How To Identify A Nephite City.

[helaman38]

Under a closed topic poster Stargazer asked the following question:

 

It is clear that Volgadon's point is very important.  Can someone come up with viable criteria for identifying a Nephite city?

 

 

 

[Ahab]

Under a closed topic poster Stargazer asked the following question:

 

It is clear that Volgadon's point is very important.  Can someone come up with viable criteria for identifying a Nephite city?

Well, for one thing, Nephi or some of his descendants will claim it as one of their cities

[Anijen]

identifying a Nephite city

Well Nephi means goodly, therefore since Nebraska is the good life, and Mormons used handcarts, and Wayne means wagonmaker whom the people of Wayne must have made the a fore mentioned handcarts, thus Wayne, Nebraska must be a Nephite city.

 

Easy cheesy Japaneesy

 

As a citizen of Wayne Nebraska that would make me a Nephite, thus I become a primary source and I declare Wayne a Nephite city. Thank you I'll be here all day.

Edited August 28, 2013 by Anijen

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Under a closed topic poster Stargazer asked the following question:

 

It is clear that Volgadon's point is very important.  Can someone come up with viable criteria for identifying a Nephite city?

You will see a sign from heaven saying...Zarahemla this way.

[cursor]

Anijen ... your avatar projects my immediate reaction to your last post.

 

In all seriousness, if "Nephi" means "good life," ... I'll tell ya where I'm gonna be this Friday PM ...

http://www.goodlifebrewing.com/index.html

 

... dude, clearly Zarahemla is in Oregon!

 

I'll see y'all in Zarahemla in a coupla days!

Edited August 28, 2013 by cursor

[helaman38]

Well, for one thing, Nephi or some of his descendants will claim it as one of their cities

 

CFR

[Anijen]

Zarahemla is clearly not in Oregon, since Oregonians came from Atlantis which is really quite funny because the people who were left in Atlantis did not know where they went and assumed they were participants of the first rapture however, I digress. The Oregonians all were named after giving up vital organs (mainly their hearts) After leaving their organs mostly south of Oregon in a placed called San Francisco, they then migrated heartlessly to Oregon and that is why the Sea Hawks lose all the time disappointing their fans. Those heartless Oregonians....

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

Under a closed topic poster Stargazer asked the following question:

 

It is clear that Volgadon's point is very important.  Can someone come up with viable criteria for identifying a Nephite city?

So tell us. How would one itdentify a Nephite land or city?

 

Let me guess, some obscure source of JS saying it once upon a time? 

Edited August 28, 2013 by Mola Ram Suda Ram

[Ahab]

CFR

What?  You don't think Nephi or some of his descendants would tell you if a city was one of their cities?  Who else would you ask?

[ksfisher]

Well Nephi means goodly, therefore since Nebraska is the good life, and Mormons used handcarts, and Wayne means wagonmaker whom the people of Wayne must have made the a fore mentioned handcarts, thus Wayne, Nebraska must be a Nephite city.

 

Easy cheesy Japaneesy

 

As a citizen of Wayne Nebraska that would make me a Nephite, thus I become a primary source and I declare Wayne a Nephite city. Thank you I'll be here all day.

 

This would convince me except that I know that Nephites wrote in Hebrew (or was that some sort of Egyptian)...anyway, that sign is clearly not in Hebrew or Egyptian or even reformed Pig Latin.  You'd have to get up pretty early in the morning to pull that one over on me. 

[helaman38]

:help:

[Ahab]

This would convince me except that I know that Nephites wrote in Hebrew (or was that some sort of Egyptian)...anyway, that sign is clearly not in Hebrew or Egyptian or even reformed Pig Latin.  You'd have to get up pretty early in the morning to pull that one over on me. 

Just because they wrote in Hebrew or reformed Egyptian a long time ago doesn't  mean they still write that way now.

 

Many people in America are writing in what is called "English" today, and the Nephites are still some pretty smart people who have learned to both write and speak in English, at least in some places in America.   Not saying they don't write in Spanish or some other language too, though.

[Robert F. Smith]

Under a closed topic poster Stargazer asked the following question:

 

It is clear that Volgadon's point is very important.  Can someone come up with viable criteria for identifying a Nephite city?

Of course.  Archeologists (anthropologists) face this question all the time.  For Heinrich Schliemann trying to find Ilium (Troy), it meant reading the text of Homer's Iliad.  He extrapolated from the text to geography and then excavated a suspected site.  Turned out he was right, even though most people then considered the Iliad to be a fairy tale.

 

John Sorenson's An Ancient American Setting for the Book of Mormon squarely faced the same problem, and he made a number of specific and many more general suggestions as to geographical and city locations in the Book of Mormon.  Many of those sites have either been surveyed or excavated, and comparison of the text with the historical geography (archeological chronology) can be very helpful in assigning probable identifications.  In Sorenson's Mormon's Codex (now in press at Deseret Book), that case will be solidified with many tight archeological correlations.

 

Many otherwise unknown bibiical sites have been identified in this way -- see Yohanan Aharoni, Land of the Bible: A Historical Geography, rev. ed. (Westminster Press, 1979).

[Anijen]

I definitely need to step off the humor train, it is not my cup of tea, obviously neither is geography just realizing that the Sea Hawks are from Seattle which is not in Oregon, but Washington, therefore I take back and rescind my previous argument and declare that Zarahemla is in Oregon...

Edited August 28, 2013 by Anijen

[Maidservant]

Well.

 

Do you mean something like this?

 

Such as when Captain Moroni made certain kinds of fortifications?

 

And when there are walls mentioned, like with Ammon and Lamoni; and the seige of Laconeous?

 

Things like this?

[cursor]

Wait ... those are the Seahawkites, an offshoot of the Mulekites, right?

[Ahab]

I definitely need to step off the humor train, it is not my cup of tea, obviously neither is geography just realizing that the Sea Hawks are from Seattle which is not in Oregon, but Washington, therefore I take back and rescind my previous argument and declare that Zarahemla is in Oregon...

Don't give up, yet.  Practice makes perfect.  And many people who live in Oregon are fans of the Seattle Seahawks.

[cursor]

There are geographic magnets that attract:

http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/5106f2716bb3f7e816000002-900-525/nfl-fans-map.jpg

[helaman38]

Of course something carved in metal or stone that identified the boundaries of a city would be nice. There was such an artifact found in western NY, but that's besides the point of the op. Here's a primer for those unfamiliar with the Book of Mormon.

 

1. There were two factions - believers (Nephites) and non-believers (Lamanites).

 

2. The non-believing Lamanites vowed to erase all evidence of the Nephites from off the face of the earth.

 

3. The Lamanites were aware of Nephite prophecies that said among other things the following:

 

a. The Nephites would become wicked.

 

b. They, the Lamanites, would on God's behalf destroy the Nephites.

 

c. Nephite records would come forth in latter times to their descendants.

 

4. Prior to the final battle, the Lamanites destroyed all Nephite cities by fire.

 

5. At the coming of Jesus every house, wall and building collapsed.

 

6. Prior to the coming of Jesus there used to be some cement homes, but they were only found in the Land Northward.

 

7. After the destruction that occurred at the coming of Jesus they had timber so they only rebuilt with wood. 

 

Having laid that foundation it should be clear that attempts to find a Nephite artifact are slim to none.

 

 

Things To Keep In Mind

 

The Lamanites vowed to erase all evidences of the Nephites, their culture & religion from the earth and they made sure nothing would remain to confirm the record when it came forth.

 

For 3.5 years prior to the final battle, all believers were restricted to the small area of Cumorah much like Hitler restricted the Jews. They lived in tents only and awaited the final battle. NO ONE before that time ever lived in Cumorah.

 

Cumorahland was chosen for the final battle because it was away from the core area of Book of Mormon lands. The winner of the battle did not want the burden of burying the dead so they needed a location down wind and far away. Thus, bones that are allowed to moulder upon the ground turn to dust - like the bones of the Jaredites did.

 

What Would Remain

 

Aside from very distinct land marks and water boundaries, there should remain a great number of dirt palisades as described in the Book of Mormon. The largest number of such dirt palisades are found in one place - western New York.

 

Where Prophecies Were Fulfilled

 

There are a great many prophecies that readers can identify and then use those to identify Book of Mormon lands. For example, prophecy says the record would come forth ON Book of Mormon lands, which came to pass in Palmyra. Another prophecy said that the record would come forth to the descendants of the Lamanites, which came to pass in Buffalo, NY where the first missionaries were sent with copies of the Book of Mormon.

 

Conclusion

 

Even though no land markers remain for the public to see (yet), and all evidences of their existence were purposely destroyed, the plates themselves and the gospel on them confirm the Bible and the birth, death, and resurrection of our Lord Jesus, which we must each come to know like Peter, "not by flesh and blood."

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

I definitely need to step off the humor train, it is not my cup of tea, obviously neither is geography just realizing that the Sea Hawks are from Seattle which is not in Oregon, but Washington, therefore I take back and rescind my previous argument and declare that Zarahemla is in Oregon...

Go forth my son and study under the master..."The Nehor".

[helaman38]

Go forth my son and study under the master..."The Nehor".

 

BaBa you should be so proud of yourself for having written so many clever quips, by golly, you have garnered an amazing 13,340 posts! 

[Calm]

Go forth my son and study under the master..."The Nehor".

 

[Robert F. Smith]

Well.

 

Do you mean something like this?

 

Such as when Captain Moroni made certain kinds of fortifications?

 

And when there are walls mentioned, like with Ammon and Lamoni; and the seige of Laconeous?

 

Things like this?

Yes, and a host of other circumstantial considerations as well.  Sorenson's arguments are made carefully and systematically.

[helaman38]

Yes, and a host of other circumstantial considerations as well.  Sorenson's arguments are made carefully and systematically.

 

You forgot that Sorenson had to admit his model was biased.

[Freedom]

Here's a primer for those unfamiliar with the Book of Mormon.

It would be useful if you provided the references to support your claims because you may find that some of them are based on false assumptions.