secondclasscitizen Posted July 2, 2021 Posted July 2, 2021 Does anyone know why the church is presenting a dead link for this essay? https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays/becoming-like-god?lang=eng
InCognitus Posted July 2, 2021 Posted July 2, 2021 19 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: Does anyone know why the church is presenting a dead link for this essay? https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays/becoming-like-god?lang=eng That's a very nice circular reference Hopefully they'll fix it soon. In the meantime you can get a working link from the Internet Archive page: https://web.archive.org/web/20210302130142/https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays/becoming-like-god?lang=eng
Calm Posted July 2, 2021 Posted July 2, 2021 (edited) I think it most likely a glitch that hasn’t been fixed yet as this was noticed by a friend a week ago or so and the Are Mormons Christians? essay had the same problem or they were linked together or something. Other friends otoh had working links. The Are Mormons Christians essay looks back online at least for me, so I am assuming the same will eventually happen with the Becoming like God essay. If there is a change coming, no doubt plenty of people saved the original for comparison. Edited July 2, 2021 by Calm
secondclasscitizen Posted July 2, 2021 Author Posted July 2, 2021 8 minutes ago, InCognitus said: That's a very nice circular reference Hopefully they'll fix it soon. In the meantime you can get a working link from the Internet Archive page: https://web.archive.org/web/20210302130142/https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays/becoming-like-god?lang=eng Thanks! Someone needs a new IT dept if it takes a week to get a link live again. I’m betting it is getting edited
secondclasscitizen Posted July 2, 2021 Author Posted July 2, 2021 3 minutes ago, Calm said: FYI, still available in Gospel Library app. Yep I just checked it there. I guess the public page on the church website is what has the dead link.
Calm Posted July 2, 2021 Posted July 2, 2021 (edited) 43 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: Thanks! Someone needs a new IT dept if it takes a week to get a link live again. I’m betting it is getting edited My understanding is they use a lot of interns that don’t always integrate what they do to update the site well with past updates, but I have no clue how good a source that was. I do have a nephew who used to be in charge of the website and back around 2005 when the site was much smaller, he said there was always a huge backlog of stuff waiting to be done…took about 6 months to get to most stuff up (I was whining to him they didn’t put a ward library database online, but left it to individuals to track and figure out how to set up beyond very basics). From what I have seen over the years I doubt that has changed much. They are always updating stuff, but there are also glitches that take awhile to change in my experience. Changes were announced in the Handbook that took months to get updated, for example. I need to get back to family get togethers so I can ask my nephew if the intern comment is accurate or not, assuming he still is involved any in that department. Edited July 3, 2021 by Calm 2
InCognitus Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 24 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: Thanks! Someone needs a new IT dept if it takes a week to get a link live again. I’m betting it is getting edited Yeah, hopefully they'll fix it before someone accuses us of changing our doctrine again. 2
secondclasscitizen Posted July 3, 2021 Author Posted July 3, 2021 13 hours ago, InCognitus said: Yeah, hopefully they'll fix it before someone accuses us of changing our doctrine again. Well it wouldn’t be the first time the church was accused of changing doctrine nor the first time it actually has changed doctrine.
Popular Post CV75 Posted July 3, 2021 Popular Post Posted July 3, 2021 15 hours ago, secondclasscitizen said: Does anyone know why the church is presenting a dead link for this essay? https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays/becoming-like-god?lang=eng It's not dead, just translated as it was becoming like God. 7
Kenngo1969 Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 I have two theories: It's a nefarious plot. Spoonerize the last two words of #1, and one gets closer to the truth: It's a plefarious not. Which do you think is correct, or is closer to the truth? 1
secondclasscitizen Posted July 3, 2021 Author Posted July 3, 2021 27 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said: I have two theories: It's a nefarious plot. Spoonerize the last two words of #1, and one gets closer to the truth: It's a plefarious not. Which do you think is correct, or is closer to the truth? Probably just incompetence. I just don’t rule out unannounced changes because that is a common practice.
Kenngo1969 Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 49 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: Probably just incompetence. I just don’t rule out unannounced changes because that is a common practice. So, if someone sets a perhaps-idiosyncratic (unrealistic? unfair?) standard for you to meet, and you don't meet it, in their judgment of you, you're OK if they skip past the myriad of other possibilities and go straight to "incompetence," hmm? Ooh-kay. To each, his or her own, I suppose. 3
TheTanakas Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 17 hours ago, Calm said: I think it most likely a glitch that hasn’t been fixed yet as this was noticed by a friend a week ago or so and the Are Mormons Christians? essay had the same problem or they were linked together or something. Other friends otoh had working links. The Are Mormons Christians essay looks back online at least for me, so I am assuming the same will eventually happen with the Becoming like God essay. If there is a change coming, no doubt plenty of people saved the original for comparison. Maybe they should rephrase the essay to "Becoming a god" as the previous Gospel Principles taught. https://ia800509.us.archive.org/27/items/GospelPrinciples1997/Gospel Principles 1997.pdf All good things come from God. Everything that he does is to help his children become like him—a god Pete
secondclasscitizen Posted July 3, 2021 Author Posted July 3, 2021 1 hour ago, Kenngo1969 said: So, if someone sets a perhaps-idiosyncratic (unrealistic? unfair?) standard for you to meet, and you don't meet it, in their judgment of you, you're OK if they skip past the myriad of other possibilities and go straight to "incompetence," hmm? Ooh-kay. To each, his or her own, I suppose. Sounds kinda like how the church treats doubters. No good reason other than they are lazy and want to sin. Nothing slaw considered, they are just wrong
OGHoosier Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 10 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: Sounds kinda like how the church treats doubters. No good reason other than they are lazy and want to sin. Nothing slaw considered, they are just wrong I am unfamiliar with the term "nothing slaw." Also the central point of disagreement is the belief that your interlocuter is wrong, so I'm not sure why this is controversial. 3
Kenngo1969 Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 48 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: Sounds kinda like how the church treats doubters. No good reason other than they are lazy and want to sin. Nothing slaw considered, they are just wrong Oh, I have my share of doubts, but I don't feel mistreated by "the Church" of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The Church of Jesus Christ isn't a monolith. It's not The Borg Hive Mind. There is a variety of people in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, each one with varying attitudes, perspectives, outlooks, and so on, so it's inaccurate to say that "the Church" treats anyone in any manner. It's an organization, and organizations are composed of their constituent members, in other words, people—humans. If I think the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints offers the best system for living, yet I see people who, perhaps, ought to know better deviate from that system, yes, I'm likely to have a certain opinion about the deviation, but it won't be driven by any desire to look down my nose at my fellow human beings. Just as easily, indeed, it could be driven by a desire for my fellow human beings to be able to live their best life, and I might believe, sincerely, that, in general, the Church of Jesus Christ offers people the best opportunity available to do that. Having said that, yes, each of us sees things, not as they are but, rather, as we are, and each of us must make his or her own decision about what tools might enable us to live our best life. I'm sure I'm judged (and perhaps I would come to believe that I'm judged unfairly) both by people inside of the Church of Jesus Christ and people outside of it. If someone were, overtly, to engage in such judgment, I might invite that person to "weed his or her own garden" and might quote Matthew 7:1-5. In any case, if someone is determined to sit in judgment of me, I don't have to accept the judgment: Still, I have a choice as to whether I will allow it to affect my outlook adversely or to allow the erroneous judgment of an individual, unfairly, to affect how I perceive an organization. Your judgments of employees or powers-that-be in the Church of Jesus Christ (a) incompetence or (b) attempting to hide something have no basis in fact to which you can point for support, assume facts not in evidence, and are unfair and ill founded in several other ways. You may have a legitimate beef with more than a few members of the Church of Jesus Christ, but that does not confer carte blanche upon you to pass the sort of judgment you pass here. 2
secondclasscitizen Posted July 3, 2021 Author Posted July 3, 2021 2 hours ago, OGHoosier said: I am unfamiliar with the term "nothing slaw." Also the central point of disagreement is the belief that your interlocuter is wrong, so I'm not sure why this is controversial. Nothing else.. typo
secondclasscitizen Posted July 3, 2021 Author Posted July 3, 2021 1 hour ago, Kenngo1969 said: Oh, I have my share of doubts, but I don't feel mistreated by "the Church" of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The Church of Jesus Christ isn't a monolith. It's not The Borg Hive Mind. There is a variety of people in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, each one with varying attitudes, perspectives, outlooks, and so on, so it's inaccurate to say that "the Church" treats anyone in any manner. It's an organization, and organizations are composed of their constituent members, in other words, people—humans. If I think the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints offers the best system for living, yet I see people who, perhaps, ought to know better deviate from that system, yes, I'm likely to have a certain opinion about the deviation, but it won't be driven by any desire to look down my nose at my fellow human beings. Just as easily, indeed, it could be driven by a desire for my fellow human beings to be able to live their best life, and I might believe, sincerely, that, in general, the Church of Jesus Christ offers people the best opportunity available to do that. Having said that, yes, each of us sees things, not as they are but, rather, as we are, and each of us must make his or her own decision about what tools might enable us to live our best life. I'm sure I'm judged (and perhaps I would come to believe that I'm judged unfairly) both by people inside of the Church of Jesus Christ and people outside of it. If someone were, overtly, to engage in such judgment, I might invite that person to "weed his or her own garden" and might quote Matthew 7:1-5. In any case, if someone is determined to sit in judgment of me, I don't have to accept the judgment: Still, I have a choice as to whether I will allow it to affect my outlook adversely or to allow the erroneous judgment of an individual, unfairly, to affect how I perceive an organization. Your judgments of employees or powers-that-be in the Church of Jesus Christ (a) incompetence or (b) attempting to hide something have no basis in fact to which you can point for support, assume facts not in evidence, and are unfair and ill founded in several other ways. You may have a legitimate beef with more than a few members of the Church of Jesus Christ, but that does not confer carte blanche upon you to pass the sort of judgment you pass here. Well the rollout of the essays themselves was done in a manner to not draw attention to them. The church historian at the time admitted so because they didn’t want to cause mass faith crisis or something like that. That is deceptive, it is dishonest and it is essentially hiding information. It’s one thing if they provided a year long educational curriculum to let us know about all the stuff that has been lied about but instead they chose to just silently stick it somewhere because the discipleship in the church is pretty much a lazy bunch and will never see it. They were right about that. Most members I know who I have mentioned the esssys to had never even heard of them and they have been out for what ? Seven years?! Yea the church is deceptive and I’m not off base on sssuming that whenever I feel like it. They have proven themselves readily willing to do that. Something about the truth not being very useful at times lol. Well the chickens are coming home to roost.
Calm Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 2 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: The church historian at the time admitted so because they didn’t want to cause mass faith crisis or something like that CFR
Calm Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 https://www.deseret.com/2016/12/26/20602980/essays-on-mormon-history-doctrine-find-new-visibility-in-official-app-sunday-school Quote The soft launch was deliberate. The essays had a practical purpose, leaders said. They intended the essays to help people find official answers to questions they might have when researching a specific topic online. And they were also meant to be widely used over time 1
Calm Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Calm said: CFR Scc, Are you thinking about this comment perhaps? Can’t get everything in, but think I got the relevant part…from an interview on Gospel Tangents… Don’t know how accurate the transcript is, here is the interview, sorry, don’t know time stamp for quote https://youtu.be/BS6hRBfYqHc Edited July 3, 2021 by Calm
secondclasscitizen Posted July 3, 2021 Author Posted July 3, 2021 18 minutes ago, Calm said: Scc, Are you thinking about this comment perhaps? Can’t get everything in, but think I got the relevant part…from an interview on Gospel Tangents… Don’t know how accurate the transcript is, here is the interview, sorry, don’t know time stamp for quote https://youtu.be/BS6hRBfYqHc Yes. Time stamp 4:00
Calm Posted July 3, 2021 Posted July 3, 2021 3 minutes ago, secondclasscitizen said: Yes. Time stamp 4:00 Thanks
secondclasscitizen Posted July 3, 2021 Author Posted July 3, 2021 15 minutes ago, Calm said: Thanks No problem. Some of these guys shouldn’t be allowed to talk to the press. Kinda reminds me of a certain Apostle and Prophet who lied on camera about our beliefs. Any question asked by a reporter you must assume they know the correct answer.
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