General Conference talk on the understanding of the Godhead

[GoCeltics]

On 7/12/2026 at 8:59 PM, InCognitus said:

So you think God the Father was doing the things that Jesus did at the same time that Jesus did them so Jesus could “see” his Father do those things in the present tense?

It depends on how you interpret what the Father is doing while Jesus is acting based on what he observes the Father doing.

On 7/12/2026 at 8:59 PM, InCognitus said:

I believe God can reveal things to us (past, present, or future) in the present tense.  Don’t you?

Yes.

[GoCeltics]

On 7/12/2026 at 9:04 PM, InCognitus said:

Nobody else talks like this.  In case anyone had any doubt that theplains and GoCeltics are the same person, see the post from theplains on 04/21/2025:

And:

Two or more people can ask the same question and that makes them the same person. Sure 😀

[InCognitus]

13 hours ago, GoCeltics said:

On 7/12/2026 at 6:59 PM, InCognitus said:

I believe God can reveal things to us (past, present, or future) in the present tense.  Don’t you?

Yes.

So no problem then.

[GoCeltics]

On 7/14/2026 at 11:20 PM, InCognitus said:

So no problem then.

Except that worshipping Joseph Smith’s God leads to another destination.

[InCognitus]

3 hours ago, GoCeltics said:

Except that worshipping Joseph Smith’s God leads to another destination.

Right, the Celestial Kingdom of God, living eternally with God the Father and his Son, Jesus Christ.

[theplains]

On 7/12/2026 at 8:53 PM, InCognitus said:

No, that’s not correct.  This is what I said in a recent post to you on July 1, where I was commenting on a quote from the King Follet Discourse.  I said:

God is eternally the Most High God who once was a man and he became our God, just as Joseph Smith taught in that same sermon:

In that discourse, he said "I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and 
supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away the veil, so 
that you may see".

Do you believe that he was only teaching the people to know and believe God became OUR God instead 
of Him becoming A God?  If yes, provide the exact inference.
 

On 7/12/2026 at 8:53 PM, InCognitus said:

"The first principles of man are self-existent with God. God himself, finding he was in the midst of spirits and glory, because he was more intelligent, saw proper to institute laws whereby the rest could have a privilege to advance like himself. 

Under whose laws did Heavenly Father advance before and after he supposedly became a man?
 

On 7/12/2026 at 8:53 PM, InCognitus said:

In my post on May 26, 2025, I provided a list of some of the early Christian Fathers that taught that men become “gods” or are deified (they are “exalted”), and taught that other “gods” exist in reality:

• Clement of Rome (35 AD – 99 AD) – “Saint” (Clement is mentioned in the Bible in Philippians 4:3).
• Justin Martyr (150 AD) - “Saint”
• Irenaeus of Lyons (c. 175 - c. 195) - “Saint”
• Theophilus of Antioch (died approximately 180 AD)
• Clement of Alexandria (c. 155 - c. 220 AD) - “Saint”
• Hippolytus of Rome (c. 170–235 AD) - “Saint”
• Origen (185-254 AD) - Highly regarded as one of the most influential Christian theologians
• Cyprian (A.D. 200-258) - “Saint”
• Athanasius of Alexandria (A.D. 296–373) - “Saint”
• Gregory of Nyssa (c. 335-395) - “Saint”
• Augustine of Hippo (354-430 AD) - “Saint"

These men lived the closest to the time of Jesus and the apostles.  Some of them personally knew the apostles and were taught by them, or they were taught by others who were taught by the apostles. These were orthodox Christians.  Many of them are called “Saints”.  Their teachings about other gods and that humans can become gods were not isolated cases, they were widespread teachings, proving that these were fundamental doctrines of early Christianity.  How did they have this doctrine in common among them if it did not originate from a common earlier source?  Did they invent it independently in different parts of the Christian world?

Moses and Satan were referred to as gods in scripture but they were not Deities.  

As for the people you mentioned above, I don't believe it was on par with all the quotes from the 
following:

1] The thread "The caricature: Mormons wishing to "get their own planet?"

2] Doctrine and Covenants 76 ("…And he makes them equal in power, and in might, and in dominion")

3] Gospel Principles (page 275 - "Exaltation is eternal life, the kind of life God lives. He lives 
in great glory. He is perfect. He possesses all knowledge and all wisdom. He is the Father of spirit 
children. He is a creator. We can become like our Heavenly Father. This is exaltation". Page 277 - 
"5. They will have everything that our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ have—all power, glory, 
dominion, and knowledge (see D&C 132:19–20)"

4] Orson Pratt, The Seer.

"All these Gods are equal in power, in glory, in dominion, and in the possession of all things; 
each possesses a fulness of truth, of knowledge, of wisdom, of light, of intelligence ; each 
governs himself in all things by his own attributes, and is filled with love, goodness, mercy, 
and justice towards all. The fulness of all these attributes is what constitutes God. "God is 
Light." "God is Love." "God is Truth." The Gods are one in the qualities and attributes".

"Each person is called God, not because of his substance, neither because of the shape and size 
of the substance, but because of the qualities which dwell in the substance" .

You seem to believe the men you quoted above were speaking the truth, but you didn't mention if 
you believed all the LDS leaders that I referenced were speaking the truth or if you also consider 
them as "doctrine" like you applied above.

Have a look at the thread and let me know which statements you believe are false.

It's odd how you use the word "doctrine" and apply it to what the early Church Fathers taught but 
you don't apply the same thing to what LDS leaders taught.

We have LDS teaching guides like "Doctrines of Salvation" and "Doctrines of the Gospel – Student 
Manual" but you want readers to believe nothing in them is not a false doctrine, right?  The book 
"Gospel Truths", by former First Presidency Member George Q. Cannon" is really not "gospel truths", 
right?

I suggest you quote some of what your own LDS leaders really teach and really mean if you disagree 
with how I am interpreting them.

I don't agree that everything early Church Fathers taught square with what has been revealed in 
scripture.  "Becoming like God" in the LDS sense is not how Christians view "Adam and Eve becoming 
like God" in the Garden of Eden.  Being created in the image of God does not make us gods.

The Church Fathers did not teach Heavenly Father was once a married man who became a God and then 
populated Earth with spirit children created on the world he lives on. They also didn't teach 
Jesus and the Holy Ghost are spirit brothers of Lucifer.

When LDS leaders have repeatedly taught God is an exalted man, they do not mean that God was always 
a God and then this God became a man, and then this God/man was re-exalted back to the position he 
had before. 

It's even taught as LDS doctrine that Jesus became a God in his pre-mortal life before he comes 
to Earth in mortal flesh.

Does the LDS Heavenly Mother become a God before the LDS Jesus is even born to her as her first 
spirit child? Obviously. Was he born a spirit-God to her?  No.  He was ranked as a God when he 
reached some pinnacle of intelligence in his pre-existence, as taught in "Doctrines of the 
Gospel – Student Manual).  

In some fashion, an LDS man and woman attained their fulness of joy when they became Gods (they 
achieved godhood) and then supposedly became Heavenly Parents of Earth.
 

On 7/12/2026 at 8:53 PM, InCognitus said:

Is it a temptation to want to sit with God in his throne?  Why would you consider it a “temptation” to want the very thing that God offers to us?  Is God trying to trick us?

No.  But I see a dividing line between the Creator and creation.
 

On 7/12/2026 at 8:53 PM, InCognitus said:

Was Jesus tempting us too when he prayed to his Father so that his disciples would receive the very same “glory” with him and the Father, that Jesus received from his Father?  (John 17:22)   How are these things temptations?  It shows God’s love for us and his desire for us to partake of everything that he enjoys.

We will partake of God's blessings in his kingdom but this won't make us Gods.

If I understand LDS theology correctly, everyone in the Celestial kingdom (with its three sections) 
will have celestial glory, whose glory is that of the sun (D&C 76:70).  And the glory of the sun is 
one (76:96).  But all the inhabitants of the celestial kingdom are not Gods.

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not 
perish but have eternal life".

In LDS theology, you can put the inhabitants of the two lower divisions of the celestial kingdom 
and all from the terrestrial/telestial kingdoms into the "should perish" class.

On the flip side, God's love is not demonstrated to those who don't partake of everything that he 
enjoys.

[theplains]

On 7/12/2026 at 8:54 PM, InCognitus said:

As for the others, I don’t think anyone denies that God the Father is an “exalted man”.  He has “achieved Godhood” and “progressed to Godhood” in that he was once a man who is now exalted.  But that’s not the same thing as him “becoming God”.  God the Father received exaltation (his body was exalted), and Jesus was exalted (Philippians 2:9).  God the Father’s body was glorified and perfected, and the same goes for Jesus (Hebrews 5:8-9).

That appears to be your definition of "exaltation" - meaning a body is exalted.  You should become 
more familiar with how the LDS Church defines exaltation.

Now it appears you do believe God has not always been a God but he became a God.
 
I'd say He (the LDS God) is not a God before "achieving Godhood".  He is not a God before "progressing 
to Godhood".

By the way, the idea of "achieving" Godhood and then "progressing to" Godhood should be reversed.  
"Progressing towards" is one of the steps in the journey before reaching the "achieved" state.
 

On 7/12/2026 at 8:54 PM, InCognitus said:

God’s “glory” increases through him creating more worlds (he has worlds without number) and bringing to pass the immortality and eternal life of man.

And none of these things changes the teaching that God the Father has always been the most intelligent of all eternal beings and the most High God, the God of all other gods.

You are only thinking about Heavenly Father's sphere of influence or realm. You should watch the 
movie "Thor" to understand what I mean by realms. In the case of LDS theology, there are many of 
them – each with its own supreme leader, or God in your case.
  
I think you believe Heavenly Father is a higher God than Jesus, right.  Do you also believe 
Heavenly Father is a higher God than his God (Jesus' Grandfather)?

Do you also believe Heavenly Father is the most High God of all other Gods which supposedly exist 
before he becomes a God and heavenly father of our Earth?

Notice that I specifically use upper case "g" but you keep referring to lower case "g". It seems 
they mean different things to you.
 

On 7/12/2026 at 8:54 PM, InCognitus said:

See Calm’s response to your same question, here and here.  I agree with what she said.

Based on what she wrote, and I hope that I didn't misunderstand her, she believes that some woman 
who lived on some other world became a God and then became the heavenly mother of the humans on 
our Earth. I think she also believes the same about Heavenly Father of our Earth; that they were 
married on that world, became Gods, and then had spirit children and populated our Earth with these 
children. They had a beginning as Gods and as heavenly parents.  They are not classified as "Gods" 
until they become Gods. They are not classified as "heavenly parents" until they have spirit 
children (i.e. eternal increase).

I think the LDS Church formulizes the doctrine of Heavenly Mother through "The Family: Proclamation 
to the World" but doesn't speculate on how she became a God and who atoned for her sins while she 
was living on her world.

[GoCeltics]

On 7/17/2026 at 2:07 PM, InCognitus said:

Right, the Celestial Kingdom of God, living eternally with God the Father and his Son, Jesus Christ.

If God the Father is not a being who became a God and produced spirit children with his heavenly wife, then he is not the true one.

“And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.”