Thinking Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 6 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: Are there any choices your child might make that would not be OK with you and that would incline you to stand in his way? Of course, but let's not derail the thread. 6 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: I guess the point of my question is that there are some matters that some parents might regard as far more serious than having a child go out for the basketball team when you hoped he would take concert band instead. Currently my son is choosing to be celibate and active LDS. I am not trying to convince him to leave the LDS Church. When he sang with an institute choir at general conference, I (and my wife) went and supported him. If he chooses to be openly gay, I will support that too, and welcome his partner into my life. 4
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 8 minutes ago, Thinking said: Of course, but let's not derail the thread. Currently my son is choosing to be celibate and active LDS. I am not trying to convince him to leave the LDS Church. When he sang with an institute choir at general conference, I (and my wife) went and supported him. If he chooses to be openly gay, I will support that too, and welcome his partner into my life. You have acknowledged that there are some choices a child might make that you as a parent could not support or abide. For some parents, a choice by a child to engage in homosexual behavior would fit in that category. That's all I'm saying. 1
rockpond Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 6 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: You have acknowledged that there are some choices a child might make that you as a parent could not support or abide. For some parents, a choice by a child to engage in homosexual behavior would fit in that category. That's all I'm saying. You don't have to answer this because it is a personal thing and hypothetical, but if you had a child who chose to enter into a same-gender marriage what would "not supporting" them look like? Thinking said that he would still welcome the child's partner into their life. Would you not do that?
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 2 minutes ago, rockpond said: You don't have to answer this because it is a personal thing and hypothetical, but if you had a child who chose to enter into a same-gender marriage what would "not supporting" them look like? Thinking said that he would still welcome the child's partner into their life. Would you not do that? Suppose you tell me what "supporting" the child or "welcom[ing] the child's partner into their life" would look like.
Jeanne Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 9 hours ago, Calm said: I have never read that as promising happiness in the here and now, though it can happen. The "might" always seemed future tense though in the sense of a state of being or a possession rather than the temporary, often momentary happiness, even joy we experience in mortality. You would need to define "happiness" in terms of length and intensity, I think, before you can start comparing your experience to others. I for one do not believe that joy is identical to happiness, I see joy as something more sublime, more enlightening and uplifting than happiness. Godly perhaps. I think that a lot of us confuse happiness with content. I am content and that is okay. The joy??? When kids are born..! Some distinct memories..but there is a fine line between happiness and content. Hope to find JOY in that other world!! 1
Jeanne Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 3 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: Suppose you tell me what "supporting" the child or "welcom[ing] the child's partner into their life" would look like. I have done this. It is just like accepting another daughter/son into your family. My stepson's partner of 7 years was my son! 1
rockpond Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 5 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: Suppose you tell me what "supporting" the child or "welcom[ing] the child's partner into their life" would look like. Treating them as the equal to your other childrens' opposite sex spouses. 1
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 (edited) 17 minutes ago, rockpond said: Treating them as the equal to your other childrens' opposite sex spouses. No, I couldn't do this. People who engage in homosexual behavior morally corrupt one another thereby. I could not approve of that any more than I would approve of individuals supporting one another in the procurement and use of crack cocaine. Edited July 25, 2016 by Scott Lloyd 1
The Nehor Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 10 hours ago, california boy said: Oh I never knew that. I.thought we were promised happiness on earth too. Am I rare in finding happiness here We are told to seek it and to 'be of good cheer' and that we will find a kind of heavenly peace but there is no promise of any kind of settled happiness. I have some but not as much as I would like. 2
The Nehor Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 9 hours ago, thatjimguy said: You know, how much of this stems from the idea that the Celestial Kingdom is the only thing worth shooting for? I'm not trying to belittle it, but didn't Joseph Smith syat the other kingdoms were so terrific we would die to get to them? For that matter, although we say we all want the Celestial kingdom, hasn't past leaders state that many Mormons aren't going there anyway? Also, I just read an except of many passages from leaders stating that there will be no chance to progress after this life anyway. So considering all the possibility of not making it anyway, why place so much stress on gays about not making it. Chances are we aren't either. Yes, but I am going there.
The Nehor Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 (edited) 9 hours ago, thatjimguy said: On a side thought.. Isn't Jesus' yoke supposed to be light? What is it about LDS thinking that makes it so stressful that suicide is a possible answer to some? I've heard critics talk of us having an "impossible gospel". Is it LDS society that has it wrong? If so, what are we missing in the scriptures or teachings that would tell us to "lighten up"? It is light. My spiritual obligations to God weigh less heavily on me then duty to others, my employer, loneliness from being single, etc. it is just not the only yoke I wear. Edited July 25, 2016 by The Nehor 1
Jeanne Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 45 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: No, I couldn't do this. People who engage in homosexual behavior morally corrupt one another thereby. I could not approve of that any more than I would approve of individuals supporting one another in the procurement and use of crack cocaine. It would be your loss.
rockpond Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 3 minutes ago, Jeanne said: It would be your loss. I can't imagine why gay members of this church struggle when there are devoted members like Scott who compare their marriages to the procurement and use of crack cocaine. 3
Jeanne Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 1 minute ago, rockpond said: I can't imagine why gay members of this church struggle when there are devoted members like Scott who compare their marriages to the procurement and use of crack cocaine. It speaks volumes of a certain mindset. My stepson lost his partner almost 3 years ago..suicide. So...I feel more than confident in repeating..It is your loss. 1
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jeanne said: It would be your loss. The loss would be having a son or daughter engaging in a lifestyle amounting to a grave violation of the laws of God. I would continue to love the child and show that love however I could, but the circumstance would bring a severe sense of grief. Edited July 25, 2016 by Scott Lloyd
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 54 minutes ago, rockpond said: I can't imagine why gay members of this church struggle when there are devoted members like Scott who compare their marriages to the procurement and use of crack cocaine. You set me up. I merely gave that as an example (of which there are many) of behavior that would be unacceptable to me as a parent. Any form of sexual immorality would fit into that category for me.
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 55 minutes ago, Jeanne said: It speaks volumes of a certain mindset. My stepson lost his partner almost 3 years ago..suicide. So...I feel more than confident in repeating..It is your loss. So there you have it. One cannot publicly disapprove of homosexual behavior without being seen as a contributor to suicide. Such is the tyranny of political correctness that hallmarks our age. 2
rockpond Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 4 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: You set me up. I merely gave that as an example (of which there are many) of behavior that would be unacceptable to me as a parent. Any form of sexual immorality would fit into that category for me. I asked you a question. That isn't setting you up. You chose your comparison.
rockpond Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 2 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: So there you have it. One cannot publicly disapprove of homosexual behavior without being seen as a contributor to suicide. Such is the tyranny of political correctness that hallmarks our age. That isn't what Jeanne said. Read more carefully. 1
Jeanne Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 1 minute ago, Scott Lloyd said: So there you have it. One cannot publicly disapprove of homosexual behavior without being seen as a contributor to suicide. Such is the tyranny of political correctness that hallmarks our age. My thoughts to you have nothing to do with my stepson's suicide. I am just pointing out that you lose..by not loving others. Gay or not..my stepson isn't even LDS. This is just pointing out that we should all love one another..quit judging and be more understanding. Actually, my concern was for you Scott..how many good people have you turned away in your life because they don't quite meet up to your expectations?? You lose because they have value and contributions they can add to your life!
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 (edited) 6 minutes ago, rockpond said: That isn't what Jeanne said. Read more carefully. She spoke of "a certain mindset," alluding to me. Then she pulled the suicide card. This was right after you hectored me for my crack cocaine example after setting me up. It all sounds pretty vindictive to me. Edited July 25, 2016 by Scott Lloyd 1
Scott Lloyd Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 5 minutes ago, Jeanne said: My thoughts to you have nothing to do with my stepson's suicide. I am just pointing out that you lose..by not loving others. What does disapproving of homosexual behavior have to do with loving others? Or, to put it another way, cannot one love others without approving of homosexual behavior?
Jeanne Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 4 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: What does disapproving of homosexual behavior have to do with loving others? Or, to put it another way, cannot one love others without approving of homosexual behavior? You just asked the very question I asked pretty much.. you can disapprove and still love..but your answer above didn't convey that.
rockpond Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 11 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: She spoke of "a certain mindset," alluding to me. Then she pulled the suicide card. This was right after you hectored me for my crack cocaine example after setting me up. It all sounds pretty vindictive to me. One cannot mention that suicide of a loved one without it being "pulling the suicide card"? She was sharing her experience and encouraging love. I didn't set you up at all. I asked a question because I was sincerely curious as to your example. You chose your response and I assume it is an accurate reflection of your feelings but you can change your response if you'd like.
rockpond Posted July 25, 2016 Posted July 25, 2016 11 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: What does disapproving of homosexual behavior have to do with loving others? Or, to put it another way, cannot one love others without approving of homosexual behavior? It might be hard for someone to feel loved by you when you are comparing their marriage to the procurement and use of cocaine. 2
Recommended Posts