Scott Lloyd Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) Merry Hitchmas everyone, or as we say in German, Fröhliche Hitchnachten!Seriously though, I don't think critics mean to imply a lot of members celebrate Smithmas privately, as just recognize the not-insignificant attention paid to Smith's birthday by the official church which, coming just a couple of days before Christmas, could be seen as relating the two in importance. It's kind of a bummer for Smith, really, because it's nobody's fault he was born on December 23.I find the above commentary rather curious.Do you intend the phrase "not-insignificant" as a weasel term for significant? If so, what credible evidence can you offer that the "official church" pays inordinate attention to the birthday of Joseph Smith, to the degree that a reasonable observer could conclude that said attention eclipses the Mormon observance of the birth of Christ? Edited December 28, 2011 by Scott Lloyd
Scott Lloyd Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) Personally, I was in Sharon Vermont with President Hinckley doing stories...But it wasn't a Christmas event, or similar celebration by any means.Shame on those LDS leaders for doing something unusual to observe the bicentennial of the birth of the prophet of the Restoration. Edited December 28, 2011 by Scott Lloyd
Storm Rider Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Where were you in 2005?I was overseas. Did we do something as a church that I missed? I admit that I am pretty independent, but it could also be that somethings just don't make an impression and are easily overlooked, forgotten, or even unnoticed. It is a little bit like attending Sacrament meeting and reading scriptures rather than listening to one of the talks. At the end of the day, I may just be too self-centered to care what others are doing around me.
Bill “Papa” Lee Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Other than 2005, I've rarely heard mention of Joseph Smith's birthday in December.As a point of data, the Ensign almost always has a Christmas/ Nativity themed cover for December. Going back to 2000, they are all Christmas covers except for 2005, when this was the cover:This has been my experience. I posted this thread here…http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/56545-the-great-man-%E2%80%9Cjoseph%E2%80%9D-is-slighted-at-christmas-why/And some were relived that I was not speaking of Joseph Smith, but all here after reading made remarks speaking to the thread. I posted the same over at another location and the first six or seven posts blasted me for wanting to worship Joseph Smith, or for trying to make Christmas about him. I cannot remember other than this one…(because of the reasons I stated via conversations with my son about the threads) that anyone in my family has ever mentioned the name of Joseph Smith at Christmas. Most members of the Church probably do not know what date he was born. I can only remember a couple of times in my 32 years his name coming up at Christmas in Church (other than the one you cite) it was a big deal on his 200th birthday.I love Joseph, I revere him…but at Christmas he rarely gets a passing thought in my mind. Just one man’s opinion.
Bill “Papa” Lee Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 In my household, we actually do celebrate Joseph Smith's birthday on 23 December. We've done it for roughly ten years now. Maybe fifteen. We'll do it tomorrow night. We invite friends over, have a potluck meal and a white elephant party, maybe tell a story about Joseph Smith (we once had Scott Faulring as a guest), and mostly sing carols. (We're fortunate to have some friends who are extremely good musicians -- including a Ph.D. in composition and a soprano who has performed at Carnegie Hall -- so that's a really fun part of the night.)If I may ask; what changed 10 years ago for you to start doing so? I have never heard of this...
Bill “Papa” Lee Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 At least Smith was actually born that week, unlike the other subject of celebration. It is a bit odd to celebrate a birth on a day that we all are pretty sure it didn't happen.Anyway, Smith's birthday was always mentioned in my family, but that may be because it was also my sister's. (They seriously considered naming her Mary Christie, poor kid. Josephine was also in the running.)Tell me it did not happen.
Daniel Peterson Posted December 28, 2011 Author Posted December 28, 2011 If I may ask; what changed 10 years ago for you to start doing so? I have never heard of this...Nothing really changed. I just thought it was a good idea. (Don't exaggerate it in your imagination. It's not really very much about Joseph Smith, though he's mentioned. Mostly good food and the singing of really good Christmas carols by some exceptionally good singers.)I also try to commemorate my late mother's and father's birthdays, and, though I always forget, I think it would be a good idea to commemorate some of our family's ancestors (Mormon and non-Mormon). Nothing much. Just maybe a dessert in their honor, a picture displayed, and a story told. I think it important to remember the past and to cultivate a sense of family heritage and tradition. 1
LeSellers Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Anyway, Smith's birthday was always mentioned in my family, but that may be because it was also my sister's. (They seriously considered naming her Mary Christie, poor kid. Josephine was also in the running.)Twenty-five years or so ago, a set of twins was born in our ward. Joyce Noel and Mary Christine were born the 25th of December.Lehi
thesometimesaint Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 My youngest was born on Dec 7th. We rib him about the day that shall live in infamy.
Stargazer Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Nothing really changed. I just thought it was a good idea. (Don't exaggerate it in your imagination. It's not really very much about Joseph Smith, though he's mentioned. Mostly good food and the singing of really good Christmas carols by some exceptionally good singers.)I also try to commemorate my late mother's and father's birthdays, and, though I always forget, I think it would be a good idea to commemorate some of our family's ancestors (Mormon and non-Mormon). Nothing much. Just maybe a dessert in their honor, a picture displayed, and a story told. I think it important to remember the past and to cultivate a sense of family heritage and tradition.Yes, and I wish now I had done something similar about my ancestors. My kids have largely grown up with only a genealogical notion of our past family members.
Bill “Papa” Lee Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Nothing really changed. I just thought it was a good idea. (Don't exaggerate it in your imagination. It's not really very much about Joseph Smith, though he's mentioned. Mostly good food and the singing of really good Christmas carols by some exceptionally good singers.)I also try to commemorate my late mother's and father's birthdays, and, though I always forget, I think it would be a good idea to commemorate some of our family's ancestors (Mormon and non-Mormon). Nothing much. Just maybe a dessert in their honor, a picture displayed, and a story told. I think it important to remember the past and to cultivate a sense of family heritage and tradition.Thanks just curious. You know when I joined the Church in 1979 I had to get a written wavier from President Kimball that I would promise to never sing outside my shower. But I break the rule every year when we sing Christmas Carols.
LeSellers Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) when I joined the Church in 1979 I had to get a written wavier from President Kimball that I would promise to never sing outside my shower. I joke that our two girls got their singing talents from me, which explains my lack: they took it all, and left me none.Having been born into an LDS family, I didn't make a promise like yours, but, had I done so, it would have equally forbidden the shower, I assure you. No one deserves that in the morning, least of all my Jacquie.On Christmas, we all (well, most of us, there were only 33 of us in one spot, five of our children and their families) had a sing along. Our younger daughter had assembled a set of 20 "Carol Folders" and one with music for the accompanist as a gift for my Jacquie and me. While everyone else was eating (I wasn't hungry, a notion that will strike any who know me as worrisome), I held the newest grandson, Xavier Teancum, aged three months and sang to him, all 46 of the songs and hymns.One of our daughters-in-law told Jacquie she'd never heard me sing before, and that my voice was, as others have noted, very nice. But when anyone in the ward asks me to join the choir (usually with the lead in, "You have such a nice voice") I must reply, "Voice of gold, ear of tin." I sing in the key of off, and cannot even pretend to sing while others are really doing it.Lehi Edited December 28, 2011 by LeSellers 1
Chris Smith Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I've seen ex-Mormons crack wise about Smithmas, but I don't know that they intend to say Mormons actually celebrate this.
Bill “Papa” Lee Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I joke that our two girls got their singing talents from me, which explains my lack: they took it all, and left me none.Having been born into an LDS family, I didn't make a promise like yours, but, had I done so, it would have equally forbidden the shower, I assure you. No one deserves that in the morning, least of all my Jacquie.I was sitting next to my granddaughter singing Christmas Carols and my Son's house Friday and she was shocked to hear Pa Pa singing.
Bill “Papa” Lee Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I've seen ex-Mormons crack wise about Smithmas, but I don't know that they intend to say Mormons actually celebrate this.Do they suggest it is in jest when they say it. I have never even heard the term until this thread.
Stargazer Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 ... I held the newest grandson, Xavier Teancum, aged three months ...Oh my gosh. I love that name.One of my older sons confided yesterday that they are planning to start a new pregnancy next year, dependent upon their economic situation, and I told him I would have a list of suggested names for the new sprog. Xavier Teancum will be on that list!
LeSellers Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Xavier Teancum will be on that list!I'll pass that along.Lehi
Flyonthewall Posted December 29, 2011 Posted December 29, 2011 Do they suggest it is in jest when they say it. I have never even heard the term until this thread.I have never heard of it before this thread either. I don't even remember making a big deal about Joseph's birthday ... I'm sure there might have been some talks about him around his birthday but no celebration comes to my mind.
Kenngo1969 Posted December 29, 2011 Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) One of my older sons confided yesterday that they are planning to start a new pregnancy next year, dependent upon their economic situation, and I told him I would have a list of suggested names for the new sprog. Xavier Teancum will be on that list!Sprog? I don't think I've ever heard that term for an offspring before. I like it! (Alas, I have no sprogs! I'm sprogless! )P.S.: I wonder if the appellation will be the English bastardization of the first name, with the Zay sound, or whether it will be the proper, Spanish pronunciation of that name, with the Hah sound? Edited December 29, 2011 by Kenngo1969
LeSellers Posted December 29, 2011 Posted December 29, 2011 I wonder if the appellation will be the English bastardization of the first name, with the Zay sound, or whether it will be the proper, Spanish pronunciation of that name, with the Hah sound? I can't say for Stargazer's grandson, but in our case, his parents speak English, French, Russian, and Korean, so the odds never tended to Spanish: it's ZAyVyer.And, since English is a Germanic language with a French vocabulary, one might say that everything in English is a bastardization, especially since the Great Vowel Shift. Further, loan words in any language undergo (often dramatic) changes in pronunciation.Lehi
Garden Girl Posted December 29, 2011 Posted December 29, 2011 I've never heard of the term "Smithmas"... and quite frankly hope it isn't widespread as it just gives our critics another reason to foster misrepresentations about our view of Joseph Smith, i.e., that we somehow worship JS. That distresses me... almost to the point of viewing the term as offensive because of its closeness to "Christmas." I've never heard of any inordinate mention or celebration of JS's birthday in all my 63 years in the Church, thankfully.By the way, I'm a December gal and my birthday suffered...from the beach on a rainy, gray day... but all is not lost... two BYU games will be broadcast today. Go Cougars!GG
Daniel Peterson Posted December 29, 2011 Author Posted December 29, 2011 Oh, Smithmas is definitely an invention of our apostate critics, though they sometimes write as if it were actually a term used by believers. It's meant to insinuate that Latter-day Saints venerate Joseph Smith on a par with, or even more than, Jesus Christ. Which is, as we all know, a blatant and shameless falsehood.
LeSellers Posted December 29, 2011 Posted December 29, 2011 Which is, as we all know, a blatant and shameless falsehood.When has that stopped them?Lehi
Kenngo1969 Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 I can't say for Stargazer's grandson, but in our case, his parents speak English, French, Russian, and Korean, so the odds never tended to Spanish: it's ZAyVyer.And, since English is a Germanic language with a French vocabulary, one might say that everything in English is a bastardization, especially since the Great Vowel Shift. Further, loan words in any language undergo (often dramatic) changes in pronunciation.LehiYou mean, they're that linguistically versatile, yet they've never bothered to learn the Celestial Language? (Heck, if they know that many languages already, learning Spanish oughtta be a lead-pipe cinch! )
Thinking Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 It's sometimes (often?) alleged by critics of the Church -- predominantly if not solely, in my experience, by disaffected former believers -- that "Smithmas" or, at any rate, the celebration of Joseph Smith's 23 December birthday is a really big deal for Mormons.I think it's because the Church made a big deal out of the 200th anniversary of Joseph's birth in 2005. Since it was two days before Christmas...
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