when they get here and the serious culture shock it can be to several of them. They also noted the struggle of bringing up recruiting more. Someone from the audience noted statistical changes to BYU-H that showed a serious trend of having white mainlanders there than islanders and other minorities. They also noted that a GA (I think they said one of the 12, but I want to be careful here as they didn’t name him (for obvious reasons)) had told Samuelson to there was no longer a need to worry about diversity recruitment/concerns….something similar to this. Luis, who is from Mozambique was the one consistently positive note in discussing about his experiences and the multicultural student services. He also noted that he was aware that in many ways he was lucky and privileged to have the experience that he did and that others did not have it as easy.  Growth in minority and particularly black numbers is fairly stagnate.

 

So basically, it was fairly bleak, but also well documented. Still, there were a couple of people in the audience that were fairly defensive about it. So in the Q+A things got tense as the person came to the defense of byu by saying they leave 20% of the pool open for minorities, that there wasn’t enough facts that BYU didn’t care about diversity, that they shouldn’t compare us to ivy league school, and –paradoxically - that it was an elite school and shouldn’t lower standards to recruit. That did not go well. But the presenter was judicious in giving facts that did show that although the mountain west in general struggled to get black students, BYU’s was still abnormally low by about half.

 

There was also mention of a little friction between black African and AA populations. Which was also noted as a perception of one. But it’s one I would agree. Cultural points and aspects can at times cause some misunderstandings or division in outlook. This can be seen with Sitati’s presentation as well as a bit of the discussion in the race at BYU stuff. Of course, BYU minorities are so minimal that these differences can also be overlooked because what’s more pertinent is that there’s so few of us there.  

 

Personally I’ve seen pieces/concerns with this in general. Though the international dept is thriving, minority and women’s concerns at BYU have seriously taken cuts in the last couple of years especially. Which is concerning. I also felt a parallel in my education, particularly in the Masters. Though I did well in it, I often felt…stifled as who I was or how I thought did not mesh with some things.

 

Other noted things

 

One last thing. There were 2-3 temple related experiences that were interestin. One was of a woman staring at a painting in the Chicago temple, uncomfortably and realizing the reason she was uncomfortable was because all the angels were white. She noted that this was their view of heaven, where people who looked like her just weren’t there. Another noted hearing a woman in the SLC temple ask what was that N***** doing there toward her. And the last was of Margaret Young discussing with another temple worker about the new videos who was wondering if they would have videos with other ethnicities. This woman noted that, of course they wouldn’t have a black A+E.... When Young asked why she stated that was because that their skin color didn’t come about until after Cain.

 

They also had a stat stating that about 20% of LDS people were aware of the Race/Priesthood essay on gospel topics, with few still having read it. There were some notes of frustration in trying to get the essay distributed with very little head way.

 

That’s all I can remember….A little longer than I meant for this to go.

 

With luv,
BD

Edited October 11, 2015 by BlueDreams

[Okrahomer]

Thank you, Blue Dreams! I really wish I could have attended.

I was not aware that BYU had made cuts to programs aimed at increasing diversity. That seems a shame, because I agree that BYU does act as a kind of LDS cultural "epicenter." It really is important for BYU to do more to lead out on this, so as to help the entire Church transform. The Temple experiences you described are particularly disappointing. We still have a lot of work to do.

One item from your report is very new to me, and I wonder if it wasn't also reflected in Elder Sitati's presentation and President Sullivan's reaction to it: there are cultural differences and some tension between African-American Saints and African Saints. Do you see this as a serious problem?