savedwheat Posted January 30, 2016 Author Posted January 30, 2016 Just now, Jim Stiles said: The gospel is offered freely to the elect, because only a regenerated persons is aware of their own sinfulness. The traditional LDS theology of forgiveness (after all you can do) is given in the Miracle of Forgiveness by Spencer W. Kimball. https://archive.org/stream/MiracleOfForgiveness/MoF_djvu.txt Jim Stiles realize you are not a Christian, because the gospel is offered to everyone, but your god can't do that. It's not true that a regenerated person is only aware of sinfulness. People come to Christ because they are intimately aware of their sinfulness and receive the Savior. God pleads with a sinner to believe in Him, so it would be sadistic if he could not respond to God's saving grace.
Jim Stiles Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 3 minutes ago, savedwheat said: Jim Stiles realize you are not a Christian, because the gospel is offered to everyone, but your god can't do that. It's not true that a regenerated person is only aware of sinfulness. People come to Christ because they are intimately aware of their sinfulness and receive the Savior. God pleads with a sinner to believe in Him, so it would be sadistic if he could not respond to God's saving grace. Go read a book. http://www.cprf.co.uk/pamphlets/furtherobjectionstofreeoffer.htm#.VqwsINQrIUQ
savedwheat Posted January 30, 2016 Author Posted January 30, 2016 I read the Bible, twice. You didn't answer to your sadistic god.
JLHPROF Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 1 hour ago, Jim Stiles said: Says who? The actual word Trinity was first used by Tertullian. Formal Trinitarian Greetings were used in 1st century church worship. So he was the first to be wrong? A quick google of his teachings show that trinitarian beliefs weren't his only error.
JLHPROF Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 5 minutes ago, savedwheat said: I read the Bible, twice. Got you beat. Keep reading, and maybe you'll finally get it right.
savedwheat Posted January 30, 2016 Author Posted January 30, 2016 (edited) 6 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: Got you beat. Keep reading, and maybe you'll finally get it right. Still couldn't find anything in the Bible about you having always existed alongside God, that God was not alone from everlasting, that there were gods and material beside God, that God is not omnipresent/omnipotent/omniscient, non-OSAS, salvation by works, that Jesus didn't create all things, and Jesus is not the Alpha & Omega and the great I AM, and that Joseph Smith saw the Father when the Bible says God the Father can't be seen since He is spirit only. I think an 8 year old can understand why not you? Let me know. Edited January 30, 2016 by savedwheat
JLHPROF Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 4 minutes ago, savedwheat said: that God was not alone from everlasting, non-OSAS salvation by works, that Jesus didn't create all things and that Joseph Smith saw the Father when the Bible says God the Father can't be seen since He is spirit only. At the very least you've been shown all of these, and you ignore the Bible in favor of medieval creeds. All of these are in the Bible. Keep reading until you can see what God and Christ are actually saying instead of the same old errors. And get back to me when you are ready to stop ignoring the Bible.
savedwheat Posted January 30, 2016 Author Posted January 30, 2016 I am glad you couldn't show any. Therefore, one must conclude it is pride thinking you always existed in the past and just an elaborate scheme to reject and rebel against God and go to Hell. Not sure how you could have always existed before time and space since your very being requires the dimensions of time and space.
Anakin7 Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 We feel that you hear and hear not, see and see not. There is an Armada of Biblical/Christian materials that support our positions. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7
Jim Stiles Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 59 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: At the very least you've been shown all of these, and you ignore the Bible in favor of medieval creeds. All of these are in the Bible. Keep reading until you can see what God and Christ are actually saying instead of the same old errors. And get back to me when you are ready to stop ignoring the Bible. I am unaware of the part of the Bible that says that a prophet can marry anyone he wants to. Please tell me about that section.
savedwheat Posted January 30, 2016 Author Posted January 30, 2016 Did you know that Mormons teach that Jesus was born in Jerusalem which is several miles away from where Jesus was born in Bethlehem? Did you know that Mormons teach there were cows in the Americas 600 BC? Did you know Mormons taught being black is a sin? Did you know Mormons teach that you can become white if you are black if you stop sinning? The Rosetta Stone showed Joseph Smith was a liar about an Egyptian burial. It was not a human sacrifice. They claim Abraham wrote the book of Abraham and facsimile #1 was dated to 100 BC which was2000 years after Abraham. So much fraud. Mormons say Mary was exceedingly white and fair. Which is not common in Israel. I guess that is where the word fair is used lots on websites for Mormons. Mormons believe blacks are from the cursed seed of Cain, but there is no mention of that in the Bible. That's why you hear Mormons use the word bigotry lots because they are preemptively using that word because they are bigots. Moses married an Ethiopian women. Mormons teach Jesus is the brother of Satan. The Bible says Jesus created Lucifer. Col. 1.15 [Col 1:15-16 KJV] 15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: 16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: Jesus is incarnated God that's the whole point that God entered His creation. In Mormon temples you can baptize for the dead, but what about all those people whose records are lost? How fair is that? No baptism for the dead in the Bible. What a waste of time. All those in 3rd world countries go to Hell? because they didn't keep good records? All this appeals to the pride of man. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19EMjOLCIGo
Jim Stiles Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 1 hour ago, JLHPROF said: At the very least you've been shown all of these, and you ignore the Bible in favor of medieval creeds. All of these are in the Bible. Keep reading until you can see what God and Christ are actually saying instead of the same old errors. And get back to me when you are ready to stop ignoring the Bible. The ecumenical creeds date to antiquity, not medieval times. Everything in the ecumenical creeds have their antecedent in the Ante-Nicene Fathers.
Jim Stiles Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 5 minutes ago, Anakin7 said: We feel that you hear and hear not, see and see not. There is an Armada of Biblical/Christian materials that support our positions. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7 Where is this Armada? If you cannot show it, then it probably does not exist outside the fevered imagination of Joseph Smith Jr. When Americans say it is in the Bible and do not give a citation, 99.99% of the time, it is not in the Bible. "God helps those who help themselves" is not in the Bible.
Calm Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 2 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: Formal Trinitarian Greetings were used in 1st century church worship. If you mean using the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, LDS use the same. Would you define as Trinitarians?
Calm Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 (edited) Savedwheat, may I suggest you read up on the subject of Baptism for the Dead. For example, see "The Work of the Church" section here: https://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-45-the-millennium?lang=eng Also the Jerusalem thing...you should lose it. http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Mormon/Anachronisms/Biblical/Jerusalem_vs_Bethlehem There are reasonable criticisms of the LDS faith from those who believe in a Trinity. You don't need to resort to ones that are nonsense. Edited January 30, 2016 by Calm
Anakin7 Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 9 minutes ago, Jim Stiles said: Where is this Armada? If you cannot show it, then it probably does not exist outside the fevered imagination of Joseph Smith Jr. When Americans say it is in the Bible and do not give a citation, 99.99% of the time, it is not in the Bible. "God helps those who help themselves" is not in the Bible. It is not a place, but a description of multiplicity. Please no corrupt communications [fevered]. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7
Anakin7 Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 Actualy it does we help ourselves to accept/access/activate True Grace so God Helps us. Client/Patron. In His eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7
savedwheat Posted January 30, 2016 Author Posted January 30, 2016 The Bible does not support baptism for the dead, nor can you find any support for it either. Dead people have already decided where they want to spend eternity either heaven or hell.
savedwheat Posted January 30, 2016 Author Posted January 30, 2016 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Calm said: Also the Jerusalem thing...you should lose it. What's a Jerusalem thing? Are you referring to Smith claimed the New Jerusalem would be built in west Missouri within a generation and never happened. Nor did he even get the dimensions right. Missouri is about 264 x 264 miles. Rev. 21 says it is 1379 x 1379 miles. And he said Jesus would return in 1891. Don't recall Jesus returning then. He was way off. Edited January 30, 2016 by savedwheat
Jim Stiles Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 5 minutes ago, Calm said: If you mean using the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, LDS use the same. Would you define as Trinitarians? No, the LDS is not trinitarian. It is not even monotheistic. Joseph Smith Jr. said the following words on 10 March 1844: Quote In order to understand the subject of the dead, for the consolation of those who mourn for the loss of their friends, it is necessary that we should understand the character and being of God, and how he came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity, I will refute that idea, and will take away and do away the vail, so that you may see. Joseph Smith Jr. forfeited any claim of his new church to Christianity, as expressed in the Old and Testaments, when he said these words.
JLHPROF Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 1 minute ago, Jim Stiles said: No, the LDS is not trinitarian. It is not even monotheistic. Joseph Smith Jr. said the following words on 10 March 1844: Joseph Smith Jr. forfeited any claim of his new church to Christianity, as expressed in the Old and Testaments, when he said these words. And praise God that he did. Truth beats false traditions.
Calm Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 (edited) Quote Lamentations 4:7] 7 Her Nazarites were purer than snow, they were whiter than milk, they were more ruddy in body than rubies, their polishing was of sapphire: Quote 10 My beloved is white and ruddy, the chiefest among ten thousand. https://www.lds.org/scriptures/ot/song/5.10?lang=eng#9 Quote 7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow. https://www.lds.org/scriptures/ot/ps/51.7?lang=eng#6 Quote 10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. https://www.lds.org/scriptures/ot/dan/12.10?lang=eng#9 PS: the actual description is "exceedingly fair and white" https://www.lds.org/scriptures/bofm/1-ne/11.13?lang=eng#12 Edited January 30, 2016 by Calm
Jim Stiles Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 6 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: And praise God that he did. Truth beats false traditions. So the LDS church is finally going to accept the proposition that none of their unique doctrines and theology agrees with the Bible? OK.
JLHPROF Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 2 minutes ago, Jim Stiles said: So the LDS church is finally going to accept the proposition that none of their unique doctrines and theology agrees with the Bible? OK. Hahaha...the day that I am a spokesman for the whole Church really will be the day the Church goes astray. 1
Raingirl Posted January 30, 2016 Posted January 30, 2016 2 hours ago, savedwheat said: Did you know that Mormons teach that Jesus was born in Jerusalem which is several miles away from where Jesus was born in Bethlehem? Did you know that Mormons teach there were cows in the Americas 600 BC? Did you know Mormons taught being black is a sin? Did you know Mormons teach that you can become white if you are black if you stop sinning? The Rosetta Stone showed Joseph Smith was a liar about an Egyptian burial. It was not a human sacrifice. They claim Abraham wrote the book of Abraham and facsimile #1 was dated to 100 BC which was2000 years after Abraham. So much fraud. Mormons say Mary was exceedingly white and fair. Which is not common in Israel. I guess that is where the word fair is used lots on websites for Mormons. Mormons believe blacks are from the cursed seed of Cain, but there is no mention of that in the Bible. That's why you hear Mormons use the word bigotry lots because they are preemptively using that word because they are bigots. Moses married an Ethiopian women. Mormons teach Jesus is the brother of Satan. The Bible says Jesus created Lucifer. Col. 1.15 [Col 1:15-16 KJV] 15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: 16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: Jesus is incarnated God that's the whole point that God entered His creation. In Mormon temples you can baptize for the dead, but what about all those people whose records are lost? How fair is that? No baptism for the dead in the Bible. What a waste of time. All those in 3rd world countries go to Hell? because they didn't keep good records? All this appeals to the pride of man. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19EMjOLCIGo So...if I type something up about your "religion" on a piece of paper and take a picture and post it on the internet...that makes it true? Cool. I think you are probably worse than simply ignorant about Mormonism (or any religion, for that matter). More and more, your rantings show a tendency toward plain old bigotry.
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