Cosmo the Cougar is Gay

[hope_for_things]

These two articles are interesting to read and the comments section on Deseret News is especially interesting considering the wide diversity of opinions from supportive and accepting to judgmental and bigoted.  

I'm happy the DNews is publishing more inclusive sounding articles like this.  How long can the church continue to have discriminatory policies and conference talks from its top leaders with rhetoric that is hurtful, and at the same time recognize the need for inclusion and love of LGBTQ individuals who are a part of the community and who deserve respect, love and equal treatment.  This is a tension that I think can't continue on its current trajectory.  Comments & thoughts?  

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/900057600/guest-opinion-everyone-loved-me-as-cosmo-the-cougar-but-would-they-love-who-i-was-behind-the-mask-byu-lgbt-gay.html

https://www.sltrib.com/news/2019/02/26/calling-empathy-man-who/

 

[Duncan]

I think you mean the person playing Cosmo the Cougar is gay, not the character is gay-let's be honest does anyone who ever attends any kind of a game want to see a mascot of any sexual stripe engage in anything sexual?! my vote is nope! They are there to rile up the crowd not flirt with anyone or anything🤢

 

Edited February 26, 2019 by Duncan

[MustardSeed]

Lolol- Duncan. Well let’s see people debate THAT. 

[hope_for_things]

1 hour ago, Duncan said:

I think you mean the person playing Cosmo the Cougar is gay, not the character is gay-let's be honest does anyone who ever attends any kind of a game want to see a mascot of any sexual stripe engage in anything sexual?! my vote is nope! They are there to rile up the crowd not flirt with anyone or anything🤢

 

Ha!  Is it possible to determine the sexual orientation of a mascot?  Is Cosmo the character gay?  Since I haven’t seen the mascot ever engage in any acts that might inform someone of sexual orientation, I’m not sure how a person could know.  Maybe Cosmo is Bi.  

[Kenngo1969]

Removed, since people were simply using it as an excuse to virtue signal, anyway, which is not why I posted it.

Edited February 28, 2019 by Kenngo1969

[Storm Rider]

I am not my sexuality; never have been. I am me. I reject the entire gay agenda of forcing all of humanity to confuse them with their sexuality.  They are not their sexuality and never have been regardless of how much propaganda has been pounded in to the minds of humanity. It is not logical and does not hold water for any thinking person.  THINK about the crap the media  and activists of all stripes attempt to make us swallow their Kool-aid. So much of it is utter nonsense and false.

Humans wear masks naturally; very, very few individuals actually live in a way that their entire being is on display for all to see. This individual is presenting a straw man argument - "If they really knew who I was - would they hate me?" as if having one kind of sexuality is their sum total of being and they don't exist except in this one way.  Everything else about them is meaningless and subservient to their sexuality.  Gads, this is both ignorant of humans - everyone, as in each human, is a sinner and all fall short of Jesus Christ. Each human that has lived and is living recognizes their mask is on at some point; all fail themselves and their God and experience angst about God's love for them as well as the love of their parents, family, friends etc. if they actually knew who we really were. 

This is a nice attempt to shame members of the Church of Jesus Christ and shame the Church. The problem is that I don't buy any of it. Look, old mascot, you live your life. You approach your God in the same way that everyone else does. Your sins are between you and your God and no one else. No one is needed to validate your choice - you get your validation from the Holy Spirit. 

Don't try to force me to call your sins acceptable and I won't attempt to get you accept my sins are acceptable to God either. 

[MustardSeed]

I know people who would clutch their pearls.

[USU78]

1 hour ago, MustardSeed said:

Lolol- Duncan. Well let’s see people debate THAT. 

... here, hold my Dr Pepper

[california boy]

43 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

And?  

The only possible reason why "news" such as this could have any effect on me at all is if Cosmo-The-Cougar/The-Person-Who-Plays-Cosmo-The-Cougar were to hit on me.  (Frankly, despite the fact that I don't, ummmm, "swing" that way, given the fact that I've garnered the collective indifference of the Female of the Species in its entirety, a part of me might actually be flattered if that were to happen.  )  As for "hurtful rhetoric" from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and/or its leaders:

https://greatgourdini.wordpress.com/2016/08/30/cp-v-byu-p-byu-i-the-lds/

https://greatgourdini.wordpress.com/2016/10/19/alleged-anti-gay-slurs-at-byu/

https://greatgourdini.wordpress.com/2013/11/12/mormon-support-for-enda/.

Should we care because you're concerned that members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints think, "Omigosh!  He's gay!     He shouldn't be allowed to play Cosmo the Cougar/earn a living/go to BYU/get an education/be treated with basic human decency and dignity/ad infinitum/ad nauseam!"  Well, I don't think that, I know few, if any, members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saint who do think that, and if anyone were to express such sentiments in my hearing or in my circle of influence, I would correct him or her forthwith.

Do you really think that a gay person at BYU feels safe in revealing that he is gay?  Do you think it is just coincidence that this guy felt he couldn't say something about his orientation while he was attending BYU?  There is a strong reason why he waited until after he graduated.

I personally have found the Church to be a very hostile place once I came out as gay.  I had many friends in the ward when they all thought I was straight.  Once I came out, only 2 members from my entire ward ever contacted me again.  If you want me to be more specific in the experiences I had while growing up and being involved in the church for over 40 years, I would be glad to expand on the treatment I have received from members of the church. both in leadership positons and in the congregation. 

Reading your naively written comments you linked above, you clearly have no idea what you are talking about and can only see this issue on a very superficial level.  

Edited February 27, 2019 by california boy

[hope_for_things]

30 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

And?  

The only possible reason why "news" such as this could have any effect on me at all is if Cosmo-The-Cougar/The-Person-Who-Plays-Cosmo-The-Cougar were to hit on me.  (Frankly, despite the fact that I don't, ummmm, "swing" that way, given the fact that I've garnered the collective indifference of the Female of the Species in its entirety, a part of me might actually be flattered if that were to happen.  )  As for "hurtful rhetoric" from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and/or its leaders:

https://greatgourdini.wordpress.com/2016/08/30/cp-v-byu-p-byu-i-the-lds/

https://greatgourdini.wordpress.com/2016/10/19/alleged-anti-gay-slurs-at-byu/

https://greatgourdini.wordpress.com/2013/11/12/mormon-support-for-enda/.

Should we care because you're concerned that members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints think, "Omigosh!  He's gay!     He shouldn't be allowed to play Cosmo the Cougar/earn a living/go to BYU/get an education/be treated with basic human decency and dignity/ad infinitum/ad nauseam!"  Well, I don't think that, I know few, if any, members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saint who do think that, and if anyone were to express such sentiments in my hearing or in my circle of influence, I would correct him or her forthwith.

Considering that your very comments in this post demonstrate hurtful rhetoric it is not surprising that you aren’t aware of how the rhetoric by church leaders is also hurtful.  

As for treating LGBTQ individuals with the same basic human dignity that everyone deserves, I of course wholeheartedly agree, but unfortunately the very policies of the church and of BYU do not afford this kind of treatment.  

[california boy]

11 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

I am not my sexuality; never have been. I am me. I reject the entire gay agenda of forcing all of humanity to confuse them with their sexuality.  They are not their sexuality and never have been regardless of how much propaganda has been pounded in to the minds of humanity. It is not logical and does not hold water for any thinking person.  THINK about the crap the media  and activists of all stripes attempt to make us swallow their Kool-aid. So much of it is utter nonsense and false.

Humans wear masks naturally; very, very few individuals actually live in a way that their entire being is on display for all to see. This individual is presenting a straw man argument - "If they really knew who I was - would they hate me?" as if having one kind of sexuality is their sum total of being and they don't exist except in this one way.  Everything else about them is meaningless and subservient to their sexuality.  Gads, this is both ignorant of humans - everyone, as in each human, is a sinner and all fall short of Jesus Christ. Each human that has lived and is living recognizes their mask is on at some point; all fail themselves and their God and experience angst about God's love for them as well as the love of their parents, family, friends etc. if they actually knew who we really were. 

This is a nice attempt to shame members of the Church of Jesus Christ and shame the Church. The problem is that I don't buy any of it. Look, old mascot, you live your life. You approach your God in the same way that everyone else does. Your sins are between you and your God and no one else. No one is needed to validate your choice - you get your validation from the Holy Spirit. 

Don't try to force me to call your sins acceptable and I won't attempt to get you accept my sins are acceptable to God either. 

 

A perfect example why I find the church to be hostile to those that are gay and why this guy never came out when attending BYU.  Your whole post is laced with accusations of being gay equals sin.  The article said nothing about whether he was celibate or not.  

Have you ever been assumed to be sinning simply because you are not attracted to the same sex?  

And yes. when I came out in my ward, it seems that it didn't matter one bit to them the countless hours I served in leadership positions and in working with the youth.  Is all they now needed to know is that I was gay.  So yes, we do get defined by that ONE issue in our lives.. alot.

 

[Duncan]

1 hour ago, hope_for_things said:

Ha!  Is it possible to determine the sexual orientation of a mascot?  Is Cosmo the character gay?  Since I haven’t seen the mascot ever engage in any acts that might inform someone of sexual orientation, I’m not sure how a person could know.  Maybe Cosmo is Bi.  

That's what i'm saying! I hope you can't tell the sexuality of a mascot! 

[hope_for_things]

13 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

I am not my sexuality; never have been. I am me. I reject the entire gay agenda of forcing all of humanity to confuse them with their sexuality.  They are not their sexuality and never have been regardless of how much propaganda has been pounded in to the minds of humanity. It is not logical and does not hold water for any thinking person.  THINK about the crap the media  and activists of all stripes attempt to make us swallow their Kool-aid. So much of it is utter nonsense and false.

Humans wear masks naturally; very, very few individuals actually live in a way that their entire being is on display for all to see. This individual is presenting a straw man argument - "If they really knew who I was - would they hate me?" as if having one kind of sexuality is their sum total of being and they don't exist except in this one way.  Everything else about them is meaningless and subservient to their sexuality.  Gads, this is both ignorant of humans - everyone, as in each human, is a sinner and all fall short of Jesus Christ. Each human that has lived and is living recognizes their mask is on at some point; all fail themselves and their God and experience angst about God's love for them as well as the love of their parents, family, friends etc. if they actually knew who we really were. 

This is a nice attempt to shame members of the Church of Jesus Christ and shame the Church. The problem is that I don't buy any of it. Look, old mascot, you live your life. You approach your God in the same way that everyone else does. Your sins are between you and your God and no one else. No one is needed to validate your choice - you get your validation from the Holy Spirit. 

Don't try to force me to call your sins acceptable and I won't attempt to get you accept my sins are acceptable to God either. 

This saddens me greatly...  I almost feel the need to apologize for opening a thread that invites this kind of hurtful and ignorant commentary.  These are real people we’re talking about, people I love and people who are often the most at risk and marginalized in our society.  

If you are LGBTQ, please know that you are  loved and please know that your allies are here and we won’t stop educating and standing up for equality and dignity.  

[Duncan]

18 minutes ago, USU78 said:

... here, hold my Dr Pepper

and another thing, beverages are like 300 dollars at the sportsplace, if a mascot even touches me and it spills..........................☠️

[hope_for_things]

1 minute ago, Duncan said:

That's what i'm saying! I hope you can't tell the sexuality of a mascot! 

Agreed, and I would add that we shouldn’t even assume the masco is heterosexual.  Or cisgender.  Let the mascot be whatever they feel called to be.  

[Duncan]

1 minute ago, hope_for_things said:

Agreed, and I would add that we shouldn’t even assume the masco is heterosexual.  Or cisgender.  Let the mascot be whatever they feel called to be.  

i'll be honest what the sexuality is of a mascot has never crossed my mind until now!

[Kenngo1969]

OK.  I'll bow out then.  

[Kenngo1969]

California Boy, I'm sorry for the hurtful treatment you received in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.  I think your fire is misdirected.  If you were more willing to parse what I have said more carefully, I think you would find that I'm more of an ally than you give me credit for being, but I cannot force you to do that.  If you're determined to shoot the allies, I wonder what you will do when only the enemies are left, but that's your business. 

I'll bow out.  This will be my last post on the thread.  (Frankly, I don't bother posting much anyway, because this is usually what happens.)  I bear you no ill will.  I only wish you could say the same, but, again, that's your business.

[california boy]

17 minutes ago, Duncan said:

That's what i'm saying! I hope you can't tell the sexuality of a mascot! 

I think the issue might be more:  Would BYU choose someone who was openly gay to be its mascot or did he have to hide his orientation to be considered.

While being gay is not the only thing that definds a person who is attracted to the same sex, it can be the only thing that others judge about him when choosing someone to represent BYU.  And that is the reality of being gay in the church

Ovbiously the mascot itself is  orientation neutral.

[california boy]

21 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

California Boy, I'm sorry for the hurtful treatment you received in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.  I think your fire is misdirected.  If you were more willing to parse what I have said more carefully, I think you would find that I'm more of an ally than you give me credit for being, but I cannot force you to do that.  If you're determined to shoot the allies, I wonder what you will do when only the enemies are left, but that's your business. 

I'll bow out.  This will be my last post on the thread.  (Frankly, I don't bother posting much anyway, because this is usually what happens.)  I bear you no ill will.  I only wish you could say the same, but, again, that's your business.

When I read your links, what I saw was a complete lack of understanding to what the issue is about.  Can a gay person feel safe in attending BYU?  Is it always assumed that because a person is gay then they want to have sex in front of everyone on the football team?  For example, this is what you wrote:

Quote

I’m confused. Putting aside, for the moment, that certain behavior probably isn’t appropriate in any public place, are two lesbian cheerleaders from an opposing school going to feel “unwelcome” at BYU because they can’t make out during a game? Are two gay football players from an opposing school going to feel “unwelcome” because they cannot do that? If not, I’m afraid I don’t quite understand what the stances of BYU or of its sponsoring institution regarding chastity and marriage have to do with what athletic conference it belongs to (or not).

 

From the way you approached this subject in your linked articles, I don't think you do have any idea what the issue is. This is not about not being able to make out on the football field.   It is about a hostile evironment knowing that being openly gay may be the only thing BYU needs to know about you and because you are gay, as you have done here, it is assumed that you want to have some kind of sexual display on the football field.  You certainly would not make the kind of statement about a hetersexual couple.  

And it is about if a gay couple did kiss on the football field, there would be an issue. Why can't they do that?  Why would they feel unwelcomed?  Are straight couples allowed to feel welcome at BYU if they put their arm around the person they love and give them a peck on the cheek even if they are at a football game?

I am not picking on you, hopefully I am sharing my perspective on how you view this issue comes across.  

[Storm Rider]

2 hours ago, california boy said:

A perfect example why I find the church to be hostile to those that are gay and why this guy never came out when attending BYU.  Your whole post is laced with accusations of being gay equals sin.  The article said nothing about whether he was celibate or not.  

Have you ever been assumed to be sinning simply because you are not attracted to the same sex?  

And yes. when I came out in my ward, it seems that it didn't matter one bit to them the countless hours I served in leadership positions and in working with the youth.  Is all they now needed to know is that I was gay.  So yes, we do get defined by that ONE issue in our lives.. alot.

 

This is you jumping to conclusions not in evidence. I don't know your sins and you don't know mine. In fact, I don't care about your sins. I view them as personal between you and God. I also don't think anyone's sins are the business of any other individual. 

You are not your sexuality. You are you, a human being. Full stop. The only thing I believe is the responsibility of others is share the Good News of Jesus Christ born, crucified and resurrected. Your path in discipleship with Jesus Christ is yours and my path is mine. 

I will not define any human by their sins in the same way that I do not want to be defined by my sins. 

[Storm Rider]

2 hours ago, hope_for_things said:

This saddens me greatly...  I almost feel the need to apologize for opening a thread that invites this kind of hurtful and ignorant commentary.  These are real people we’re talking about, people I love and people who are often the most at risk and marginalized in our society.  

If you are LGBTQ, please know that you are  loved and please know that your allies are here and we won’t stop educating and standing up for equality and dignity.  

This is such drivel; such bleeding heart, liberal BS posing as a kind heart. You don't have a concept of God's love for his each of his children or his plan for them. You are lost in a mindf**t and cannot define up from down. You project your ignorance on others as you walk through darkness. Get thee behind me.

[california boy]

26 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

This is you jumping to conclusions not in evidence. I don't know your sins and you don't know mine. In fact, I don't care about your sins. I view them as personal between you and God. I also don't think anyone's sins are the business of any other individual. 

You are not your sexuality. You are you, a human being. Full stop. The only thing I believe is the responsibility of others is share the Good News of Jesus Christ born, crucified and resurrected. Your path in discipleship with Jesus Christ is yours and my path is mine. 

I will not define any human by their sins in the same way that I do not want to be defined by my sins. 

 

Never mind.  I wouldn't expect you to get what I am talking about.  

Edited February 27, 2019 by california boy

[Tacenda]

40 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

This is you jumping to conclusions not in evidence. I don't know your sins and you don't know mine. In fact, I don't care about your sins. I view them as personal between you and God. I also don't think anyone's sins are the business of any other individual. 

You are not your sexuality. You are you, a human being. Full stop. The only thing I believe is the responsibility of others is share the Good News of Jesus Christ born, crucified and resurrected. Your path in discipleship with Jesus Christ is yours and my path is mine. 

I will not define any human by their sins in the same way that I do not want to be defined by my sins. 

Why are you calling being a homosexual a sin?

Here's your quote: Don't try to force me to call your sins acceptable and I won't attempt to get you accept my sins are acceptable to God either. 

 

Edited February 27, 2019 by Tacenda

[kllindley]

2 hours ago, hope_for_things said:

This saddens me greatly...  I almost feel the need to apologize for opening a thread that invites this kind of hurtful and ignorant commentary.  These are real people we’re talking about, people I love and people who are often the most at risk and marginalized in our society.  

If you are LGBTQ, please know that you are  loved and please know that your allies are here and we won’t stop educating and standing up for equality and dignity.  

You mean, except all those LGBTQ who have testimonies of the Doctrine of the Restored Gospel. Because you aren't acting as my Ally. These kinds of comments make me feel the opposite of loved and supported.