Texas Ranch Has a New Owner

[Ahab]

8 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I just saw a report on the news that a Mediterranean diet is best. Looked it up and this came up.

https://www.helpguide.org/articles/diets/the-mediterranean-diet.htm

Best according to some people, I suppose.  Some days I prefer to go without any animal flesh or dairy products, so that doesn't look the best to me.  I do like wine though as long as it isn't fermented.  And beer too, as fresh as possible.

One of my favorite foods from the East is hummus, with fresh soft hot bread like naan or some other type of pita bread.  I like it with fresh bell pepper strips and mushrooms and carrots and cucumbers and celery and grapes and apple slices and olives and other foods that are also good to eat all by themselves.

Fresh fruits and veggies are my favorite foods so I eat those most often and there is a huge variety to choose from so I seldom feel like I am eating the same things all of the time.  Beans are my second favorite food and there are a lot of kinds of beans to choose from too.

Lentil soup sounds good to me right now so I'll probably be asking my wife to make some more of that soon.  She makes it with a lot of red curry so it's more like an Indian dish and we usually have some fresh bread with that too.  We try to not eat too much bread, though.  Bread can be very fattening but it is also filling and just gosh darn tasty so we usually want to eat at least a little.  All kinds of good things to eat without having to resort to eating animal flesh like cow flesh and pig flesh and chicken flesh, etc.  Tastes good but not very good for us so better to eat just a little of that and on rare occasions than to eat a lot of it and often.

[Ahab]

23 minutes ago, rockpond said:

I assume the idea came from observing other carnivores in the animal kingdom.  Not sure how they figured out that cooking it could make it taste better (beef tartare and sushi, notwithstanding).

i think it's a common mistaken notion that we are carnivores.   I think we are actually herbivores who sometimes like to think and act like we are carnivores.  It's a very debatable topic though and I don't think we'll settle this now so go ahead and think whatever you want.

[rockpond]

18 minutes ago, Ahab said:

i think it's a common mistaken notion that we are carnivores.   I think we are actually herbivores who sometimes like to think and act like we are carnivores.  It's a very debatable topic though and I don't think we'll settle this now so go ahead and think whatever you want.

I wasn't commenting on whether or not humans are carnivores.

I was responding to the question of how the first humans to eat a cow came up with the idea to eat a cow:  by watching animals eat other animals.

[Calm]

23 minutes ago, Ahab said:

i think it's a common mistaken notion that we are carnivores.   I think we are actually herbivores who sometimes like to think and act like we are carnivores.  It's a very debatable topic though and I don't think we'll settle this now so go ahead and think whatever you want.

Technically we are omnivores.  Check out your teeth if you think otherwise.

[pogi]

16 hours ago, Ahab said:

Best according to some people, I suppose.  Some days I prefer to go without any animal flesh or dairy products, so that doesn't look the best to me. 

The Mediterranean diet doesn't require you to eat animal flesh or dairy products daily.  If your diet consists of mostly a plant based whole food diet and you only eat fish a few times/week, maybe some chicken once a week or less, and maybe a steak once a month or less, and keep your sweets consumption to a minimum, then you follow the Mediterranean diet.  It sounds to me like you already follow the diet without even realizing it.  I don't know about your sweet consumption however. 

[Ahab]

16 hours ago, rockpond said:

I wasn't commenting on whether or not humans are carnivores.

I was responding to the question of how the first humans to eat a cow came up with the idea to eat a cow:  by watching animals eat other animals.

Okay. I just took your comment at face value when you said: I assume the idea came from observing other carnivores in the animal kingdom.

... reading that as if you meant and were saying we are carnivores.

That is a reasonable explanation, but I still don't get it, though.  So you think someone watching an animal tear into another animal made that person hungry?  With all that blood dripping and flesh tearing away?  Like: Hmm, yummy!  I want to eat that, too!

Eh, maybe it's just me, but I don't think raw flesh dripping with blood is particularly appetizing.  I'd rather see some corn on the cob, or some other veggies that are ready to eat.  An apple or a pear or a plum hanging on a tree looks more appetizing to me.

[Ahab]

16 hours ago, Calm said:

Technically we are omnivores.  Check out your teeth if you think otherwise.

Like I said, the topic is highly debatable and debated and I don't think we're going to resolve that here.  Opinions vary and nobody speaks for everybody.  

Here's a taste of what we'd be in for if we decided to get into the debate:  https://en.wikiversity.org/wiki/Are_humans_omnivores_or_herbivores%3F

And here's a discussion on whether or not we should be vegan: https://en.wikiversity.org/wiki/Should_we_go_vegan%3F

And here is a picture of some teeth: 

Edited February 19, 2020 by Ahab

[rockpond]

9 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Okay. I just took your comment at face value when you said: I assume the idea came from observing other carnivores in the animal kingdom.

... reading that as if you meant and were saying we are carnivores.

That is a reasonable explanation, but I still don't get it, though.  So you think someone watching an animal tear into another animal made that person hungry?  With all that blood dripping and flesh tearing away?  Like: Hmm, yummy!  I want to eat that, too!

Eh, maybe it's just me, but I don't think raw flesh dripping with blood is particularly appetizing.  I'd rather see some corn on the cob, or some other veggies that are ready to eat.  An apple or a pear or a plum hanging on a tree looks more appetizing to me.

You're right -- I shouldn't have put the "other" in there, I had originally written something else and then edited it poorly.

You're also right that it's not appetizing.  But if you were sitting there in the middle of the winter starving to death because you couldn't find any plants to eat, then you might think:  "well, it worked for that animal."

 

And, while I think you could successfully make the argument that humans are better off as herbivores, the vast majority of us currently exist as omnivores.

[carbon dioxide]

On 2/13/2020 at 8:17 AM, Tacenda said:

Interesting, I wonder if it will be for cattle, too bad now many are going for the beef less hamburgers and going more vegan these days. Not to make this a "beef" about how the church spends money, I'd hoped it would go to maybe education institutions, homeless shelters etc. But I guess it could be a good investment moving forward as well and being good stewards will be a benefit.

The number of vegans is not increasing dramatically.  The biggest problem for beef is  not vegans but chickens.  Chicken is becoming the number meat that is consumed.   Fake meat has a small segment but its more expensive and high in sodium.  Also cattle is also needed in dairy stuff.  Ice Cream, milk, and cheese are are popular as ever.

Edited February 19, 2020 by carbon dioxide

[Ahab]

8 minutes ago, rockpond said:

You're also right that it's not appetizing.  But if you were sitting there in the middle of the winter starving to death because you couldn't find any plants to eat, then you might think:  "well, it worked for that animal."

Yes we can be very resourceful.  When I was a young child I ate some black wire wrapping because it looked a lot like some black licorice rope I had eaten recently.  I didn't eat very much of the wire though once I saw that it didn't taste like what I had eaten before.

So I went in search for something else to eat, thinking there was probably something better than the wire around, and maybe even some more licorice.  I don't remember what I found but I do remember those moments.  I was probably about 5 or 6.  Very naive.

[carbon dioxide]

On 2/13/2020 at 10:02 AM, pogi said:

If our goal is to feed the most people during a famine, beef production is not the way to do it.  

But it is the best food to eat during a famine.  If I am hungry, I rather have a steak or ribs than some lettuce.

[carbon dioxide]

30 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Like I said, the topic is highly debatable and debated and I don't think we're going to resolve that here.  Opinions vary and nobody speaks for everybody.  

Here's a taste of what we'd be in for if we decided to get into the debate:  https://en.wikiversity.org/wiki/Are_humans_omnivores_or_herbivores%3F

And here's a discussion on whether or not we should be vegan: https://en.wikiversity.org/wiki/Should_we_go_vegan%3F

And here is a picture of some teeth: 

Humans don't need big fangs to kill.  We use guns and bow and arrows to do the work.   The fangs are for killing, not chewing.

Edited February 19, 2020 by carbon dioxide

[carbon dioxide]

All this talk of beef and meat is inspiring me to use my 50 dollar gift card to Texas Road House. 

[Ahab]

7 minutes ago, carbon dioxide said:

But it is the best food to eat during a famine.  If I am hungry, I rather have a steak or ribs than some lettuce.

Maybe that's just because you don't know how to make a good salad.  Or don't have other good foods around that are ready for you to eat.

Have you tried a vegan burger yet, with the patty made from some plants rather than some parts of a cow?  With all the fixings and spices and sauces I can't really tell them apart.

Jack in the Box is one of my and my wife's favorite fast food restaurants.  That stuff they put in their tacos doesn't really count as meat, I don't think.  Seems more like beans to me, or at least I have had beans that tasted that good.  Kinda oily, though, because they fry their tacos, but fast and cheap.

Edited February 19, 2020 by Ahab

[rockpond]

3 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Jack in the Box is one of my and my wife's favorite fast food restaurants.  That stuff they put in their tacos doesn't really count as meat, I don't think.  Seems more like beans to me, or at least I have had beans that tasted that good.  Kinda oily, though, because they fry their tacos, but fast and cheap.

I also like Jack in the Box tacos.  While they do have TVP in the filling (textured vegetable protein made primarily with soy flour), they also have beef as the largest ingredient.

[Ahab]

13 minutes ago, rockpond said:

I also like Jack in the Box tacos.  While they do have TVP in the filling (textured vegetable protein made primarily with soy flour), they also have beef as the largest ingredient.

Okay. Good to know.  I thought maybe they used the same kind of thing as those meatless burgers use.  They probably could and still get the same taste but as of now, as you say, they don't do that to achieve that result. 

I do find that when I eat meat I like to eat veggies with it, though, and more veggies than meat, preferably.  Like a nice salad and baked potato, or some other kinds of fresh seasoned veggies on the side.  And I do like herbs a lot, too.  Where would we be without herbs and spices.

Edited February 19, 2020 by Ahab

[pogi]

2 hours ago, carbon dioxide said:

But it is the best food to eat during a famine.  If I am hungry, I rather have a steak or ribs than some lettuce.

I hope you enjoy your steak while others are starving with no food.  I doubt we will be faced with that false dichotomy of beef or lettuce though  

Edited February 19, 2020 by pogi

[Calm]

2 hours ago, carbon dioxide said:

 The fangs are for killing, not chewing.

Our front teeth (incisors and canines) are for biting and tearing, whether for killing or ripping apart into bite size chunks.  Our canines not being so prominent as to easily reach jugular or other veins of most animals probably indicates our ancestors more often bit into dead meat, either killing it ourselves or robbing it from those who did.

The back teeth with flat surfaces are for chewing.

https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2012/04/20/150817741/for-most-of-human-history-being-an-omnivore-was-no-dilemma

Edited February 19, 2020 by Calm

[MiserereNobis]

On 2/18/2020 at 4:38 PM, pogi said:

If you are serious, I think that is awesome.  I would recommend easing into it.  Start with meat-less Mondays then slowly add days to the week. 

Or you could go traditional Catholic style and have meatless Fridays and 40 days of meatless Lent.

I guess you could consider it the Catholic word of wisdom that medical science has shown is good for you  

[MiserereNobis]

On 2/18/2020 at 5:00 PM, Ahab said:

I do like wine though as long as it isn't fermented. 

You mean... grape juice?

Quote

And beer too, as fresh as possible.

Just to clarify, you drink beer? Against the teachings of your church?

[pogi]

4 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

Or you could go traditional Catholic style and have meatless Fridays and 40 days of meatless Lent.

I guess you could consider it the Catholic word of wisdom that medical science has shown is good for you  

I didn't know such a thing existed.  That is cool!

[Ahab]

5 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

You mean... grape juice?

It is made from the juice of grapes, yes, and sometimes the skin too.

5 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

Just to clarify, you drink beer? Against the teachings of your church?

Yes and No.  Beer is considered a mild drink as long as it isn't fermented or not fermented for very long.  It's difficult to brew beer without any fermentation, but it is possible and I have done it.  Think of root beers and ginger beers and what are called non-alcoholic beers and then realize that if you brew the beer yourself you can determine how much alcohol it will have in it.  I like beers because of their taste, not to get a buzz from drinking them. Much heartier and healthier than soda pop or sweetened fruit juices.

[MiserereNobis]

1 hour ago, pogi said:

I didn't know such a thing existed.  That is cool!

Prior to early 1970s it was the rule. It's why Catholics used to be called "fish eaters" (kinda derogatory). My parents remember that Fridays were meatless lunches in elementary school because of that. Then Lent was completely meatless.

They loosened up the rules in the early 1970s so that meatless Fridays are only during Lent. I think it was a bad change. It had been a long tradition and reminded us that Fridays were fast days because of Good Friday.

Most traditional Catholics keep the old rules still. I do and I bet 3DOP does, too.

[JAHS]

1 hour ago, MiserereNobis said:

Prior to early 1970s it was the rule. It's why Catholics used to be called "fish eaters" (kinda derogatory). My parents remember that Fridays were meatless lunches in elementary school because of that. Then Lent was completely meatless.

They loosened up the rules in the early 1970s so that meatless Fridays are only during Lent. I think it was a bad change. It had been a long tradition and reminded us that Fridays were fast days because of Good Friday.

Most traditional Catholics keep the old rules still. I do and I bet 3DOP does, too.

We always had fish sticks or toasted cheese sandwiches on Fridays in my grade school in Ogden Utah

[Calm]

9 minutes ago, JAHS said:

We always had fish sticks or toasted cheese sandwiches on Fridays in my grade school in Ogden Utah

Cinnamon rolls and chili on Fridays in Provo for the four months I was there (only meal I liked and I often just had the roll as they were massive).  Don't remember if the chili had meat in it or not.  It was a harsh time and that cinnamon roll was sometimes the highlight of my week, which is why I remember it.

Mom almost always packed roast beef sandwiches, so no meatless Fridays for me.  (We were staying with Grandma while in Provo, she was not a cook so no packed lunches).  Never ate Cafeteria at school outside of Grandma days, Mom was too concerned with healthy eating and costs.

Edited February 20, 2020 by Calm