Tacenda Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 (edited) That song tugs at my spirit and tells me how I should treat all of God's children. Thank you my friend.After reading your stand on following Christ, this song popped in my head immediately. Here are the words for those that are unable to listen. Lyrics to "I'll Walk With You" words by Carol Lynn Pearson If you don't walk as most people do,Some people walk away from you,But I won't! I won't!If you don't talk as most people do,Some people talk and laugh at you,But I won't! I won't!I'll walk with you. I'll talk with you.That's how I'll show my love for you.Jesus walked away from none.He gave his love to ev'ryone.So I will! I will!Jesus blessed all he could see,Then turned and said, "Come, follow me."And I will! I will!I will! I will!I'll walk with you. I'll talk with you.That's how I'll show my love for you. Edited January 29, 2015 by Tacenda
Rock_N_Roll Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 Not gonna stand with ya my brother. I believe in the right to lawfully discriminate so that our society doesnt turn completely immoral. That's ok. We all have our sins we need to work on.
ERayR Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 (edited) As I have stated in another thread, I stand against discrimination in the workplace for ANY reason. Who will stand with me? Who will wait on ANYONE who walks in the door no matter what their sins. Who will reach out with me to anyone who has been discriminated against even if they are black, Jewish, Mormon, gay, or any other minority. Who believes that their testimony of Christ demands that we serve all, no matter what their sins. Who thinks we will be blessed the most when we treat others that are not like us with the same kindness as we do our friends. Anyone shows kindness to those that are like them. Those that follow Christ are commanded to show kindness to even their enemies no matter what sins they are committing. If some Mormon, Jew, gay or anyone else is living in sin, I will choose to bake them my very best cake I can possibly make. If they ask me to take pictures of their wedding, I will take the finest pictures I can possibly take. I will be more concerned with how I treat others than what their sins might be. I will not let my religion be used as a weapon to justify unkindness towards others no matter what their sin. I stand against Elder Oaks and anyone else who tries to repeal the anti-discrimination laws. I stand against anyone no matter who they are who will not serve all of God's children, no matter what their sins. I will worry about my own salvation and my own sins and leave the judgement of others to God. Who is with me. Who will stand against this belief that religion should be used as a weapon to justify discrimination against others? I choose to stand with you against discrimination. I choose to wait on anyone who walks through the doors of may business. I also believe in giving others the chance to choose for themselves to choose the path of growth and enlightenment or to choose the path that shrivels their souls. If there is no choice there is no growth. Edited January 29, 2015 by ERayR 3
thesometimesaint Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 All this Sturm and Drang over not wanting to follow the simple dictum of: Do not unto others as you would have them not do unto you.Silver Rule.
Kenngo1969 Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 After reading your stand on following Christ, this song popped in my head immediately. Here are the words for those that are unable to listen. Lyrics to "I'll Walk With You" words by Carol Lynn Pearson If you don't walk as most people do,Some people walk away from you,But I won't! I won't!If you don't talk as most people do,Some people talk and laugh at you,But I won't! I won't!I'll walk with you. I'll talk with you.That's how I'll show my love for you.Jesus walked away from none.He gave his love to ev'ryone.So I will! I will!Jesus blessed all he could see,Then turned and said, "Come, follow me."And I will! I will!I will! I will!I'll walk with you. I'll talk with you.That's how I'll show my love for you. My attitude is a lot less, "Lord, I thank thee that I am not as other men" and a lot more, "Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner." And I'll save a seat by me at Church for anyone who sins (which would be, ummm, anyone and everyone) regardless what their sins are ("They that are whole need not a physician," and all that). No, I won't judge you simply because you sin differently than I do. Yes, Christ said, "I the Lord will forgive whom I will forgive, but of you it is required to forgive all men"; and yes, He said, "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself." But He also said, "Think not that I am come to bring peace upon the Earth, but a sword," and "He that loveth father or mother or son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me," and "If ye love Me, keep my commandments," and "Go, and sin no more." Just because I'll leave judgment to God doesn't mean He won't eventually take it. And while I agree with the song's premise that one shouldn't judge another by physical appearance, I have to wonder how that applies to gays. After all, if I were to see someone and say, "He looks gay," I would be marginalized pretty quickly, and rightfully so (even if that observation were a prelude to my attempt to befriend him). As someone with a physical disability who was mainstreamed in school from day one, I could have used a lot more of the kind of attitude the song alludes to. For reasons I have already explained, attempts to apply its premise to gays, however, seem, to me, to be a bit of a stretch. 1
california boy Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 I choose to stand with you against discrimination. I choose to wait on anyone who walks through the doors of may business. I also believe in giving others the chance to choose for themselves to choose the path of growth and enlightenment or to choose the path that shrivels their souls. If there is no choice there is no growth. Good for you. I will walk right beside you every step of the way.
rockpond Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 Is there a transcription or a video of what Elder Oaks said? as I see it all we have is what one journalist says that he said I haven't found a transcript of the Q&A session yet.
california boy Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 My attitude is a lot less, "Lord, I thank thee that I am not as other men" and a lot more, "Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner." And I'll save a seat by me at Church for anyone who sins (which would be, ummm, anyone and everyone) regardless what their sins are ("They that are whole need not a physician," and all that). No, I won't judge you simply because you sin differently than I do. Yes, Christ said, "I the Lord will forgive whom I will forgive, but of you it is required to forgive all men"; and yes, He said, "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself." But He also said, "Think not that I am come to bring peace upon the Earth, but a sword," and "He that loveth father or mother or son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me," and "If ye love Me, keep my commandments," and "Go, and sin no more." Just because I'll leave judgment to God doesn't mean He won't eventually take it. And while I agree with the song's premise that one shouldn't judge another by physical appearance, I have to wonder how that applies to gays. After all, if I were to see someone and say, "He looks gay," I would be marginalized pretty quickly, and rightfully so (even if that observation were a prelude to my attempt to befriend him). As someone with a physical disability who was mainstreamed in school from day one, I could have used a lot more of the kind of attitude the song alludes to. For reasons I have already explained, attempts to apply its premise to gays, however, seem, to me, to be a bit of a stretch. Knowing Carol Lynn Pearson I would not be the least bit surprised if she had gay people in mind when she wrote that song. Christ did not provide any exceptions to his teachings of caring and serving everyone no matter what their sins or who they were. I follow his teachings. I walk His path. I will not discriminate against a single person. We are all sinners. We are all beggars. We are called to serve everyone.
Danzo Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 (edited) I will worry about my own salvation and my own sins and leave the judgement of others to God. I agree with the statement above, however your positions seems to be: leave the judgement of others to administrative agencies of the state, instead of God. Edited January 29, 2015 by Danzo 2
california boy Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 I agree with the statement above, however your positions seems to be: leave the judgement of others to administrative agencies of the state, instead of God. God will judge who He will judge. In the mean time, we live in the world subject to kings presidents and magistrates. If we don't like the Constitution then change it. But for me, I like the guaranteed rights that God inspired document set up.
Duncan Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 I agree with the statement above, however your positions seems to be: leave the judgement of others to administrative agencies of the state, instead of God. render unto caesar something something!
Mystery Meat Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 As I have stated in another thread, I stand against discrimination in the workplace for ANY reason. Who will stand with me? Who will wait on ANYONE who walks in the door no matter what their sins. Who will reach out with me to anyone who has been discriminated against even if they are black, Jewish, Mormon, gay, or any other minority. You are missing the point. I would also do all of those things, but I think people who don't want to should have that right.
Danzo Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 God will judge who He will judge. In the mean time, we live in the world subject to kings presidents and magistrates. If we don't like the Constitution then change it. But for me, I like the guaranteed rights that God inspired document set up. The issues are not a matter of constitutional law, but statutory law. No one I know thinks the US constitution mandates service to anyone. I wish people would not invoke the constitution every time without actually reading what it says. 2
rockpond Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 As it should be. They did nothing that could be deemed sinful. Where there is no sin, there is no need to repent. There's a difference between apologizing and repenting. I would think that given all they had to say yesterday about discrimination and religious freedom that they might have felt a bit of remorse about what they have done to impinge on rights and freedoms of LGBT folks in the past.
Mystery Meat Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 There's a difference between apologizing and repenting. I would think that given all they had to say yesterday about discrimination and religious freedom that they might have felt a bit of remorse about what they have done to impinge on rights and freedoms of LGBT folks in the past. Or, maybe, just maybe, the writing is on the wall and they are trying to reach some sort of middle ground. 1
Mystery Meat Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 (edited) There's a difference between apologizing and repenting. I would think that given all they had to say yesterday about discrimination and religious freedom that they might have felt a bit of remorse about what they have done to impinge on rights and freedoms of LGBT folks in the past. I still see no reason whatsoever to apologize or repent (please keep in mind I am politically opposed to Prop 8 ). Edited January 29, 2015 by lvjd66 1
rockpond Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 Or, maybe, just maybe, the writing is on the wall and they are trying to reach some sort of middle ground. I'm not exactly sure what you mean but, yeah, I'm sure they realize that they are now in a minority position. Over the past few years we've seen their focus shift from working to deny rights to the LGBT population to working to protect their own rights (even if that means, as they explained in the press conference, supporting protections for LGBTers in the process).
Tacenda Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 My attitude is a lot less, "Lord, I thank thee that I am not as other men" and a lot more, "Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner." And I'll save a seat by me at Church for anyone who sins (which would be, ummm, anyone and everyone) regardless what their sins are ("They that are whole need not a physician," and all that). No, I won't judge you simply because you sin differently than I do. Yes, Christ said, "I the Lord will forgive whom I will forgive, but of you it is required to forgive all men"; and yes, He said, "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself." But He also said, "Think not that I am come to bring peace upon the Earth, but a sword," and "He that loveth father or mother or son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me," and "If ye love Me, keep my commandments," and "Go, and sin no more." Just because I'll leave judgment to God doesn't mean He won't eventually take it. And while I agree with the song's premise that one shouldn't judge another by physical appearance, I have to wonder how that applies to gays. After all, if I were to see someone and say, "He looks gay," I would be marginalized pretty quickly, and rightfully so (even if that observation were a prelude to my attempt to befriend him). As someone with a physical disability who was mainstreamed in school from day one, I could have used a lot more of the kind of attitude the song alludes to. For reasons I have already explained, attempts to apply its premise to gays, however, seem, to me, to be a bit of a stretch.Bold mine... I didn't search out this song, it came into my head immediately after reading CB's post (maybe inspiration from on high ), I had to see what the song said because I was only singing the chorus in my head, and didn't even know it was written by Carol Lynn Pearson, but she may have had gays on this list of people that need that unconditional love. This part of the song is what stand out and I think all Latter Day Saints, since they are calling themselves "saints", should react the same, in the vein of Mother Teresa for example!! Jesus walked away from none.He gave his love to ev'ryone.So I will! I will!Jesus blessed all he could see,Then turned and said, "Come, follow me."And I will! I will!I will! I will!I'll walk with you. I'll talk with you.That's how I'll show my love for you.
Rob Osborn Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 No problem. I will still seat you at my diner, take your wedding photos, bake you my finest cake no matter what your sins are. And I still invite you to come to Christ. Serve your friends. And serve your enemies. Serve those that sin. Serve those that are righteous as well as wicked. Stand for goodness and show others the way. Are we not all sinners? Are we not all beggars? Seek a better way. Turn away from discrimination and turn towards inclusion. You are always welcome to stand beside me. There is a place for you when you have a change of heart. Im pretty much right there with you except for that I am going to continue to express my freedom of speech in the condemnation of homosexual behavior.
ERayR Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 Bold mine... I didn't search out this song, it came into my head immediately after reading CB's post (maybe inspiration from on high ), I had to see what the song said because I was only singing the chorus in my head, and didn't even know it was written by Carol Lynn Pearson, but she may have had gays on this list of people that need that unconditional love. This part of the song is what stand out and I think all Latter Day Saints, since they are calling themselves "saints", should react the same, in the vein of Mother Teresa for example!! Jesus walked away from none.He gave his love to ev'ryone.So I will! I will!Jesus blessed all he could see,Then turned and said, "Come, follow me."And I will! I will!I will! I will!I'll walk with you. I'll talk with you.That's how I'll show my love for you. I have no doubt she is referring to homosexuals. Her husband was homosexual and died of aids.
Scott Lloyd Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 Is there a transcription or a video of what Elder Oaks said? as I see it all we have is what one journalist says that he saidWhich journalist said it and where?
DJBrown Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 There's a difference between apologizing and repenting. I would think that given all they had to say yesterday about discrimination and religious freedom that they might have felt a bit of remorse about what they have done to impinge on rights and freedoms of LGBT folks in the past. This comment is very typical of many I have read in the last day. Please tell me- what has the church done in the past to "impinge on rights and freedoms of LGBT folks?" Standing up vocally in the public arena and stating the church's position on marriage and involvement in the process of public discourse does not constitute "imping[ing]" on the rights of others. Help me out here. 2
rockpond Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 Which journalist said it and where? PFS. http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/2108746-155/we-all-can-be-more-civil
pogi Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 There is no such thing. Marriage is a union between man and woman. Not in all states. Can a government not discriminate by definition? Definitions are subject to change. Should they change if marriage is a government prerogative and is discriminatory by the current definition? There are many instances where government discriminates, and rightly should discriminate - legal age of drinking, age of military service, president must be a natural-born-citizen, etc.
rockpond Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 This comment is very typical of many I have read in the last day. Please tell me- what has the church done in the past to "impinge on rights and freedoms of LGBT folks?" Standing up vocally in the public arena and stating the church's position on marriage and involvement in the process of public discourse does not constitute "imping[ing]" on the rights of others. Help me out here. Mounting a campaign to take away marriage rights for homosexual couples. Amicus curiae briefs filed at the state and federal level to against marriage rights and housing/employment non-discrimination.
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