Dilemma

[halconero]

I have a dilemma I'm mulling over currently, and I wanted some input from others here. These past few days I've been moving into a new apartment in Toronto, with my best friend and another roommate, all of us members. My friend is attends church, is the choir director there, and is in a homosexual relationship. It's not a secret, his brother is a Counselor in the branch presidency. My friend still has a testimony of the Atonement, and Restoration, but his beliefs around sexuality have changed.

Last year living together things worked out fine. I met a few of the guys he was dating, eventually became great friends with one of them, with the understanding that any sexual activity wouldn't be brought into the apartment (we shared a room). The same standard was held for me (I'm in a relationship as well, but am keeping the law of chastity). All goes reasonably well.

Jump to this year. Today we all held a post-move in pow wow to sort out finances, cleaning routine, ground rules, etc. The new roommate brings up what we're going to say for ground rules concerning guests. We come to relationships, and decide that in certain circumstances (distance or terrible weather), a girlfriend or boyfriend (as is the case with my friend) could stay the night, but would have to be on the couch, not in their beau's bed.

Tonight came the dilemma. My friend approaches me after our other roommate goes to bed, and explains his opposition to the rule. Now that he has his own room, and since he is on the lease and helping pay rent, he should be able to have who he wants stay in his room for the night.

He said that by setting the rule that we did, we are imposing our standards on him. I responded that while I love him, I love meeting and befriending the people he's dating, and that I totally respect whatever decision he makes, that I desire a home where the spirit may be invited through adherence to certain standards. I pointed out that this wasn't limited to homosexual relationships, but heterosexual relationships as well. He said that if he couldn't make his bedroom an intimate home for he and his boyfriend, he would look for somewhere else. Not just because of his wants, but his desire to respect my own desires and beliefs

Our discussion was very civil and loving, but we both admitted that we were declaring ultimatums: a chaste apartment, or one where one's decisions in the bedroom are individually decided. Both ultimates were imposing on the desires and lifestyles of the other. Both have valid points.

Currently I'm pondering, praying, and meditating on the matter. Do I stick to my guns, concede to him, or are the compromises? I know the ultimate decision is mine, his, and hopefully influenced by The Lord, but I also feel from the Holy Spirit that I should consult with the people on this board who I respect so much.

God bless, I love you all.

[Storm Rider]

Hello Hal,

 

These are difficult situations. It is interesting to see how things evolve in the lives of individuals and how what was once forbidden fruit becomes acceptable.  

 

I can only share how I would respond to these situations with an understanding that each individual has to make his own choice.  For me, there is no sex before marriage in our home regardless of religious persuasion, age, or gender.  There are no exceptions.

 

If I was in your shoes, a new lease is signed that comes with financial obligations.  Rules were set and accepted.  Now they don't apply for whatever reason; someone wants to rewrite the rules.  I would probably decide if I wanted/could afford the apartment or not without a roommate paying 1/3 or whatever the percentage is.  If I could pay for it, then I would invite the noncomplying fellow to leave.  If I could not pay for it, I would tell him that his decision forces you to leave and he would have to pay for the apartment.  

 

The problem - these kinds of things can turn acrimonious very quickly.  

 

The principle to focus on  is not the sex, but the fact that he agreed to a set of conditions that he now wants to change.  His proposed change is not acceptable and he is expected to observe the rules.  If he wants to live a different lifestyle get a hotel room or stay with his friend.  He either is the type of person to keep his word or not.  His choice and he has to bear the consequences of his choices. 

 

Not fun - good luck.  Draw the line and stick to it.  Remember this is not about sex - it is about keeping his word. 

[Calm]

If you give into him, he will still know you disapprove and feel uncomfortable about it and that would see to place a great deal of strain and maybe even taint the relationship. Otoh if he gives into you, it is likely he may have resentment. A lot depends on the depth of the relationship and how much trust and openness there is, but beyond the change I am much more concerned with how you say he brought it up.

He did go into the relationship with the new apartment, even getting settled and signed everything before telling you he wanted a change of rules. This should have been discussed long before the move. Why did he wait? Has that created a hardship? If you say no, that you want to continue with the standard all agreed to at first, what happens if he decides to move out? Who is responsible for the lease? Is he required to find a replacement? Do you have to approve or can it be anyone? Would he likely just default and walk away? Sounds unlikely as a best friend, but why then the delay in telling you?

Imo I think you need to explore with him why he did it the way he did in order to better understand what he is thinking to etter make a decision thatbwill deeply affect your relationship. Does he value it as much as you do? If so, why this approach? It comes across as a pressure tactic, everything is settled and it would be difficult now to get a new roommate perhaps or it will feel worse like you are kicking him out if you say no, but hard for you to find a new place if you don't want to impose on him but still want to keep the standard yourself. There may be a very valid reason he didn't bring it up until the very last minute and it is not an attempt at emotional or financial manipulation, but if it is, it means the dynamic of your relationship has changed in more than just the possibility of having to have chaste/no chaste zones in the house. To me this needs to be settled before focusing on how rules might change or remain the same.

Edited September 5, 2014 by calmoriah

[Calm]

"He said that if he couldn't make his bedroom an intimate home for he and his boyfriend"

Does he plan on having his boyfriend move in? Would this be allowed in the lease? Would the boyfriend contribute to expenses, etc?

[Avatar4321]

i think you are doing the right thing.

[rpn]

Are you saying that you had the rule about no sex in the apartment in the old apartment and when you discussed living arrangements and who got what bedroom in the new apartment, he never negotiated that he wanted a room where he could have sex and that is why he was in the single bedroom?    And he put his name on the lease?   (What does the lease say about overnight friends?)  

 

He hasn't been honest with you about what he wanted in the apartment.   I'd simply tell him that when he wants intimacy he can do it elsewhere.  And that you aren't going to be making out with your paramour in your apartment either.   On a practical level, I presume no one is going to be walking into another's bedroom without their permission, so you would never know what is going on in that room.   They may have been having sex in your apartment during the day for years, already.

 

Truth is though that you  aren't going to be able to enforce it.   So you need to start looking for a new roommate and he needs to start looking for a new apartment (or vice versa.   Are you sure the third roomie will back you  or will they back him?) 

[Darren10]

Halconero;

You've done nothing wrong so far ad I can tell. Stick to your guns and with the rules set. No beaus in the bedroom. Sounds to me like your friend needs to find his own place.

[Rain]

I agree with those above. You had the rule. He waited till after the lease was signed and now wants to change the rule. This isn't a small rule either like who changes the toilet paper. Even if both of you were ok with premarital sex it would still be a big thing in most of the lives of my non member friends and many of them agree upon what should happen before moving in together.

This is not about you forcing your beliefs on him or him on you. It's about honesty and keeping agreements.

[bluebell]

I think you should stick to your guns.  He signed the lease under false pretenses and it's not fair of him now to ask you to change the rules.

 

Edit to add-

 

His whole argument seems to be based on a false premise.  In a situation where people live together as roommates, there is no expectation that any of the roommates will be allowed to live however they wish regardless of how the other roommates feel about it just because they have signed a lease or are paying rent.  Implied in every roommate agreement is the notion of compromise and following certain standards which everyone agrees on.

 

Since he knew the standards and agreed to them prior to this, it is completely unfair for him (though i'm sure he's a very nice person and you would both be sad to have to find new roommates) to argue that they shouldn't apply.

Edited September 5, 2014 by bluebell

[thesometimesaint]

You loose either way. It would probably be for the best if either you or he found different living places.

[ERayR]

It all depends on how resolute you are in maintaining your values.  Either way I don't see your living arrangements as lasting too long, the diametrically opposed values are not compatible.   Start looking for more compatible room mates.

[halconero]

Just so everyone is aware, the issue came to an amicable conclusion where everyone's feelings were addressed and it had a happy ending. Thank you for all your advice, it did help a lot.

Edited September 8, 2014 by halconero

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

Time to find a new apartment. When does your lease end?

[Calm]

Just so everyone is aware, the issue came to an amicable conclusion where everyone's feelings were addressed and it had a happy ending. Thank you for all your advice, it did help a lot.

Happy endings are good.

[Stargazer]

If all is now resolved and the problem solved to everyone's satisfaction, then now might be a good time to post what was agreed to, and then close the topic to avoid people stumbling into it in order to add their two cents, a day late and a dollar short.

Just a suggestion!