Popular Post cinepro Posted February 24, 2016 Popular Post Posted February 24, 2016 Just to be clear, I'm supposed to be skeptical of Naugle's numbers because I can't verify them? I'm all for solid, meaningful stats and reporting, but this being a discussion board about the LDS Church, that ship sailed a long time ago. 6
Scott Lloyd Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) This strikes me as a great vehicle for those make who serial resignations from the Church of Jesus Christ a personal avocation. I wonder if they get together at social functions and boast individually of how many times they have resigned from the Church. Edited February 24, 2016 by Scott Lloyd 3
ALarson Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 2 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: This strikes me as a great vehicle for those make serial resignations from the Church of Jesus Christ a personal avocation. I wonder if they get together at social functions and boast individually of how many times they have resigned from the Church. Again, I doubt anyone can resign from the church numerous times. I have to believe the church membership department keeps meticulous records and would not allow errors such as that.
saemo Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: This strikes me as a great vehicle for those make serial resignations from the Church of Jesus Christ a personal avocation. I wonder if they get together at social functions and boast individually of how many times they have resigned from the Church. I have several times and our social functions now include a martini, named after me. (J/k....I've never resigned. In your opinion, should I contact this website?) Edited February 24, 2016 by saemo 1
saemo Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 1 minute ago, ALarson said: Again, I doubt anyone can resign from the church numerous times. I have to believe the church membership department keeps meticulous records and would not allow errors such as that. But they could sign up at the website multiple times. Use fake info. Etc.
Scott Lloyd Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 1 minute ago, saemo said: I have several times and our social functions now include a martini, named after me. (J/k....I've never resigned. In you opinion, should I contact this website?) You may please yourself. I have no opinion on that. (Though I will say I think you are intelligent enough to know that you don't need an attorney to resign from the Church.) 1
ALarson Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 6 minutes ago, saemo said: But they could sign up at the website multiple times. Use fake info. Etc. From what I can tell, this attorney is reporting successfully completed resignations, not just those who pass by his website and "sign up" or show an interest. The church would not accept and process "fake" resignations. Edited February 24, 2016 by ALarson
Scott Lloyd Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 5 minutes ago, ALarson said: Again, I doubt anyone can resign from the church numerous times. I have to believe the church membership department keeps meticulous records and would not allow errors such as that. You know that and I know that. But I don't think that stops anyone from resigning numerous times (in his own view) who is determined to do so. Edited February 24, 2016 by Scott Lloyd
stemelbow Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 28 minutes ago, cinepro said: Just to be clear, I'm supposed to be skeptical of Naugle's numbers because I can't verify them? I'm all for solid, meaningful stats and reporting, but this being a discussion board about the LDS Church, that ship sailed a long time ago. But I can be as skeptical of his reporting of resignation just as much as I'm skeptical of the LDS Church's claims on things like, membership, or how the money was spent. He seems proud of himself kinda like the Church does, and I'm also a bit confused as to why anyone would need to use his services to resign. Writing a letter is required either way, no? Does the Church respond to resignations? How do we know anyone's resignation happened? 1
saemo Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Just now, Scott Lloyd said: You may please yourself. I have no opinion on that. (Though I will say I think you are intelligent enough to know that you don't need an attorney to resign from the Church.) As I see it, I don't need to resign.
saemo Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 1 minute ago, stemelbow said: But I can be as skeptical of his reporting of resignation just as much as I'm skeptical of the LDS Church's claims on things like, membership, or how the money was spent. He seems proud of himself kinda like the Church does, and I'm also a bit confused as to why anyone would need to use his services to resign. Writing a letter is required either way, no? Does the Church respond to resignations? How do we know anyone's resignation happened? Or skeptical about famous names being submitted for proxy baptisms by "family", several times over. Some people just like to do weird stuff! 2
ALarson Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Just now, Scott Lloyd said: You know that and I know that. But I don't think that stops anyone from resigning numerous times (in their own view) who is determined to do so. I doubt many would want to even attempt to resign numerous times. So this is a bit ridiculous to even discuss. This attorney seems to be reporting the numbers for completed resignations. He sends them in for members with all their information and then he receives the confirmation that the resignation is recorded. Here's what is stated on the website: Quote We usually mail your resignation letter within one week after you have provided all the necessary information to us. The church typically processes and returns the confirmation to us within 2-3 weeks.
Scott Lloyd Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 6 minutes ago, ALarson said: I doubt many would want to even attempt to resign numerous times. So this is a bit ridiculous to even discuss. It's a bit ridiculous that mass resignation events seem to draw perennial attendees. Quote This attorney seems to be reporting the numbers for completed resignations. He sends them in for members with all their information and then he receives the confirmation that the resignation is recorded. I wonder if he specializes in offering extraneous/unnecessary services. Edited February 24, 2016 by Scott Lloyd
JAHS Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 What's to stop someone from sending in a resignation request for someone else without them knowing about it? Doesn't the church have to contact the person or their Bishop to verify the request is real? 1
ALarson Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: It's a bit ridiculous that mass resignation events seem to draw perennial attendees. Maybe, but that's different from what's being reported here. Just because people attend the event several times, that does not mean they are actually submitting numerous resignations. 3 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: I wonder if he specializes in offering extraneous services. Such as? . Edited February 24, 2016 by ALarson
smac97 Posted February 24, 2016 Author Posted February 24, 2016 6 minutes ago, JAHS said: What's to stop someone from sending in a resignation request for someone else without them knowing about it? Doesn't the church have to contact the person or their Bishop to verify the request is real? You would think so. And yet Mr. Naugle is threatening to sue the Church if it does this. Weird. -Smac
ALarson Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 6 minutes ago, JAHS said: What's to stop someone from sending in a resignation request for someone else without them knowing about it? I can't imagine anyone would try that. Whoever they submitted the resignation for would find out and correct it.
Scott Lloyd Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 10 minutes ago, ALarson said: Such as? . Such as offering himself as an intermediary for someone wishing to resign from the Church. (Did you really have to ask that?) Edited February 24, 2016 by Scott Lloyd 2
stemelbow Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 9 minutes ago, smac97 said: You would think so. And yet Mr. Naugle is threatening to sue the Church if it does this. Weird. -Smac Well that's weird. I'm curious to learn more about why there is a problem with resigning. Does it get drug out if they don't use his services? If so, why?
Thinking Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 1 hour ago, MorningStar said: Why would anyone need a lawyer to resign? I believe the reason the Church forwards the request back to the local bishop is to verify that the request is legitimate. Otherwise there could be some serious pranks (which in my opinion would be criminal) committed against members who don't want to resign. A lawyer could make that contact with the bishop unnecessary because a lawyer would presumably verify the identity of the person.
ALarson Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: Such as offering himself as an intermediary for someone wishing to resign from the Church. (Did you really have to ask that?) Isn't he already doing that? (That's why I asked what other "extraneous" services you think he may be offering the member.) . Edited February 24, 2016 by ALarson
Calm Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, smac97 said: I suspect Mr. Naugle is simply counting the number of submissions he has received. That is the only number to which he has access. I'm not sure what the Church would do regarding the "Authorization Form" appended to the resignation letter which purportedly requires the Church to communicate through him rather than directly with his "clients". Is there any evidence the Church is sending him confirmation of resigning rather than just sending the notification to the resignee? Given that there hasn't been a restraining order issued, the Church can legally do that, right? I would also think they would need to confirm that this is the actual member's wishes and not a fraud in the cases of actual members being involved. If the membership was a fraud, would they have any legal requirement to notify the lawyer that it was such? I can see them using the lawyer if the letter was notarized, but don't see how just a form saying it without significant documentation involved would work. Edited February 24, 2016 by Calm
JAHS Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 5 minutes ago, Thinking said: I believe the reason the Church forwards the request back to the local bishop is to verify that the request is legitimate. Otherwise there could be some serious pranks (which in my opinion would be criminal) committed against members who don't want to resign. A lawyer could make that contact with the bishop unnecessary because a lawyer would presumably verify the identity of the person. I don't see where this particular lawyer is asking for any proof of identity (birth cert, Drivers license, etc), unless that happens later on in the process.
stemelbow Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 5 minutes ago, Thinking said: I believe the reason the Church forwards the request back to the local bishop is to verify that the request is legitimate. Otherwise there could be some serious pranks (which in my opinion would be criminal) committed against members who don't want to resign. A lawyer could make that contact with the bishop unnecessary because a lawyer would presumably verify the identity of the person. So two messages on this it seems. Smac is suggesting that this lawyer is threatening to sue the Church if the Church tried to verify if the person requesting resignation is legitimate. But you are claiming the Church forwards the request on to the local bishop to verify. I don't see anything on this site addressing this. His site's kind of lacking info, if you ask me. 1
Scott Lloyd Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 2 minutes ago, ALarson said: Isn't he already doing that? (That's why I asked what other "extraneous" services you think he may be offering the member.) . You didn't ask what "other" services he may be offering. You only said, "Such as?". Observing that he here is offering unnecessary service, I was wondering whether he makes a habit of doing this sort of thing.
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