I Will Draw All Men Unto Myself

[3DOP]

In one of the readings from "the Office" (not Jim and Pam, or Michael, heh) for Palm Sunday we see the familiar prophetic words of Jesus Christ, "When I am lifted up, I will draw all men unto myself."

I was meditating on these words a little while gazing at a Crucifix that hangs in our bedroom. It came to mind that this image over my wife's dresser demonstrates why it was necessary for the Lord to suffer as He did, and not only to achieve redemption for our souls. We certainly need forgiveness of sins. I hold that the Cross of Christ is a fathomless mystery, which perhaps no one has fully realized in its depth. Through our imaginations, faithful Christians continually try to realize more profoundly the gift that Jesus gives us on Calvary. 

He draws all men to Himself. He doesn't force His divine love upon us. Rather He shows it to us, when we picture Him suffering in body, when we hear Him repeat His dying words, when we see the centurion thrust His spear into the side of our dead Savior. When men and women, young and old, have imagined the horrid but sacred scene they have run to this Savior, of their own free will, and offered Him their spirits and souls and bodies for 2,000 years on every continent and in every nation. He draws us to Himself. 

I am aware that there is a bit of a taboo in some Christian circles against the making of religious art that shows our Lord on a Cross. Perhaps LDS lead the way in this era of time, but they didn't arrive at the conclusion without precedent. Reforming Protestants also disdained the practice centuries before Joseph Smith. Before that there was the iconoclastic movement in the Middle Ages, mostly limited to Eastern Christianity, which was exposed to ideas gained from devout Muslim neighbors. This is not a history lesson. It is try to understand and have sympathy with those who do not like a Crucifix, a rude, garish symbol hanging prominently in Catholic churches, and privately in Catholic homes.

I am not suggesting to the Muslim, Protestant Reformer, or Latter-day Saint that they need to start hanging up crucifixes. But I am suggesting that whether one of these should use a physical image such as a crucifix to help them picture the scene at Calvary, or merely use their imaginations to see the event where Christ triumphs over sin and death, that we need to see it in our minds, with or without using our physical vision. However far we may have advanced in our love for God the Father and His Blessed Son, we will always be drawn to a greater love for the Lord Jesus Christ by taking time, and making a point to purposely imagine again what Jesus did for us to make our Easter resurrection and His, a reality of history that shall never fade away.

May there be a Blessed Palm Sunday and holy week of preparation for us all. May we be more ready than ever to race to Him, in the glory of His Resurrection, with hearts bursting with love and joy in seven days. May we always be more and more profoundly drawn to Him, using the method He left for us.

Rory

[Tony uk]

As a Roman Catholic, there is an argument against religious imagery, that I have always struggled to grasp. In the RC world we have crucifixes with Christ on the the cross. Also statues of saints, and various artwork on a religious theme. When I hear non RC giving criticism of this. I rarely hear the same people offering criticism of statues in public places of politicians and other notable people. Also artwork, or other imagery.

[3DOP]

1 hour ago, Tony uk said:

As a Roman Catholic, there is an argument against religious imagery, that I have always struggled to grasp. In the RC world we have crucifixes with Christ on the the cross. Also statues of saints, and various artwork on a religious theme. When I hear non RC giving criticism of this. I rarely hear the same people offering criticism of statues in public places of politicians and other notable people. Also artwork, or other imagery.

Hi Tony, good point about non religious images. I think it is a healthy human instinct to make images of those for whom we love or have deep respect.

Imagery isn't good if one's imagination is imagining that the image IS God, or Lincoln or Wellington. But we Catholics even kneel before our images. Sometimes through misunderstanding, Catholics have been accused of replacing God with an image.

It is a human trait to have trouble concentrating our imaginations. It takes a lot of discipline which I lack. In the Gospel, we are told that Mary pondered certain events in her heart. It CAN be done without physical images. But must it be? Are we in danger of idolatry if we need visual aids to tame our wild imaginations?

There is no question in my mind that images must be used as aids to our meditations. Of course, like Mary, we can limit our images to our own interior imagination without outside help, especially if we fear offending God by the use of an artist's representation. The main thing is to develop a deeper penetration into the meaning of an event.

 

 

 

Edited March 29 by 3DOP

[Tony uk]

3 minutes ago, 3DOP said:

Hi Tony, good point about non religious images. I think it is a healthy human instinct to make images of those for whom we love or have deep respect.

Imagery isn't good if one's imagination is imagining that the image IS God, or Lincoln or Wellington. But we Catholics even kneel before our images. Sometimes through misunderstanding, Catholics have been accused of replacing God with a statue. 

I doubt that many non-Catholics would mistake an image of Christ crucified, for God. It is a human trait to have trouble concentrating our imaginations. It takes a lot of discipline which I lack. In the Gospel, we are told that Mary pondered certain events in her heart. It CAN be done without physical images.

There is no question in my mind that images must be used as aids to our meditations. Of course, like Mary, we can limit our images to our own interior imagination without outside help if we fear offending God by the use of an artist's representation. The main thing is to develop a deeper penetration into the meaning of an event.

 

 

 

Glad you are to make the point far better than I could. Within the Catholic Church, there maybe a lack of education, with regards to this among a minority of people. Outside the Catholic Church, there maybe a lack of understanding on the matter.

[marineland]

6 hours ago, Tony uk said:

When I hear non RC giving criticism of this. I rarely hear the same people offering criticism of statues in public places of politicians and other notable people. Also artwork, or other imagery.

Let's talk further when a gold statue of DJT is erected 🙂 

[Orthodox Christian]

On 3/29/2026 at 1:24 PM, Tony uk said:

As a Roman Catholic, there is an argument against religious imagery, that I have always struggled to grasp. In the RC world we have crucifixes with Christ on the the cross. Also statues of saints, and various artwork on a religious theme. When I hear non RC giving criticism of this. I rarely hear the same people offering criticism of statues in public places of politicians and other notable people. Also artwork, or other imagery.

As an Orthodox Christian icons are very much part of our worship experience. I guess we see them as representing that many clouds of witnesses and as such like them around us in our prayer corners, as we know that they are only dead in the flesh. These icons are venerated, not worshipped, they kind of act like a conduit to put one into the presence of the prototype. So when we stand before the icon of Christ, the icon leads us to meditate upon Him and enter into his presence in prayer. It's also quite nice when you go into whichever room holds your prayer corner, to see them, and acknowledge them in your heart with a prayer of thanksgiving. 

Edited April 3 by Orthodox Christian

[RevTestament]

On 3/29/2026 at 3:59 AM, 3DOP said:

I was meditating on these words a little while gazing at a Crucifix that hangs in our bedroom. It came to mind that this image over my wife's dresser demonstrates why it was necessary for the Lord to suffer as He did, and not only to achieve redemption for our souls. We certainly need forgiveness of sins. I hold that the Cross of Christ is a fathomless mystery, which perhaps no one has fully realized in its depth. Through our imaginations, faithful Christians continually try to realize more profoundly the gift that Jesus gives us on Calvary. 

He draws all men to Himself. He doesn't force His divine love upon us. Rather He shows it to us, when we picture Him suffering in body, when we hear Him repeat His dying words, when we see the centurion thrust His spear into the side of our dead Savior. When men and women, young and old, have imagined the horrid but sacred scene they have run to this Savior, of their own free will, and offered Him their spirits and souls and bodies for 2,000 years on every continent and in every nation. He draws us to Himself. 

I am aware that there is a bit of a taboo in some Christian circles against the making of religious art that shows our Lord on a Cross. Perhaps LDS lead the way in this era of time, but they didn't arrive at the conclusion without precedent. Reforming Protestants also disdained the practice centuries before Joseph Smith. Before that there was the iconoclastic movement in the Middle Ages, mostly limited to Eastern Christianity, which was exposed to ideas gained from devout Muslim neighbors. This is not a history lesson. It is try to understand and have sympathy with those who do not like a Crucifix, a rude, garish symbol hanging prominently in Catholic churches, and privately in Catholic homes.

I am not suggesting to the Muslim, Protestant Reformer, or Latter-day Saint that they need to start hanging up crucifixes. But I am suggesting that whether one of these should use a physical image such as a crucifix to help them picture the scene at Calvary, or merely use their imaginations to see the event where Christ triumphs over sin and death, that we need to see it in our minds, with or without using our physical vision. However far we may have advanced in our love for God the Father and His Blessed Son, we will always be drawn to a greater love for the Lord Jesus Christ by taking time, and making a point to purposely imagine again what Jesus did for us to make our Easter resurrection and His, a reality of history that shall never fade away.

May there be a Blessed Palm Sunday and holy week of preparation for us all. May we be more ready than ever to race to Him, in the glory of His Resurrection, with hearts bursting with love and joy in seven days. May we always be more and more profoundly drawn to Him, using the method He left for us.

Rory

Hey Rory,

Glad to see you are still counseling to these stubborn LDS!

My view of Jesus' phrasing is a little broader than the Catholic view. Jesus was literally saying he would draw all men to himself. He also said that it was His Father's will that He lose none given unto him. I always had a hard time reconciling Jesus' words to "orthodox" Christian beliefs.... that is until I matured in the restored gospel.... and it all begins to make sense. Yeshua will lose virtually none from this world given to Him, as He will be called the Eternal Father Isa. 9:6 after His work is done. Even the wicked will be resurrected upon which they will be given the opportunity to repent or to go back to hell. Essentially all will accept Him once they see Him. But, you see that didn't take all that much faith... and little to no valor. So, consequently their reward will not be great.

In a way I closely believe something like purgatory. It is what I believe the scriptures call spirit prison for those who can live "godly" once they accept the truth. You see purgatory is not a permanent place and neither is spirit prison.

[3DOP]

On 4/29/2026 at 2:12 AM, RevTestament said:

Hey Rory,

Glad to see you are still counseling to these stubborn LDS!

My view of Jesus' phrasing is a little broader than the Catholic view. Jesus was literally saying he would draw all men to himself. He also said that it was His Father's will that He lose none given unto him. I always had a hard time reconciling Jesus' words to "orthodox" Christian beliefs.... that is until I matured in the restored gospel.... and it all begins to make sense. Yeshua will lose virtually none from this world given to Him, as He will be called the Eternal Father Isa. 9:6 after His work is done. Even the wicked will be resurrected upon which they will be given the opportunity to repent or to go back to hell. Essentially all will accept Him once they see Him. But, you see that didn't take all that much faith... and little to no valor. So, consequently their reward will not be great.

In a way I closely believe something like purgatory. It is what I believe the scriptures call spirit prison for those who can live "godly" once they accept the truth. You see purgatory is not a permanent place and neither is spirit prison.

Hi Rev!

So my point in bringing up the Cross at the beginning of this thread was to speak of the necessity of images, either made out of matter to be meditated on in the mind, or to be meditated upon without physical aids of any kind. 

The Catholic Church says definitively that we cannot as Catholics know that any particular individual is in Hell. Recently (1917), there was a "private revelation" given while about 70,000 people observed some inexplicable meteorological phenomena. Part of the message of "Our Lady of Fatima" (where what many Catholics believe to have been miraculous), was that Mary told the children who reportedly saw her (while the approximately 69,997 others present could only observe the "miracle of the sun") to exhort faithful Catholics to add this prayer to each decade of Mary's Rosary:

O my Jesus, forgive us our sins, LEAD ALL SOULS TO HEAVEN, especially those most in need of Thy mercy.

Disclaimer: I do not remember at which apparition Our Lady gave us what has come to be called, "The Fatima Prayer".

Anyway, I think both of our communities agree that God draws or leads everyone to Himself. There might be few or many who hate God so much as to refuse His overtures. Poor souls who prefer separation from God instead of union. We should pray for all and hope for all, especially those "most in need of God's mercy". 

Edited May 3 by 3DOP

[Navidad]

My favorite image of Christ is the one hanging in my office. It shows Christ reaching down into the water to pull Peter out. I like it because it shows me both the redemptive and the higher expectation of Christ for those who followed Him. Christ neither left Peter to drown in his humanness (fears and doubt) nor did he go beyond a gentle remonstrance. It helps me in my valuing of uncertainty as something of an aid that draws me into dependence on the reliability of Christ, something, at least in my community, we don't talk about very much. Best wishes to all. 

[longview]

On 3/29/2026 at 12:45 PM, marineland said:

Let's talk further when a gold statue of DJT is erected 🙂 

Extremely unlikely. However, it would be awesome if he was to be added to Mount Rushmore ! ! !

[Calm]

27 minutes ago, longview said:

Extremely unlikely. However, it would be awesome if he was to be added to Mount Rushmore ! ! !

It’s already an eyesore. 

[longview]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

It’s already an eyesore. 

Have you been to the Black Hills? What do you think of Chief Crazy Horse monument? Do you have positive feelings about him? Native Americans did ask Borglum to do it.

I think Mount Rushmore is magnificent.

[Calm]

One definitely looks better than four (they look uncomfortable, cluttered), but I am not fond of the Crazy Horse monument. 
 

I get that others like it.  I don’t. Never have since the first time I saw a picture of it. North by Northwest involving it didn’t help even if great movie. 
 

It can’t happen no matter how awesome anyone thinks it might look (not physically possible..at least not with today’s technology) even if they managed to pass a bill to try and do it.  Trying to carve anymore will likely collapse some of it.

Edited May 4 by Calm

[The Nehor]

8 hours ago, longview said:

Extremely unlikely. However, it would be awesome if he was to be added to Mount Rushmore ! ! !

He already won the prestigious FIFA peace prize. We wouldn’t want him to develop an ego problem.

[marineland]

On 5/3/2026 at 5:02 PM, longview said:

Extremely unlikely. However, it would be awesome if he was to be added to Mount Rushmore ! ! !

A head of gold 🙂 

[The Nehor]

3 hours ago, marineland said:

A head of gold 🙂 

Then a stone is cut out of the mountain without hands (maybe Lincoln’s eye?) and smashes the gold head? I could get behind this.

[longview]

4 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Then a stone is cut out of the mountain without hands (maybe Lincoln’s eye?) and smashes the gold head? I could get behind this.

This is WAY out of sequence. Nebuchadnezzar's dream that was interpreted by Daniel was of the image that had gold head, silver chest, brass belly/thighs, iron legs, and feet part iron/part clay. 🤣

[The Nehor]

4 hours ago, longview said:

This is WAY out of sequence. Nebuchadnezzar's dream that was interpreted by Daniel was of the image that had gold head, silver chest, brass belly/thighs, iron legs, and feet part iron/part clay. 🤣

Yes, I was being deeply serious about that and was definitely suggesting this would be the literal fulfillment of prophecy so thanks for correcting me before I got it wrong and found myself damned for all eternity.