Church Policy on Harassment, Stalking, etc.

Stargazer · January 24, 2018

Thought of something to add, but decided not to

.

Edited January 24, 2018 by Stargazer

MorningStar · February 3, 2018

After more than a month of stressing over this situation, the group of people who made the decision about this man's fate determined his actions were not sexual, so I rounded up the women and we made plans to wear all black. I indicated to someone that we were extremely angry and an emergency meeting was held. I spent 3 hours deflecting all of their crap, my friend quit dramatically during the meeting, and in the end they were glad we had the meeting. They had no idea just how upset we were because our communications were all done by email. So ridiculous. They went around and asked each one of us if we felt safe with him amongst us. We each answered, "NO." So now an appeal is starting and we will have a different panel. They will also have detailed info and hopefully they will be instructed to speak to us verbally. They are also exploring other reasons to boot him. DUH! Should have done that in the first place.

The words were flowing last night like I have never experienced before. I had no notes with me. They are used to seeing my funny side, but I went totally savage. In a polite way. Mostly.

Calm · February 3, 2018

Why didn't they just do it as soon as everyone said they didn't feel safe. It is not a constitutional government, for goodness sake.

Jeanne · February 3, 2018

Just go to the police...period. Take women with you...do it.

MorningStar · February 3, 2018

1 hour ago, Jeanne said:

Just go to the police...period. Take women with you...do it.

If he had groped me, I would have called the police that night. The victims have to report. I can't do it for them. They know once they take action, the danger increases. Frustrating!

Also, the two groping incidents happened at two different locations, so those two women don't have the luxury of reporting together for moral support if they choose to do so.

Edited February 3, 2018 by MorningStar

Jeanne · February 3, 2018

5 hours ago, MorningStar said:

If he had groped me, I would have called the police that night. The victims have to report. I can't do it for them. They know once they take action, the danger increases. Frustrating!

Also, the two groping incidents happened at two different locations, so those two women don't have the luxury of reporting together for moral support if they choose to do so.

I understand...it is just that I was feeling your frustration and I felt for you and others...it is not an easy black and white situation for any individual..You rock MorningStar!!

MorningStar · February 4, 2018

9 hours ago, Jeanne said:

I understand...it is just that I was feeling your frustration and I felt for you and others...it is not an easy black and white situation for any individual..You rock MorningStar!!

Thank you. I'm so upset. I so wish someone would press charges!

MorningStar · February 5, 2018

OK, question for everyone. If a 60ish-year-old man asks to take a picture of a woman's legs (in her late 20's to early 30's), are his motives sexual?

If yes, if the woman said yes because she was caught off guard and freaked out, is it still his fault for asking and still sexual harassment?

Calm · February 5, 2018

Why would any man want a picture of a woman's legs? Exclude medical doctors doing actual research or fashion designers getting data for how to structure clothing.

I can only think of one reason and I am usually very good at coming up with alternative scenarios to give people the benefit of the doubt.

There is no face, nothing to indicate individuality/personality. It is purely a physical representation of part of her body.

Serious question, is there any reason for some man to ask some woman for a picture of her legs besides him finding them physically and therefore sexually attractive?

------

If something is a reason before someone responds, it is a reason after someone responds.

If a person came into a room to steal something and the owner decided to give it to them instead, that doesn't mean the person's intent to come into the room is suddenly changed to coming there to get a gift.

Edited February 5, 2018 by Calm

MorningStar · February 5, 2018

I no longer worry about going to Hell for I am in it.

Storm Rider · February 5, 2018

11 hours ago, MorningStar said:

OK, question for everyone. If a 60ish-year-old man asks to take a picture of a woman's legs (in her late 20's to early 30's), are his motives sexual?

If yes, if the woman said yes because she was caught off guard and freaked out, is it still his fault for asking and still sexual harassment?

First, I think the question is beyond weird. No, I don't think it is primarily sexual - I think the sculpture Venus de Milo is great art, but I don't recognize any sexual gratification from looking admiring it. Now, having said that this has become a bizarre world in which we live and this chap may just have a fetish for women's legs and on the other hand he may just admire women's legs. The problem for me is asking a living person for permission to take a picture of their legs.

If asking permission has become sexual harassment then you know at that point that everyone has taken leave of their senses and women are looking to enter into a new puritanical era; the sexes will be separated; and women should wear burqas to protect themselves from the fiendish eyes of all men who are and can only be sexual perverts.

If adult women are asked for permission to have their picture taken and they are incapable of responding, "NO" then please remove the word adult. Have women truly become so small and weak that they are now children incapable of making a decision as basic as giving permission to have their picture taken? Said another way, if a male asks a female for permission to take their picture they are only capable of freaking out? Are women only capable of responding to other females?

If this is so, then it would seem that society should segregate women from men; do not allow women to work anywhere near men; and then all will be well. I do hope that you are beginning to see how silly this has become. There are unintended consequences when telling men that asking an adult female for permission is now considered sexual harassment. On some college campuses men are trained to actually ask for permission before they kiss, touch, etc. Based on the situation of this post it now appears that the mere act of asking for permission is too much for the all too delicate woman.

This is getting absurd and does a real injustice to actual, understandable situations of true sexual harassment.

Edited February 5, 2018 by Storm Rider

The Nehor · February 5, 2018

14 hours ago, MorningStar said:

OK, question for everyone. If a 60ish-year-old man asks to take a picture of a woman's legs (in her late 20's to early 30's), are his motives sexual?

If yes, if the woman said yes because she was caught off guard and freaked out, is it still his fault for asking and still sexual harassment?

Yes.

To the second I am not sure if it is sexual harassment but it is creepy as hell.

The Nehor · February 5, 2018

4 hours ago, Storm Rider said:

First, I think the question is beyond weird. No, I don't think it is primarily sexual - I think the sculpture Venus de Milo is great art, but I don't recognize any sexual gratification from looking admiring it. Now, having said that this has become a bizarre world in which we live and this chap may just have a fetish for women's legs and on the other hand he may just admire women's legs. The problem for me is asking a living person for permission to take a picture of their legs.

If asking permission has become sexual harassment then you know at that point that everyone has taken leave of their senses and women are looking to enter into a new puritanical era; the sexes will be separated; and women should wear burqas to protect themselves from the fiendish eyes of all men who are and can only be sexual perverts.

If adult women are asked for permission to have their picture taken and they are incapable of responding, "NO" then please remove the word adult. Have women truly become so small and weak that they are now children incapable of making a decision as basic as giving permission to have their picture taken? Said another way, if a male asks a female for permission to take their picture they are only capable of freaking out? Are women only capable of responding to other females?

If this is so, then it would seem that society should segregate women from men; do not allow women to work anywhere near men; and then all will be well. I do hope that you are beginning to see how silly this has become. There are unintended consequences when telling men that asking an adult female for permission is now considered sexual harassment. On some college campuses men are trained to actually ask for permission before they kiss, touch, etc. Based on the situation of this post it now appears that the mere act of asking for permission is too much for the all too delicate woman.

This is getting absurd and does a real injustice to actual, understandable situations of true sexual harassment.

You are also weird.

MorningStar · February 5, 2018

5 hours ago, Storm Rider said:

First, I think the question is beyond weird. No, I don't think it is primarily sexual - I think the sculpture Venus de Milo is great art, but I don't recognize any sexual gratification from looking admiring it. Now, having said that this has become a bizarre world in which we live and this chap may just have a fetish for women's legs and on the other hand he may just admire women's legs. The problem for me is asking a living person for permission to take a picture of their legs.

If asking permission has become sexual harassment then you know at that point that everyone has taken leave of their senses and women are looking to enter into a new puritanical era; the sexes will be separated; and women should wear burqas to protect themselves from the fiendish eyes of all men who are and can only be sexual perverts.

If adult women are asked for permission to have their picture taken and they are incapable of responding, "NO" then please remove the word adult. Have women truly become so small and weak that they are now children incapable of making a decision as basic as giving permission to have their picture taken? Said another way, if a male asks a female for permission to take their picture they are only capable of freaking out? Are women only capable of responding to other females?

If this is so, then it would seem that society should segregate women from men; do not allow women to work anywhere near men; and then all will be well. I do hope that you are beginning to see how silly this has become. There are unintended consequences when telling men that asking an adult female for permission is now considered sexual harassment. On some college campuses men are trained to actually ask for permission before they kiss, touch, etc. Based on the situation of this post it now appears that the mere act of asking for permission is too much for the all too delicate woman.

This is getting absurd and does a real injustice to actual, understandable situations of true sexual harassment.

A woman would only say yes to this because she's terrified of him because he brags about carrying concealed and goes off on crazy rants that combine Elohim and the F word. Women do whatever they have to to stay off his radar as one more woman who rejected him.

Storm Rider · February 5, 2018

1 hour ago, MorningStar said:

A woman would only say yes to this because she's terrified of him because he brags about carrying concealed and goes off on crazy rants that combine Elohim and the F word. Women do whatever they have to to stay off his radar as one more woman who rejected him.

Morningstar, I use my wife as an example when I think of women. There is not a doubt in my mind that if a man in church, a business environment, a social event, or one she met while shopping asked her for a picture of her legs she would not think two seconds before saying, "Absolutely Not!". She would not be freaked out to the point of saying, "yes", or "maybe another time", etc. It would be immediate and without any degree of guilt.

My daughter would answer in the same way. Then again, she has a permit to carry a pistol and often has it either in her purse or in her car. She is one that has consistently had males pay her compliments and she is experienced with telling them to flake off or just simply "NO".

Your response concerns me because it tells me that women when frightened or scare will not say NO, but will comply with any request a man give her. Are women that weak and incapable of communicating with men? Gads, what a terrible picture that is of what we are told are strong women.

In our home I was always surrounded by women I think of as independent, capable, and strong (as much as I hate the term). No, we must be talking about something else other than a woman being frightened by a jerk because he might have gun (hasn't shown at the time of the request, but just the fact that he has said in the past that he carries a pistol), or one that uses the F word, or one that rants.

Two women supported your comment, which I assume means that they agree that this type of response is acceptable for a woman. If this is actually the case there is no hope for these women to be in public around men whether they are crazy idiots or not. More importantly, they need to not leave the house until they can quickly, easily respond truthfully to requests from others, mostly men. This absolutely includes saying forcefully , "NO". It will keep them off the radar of jerks and clearly define their desires to others, including men.

MorningStar · February 5, 2018

39 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

Morningstar, I use my wife as an example when I think of women. There is not a doubt in my mind that if a man in church, a business environment, a social event, or one she met while shopping asked her for a picture of her legs she would not think two seconds before saying, "Absolutely Not!". She would not be freaked out to the point of saying, "yes", or "maybe another time", etc. It would be immediate and without any degree of guilt.

My daughter would answer in the same way. Then again, she has a permit to carry a pistol and often has it either in her purse or in her car. She is one that has consistently had males pay her compliments and she is experienced with telling them to flake off or just simply "NO".

Your response concerns me because it tells me that women when frightened or scare will not say NO, but will comply with any request a man give her. Are women that weak and incapable of communicating with men? Gads, what a terrible picture that is of what we are told are strong women.

In our home I was always surrounded by women I think of as independent, capable, and strong (as much as I hate the term). No, we must be talking about something else other than a woman being frightened by a jerk because he might have gun (hasn't shown at the time of the request, but just the fact that he has said in the past that he carries a pistol), or one that uses the F word, or one that rants.

Two women supported your comment, which I assume means that they agree that this type of response is acceptable for a woman. If this is actually the case there is no hope for these women to be in public around men whether they are crazy idiots or not. More importantly, they need to not leave the house until they can quickly, easily respond truthfully to requests from others, mostly men. This absolutely includes saying forcefully , "NO". It will keep them off the radar of jerks and clearly define their desires to others, including men.

My response would have been, "Why do you need a picture of my legs? What are you going to use it for?" And just put him on the spot in front of everyone. He probably has a pervert collage in an underground bunker.

Storm Rider · February 5, 2018

1 minute ago, MorningStar said:

My response would have been, "Why do you need a picture of my legs? What are you going to use it for?" And just put him on the spot in front of everyone. He probably has a pervert collage in an underground bunker.

Thank you - I think and I hope that most women would either respond as my wife or how you have just proposed. It is a wildly inappropriate request and outlandishly forward; I see no excuse for such a request. I want to believe that all women are capable of saying no to such requests regardless of who asks them.

MorningStar · February 5, 2018

13 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

Thank you - I think and I hope that most women would either respond as my wife or how you have just proposed. It is a wildly inappropriate request and outlandishly forward; I see no excuse for such a request. I want to believe that all women are capable of saying no to such requests regardless of who asks them.

I would also like for all women to say no, but if a woman is that scared of him, I would also like for her to not be blamed for his request. She didn't ask him to take a picture of her legs. He asked if he could. She had some cool looking tights on that day and that was an excuse for him to ask. She is kicking herself for not telling him know, but was so caught off guard and he is beyond bizarre.

Storm Rider · February 5, 2018

7 minutes ago, MorningStar said:

I would also like for all women to say no, but if a woman is that scared of him, I would also like for her to not be blamed for his request. She didn't ask him to take a picture of her legs. He asked if he could. She had some cool looking tights on that day and that was an excuse for him to ask. She is kicking herself for not telling him know, but was so caught off guard and he is beyond bizarre.

We all make mistakes and kick ourselves for making them even when we know better. If anything this individual needs to practice anew to say, "NO - HELL NO!!!" There is boorish behavior in the world and they will say almost anything. We each need to accept that fact and be prepared for how we might handle it. Our children need to understand how to handle such situations so that are empowered to say, "NO" also.

MorningStar · February 5, 2018

Just now, Storm Rider said:

We all make mistakes and kick ourselves for making them even when we know better. If anything this individual needs to practice anew to say, "NO - HELL NO!!!" There is boorish behavior in the world and they will say almost anything. We each need to accept that fact and be prepared for how we might handle it. Our children need to understand how to handle such situations so that are empowered to say, "NO" also.

Sadly, some women let him hold their babies because they have nice disease. I held my baby firmly to my chest and looked at him like, "Don't you even ask." And then when he looked at my older daughter recently like he was about to talk to her, not knowing who she was, he glanced at me, saw the look on my face, and realized she was mine. He changed his mind about talking to her. Our stupid organization thinks he's clueless. Nope. He sure knows I can't stand him and don't want him near me or my family. I'm sure if he goes postal, I'll be on his list. He's seriously a psycho.

Calm · February 6, 2018

17 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

We all make mistakes and kick ourselves for making them even when we know better. If anything this individual needs to practice anew to say, "NO - HELL NO!!!" There is boorish behavior in the world and they will say almost anything. We each need to accept that fact and be prepared for how we might handle it. Our children need to understand how to handle such situations so that are empowered to say, "NO" also.

"Boorish behaviour" is being insensitive or rude.

This is more than that.

juliann · February 6, 2018

7 hours ago, Storm Rider said:

Two women supported your comment, which I assume means that they agree that this type of response is acceptable for a woman. If this is actually the case there is no hope for these women to be in public around men whether they are crazy idiots or not. More importantly, they need to not leave the house until they can quickly, easily respond truthfully to requests from others, mostly men. This absolutely includes saying forcefully , "NO". It will keep them off the radar of jerks and clearly define their desires to others, including men.

It must be wonderful to not have to be afraid of women when you leave the house....like women have to worry about men. And I'm sure you have never been caught off guard. Or had anything at stake. Or just plain been afraid. Nope, you just know what needs to be done and every woman should feel just like you, who has never had to worry about a "crazy idiot" woman overpowering you or seeking revenge. You don't have a clue what it is like to be a woman in these situations but you think you can speak for all of those who have.

Calm · February 6, 2018

"Two women supported your comment, which I assume means that they agree that this type of response is acceptable for a woman. If this is actually the case there is no hope for these women to be in public around men whether they are crazy idiots or not. More importantly, they need to not leave the house until they can quickly, easily respond truthfully to requests from others, mostly men. This absolutely includes saying forcefully , "NO". It will keep them off the radar of jerks and clearly define their desires to others, including men."

Yeah, because stalkers are so well known for moving on as soon as their target tells them "No!"

juliann · February 6, 2018

8 minutes ago, Calm said:

"Two women supported your comment, which I assume means that they agree that this type of response is acceptable for a woman. If this is actually the case there is no hope for these women to be in public around men whether they are crazy idiots or not. More importantly, they need to not leave the house until they can quickly, easily respond truthfully to requests from others, mostly men. This absolutely includes saying forcefully , "NO". It will keep them off the radar of jerks and clearly define their desires to others, including men."

Yeah, because stalkers are so well known for moving on as soon as their target tells them "No!"

And stalkers never target powerful people, like movie stars and stuff.

Storm Rider · February 6, 2018

1 hour ago, juliann said:

It must be wonderful to not have to be afraid of women when you leave the house....like women have to worry about men. And I'm sure you have never been caught off guard. Or had anything at stake. Or just plain been afraid. Nope, you just know what needs to be done and every woman should feel just like you, who has never had to worry about a "crazy idiot" woman overpowering you or seeking revenge. You don't have a clue what it is like to be a woman in these situations but you think you can speak for all of those who have.

Juliann, you trot your little self back up to my comments and THEN READ THEM!!!! You have taken every single thing I said totally out of context and I resent it. The man that asked for such a picture was a stupid idiot. My WIFE AND DAUGHTER know how to respond to inappropriate requests.

Frankly, you don't have a friggin clue what I know, what I think, or anything else about me. Because YOU HAVE MADE ASSUMPTIONS out of your own PROJECTIONS of what you think a man thinks. Get a grip, READ FIRST and then comment.

Disgusting display of everything I hate about closed-minded feminists.

Sign In

Church Policy on Harassment, Stalking, etc.

Recommended Posts

Stargazer

MorningStar

Calm

Jeanne

MorningStar

Jeanne

MorningStar

MorningStar

Calm

MorningStar

Storm Rider

The Nehor

The Nehor

MorningStar

Storm Rider

MorningStar

Storm Rider

MorningStar

Storm Rider

MorningStar

Calm

juliann

Calm

juliann

Storm Rider

Recently Browsing 0 members

Activity

Browse