Reluctant Prophets ?

[strappinglad]

Just been studying the prophecies from the BOM about the future events to befall the Lamanites and Nephites as well as the Israelites in general and the Gentile nations. One could argue that many of the prophecies have been fulfilled. My question is about our current Prophet(s) and the apparent absence of " broad stroke " prophecies for the near future . Are they reluctant to voice such for fear of backlash? Would the Saints over-react to any specific warnings and cause chaos when order is needed? There are a couple of prophecies about the Wasatch Front and east coast cities being destroyed but nothing like it as far as I know has been uttered lately. Maybe I missed the memo. 

[Metis_LDS]

2 hours ago, strappinglad said:

Just been studying the prophecies from the BOM about the future events to befall the Lamanites and Nephites as well as the Israelites in general and the Gentile nations. One could argue that many of the prophecies have been fulfilled. My question is about our current Prophet(s) and the apparent absence of " broad stroke " prophecies for the near future . Are they reluctant to voice such for fear of backlash? Would the Saints over-react to any specific warnings and cause chaos when order is needed? There are a couple of prophecies about the Wasatch Front and east coast cities being destroyed but nothing like it as far as I know has been uttered lately. Maybe I missed the memo. 

My understanding (I could be all wrong) is that a prophecy should fulfil a purpose. Such as those foretelling the coming of Christ's birth etc..  You want warnings or broad strokes there are plenty in the scriptures about the latter days.  So let us take a specific example such as the super volcano in yellowstone national park.  when that goes the predictions are for at least 20 feet of ash in Salt Lake City.  So the Lord wants to warn the people about the volcano and the President speaks to soon about the event then people will forget.  Sometimes to be a life saving warning it must not be to far in advance.   No big prophecies right now maybe noting big about to go on IMO.

[USU78]

No OSHA for prophets.  That's why so few are offered and take the job.  Pretty hazardous to life and limb.

As for "specific warnings," try this:

WE WARN that individuals who violate covenants of chastity, who abuse spouse or offspring, or who fail to fulfill family responsibilities will one day stand accountable before God. Further, we warn that the disintegration of the family will bring upon individuals, communities, and nations the calamities foretold by ancient and modern prophets.

[Emphasis added]

That was in 1995.

[Calm]

2 hours ago, strappinglad said:

Just been studying the prophecies from the BOM about the future events to befall the Lamanites and Nephites as well as the Israelites in general and the Gentile nations. One could argue that many of the prophecies have been fulfilled. My question is about our current Prophet(s) and the apparent absence of " broad stroke " prophecies for the near future . Are they reluctant to voice such for fear of backlash? Would the Saints over-react to any specific warnings and cause chaos when order is needed? There are a couple of prophecies about the Wasatch Front and east coast cities being destroyed but nothing like it as far as I know has been uttered lately. Maybe I missed the memo. 

Do we really need them?  If not, then given the reaction I have seen by those focusing on older ones and the use of them in what amounts in my view to priestcraft, I am glad our leaders are avoiding them.  It may be a small percentage but families were devastated by the fear based reactions back when Rowe got carried away by her own drama and gave the end as a matter of months, if not weeks.

I think if leaders start choosing to give out more specific prophecies, they will need to be much more hands on in telling people how to react and it will distract from better time and effort investments (people are more likely to reach out and help,others if they aren't focused on ensuring their family survived the apocalypse).  I see endtimes focus as tending to draw people into self centered concerns rather than being more fully involved in others' lives.

[JAHS]

39 minutes ago, USU78 said:

No OSHA for prophets.  That's why so few are offered and take the job.  Pretty hazardous to life and limb.

As for "specific warnings," try this:

 

 

[Emphasis added]

That was in 1995.

Well it didn't copy over, but I was wondering, if this is a true prophecy about the disintegration of the families, assuming they were true prophets who said this, who are we to try to stop it from happening? 
Are such prophecies definitely going to happen no matter what we do or do we have the option and the duty to try and stop it from happening?

[Bernard Gui]

3 hours ago, strappinglad said:

Just been studying the prophecies from the BOM about the future events to befall the Lamanites and Nephites as well as the Israelites in general and the Gentile nations. One could argue that many of the prophecies have been fulfilled. My question is about our current Prophet(s) and the apparent absence of " broad stroke " prophecies for the near future . Are they reluctant to voice such for fear of backlash? Would the Saints over-react to any specific warnings and cause chaos when order is needed? There are a couple of prophecies about the Wasatch Front and east coast cities being destroyed but nothing like it as far as I know has been uttered lately. Maybe I missed the memo. 

The prophetic memo for now and forever is to repent.

[USU78]

34 minutes ago, JAHS said:

Well it didn't copy over, but I was wondering, if this is a true prophecy about the disintegration of the families, assuming they were true prophets who said this, who are we to try to stop it from happening? 
Are such prophecies definitely going to happen no matter what we do or do we have the option and the duty to try and stop it from happening?

Heard of Jonah?

[Alaris]

Isaiah 28 is a good read here. The prophet Isaiah reveals the general state of Ephraim when the one mighty and strong shows up with knowledge in tow. I don't consider Isaiah 28 to be a derogatory statement to the Apostels and Prophet Russell M. Nelson, but to Ephraim at large who is described as being drunk on pride and latched to milk. This would explain why the Lord does not reveal much meat - at least not through the prescribed channels. The people simply haven't earned it.

 

Edited April 18, 2019 by Alaris

[member10_1]

6 hours ago, strappinglad said:

Just been studying the prophecies from the BOM about the future events to befall the Lamanites and Nephites as well as the Israelites in general and the Gentile nations. One could argue that many of the prophecies have been fulfilled. My question is about our current Prophet(s) and the apparent absence of " broad stroke " prophecies for the near future . Are they reluctant to voice such for fear of backlash? Would the Saints over-react to any specific warnings and cause chaos when order is needed? There are a couple of prophecies about the Wasatch Front and east coast cities being destroyed but nothing like it as far as I know has been uttered lately. Maybe I missed the memo. 

In fairness to modern prophets, the Book of Mormon prophets also seem a little reluctant to be as specific in their prophecies concerning post-1820-30 events as they were regarding things like the colonization of the US, the revolutionary war, the coming forth of the Book of Mormon (“I cannot read a sealed book”), etc.

[The Nehor]

It is important to note that the prophecies we have recorded were recorded by only a fraction of prophets that have existed. Many more have prophesied but the more general prophecies we often get in Conference about the consequences of sin, the reality of the Savior, and promised blessings for obedience. It is also important to note that they do not tell everything they know and prophecies are being poured out on the leaders and the Saints but not as generally as some would like.

I also contend against the idea in the OP that the prophets keep their mouths shut for fear of backlash. I believe the Spirit directs what they share and not the fear of men or of apostasy from Saints not liking what they say.

[Robert F. Smith]

16 hours ago, JAHS said:

Well it didn't copy over, but I was wondering, if this is a true prophecy about the disintegration of the families, assuming they were true prophets who said this, who are we to try to stop it from happening? 
Are such prophecies definitely going to happen no matter what we do or do we have the option and the duty to try and stop it from happening?

You may be thinking of Jonah the Prophet who foretold doom on Nineveh, which did not come true.  Why?  Because the people of Nineveh repented, and so God relented.   Because of that, Jonah got very self-righteous, indignant, and resentful 

[The Nehor]

16 hours ago, JAHS said:

Well it didn't copy over, but I was wondering, if this is a true prophecy about the disintegration of the families, assuming they were true prophets who said this, who are we to try to stop it from happening? 
Are such prophecies definitely going to happen no matter what we do or do we have the option and the duty to try and stop it from happening?

Most prophecies are conditional. Even some of the apocalyptic ones say the Gentiles will be fine as a whole if they just repent (I am not holding my breath).

You might be able to keep your family from disintegrating.

Edited April 18, 2019 by The Nehor

[Robert F. Smith]

13 hours ago, The Nehor said:

......................................

I also contend against the idea in the OP that the prophets keep their mouths shut for fear of backlash. I believe the Spirit directs what they share and not the fear of men or of apostasy from Saints not liking what they say.

There is the fundamental misconception about prophets that they are foretellers, when that is only a minor part of their function.  A prophet is a messenger of God and of the Divine Council.  He may receive far more housekeeping assignments than predictions.  Those housekeeping or maintenance functions may not be as sexy as Hell, fire, and brimstone, but they are essential to the household of faith.

For, sans doute, the Prophet of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints must first of all preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ as well as manage a huge body of Saints assigned to preach that Gospel full time.  He is also the President of the High Priesthood of God concerned with holy ordinances for both living and dead in the many holy temples of God, which depend upon a magnificent genealogical establishment.  If that were not enough, he is also President of the corporation which is the formal Body of Christ -- a far flung, worldwide church organization -- in which he is the chairman of the board and deputy of Christ on Earth.  And how old is the guy who has to do all that?  With a smile and love in his heart . . .

[JAHS]

30 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

You may be thinking of Jonah the Prophet who foretold doom on Nineveh, which did not come true.  Why?  Because the people of Nineveh repented, and so God relented.   Because of that, Jonah got very self-righteous, indignant, and resentful 

 

26 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Most prophecies are conditional. Even some of the apocalyptic ones say the Gentiles will be fine as a whole if they just repent (I am not holding my breath).

You might be able to keep your family from disintegrating.

 

16 hours ago, USU78 said:

Heard of Jonah?

Yes I remember the Jonah issue, but the signs leading to the end of the world are things that are going to happen. Christ is going to come again and the conditions leading up to that event are going to happen no matter what we do.
I am just wondering why the proclamation is warning the world of things that are going to happen as if there is something all the people of world can do about it. I guess like you say we just have to look at it on an individual family basis, that if we take care of our own family and keep it together, then we will be spared the terrible events preceding the second coming. 

[Robert F. Smith]

3 hours ago, JAHS said:

Yes I remember the Jonah issue, but the signs leading to the end of the world are things that are going to happen. Christ is going to come again and the conditions leading up to that event are going to happen no matter what we do.
I am just wondering why the proclamation is warning the world of things that are going to happen as if there is something all the people of world can do about it. I guess like you say we just have to look at it on an individual family basis, that if we take care of our own family and keep it together, then we will be spared the terrible events preceding the second coming. 

There is likewise a powerful communal responsibility of all those who have taken an oath and covenant to give all they have (including their very lives) in service to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints -- who must prepare as a body of high priests to meet Christ on his return, and be prepared to spend a millennium finishing up the essential ordinance work, lest the Earth be smitten with a curse.

[Navidad]

On 4/18/2019 at 9:30 AM, The Nehor said:

Most prophecies are conditional. Even some of the apocalyptic ones say the Gentiles will be fine as a whole if they just repent (I am not holding my breath).

You might be able to keep your family from disintegrating.

Who are the Gentiles in this apocalyptic prophecy and of what will they repent?

[The Nehor]

13 hours ago, Navidad said:

Who are the Gentiles in this apocalyptic prophecy and of what will they repent?

This is originally from Nephi’s group of apocalyptic visions and he has sections focused on the Old World, the New World, and the world generally. It is generally thought to mean those in the Western Hemisphere who were not Native Americans including probably me and you. If they generally repent they will be spared. I find it more likely that a small group will repent and be spared.

Further Spoiler: The Mexican border wall, if built, will not save us.  

[USU78]

Walls fail when they are unmanned. The Mongols taught us that.

[Navidad]

5 hours ago, The Nehor said:

This is originally from Nephi’s group of apocalyptic visions and he has sections focused on the Old World, the New World, and the world generally. It is generally thought to mean those in the Western Hemisphere who were not Native Americans including probably me and you. If they generally repent they will be spared. I find it more likely that a small group will repent and be spared.

Further Spoiler: The Mexican border wall, if built, will not save us.  

Ok Thanks. Are you saying the Mexican border wall won't save from the New World apocalypse you are describing? Maybe I am on the right side of it! 😎 Further Spoiler - the newest wall I have seen -shutting off access to the US in downtown Palomas, Chihuahua is indeed . . . on the Mexican side of the border! No one ever seems to talk about the Mexican government and its strengthening of its borders! That just might indeed save us!

[The Nehor]

Here is one iteration of that prophecy given by Jesus in his visit to the New World:

14 Yea, wo be unto the Gentiles except they repent; for it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Father, that I will cut off thy horses out of the midst of thee, and I will destroy thy chariots;
15 And I will cut off the cities of thy land, and throw down all thy strongholds;
16 And I will cut off witchcrafts out of thy land, and thou shalt have no more soothsayers;
17 Thy graven images I will also cut off, and thy standing images out of the midst of thee, and thou shalt no more worship the works of thy hands;
18 And I will pluck up thy groves out of the midst of thee; so will I destroy thy cities.
19 And it shall come to pass that all lyings, and deceivings, and envyings, and strifes, and priestcrafts, and whoredoms, shall be done away.
20 For it shall come to pass, saith the Father, that at that day whosoever will not repent and come unto my Beloved Son, them will I cut off from among my people, O house of Israel;
21 And I will execute vengeance and fury upon them, even as upon the heathen, such as they have not heard.
22 But if they will repent and hearken unto my words, and harden not their hearts, I will establish my church among them, and they shall come in unto the covenant and be numbered among this the remnant of Jacob, unto whom I have given this land for their inheritance;

Pretty sure the wall would fall under “strongholds”.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

On 4/17/2019 at 7:04 PM, JAHS said:

Well it didn't copy over, but I was wondering, if this is a true prophecy about the disintegration of the families, assuming they were true prophets who said this, who are we to try to stop it from happening? 
Are such prophecies definitely going to happen no matter what we do or do we have the option and the duty to try and stop it from happening?

Prophets are “commanded”, to warn. This way the judgements of God are just, and righteous. For a Prophet not to warn, is the same for a parent who does not teach their children “truth and righteousness”, the sins will be upon their hands and heads.