Rivers Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 http://m.standard.net/standardex/pm_109839/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=jrzgGrUW
Popular Post jwhitlock Posted June 1, 2013 Popular Post Posted June 1, 2013 Well, it appears that since Elder Packer is a religious leader, he should be relegated to second class status in society. Good to know how all those "progressive" people really view things. 5
Calm Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) Boyd K. and Donna S. Packer Center for Family and Community EducationI wonder if he promoted a family that included gay parents if there would such an uproar.Martin Luther King was a religious leader, will Stonewall Democrats protest his name wherever it appears? Edited June 1, 2013 by calmoriah 2
Calm Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 These Packer protesters are petty .Pretty profound perception. 2
Rivers Posted June 1, 2013 Author Posted June 1, 2013 I respect Weber State for standing firm in their decision. 1
Storm Rider Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 "It causes me emotional pain", well golly gee Ms. Molly, how many things in this world don't cause you emotional pain? When I hear these types of comments my eyes always begin to roll. Why should I care that my life style, my choices cause you personal pain. Should all things that cause anyone personal pain not be allowed? This is just such an egotistical position. Grow up and realize that life is full of things that will cause you emotional pain and it will never stop until you realize that the decisions of others are not "personal" and don't really affect you directly; there is no need to be bothered, concerned or worried. 3
thesometimesaint Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Well, it appears that since Elder Packer is a religious leader, he should be relegated to second class status in society. Good to know how all those "progressive" people really view things.It has nothing to do with being progressive in the political sense. Moreover I don't see any separation of Church and State issues here. Living in California we have lots cities, and counties, not to mention many buildings that are named after important religious figures. San Francisco got it name from Saint Francis of Assisi.
Calm Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) It has nothing to do with being progressive in the political sense.The full story makes it clear his stand on the LGBT issue is what is the problem at heart.If you go to the Stonewall Democrats site, it is clear they see themselves as "progressive" in a political sense: http://www.stonewalldemocrats.org/toklas/blog/guest-blogger-one-nation-working-together-organizer-alex-kapelman?page=7http://www.stonewalldemocrats.org/takeaction/internOur internship program is designed to train individuals in the skills required for success within political organizing and political advocacy. We seek to develop talents into a skill set desired by political campaigns, government offices and progressive organizations. Edited June 1, 2013 by calmoriah 1
Calm Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) Moreover I don't see any separation of Church and State issues here.The petition says naming the center for Boyd K. Packer, an apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, is an inappropriate choice, because Packer is a religious leader, and WSU is a state school, raising the First Amendment issue of separation between church and state."Weber State is a publicly owned university supported by my tax dollars," Henline said. "To name a center at a state university for someone in the community who does nothing but religion is wrong. Edited June 1, 2013 by calmoriah
thesometimesaint Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) Anyone can claim a separation of Church and State issue, but that doesn't make it one. They would have an issue if the state mandated that those that paid for or used the building believe the same as Elder Packer.Ps. The New Mexico state flag has a Zia on it. Zia is the representation for the Pre-Christian era sun God.http://en.wikipedia....g_of_New_MexicoPPs. The California is the Bear Flag Republic. With a Black Bear at its center. The American Indians in California worshiped the Black Bear.With both of those, and many more, I don't know of any that want to change their flags just because there are religious symbols on them. Edited June 1, 2013 by thesometimesaint
jwhitlock Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Weber State University's announcement last month that a new center for family and community education would be named for WSU alumni Boyd K. and Donna S. Packer sparked simmering anger, now grown to a full boil.The Utah Stonewall Democrats (www.utahstonewalldems.org), formed to champion the rights of Utah's lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender communities, posted a petition asking Weber State officials to change the name of the Boyd K. and Donna S. Packer Center for Family and Community Education. As of Thursday afternoon, the petition had been signed by more than 2,060.It would have been more accurate to use "simmering bigotry" instead of anger. From a statistical standpoint, we now know that there are at least 2060 bigots floating around in the general area up there.Perhaps the Stonewall Democrats could use a new slogan, like "God hates religions leaders". Some groups with their general values use similar slogans.
CV75 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 http://m.standard.ne...ntguid=jrzgGrUWActually, it is an organization, not a building: "Kowalewski said the new center, not a building but an organization to oversee eight educational and community outreach programs, has garnered significant support and donations." In my mind, this allows much more flexibility to appropriately name it after an individual whose values may be aligned with the mission(s) of the eight programs it oversees. I'm sure there are other centers at WSU that allow an alternative viewpoint, and I haven't seen anything about the new center proving to be as rigid as the protesters fear.
Calm Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) With both of those, and many more, I don't know of any that want to change their flags just because there are religious symbols on them.Then the paper shouldn't have presented it in its blurb as only about religion: The petition says naming the center for Boyd K. Packer, an apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, is an inappropriate choice, because Packer is a religious leader, and WSU is a state school, raising the First Amendment issue of separation between church and state.Nor did I ever suggest that they had a valid case of 1st A., simply pointed out that was how it was being framed. Edited June 1, 2013 by calmoriah
Rivers Posted June 1, 2013 Author Posted June 1, 2013 It would have been more accurate to use "simmering bigotry" instead of anger. From a statistical standpoint, we now know that there are at least 2060 bigots floating around in the general area up there.Perhaps the Stonewall Democrats could use a new slogan, like "God hates religions leaders". Some groups with their general values use similar slogans.Why can't we all learn to agree to disagree with each other on things without accusations of bigotry?
Rivers Posted June 1, 2013 Author Posted June 1, 2013 Actually, it is an organization, not a building:Oh. Thanks for the correction.
Deborah Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Well, since I've always loved Elder Packer, and in partiucular his bluntness, I'm happy about it. What I want to know why are those who protest religious values open minded while those with religious values who oppose what they consider immoral acts bigots? 1
ERayR Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) Why can't we all learn to agree to disagree with each other on things without accusations of bigotry?It is not productive to ignore what it is. It is bigotry so why call it love. Edited June 1, 2013 by ERayR 1
jwhitlock Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Why can't we all learn to agree to disagree with each other on things without accusations of bigotry?Because some forms of hate speech - such as that practiced by the Stonewall Democrats - are not intended for discussion. So we might as well get to the point and identify them for what they are.I'll note that those who opposed the naming of the center were quick to label Elder Packer a bigot, and with far less support for that accusation than what they were themselves demonstrating. 2
rpn Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 1) I think it is wrong to name any public building after a living person.2) And the Center's attempt to use his name to improve fund raising in my view is abhorrent.3) But whichever group receives these petitions should ask those who signed it if they have read or personally seen in their entirety all the GC talks he has give over the last seven years. I've paid some attention to the outcries that come after every talk. And because of that I pay closer than usual attention to his talks. And he doesn't say what the internet lights up to report he says. The protest is a visceral misinterpretation because they don't like him personally, maybe even fear him as Pres of the 12, not truly because of what he says. So every petition signer who hasn't actually read or hear his works, should be ignored. 1
Avatar4321 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 It's absolutely astounding how much hatred exists in the world.
SamIam Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 San Francisco got it name from Saint Francis of Assisi.** Bad humor alert **So what you are saying here is a cleverly concealed insinuation. By emphasizing a small variant of spelling we read Saint Franc is Assisi. San Francisco could not have a more fitting patron saint.
thesometimesaint Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 ** Bad humor alert **So what you are saying here is a cleverly concealed insinuation. By emphasizing a small variant of spelling we read Saint Franc is Assisi. San Francisco could not have a more fitting patron saint.That is BAD.
Kenngo1969 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 That is BAD. Sam's slogan is, "When I'm good, I'm very, very good, but when I'm bad, I'm even better!
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