Heavenly Mother

[Tacenda]

That would explain why little is know, if there are more than one they may all have different personalities, etc.

That is tru I was thinking more about our everyday prayers. But good point.

This is where polygamy comes in. God and several wives. Makes perfect sense. This is why polygamy is celestial marriage, but few will admit it aloud.

[Kevin Christensen]

A recent Meridian article by Warren Aston on the topic, with some good sources.

http://www.ldsmag.com/article/1/11842

Myth 1: Church leaders do not speak of her, so we should not.

Myth 2: She exists, but we know nothing else about her.

Myth 3: Our silence protects her against being blasphemed and slandered as the Father and the Son are.

He cites the essential BYU Studies article by David L. Paulsen and Martin Pulido entitled, “A Mother There: Historical Teachings and Sacred Silence.”

For a basic perspective these days, I think you also have to have read Raphael Patai, The Hebrew Goddess, William Dever, Did God Have a Wife? and Margaret Barker, The Mother of the Lord vol 1. Bill Hamblin has responded to Mother of the Lord by saying it is "unconvincing" as though that were an inherent existential property of that text. However, much as I like and respect and recommend Bill and his scholarship in general, I also notice in this case, that if I had not read Margaret's book, I would have no idea of what her case was, based on reading Bill's recent thread, and blog posts, and his recent "Vindicating Josiah" essay. Rather than responding to her arguments and evidence, he seemed to me in this instance to be in the mode of building a wall around the questions. That is, once he makes a case that Jeremiah supported the reform, that other questions or arguments can be safely ignored as "unconvincing."

For instance, when I read his statement that "1- Jeremiah composed a lament at the death of Josiah (2 Chronicles 35:25)." (from his 16 November Post on evidence that Jeremiah supported Josiah's reforms). This is factually correct, but it does not give any notice to Margaret's discussion of Jeremiah and the content and implications of the Lamentations we have. See Mother of the Lord, 58-59. Her reading of Lamentation shows that there "The daughter of Zion was the victim, not the cause of what had gone wrong.

"Lamentations does not mention Jerusalem worshipping other gods. It was her own leaders who had caused the disaster...The enemies who invaded her sanctuary (Lam. 1.10) could have been those who dragged out the Asherah and destroyed the temple furnishing, the lovers who decieved her (Lam 1.19), would have been the kings who were [ritually speaking] both the sons and consorts of the Lady." (Barker, 59).

And of course, read Daniel Peterson's Nephi and His Asherah, and Alyson Von Feldt's Occasional Paper, His Secret is with the Rightious: Instructional Wisdom in the Book of Mormon.

I don't think it's a matter of worshiping or praying to Mother in Heaven, but of recognizing her presence in the overall scheme of things. When Jesus taught us to pray, he said, "After this manner pray ye..."

FWIW

Kevin Christensen

Bethel Park, PA

[thesometimesaint]

Proverbs 8 is doctrine on her. Heed her message. She isn't a silent subject and she deserves more recognition and reverance than we have given her. Pray to her. Talk to her. She's there.

We are specifically commanded not to pray to her. But no one is going to ex you for whom you pray to in the privacy of your own home.

[Saints Alive]

We are specifically commanded not to pray to her. But no one is going to ex you for whom you pray to in the privacy of your own home.

nether will you be ex'd for having an affair, if you don't tell anyone.

[Mark Beesley]

I have my own theory about heavenly "Mother." Mainly that we don't all have the same heavenly mother. Theory only, nothing doctrinal but it makes sense to me.

I'll take it a step further and suggest that we may not all have the same literal father in heaven, except through adoption. <gasp>

[Damien the Leper]

You could NOT be more wrong, sir.

You should probably talk to some Jewish scholars and Rabbis who recognized a sought communion with the divine Mother and Proverbs 8 is used as a reference.

(Rabbi Elysse Goldstein, for example)

[Damien the Leper]

Valentinus;

I don't know the word in Hebrew for "wisdom", nor if there's a gender specific connection to that word but in Greek it's "sophia" which is definitely feminine". I think that explains the pronoun "she" in Proverbs 8. And Heavenly mother should absolutely NOT be prayed to.

____________________________________________________________________________________________

____________________________________________________________________________________________

To all;

In Proverbs 8 we read:

Man, talk about a blatant declaration of the pro-mortal existence!!! Are there other interpretations on Proverbs 8?

Valentinus: RE: my #13;

Here's from Jeremy's link:

Yeah, what Hamblin said.

You're not making a very good case.

Shekhinah

For reading:

The Great Goddess: Reverence of the Divine Feminine from the Paleolithic to the Present by Jean Markale

The Hebrew Goddess by Raphael Patai

On the Wings of Shekhinah: Rediscovering Judaism's Divine Feminine by Rabbi Leah Novick

[Damien the Leper]

We are specifically commanded not to pray to her. But no one is going to ex you for whom you pray to in the privacy of your own home.

Commanded by God or by SLC?

[teddyaware]

On this subject, it seems obvious the reason why we speak little of Heavenly Mother (in official Church settings) is because we Latter Day Saints take our doctrinal cues from the Standard Works. While it is true there are some ambiguous references in some portions of the Old Testament to divine wisdom being an attribute frequently identified with the feminine, extrapolating from these passages that there is a Heavenly Mother is at best tenuous and inconclusive.

That being said, the more private and sacred forms of our worship clearly reveal the true concept of Heavenly Motherhood. In light of this fact, questions like the ones that started this thread are unnecessary in a forum like this, since the enlightening information sought for is plainly manifested in the higher ordinances of the Restored Gospel. This mystery of godliness is plainly and unambibuously revealed (as are many others) in our sacred places; and for those who have eyes to see and ears to hear, the truth of it is as plain and palpable as the rising of the sun over the sea on a clear summer morn. Some of the greater gospel truths are reserved for disclosure in the "House of Revelation."

Edited December 28, 2012 by teddyaware

[Damien the Leper]

I have my own theory about heavenly "Mother." Mainly that we don't all have the same heavenly mother. Theory only, nothing doctrinal but it makes sense to me.

I've vaguely thought about this in the past. From an LDS standpoint, in which celestial polygamy exists, this would be reasonable.

[thesometimesaint]

nether will you be ex'd for having an affair, if you don't tell anyone.

The trouble is in keeping it quiet enough.

[thesometimesaint]

Commanded by God or by SLC?

The Bible.

[Damien the Leper]

The Bible.

Are we talking about Canaanite pagan worship?

[DavidB]

I have my own theory about heavenly "Mother." Mainly that we don't all have the same heavenly mother. Theory only, nothing doctrinal but it makes sense to me.

Makes lots of sense.

There is more than one mother for the House of Israel.

[thesometimesaint]

Are we talking about Canaanite pagan worship?

Nope. See The Lords' Prayer.

[Damien the Leper]

Matthew 6:9-13 says nothing about not praying to a heavenly mother. Keep the prayer within its context. It is illogical to assume that this prayer is the "standard".

[thesometimesaint]

It is the Standard. We pray only unto God the Father.

[JeremyOrbe-Smith]

But 3 Nephi 11:27 says "behold, verily I say unto you, that the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost are one." And if the Spirit of Wisdom = Lady Wisdom = Queen of Heaven, then ...

[pogi]

But 3 Nephi 11:27 says "behold, verily I say unto you, that the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost are one." And if the Spirit of Wisdom = Lady Wisdom = Queen of Heaven, then ...

We are taught to be one as they are one. Though we are taught to be one, we each have different roles and responsibilities. We don't turn to the ward chorister for confession, instead we are taught to go to the bishop (that is his role). Just as we don't speak to Jesus in prayer, instead we turn to the Father (that is his role). However, mighty prayer includes all members of the Godhead, but it is always directed to the Father. When one prays mightily, we speak by the Holy Ghost, in the name of the Son, and to the Father. They each have their distinct role in prayer.

The only exception that I have seen in scripture is found in 3 Nephi 19, when the people prayed directly to Jesus because he was with them, and they did this right after he taught them the Lord's prayer in chapter 13, to pray to the Father. Apparently, there are some exceptions to the prescribed direction of prayer, but it seems that their immediate presence is required. After Christ left, they again began to pray to the Father in the name of the Son (3 Nephi 27:2)

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Lately I've had my mind on the topic of Heavenly Mother. With so little talk about her, is this a doctrine that we actually accept? Is this idea fundamental to Mormon doctrine, or is it merely a wishful thinking heresy among LDS liberal feminist circles? Has Heavenly Mother become a taboo topic in Mormonism? Why do we talk about her so little? Will we ever know anything more about her, or will we have to wait until we reach the other side of the veil? Is there any official statements about her from the Church?

Assuming that we are on this earth to become like God, and we need to be married in the temple to reach the highest degree of the Celestial Kingdom, the logical conclusion is that God has a wife, right? Am I missing something here?

It is a belief, not necessarily a doctrine (or a scriptural one), but it is spoken of in lessons and song.

[Damien the Leper]

It is the Standard. We pray only unto God the Father.

Remember, the Lord's Prayer is a confession of sin and of fath and of mercy. It is what we should be bold to say. It is not a standard by which all prayer is measured or structured. Again, keep it within its context.

[JeremyOrbe-Smith]

We are taught to be one as they are one. Though we are taught to be one, we each have different roles and responsibilities. We don't turn to the ward chorister for confession, instead we are taught to go to the bishop (that is his role). Just as we don't speak to Jesus in prayer, instead we turn to the Father (that is his role). However, mighty prayer includes all members of the Godhead, but it is always directed to the Father. When one prays mightily, we speak by the Holy Ghost, in the name of the Son, and to the Father. They each have their distinct role in prayer.

The only exception that I have seen in scripture is found in 3 Nephi 19, when the people prayed directly to Jesus because he was with them, and they did this right after he taught them the Lord's prayer in chapter 13, to pray to the Father. Apparently, there are some exceptions to the prescribed direction of prayer, but it seems that their immediate presence is required. After Christ left, they again began to pray to the Father in the name of the Son (3 Nephi 27:2)

The word 'role' is not found in the scriptures. We can retroject our own interpretation of the job listings available in the Godhead into the scriptures, but positing limitations such as a necessary "immediate presence" is at least as speculative as anything I've written. (For one thing, why is the "immediate presence" necessary for Christ, but not the Father?) In other words, where does the idea that it is solely God the Father's role to hear all prayer come from? Clearly we base it on Matthew and 3 Nephi, but those teachings are not all-encompassing; they are spoken to very specific audiences in deeply patriarchal cultures. As Joseph Smith said: “If I esteem mankind to be in error, shall I bear them down? No. I will lift them up, and in their own way too, if I cannot persuade them my way is better; and I will not seek to compel any man to believe as I do, only by the force of reasoning, for truth will cut its own way.” In which case, praying to the Father, even in a patriarchal linguistic form, is step up from idols, pointing the way to conceiving of God as a kind and loving Abba rather than some of the other views of Deity then extant.

Paul taught the people he knew in the places he visited in the idiom he was familiar with; Christ did the same, and even then there were people who could not live a higher law. In a culture which has been profoundly influenced by the patriarchal Greeks who believed that "the head of the woman is the man", it has become nearly impossible, even now, to extricate ourselves from our patriarchal biases, which we justify through the very same fallible teachings present in some of our scriptures that helped to perpetuate that bias in our western worldview in the first place. (Joseph Smith said that he had "tried for a number of years to get the minds of the Saints prepared to receive the things of God; but we frequently see some of them, after suffering all they have for the work of God, will fly to pieces like glass as soon as anything comes that is contrary to their traditions: they cannot stand the fire at all." Cue the Petrine Vision, etc.)

Note, however, that it is not until the Fall that the man is placed above the woman; in the Celestial order, men and women are on equal footing.

We are taught to become Priests and Priestesses to Elohim. Elohim is the plural form for the Gods of the Divine Council, elected to lead by common consent, who created both men and women in their image and who act only through persuasion. This is essentially the apotheosis of Humanism, which includes men and women both; insofar as we are not saviors of humanity, we are as salt that has lost its savor. If a woman is a Queen, She has authority; if the Queen of Heaven/Lady Wisdom/Asherah is One with the Father and Son (is indeed necessary to be present in the wise-hearted in order to "make Aaron’s garments to consecrate him, that he may minister unto [God] in the priest’s office") then for Heaven's sake, why do we insist on carefully segregating the male God from the female Goddess in our prayers?

So let's turn the question around. If God and the Spirit and the Anointed One are all One God, why should it be blasphemous to pray to the Mother as part of the Godhead, all of them equally trying to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of their extended family of Uncreated Intelligences and sharing Christ's throne in the At-One-Ment? The only justification I can see for being upset at such an action is the perniciously lingering patriarchal bias in our culture, despite the fact that we view the cosmological Priesthood as being an Order "without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life." There's plenty of precedent in the Gnostic scriptures (not accepted by normative Judaism and Christianity, much as Mormonism is not) for a Father and Mother of Light.

Prayer/Precari = Invoke, ask earnestly, entreat. Tefilah, Palal = to intervene, intercede; Proseuche, Euche = a vow. Etc.. Prayers are internal vows where we seek personal revelation to help take part in the work of our extended family, which is to serve each other so that we can all have joy. By taking part in the plan of salvation, we are communicating with God, in a sense, because it's all a matter of internal orientation; but I don't think we're literally telepathically connected to someone outside ourselves, except in the same way that all communication is internalized and processed through our idiosyncratic subjective mental awareness. Our connection in the At-One-Ment is always mediated (and expressed) by our own understanding, our own linguistic structures; as such, we have to learn line upon line, and always be willing to seek out new ideas so that our progression is eternal.

So again I ask, where is the harm in praying to a Mother alongside a Father and Son? What do we gain by dividing them in our minds? What purpose does it serve?

[Sky]

So again I ask, where is the harm in praying to a Mother alongside a Father and Son? What do we gain by dividing them in our minds? What purpose does it serve?

We are commanded to pray only to the Father in the name of His son, Jesus Christ. No prayer that I've ever heard or scripture that I've read addresses the Heavenly Mother, or anybody else. So that should tell you that it's probably not the best idea. But in theory, the Brethren could always get a new revelation on the matter. But I doubt this one would change.

But I think it's awesome that you hold Heavenly Mother in such high regard.

[Darren10]

Jeremy #17;

Let's put on the line what I believe regarding Heavenly Mother. She exists, she stands equal to the Father, she is necessary to be with the Father in order for the Father to be Almighty God, she was part of our spiritual creation, and Eve and all the daughters of Eve were created for mortality in her image. Now, *what do we know* of her via revealed truth? A) She exists; B) we are all her sons / daughters. That's it. Everything else is speculation based on what men of God (and Eliza Snow) have spoken of her. There is nothing more to learn of her any more than man may know if God the Father had a God the Father, who had a God the Father, who had a God the Father, who... [insert "infinite regression" here]. We simply do not know if God the Father had a God, or if He really was the very first being in existence. Likewise, we do not know much of Heavenly Mother. In fact, we know so very little of the Father period so why should we know any more of Heavenly Mother than we do of He?

So far as studying the topic of Heavenly mother, I've no quarrels. In fact I find it a fascinating topic. If scholarship and/or academics leads you to study said topic, than have at it. I'd be interested in what you learn. But simply learning of her is not where this main thread, nor your linked thread was going. It was heading towards worshiping her. If it were necessary to worship Heavenly Mother than we would already know much more than we already do about her. God will not keep her hidden within the veil if her worship were necessary for our salvation. What we have already is what we need. Take today for example.

I first read your #17 much earlier this morning but obviously have not replied until now. I had to feed the baby, go shopping, take care of my other kids (five all together), I spoke with my sons casually today, sort of be with them situation, allowed my youngest daughter to hold onto my leg while I walked around the house, made them food throughout the day, etc. Now, suppose during this time you increased your knowledge of Heavenly Mother 3 fold. Suppose we die this moment and stand before God to be judged. I tell God of taking care of my family and how I learned how to better do it. I think things of that nature would lead God (not that He would, I have lots of shortcomings) to say that I'm His "good and faithful servant". You're next in line and you tell the Father that throughout your life you increased your knowledge of Heavenly Mother. I cannot imagine any reaction from the Father than to give you a stoic, not amused look and say, "so what?"

In other words, living the gospel and doing what we already know we should do and learning how to do it better is a far higher necessity than learning about Heavenly Mother. In fact, you can increase your knowledge 100X greater than that of Dr. Nibley and if you do I'll ask, "so what?" how re you closer to God for doing such? I want to make clear that I do not oppose increasing one's knowledge and if that leads people to learn of Heavenly mother than so be it. I do not "hand waving away" scholarship or anything of the sort. My reply has to do with the necessity of learning of Heavenly Mother. I replied as such because, as I said, where this thread and yours were leading to was to a worshiping of her. To that I say NO!!!

When I said that Asherah worship is sinful today you replied:

I disagree. What reason is there for it be sinful?

Here's where it is sinful. We are to pray to the Father in the name of the Son. We as LDS people declare that Father is the Most High God above *all*. We worship the Father through the Son. We worship the son for being the Son of the Father and thus the God of Israel and of the whole earth. We worship the son as the Savior of mankind. We worship the Son as the *only name under heaven* by which man may be saved. Where does Heavenly Mother fit into any of this? The only way to fit her into our worship is to force her into our worship for she is not part of our worship, nor of what we place our faith in. We explicitly believe in a filial relationship between the Father and the Son and that the Father governs all through the Son. That is where our faith lays and what we strive to serve; not Heavenly Mother.

Let's create a hypothetical. Suppose you began to pray to Heavenly mother and to worship her. You began to share this enlightenment and "higher knowledge" of your with others. You even go so far as to tell others that anciently the faithful people of Israel worshiped Asherah who is Wisdom, the Queen of Heaven, and our Heavenly mother. let's go so far as to say that true temple worship includes the worship of Heavenly mother. Well, first off, good luck getting your temple recommend signed by your bishop and stake president. And by not signing it, are they stumped on "lesser knowledge" than you? Are they not as enlightened because of the scholarship you delved into? Or are they simply remaining to true worship as per the teachings of the restored gospel of Jesus Christ?

As for the temple itself, when I go I learn of the Father creating the universe through His Son. I learn of the Father creating the earth through His Son. I learn of the Father sending true messengers to instruct man and did so through His Son. That the Son is the Master of these messengers. I do not find Asherah in the temple, nor of Heavenly mother. Why not is learning of her is necessary? Like I said before, if you desire to study Asherah, by all means, do so, but it is not necessary to do so for your salvation nor for mine nor for anyone else's. We are blessed with the fulness of the gospel in our latter days and I do not find any place for Asherah or Heavenly Mother worship. If we do as the Father commands through the son I've no doubt we will return to the presence of the Father with Heavenly Mother's full approbation (reflecting on your referencing Oh My Father) but as for our faith and worship there is ZERO need to seek her approbation for our salvation or for anything else we do.

Remember that authoritarian pronouncements without justification render our Priesthood null and void

Hog wash. If said authoritative pronouncement is true it does not need any justification. I fully agree that we of the LDS faith do seek and embrace all truth thus there is no need to justify anything. just speak the truth and if it be true, it'll justify itself. God will justify it.

Here's the title summary for Luke 7:

Jesus heals the centurion’s servant—Jesus raises from death the son of the widow of Nain—He praises John the Baptist as more than a prophet—A woman anoints Jesus’ feet, and he forgives her sins.

No mention of Asherah or Heavenly Mother. Here's Luke 33-35 (two verses before your cited verse 35)

33 For John the Baptist came neither eating bread nor drinking wine; and ye say, He hath a devil.

34 The Son of man is come eating and drinking; and ye say, Behold a gluttonous man, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners!

35 But wisdom is justified of all her children.

I read explicit reference to the Son of God, but none of Asherah, nor of Heavenly Mother. Therefore, "wisdom" here, I think can very well refer to verse 23: "And blessed is he, whosoever shall not be aoffended in me." Or, since "wisdom" is grammatically feminine it could be a reference to verse 28 (bold mine): "For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is aleast in the kingdom of God is greater than he." here women can very well represent wisdom in following the Son of God.

Before continuing I'd like to point out that it seems it is you you capitalizes "wisdom". That fact that you do this and not any modern-day prophet I know of tells me that you are forcing the worship of Asherah / Heavenly Mother into LDS theology and you have no priesthood authority to do so.

The gospel of the hebrews link looks fascinating and i'd love to peek through at a later time. For now here's the commentary accompanying your citation of "my mother, the Holy Spirit..." (bold mine)

Within Judaism, the Shekinah (or "visible" cloud of the Presence) is a feminine word, thought to be Yahvah's feminine aspect; therefore, they called the Spirit the "mother". You will note, likewise, that the Renewed City of Jerusalem that "descends from heaven" is also referred to as female, as the "mother" of us all. Jewish studies have shown that this Heavenly Jerusalem is a "palace of overcomers" (the Overcomer's Palace), and is called by the ancient Jewish kabbalists Binah ("Understanding"), a house with "many rooms" (in the New Covenant it is translated "many mansions").

I can live with that interpretation. The spirit is feminized and "wisdom" is understood as having an "understanding". NI find no reason to conclude that the Holy Spirit is Heavenly mother. In fact, from and LDS point of view, that's nearly an impossible conclusion to make. just as in the Gospel of the Hebrews, Nephi was taken by the Spirit to a mountain:

I was bcaught away in the Spirit of the Lord, yea, into an exceedingly high cmountain, which I never had before seen, and upon which I never had before set my foot.

There the prophet Nephi had a one-on-one conversation with the holy Spirit and this is the account of the Holy Spirit (bold mine):

for I beheld that he was in the bform of a man; yet nevertheless, I knew that it was the Spirit of the Lord; and he spake unto me as a man speaketh with another.

Not a very feminine physical description of the Holy Spirit. Furthermore, during their divine conversation, the Holy spirit praised the Father as the most high God and the Son of God. The holy spirit said *nothing* of Asherah or of Heavenly Mother. And ahy not, especially during this account when the Holy Spirit showed Nephi the mother of the Son of God? That she was a chosen virgin above all other virgins, yet she was not declared divine, nor to be worshiped. Also, just to note, the tree shown to Nephi is NOT Asherah; nor Heavenly mother but a representation of the Son of God. It is of His fruits we are to partake, not of any other, including Heavenly Mother.

The footenote for "wisdom" in exodus 28:3 links ot the Topical Guid which you may see HERE. And the full verse reads as follows (bold mine):

And thou shalt speak unto all that are awise hearted, whom I have filled with the spirit of bwisdom, that they may make Aaron’s garments to consecrate him, that he may minister unto me in the priest’s office.

Here "wisdom" simply means "to be wise". No need to force Asherah or Heavenly Mother into this interpretation.

Here's the summary for Proverbs 15:

A soft answer turns away wrath—A wise son makes a glad father—The thoughts of the wicked are an abomination to the Lord—Before honor comes humility.

Speaking softly applies to verse 4 and doing so is "wise". There's also explicit mention of "the Lord" but nothing on Asherah or Heavenly Mother.

Proverbs 3:13 says:

^aHappy is the man that findeth bwisdom, and the man that getteth cunderstanding.

The footnote for "wisdom", again, links to the topical Guide for "Wisdom". Here it is also connected to "understanding". Verse 18, which you referenced is only reflective of this verse thus verse 18, me thinks, can be best interpreted as "She [wisdom] is a tree of alife to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her." There is no need to pronounce 'Lady Wisdom" here, sir. Verse 13 clarifies what the pronoun "she" refers to. There is no being, only "understanding" which we understand comes from the Holy Spirit: the third person of the Godhead.

In 1 Corinthians 12:8, 'wisdom", once again, is linked to the topical guide "Wisdom". No need to make the word into a deity to worship. This is all gifts of the Spirit and the summary for the chapter is as follows:

The Holy Ghost reveals that Jesus is the Christ—Spiritual gifts are present among the Saints—Apostles, prophets, and miracles are found in the true Church.

There is explicit mention of the Son of God but nothing on Asherah or of a Heavenly Mother. So it seems that using "wisdom" in verse 8 only serves to force a feminine deity into the reading.

"Woman" in Revelation 12:1 is footnoted to D&C 5:14 which reads:

And to none else will I grant this power, to receive this same testimony among this generation, in this the beginning of the rising up and the coming forth of my church out of the wilderness—clear as the moon, and fair as the sun, and terrible as an army with banners.

The next two verses are as follows:

15 And the testimony of three awitnesses will I send forth of my word.

16And behold, whosoever abelieveth on my words, them will I bvisit with the cmanifestation of my dSpirit; and they shall be eborn of me, even of water and of the Spirit—

The "woman", therefore, seems to be the Church of God. Even the Church of the Son of God and its ordinances for salvation. It has nothing to do with Asherah or of Heavenly Mother. The Church of the Son of God, as given through Joseph Smith, is simply feminized in Rev. 12:1. There is no declaration of a female deity of any sort.

Following the footnotes to the "tree of life" in Revelations 22:2 we link to Genesis 2 and to "immortality" in the Topical Guide. There is, again, nothing about Asherah or Heavenly Mother.

All you have done is site scripture and forced Heavenly Mother into them. If you're right than the brethren of the Church of the Son of God have grossly misled us but I highly doubt any such thing of them. There is no room for worship of Heavenly mother in LDS theology. Even in Oh My Father the setting is that *by reason* there must be a Heavenly Mother. That's speculation. It's speculation that's 100% fine by me for I agree with it but speculation nonetheless. Speculation is a far cry from a decree from the Lord to worship Heavenly Mother. The two aren't even in the same league. placing Heavenly mother into our faith and worship is done only by force, not be revelation. And, yes, there are many things the Lord will yet reveal pertaining to the kingdom of God so I say, let the Lord reveal them. Don't force them upon us, especially when you have absolutely no priesthood authority to do so.

As for the Lord's prayer, nothing can be clearer as far as our worship. Jesus prayed to the Father not because of some sort of sexist weakness the patriarchs of old were plagued with but because He followed his own example to pray which is to the Father. I'm fact, since the LDS does recognize the existence of a heavenly mother than why not reveal unto man how we should worship her? Afterall, we obviously do not adhere to what you see as blind male chauvinists of old. And, yes, through Christ, all may become one eternal God. That eternal God is referred to the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. No mention of Heavenly Mother being in that formula. So so far as our faith and worship goes, we worship the Father through the Son. Am I mistaken or is that it?

Anything outside worship of the Father through the Son and worship of the son for being God's Son is not part of the LDS faith or worship. there is nothing in LDS theology to conclude otherwise.

[Darren10]

You're not making a very good case.

Shekhinah

Shekhihah means "dwelling"/ not exactly a declaration of Heavenly Mother.

You should probably talk to some Jewish scholars and Rabbis who recognized a sought communion with the divine Mother and Proverbs 8 is used as a reference.

In LDS theology, I am 100% correct.