Rescuing A Wayward Spouse

[canard78]

To rotate the children in and out of attending church would not work with the couples. For the believing spouse the issue is too important. And too much confusion for the kids. It will harm them spiritually. The non-believing exmormon would need to let the children attend church every sunday to establish peace.

Every situation is different of course, but there are 7 days in a week and 24 hours in a day. 3 hours on a Sunday morning seems reasonable.

Having said that, if the new spouse finds a different faith that involves Sunday worship they may feel that they want to share that with their children too.

It's a complicated situation.

[Thinking]

For the believing spouse the issue is too important.

Of course the issue is not important for the non-believing spouse.

The non-believing exmormon would need to let the children attend church every sunday to establish peace.

Or the believing spouse would need to allow the kids to not attend church every Sunday.

Why don't we let the kids decide if they want to attend church?

[tyler90az]

At some point in your life a person must mature and let people live how they want. That goes for the wayward spouse and also th active spouse. Sadly, most people are selfish demanding for everybody around them to do what they want. Which would mean that person has never fully matured, reached their full potential as a human being.

My advice for a wayward spouse, go inactive slowly, schedule work on sunday if possible, say prayer once in awhile, be the same guy and be free. The thing with kids is they will most likely follow the non-believing parent. Which for me does not really matter but that is a fact. Also the thing with the wife is they will also follow over time.

[canard78]

At some point in your life a person must mature and let people live how they want. That goes for the wayward spouse and also th active spouse. Sadly, most people are selfish demanding for everybody around them to do what they want. Which would mean that person has never fully matured, reached their full potential as a human being.

My advice for a wayward spouse, go inactive slowly, schedule work on sunday if possible, say prayer once in awhile, be the same guy and be free. The thing with kids is they will most likely follow the non-believing parent. Which for me does not really matter but that is a fact. Also the thing with the wife is they will also follow over time.

Odd statement. And I don't agree. Especially with the presumption that the kids and believing spouse will follow soon after.

[Lightbearer]

How would I rescue a wayward spouse? I would not. I would only love her more (if that is possible). The idea of me or my wife leaving the Church is a non-issue for us. The very foundation of our marriage, the way we met, the way we knew we were meant for each other... is all based on the restored Gospel of Jesus Christ. To deny our faith would be to deny the very foundation of our marriage and our love for each other. Our marriage is not "perfect" but our love is, we have disagreements but we always remember how we got together and all doubts and fears evaporate. With generous doses of love, patience, faith and long suffering any marriage is healable and any testimony is salvagable. The only catch is that it is all based on our desires and our choices, that is why the Lord has said we need to become "one flesh" meaning that our desires should be the same, hopefully that is established before marriage and if not I fear that is the reason for so many divorces and marital strife. I feel simpathy for all those who have had this problem, and I can only say that they must trust in God to make things right and good. To me apostasy (and even marital problems) more resembles cancer than the flu, not so much that it is a contagion as it is often looked upon as incurable. I suppose apostasy is a "spiritual cancer" because it is so difficult to rid oneself of and often is misdiagnosed. But the great physician our Lord has the cure if we will seek His help.

[Garden Girl]

Actually, that white jump suit freaked me out.

The white jumpsuit freaked you out? I can't think of anything more sensible and appropriate for the baptisms than the white jumpsuit. What would be the alternative? Bathing suits? I don't think so...

And the temple to many people is a place to flee their life, including their home life. That is surely backwards! The temple should improve the home, until like Samuel Johnson says, "To be happy at home is the ultimate result of all ambition"....

As most here know, I reactivated three years prior to the death of my wonderful but non-LDS husband. When I started attending the temple, I was used to being alone at Church, or at our ward activities (the few that I attended), etc. It always left me with a longing for the closeness I could see in some of the ward couples as they would sit together in Church or participate in the activities. But nothing prepared me for the feelings I had when I first attended the temple and saw the couples sitting together in the chapel studying the scriptures or quietly talking as we waited to go to the endowment room... and even more so as I saw them holding hands as they walked down the hallway to the endowment rooms... and then, finally sitting together in the Celestial Room, many times still holding hands, or as they very quietly prayed together or gently talked... the longing for my husband to be with me was almost unbearable. Thankfully, I'm now sealed to this dear, good man... one of my ward brothers stood proxy for him...

One thing I observed during my six years of being an ordinance worker... how couples almost without exception held hands as they walked to an endowment room, and showed a tenderness for each other. I would think this would carry over into the home, improving it if you will... helping the couple to face their daily life with a deeper caring and perspective of the nature of their marriage...

GG

[sdc999]

How would I rescue a wayward spouse? I would not. I would only love her more (if that is possible). The idea of me or my wife leaving the Church is a non-issue for us. The very foundation of our marriage, the way we met, the way we knew we were meant for each other... is all based on the restored Gospel of Jesus Christ. To deny our faith would be to deny the very foundation of our marriage and our love for each other. Our marriage is not "perfect" but our love is, we have disagreements but we always remember how we got together and all doubts and fears evaporate. With generous doses of love, patience, faith and long suffering any marriage is healable and any testimony is salvagable. The only catch is that it is all based on our desires and our choices, that is why the Lord has said we need to become "one flesh" meaning that our desires should be the same, hopefully that is established before marriage and if not I fear that is the reason for so many divorces and marital strife. I feel simpathy for all those who have had this problem, and I can only say that they must trust in God to make things right and good. To me apostasy (and even marital problems) more resembles cancer than the flu, not so much that it is a contagion as it is often looked upon as incurable. I suppose apostasy is a "spiritual cancer" because it is so difficult to rid oneself of and often is misdiagnosed. But the great physician our Lord has the cure if we will seek His help.

Congratulations on a successful marriage and congratulations on working hard at it. I truly wish more couples had your attitude about marriage as I feel that the absolute majority of the problems America faces today are due to failing families. But I do think you fail to realize that couples, probably stronger in the faith than even you, have left the church even after saying, 'that will never happen to us.' Some have left together, some just one. Some have stayed together, some have not. What I have always hated to hear though is the ultimatum from either side. This shows the utmost selfishness and lack of Christ in their life. Some leave the church and leave Christ but some do not.

[Storm Rider]

Of course the issue is not important for the non-believing spouse.

Or the believing spouse would need to allow the kids to not attend church every Sunday.

Why don't we let the kids decide if they want to attend church?

I wonder if children have always exhibited the ability to choose the right at all times and in all things? Maybe there are some things a parent should decide for their children until such time as the child is mature enough to make choices for themselves. There are many things to weigh; some children are adamant they are not going to church; those children have exhibited enough determination to leave them at home. However, if leaving them at home is not a good choice for other reasons, they can sit in the car while the family attends church. There are all kinds of alternatives; a parent needs to choose the right one for the circumstances in their family.

[brotheroflogan]

I know a couple of stories that may be helpful.

My wife's uncle got a hold of some anti-mormon literature several years ago and he left the church. I don't know all the details, but I think he tried to convince his wife. They divorced and she and the children refuse to speak to him. His daughter got married and she didn't even tell her dad that. Broke his heart. I doubt he will ever return to the church, but maybe he would have if they'd reacted differently. But maybe they were justified in preserving their testimonies? I don't know all the details, but it seems like his family could have treated him better.

That brings me to the "sick" analogy. I think that the purpose of it was to encourage compassion instead of judgment. you know, "Think of them as sick rather than evil." Maybe it is condescending, but what if you really believe that your spouse is spiritually sick?

That brings me to my own story. I had a faith crisis while on my mission. I regained my testimony after scripture study, prayer and study of apologetic materials. But I have had lingering doubts and sometimes I have wanted to stop going to church. Not because I don't believe; I do believe. But because it is hard. It is my interpretation that I do have a spiritual malady and I'd rather my spouse believe that that is the case rather than that I am evil or trying to hurt her or the church.

[saemo]

Meridian's Larry Barkdull recently posted about a man whose wife is not active.

http://www.ldsmag.co.../13050/1/page-1

As an active member of a wonderful wife who stopped believing/attending about 3 years ago I have mixed feelings about this article.

I appreciate the encouragement to love the wife and to improve the relationship. But believing the wife is "spiritually sick" will drive a wedge into the relationship. I'm glad it's an attitude I let go of a long time ago.

Today I don't pray for her to return, but for her to be happy and I pray to love her and accept her. Larry gives the wrong advice.

When I went inactive, and the never-ending family nagging was going on, one of my family members (LDS) explained to me that my family saw me as a toddler who was standing in the middle of the street, and needed rescuing.

It is a metaphor that is both endearing, and condescending, all at once! That's how this article looks to me.

The "let it go" is good advice, for the person who has left or is leaving. Let it go. Don't worry over what others are thinking or trying to manipulate you into doing. Just love them, and accept their terms of endearment, especially if/when they are condescending. Constantly reassure them that your leaving Mormonism doesn't mean you've stopped loving them.

Edited August 5, 2013 by saemo

[brotheroflogan]

I know that nagging is usually counter-productive and that being condescending or spiteful is very bad. But I also know that there are many people who have helped their spouses come back to church. My friend and elder's quorum president freely admits that his girlfriend-turned-wife helped him come back to church and he's thankful. So I honestly don't know where to draw the line.

If my wife went inactive, I suppose I would ask her to let me talk to her about it at regular intervals. Maybe once a month or once a year. Then I'd try to not bring it up unless she encouraged me to do so.

[LDSAnomaly]

My wife's uncle got a hold of some anti-mormon literature several years ago and he left the church. I don't know all the details, but I think he tried to convince his wife. They divorced and she and the children refuse to speak to him. His daughter got married and she didn't even tell her dad that. Broke his heart. I doubt he will ever return to the church, but maybe he would have if they'd reacted differently. But maybe they were justified in preserving their testimonies? I don't know all the details, but it seems like his family could have treated him better.

No offense since it is your family. That, however, is disgusting and sad behavior it makes us LDS look horrible. What an absolutely disgusting stance to take by the wife and daughters. The negative term cult applies to them and furthers it in the mind of others about our religion.

[brotheroflogan]

No offense since it is your family. That, however, is disgusting and sad behavior it makes us LDS look horrible. What an absolutely disgusting stance to take by the wife and daughters. The negative term cult applies to them and furthers it in the mind of others about our religion.

No offense taken. I haven't even met them since they refuse to speak to anyone associated with uncle Dave.

I'm beginning to believe that the "war in heaven" continues literally here on earth and that it was always about light, darkness, love, hatred, strange bedfellows, betrayals, redemption, bad choices, complex characters and personalities. Sometimes friends act badly and enemies act with virtue. So much is at stake. And that it why it is hard for spouses to not try to force their spouses to come back to church and believe.

[The Nehor]

I am pretty sure the only method that always works is to tie them to a chair and make them watch "My Turn on Earth" on an endless loop until their soul breaks. After that they will do anything you say. Downside......they are never the same again.

[The Nehor]

My wife's uncle got a hold of some anti-mormon literature several years ago and he left the church. I don't know all the details, but I think he tried to convince his wife. They divorced and she and the children refuse to speak to him. His daughter got married and she didn't even tell her dad that. Broke his heart. I doubt he will ever return to the church, but maybe he would have if they'd reacted differently. But maybe they were justified in preserving their testimonies? I don't know all the details, but it seems like his family could have treated him better.

It is quite possible there were other factors involved here. If he was trying to convince his wife (and kids?) to leave the church I can see how that would fracture a family without malice even being involved.

[bluebell]

No offense since it is your family. That, however, is disgusting and sad behavior it makes us LDS look horrible. What an absolutely disgusting stance to take by the wife and daughters. The negative term cult applies to them and furthers it in the mind of others about our religion.

Without knowing everything that happened between the two, I don't know that we can really call them names or imply they are horrible people.

They may be, but in my experience, every story has two sides and it's almost impossible to judge a situation righteously when you've only heard one of them.

[brotheroflogan]

yeah, I've never sat down with Uncle Dave and asked him, "Tell me why your family fell apart." So I am reluctant to judge his ex-wife and kids. But I think he'd have to do something REALLY bad to justify his daughter not even telling him she was getting married. And I don't think he's the type to be really bad.

But what about Jesus' command "if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out?" Could they be applying this principle to this situation?

[Calm]

No offense since it is your family. That, however, is disgusting and sad behavior it makes us LDS look horrible. What an absolutely disgusting stance to take by the wife and daughters. The negative term cult applies to them and furthers it in the mind of others about our religion.

You have no clue what was involved. If they just up and left because he attempted to convince them...well, that doesn't look good. But perhaps it was a level of pressure that affected their entire life and made it impossible to have a happy stable refuge in the home, you don't know if he offered them an ultimatum...him or the Church.

they could have been jerks, he could have been jerks, they both may have been jerks, they both may have worked as hard as they could have from a loving and compassion heart and still not made it work. Being judgmental about strangers' situation seems to me to likely cause some of the same issues that being judgmental in a family, we should be careful in doing either one and only do so with full information and if it is needed.

[Calm]

yeah, I've never sat down with Uncle Dave and asked him, "Tell me why your family fell apart." So I am reluctant to judge his ex-wife and kids. But I think he'd have to do something REALLY bad to justify his daughter not even telling him she was getting married. And I don't think he's the type to be really bad.

But what about Jesus' command "if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out?" Could they be applying this principle to this situation?

It is a situation one can never know about until someone tells you their side of the story, but even then that will be dependent on their own POV which may colour their memory heavily. It is unfortunate that they don't want anything to do with your family, but perhaps it is just too painful to bring back memories and they haven't allowed themselves the chance to 'rewrite' the relationships enough to feel comfortable with them. Perhaps someday it will occur.

[Questing Beast]

No offense taken. I haven't even met them since they refuse to speak to anyone associated with uncle Dave.

I'm beginning to believe that the "war in heaven" continues literally here on earth and that it was always about light, darkness, love, hatred, strange bedfellows, betrayals, redemption, bad choices, complex characters and personalities. Sometimes friends act badly and enemies act with virtue. So much is at stake. And that it why it is hard for spouses to not try to force their spouses to come back to church and believe.

"Force", that's the key word here. The enemy uses force, "God" does not, not ever in all of infinite eternity.

Any religion that divides people is being used for evil purposes. That this happens quite often in Mormon families should give all of us a long pause. Any spouse who threatens to leave or otherwise break up the family over mere religious doctrinal differences is indeed living inside a cult mentality. The only justifiable reasons for terminating a marriage that now includes a disbelieving spouse, is if either spouse turns into some control freak who wants to force the rest of the family into going their way or the highway, and uses abusive and destructive influence to force that decision....

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Meridian's Larry Barkdull recently posted about a man whose wife is not active.

http://www.ldsmag.com/article/1/13050/1/page-1

As an active member of a wonderful wife who stopped believing/attending about 3 years ago I have mixed feelings about this article.

I appreciate the encouragement to love the wife and to improve the relationship. But believing the wife is "spiritually sick" will drive a wedge into the relationship. I'm glad it's an attitude I let go of a long time ago.

Y

Today I don't pray for her to return, but for her to be happy and I pray to love her and accept her. Larry gives the wrong advice.

If he has expressed such a belief openly that he thinks his wife is "spiritually sick"...it's already over. Edited August 6, 2013 by Bill “Papa” Lee

[The Nehor]

Any religion that divides people is being used for evil purposes.

I have to disagree. At least Jesus did not think so. He said he came to bring the sword. Not that he wants suffering but He is clear that his gospel would tear apart relationships.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

I have to disagree. At least Jesus did not think so. He said he came to bring the sword. Not that he wants suffering but He is clear that his gospel would tear apart relationships.

Very true...truth always does.

[Duncan]

Without knowing everything that happened between the two, I don't know that we can really call them names or imply they are horrible people.

They may be, but in my experience, every story has two sides and it's almost impossible to judge a situation righteously when you've only heard one of them.

true, very true, i'm sure my ex would see our situation in a different light, I just put it as I saw it and her view would be different maybe

[bluebell]

true, very true, i'm sure my ex would see our situation in a different light, I just put it as I saw it and her view would be different maybe

No, I'm sure you were blameless. My friends are never in the wrong.