weekly church attendance

[Rain]

21 hours ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

Is no one else wondering / concerned about how they gained access to everyone’s location data for this study??

For me it just seemed like a known thing with cell phones. But it was years ago that I learned what you could learn from google about the people coming to your website when I took a classes about creating my blog so maybe I just have a little more knowledge than many people? It was not my intention to find lots of things out, I just was annoyed and concerned about all the legal things I needed to worry about to protect myself while have a simple blog.

[Rain]

21 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

Well, if it counts for anything, I attended to sacrament meetings yesterday.
And it’s funny how self-conscious I was not taking the sacrament the second time, worried that people in my old ward would judge me. Oh Humanity 🧐

If it makes you feel better I had similar worries.  I attended the ward that I partnered with for cub scouts because my husband was speaking there. It was the first time I was outside of my own ward since I stopped taking the sacrament. So I worried about the parents of the boys I taught, but it didn't occur to me till the sacrament that the boys would be passing it and one of them brought it to me. It was a little awkward for both of us. 

I've already been worrying about sacrament during our family reunion week at my parent's house.

[mfbukowski]

20 hours ago, Calm said:

This is more complicated than expected. It would appear there was a process for a few years to leave the Church, removed in 2010. 
 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_act_of_defection_from_the_Catholic_Church

http://www.canonlaw.info/2006/04/canonical-defection-just-got-harder-to.htmlI 

Well then I may be the only Catholic who also held every calling possible for a man to hold in a ward of the Church of Jesus Christ.   And I ain't changin' nothing!  Heck now I've got two chances to get it right! 

Or wrong!  😨 🤓 

Edited April 23, 2024 by mfbukowski

[Stargazer]

On 4/22/2024 at 4:33 PM, MustardSeed said:

Well, if it counts for anything, I attended to sacrament meetings yesterday.
And it’s funny how self-conscious I was not taking the sacrament the second time, worried that people in my old ward would judge me. Oh Humanity 🧐

Why wouldn't you take the sacrament twice? That used to be the common practice throughout the church, when we had Sunday School and Sacrament meetings separately. The sacrament would be administered in both meetings, and everyone attending both would partake twice.

Yes, it was a long time ago, but I'm old enough to remember those days. Sunday School opening exercises were just like sacrament, with a couple of talks and hymn practice. Those were the good old days, IMHO.

[bluebell]

7 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

Why wouldn't you take the sacrament twice? That used to be the common practice throughout the church, when we had Sunday School and Sacrament meetings separately. The sacrament would be administered in both meetings, and everyone attending both would partake twice.

Yes, it was a long time ago, but I'm old enough to remember those days. Sunday School opening exercises were just like sacrament, with a couple of talks and hymn practice. Those were the good old days, IMHO.

I think she meant it was the second sacrament meeting she had attended where she didn't take the sacrament.

[Tacenda]

25 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

Why wouldn't you take the sacrament twice? That used to be the common practice throughout the church, when we had Sunday School and Sacrament meetings separately. The sacrament would be administered in both meetings, and everyone attending both would partake twice.

Yes, it was a long time ago, but I'm old enough to remember those days. Sunday School opening exercises were just like sacrament, with a couple of talks and hymn practice. Those were the good old days, IMHO.

I was wondering the same thing.

[MustardSeed]

 

14 hours ago, Stargazer said:

Why wouldn't you take the sacrament twice? That used to be the common practice throughout the church, when we had Sunday School and Sacrament meetings separately. The sacrament would be administered in both meetings, and everyone attending both would partake twice.

Yes, it was a long time ago, but I'm old enough to remember those days. Sunday School opening exercises were just like sacrament, with a couple of talks and hymn practice. Those were the good old days, IMHO.

I had taken the sacrament in my meeting, and it would be redundant to renew my covenants an hour later in the second sacrament meeting. I figured I’d only be taking it a second time to avoid judgement but I was exercising my maturity muscle, unsuccessfully. 😅

Edited April 24, 2024 by MustardSeed

[Stargazer]

7 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

Not 

I had taken the sacrament in my meeting, and it would be redundant to renew my covenants an hour later in the second sacrament meeting. I figured I’d only be taking it a second time to avoid judgement but I was exercising my maturity muscle, unsuccessfully. 😅

Thank you! Your comment made me think, and then realize something I hadn't quite realized before. Though it seems obvious now.

I took it upon myself to comment upon what you wrote here, and it has led me down a very interesting trail. Having heard this "renewing of covenants" phrase many times, I thought I would respond to say how partaking of the sacrament wasn't renewing covenants, because no expiration dates are mentioned or even implied in our entering into them. But everyone uses that term "renewing" when speaking of partaking. I myself have occasionally spoken of "renewing my covenants," but I wondered: can I really renew my covenants? It's a picturesque way of speaking of it. It's even been spoken of in that way by general authorities of the church and in "official" church literature. I still didn't think that was what was happening, because it seemed to me that the covenants are not time-dependent. But then it hit me: it is our worthiness that is at the heart of the renewal. That is why renewal is spoken of! Those covenants are worthiness-dependent. And that is why we partake of the sacrament. 

“We are commanded to repent of our sins and come to the Lord with a broken heart and a contrite spirit and partake of the sacrament. … We witness that we are willing to take upon us the name of Jesus Christ and always remember Him and keep His commandments. When we comply with this covenant, the Lord renews the cleansing effect of our baptism. We are made clean and can always have His spirit to be with us.” (Dallin H. Oaks, “Special Witnesses of Christ,” Ensign, Apr. 2001, 13) [emphasis added]

Partaking of the sacrament is how we exercise the four steps of the first principles of the gospel continually: faith; repentance; baptism; Holy Ghost.

Elder Dale Renlund has said: "We qualify for the cleansing power of Jesus Christ when we partake of the sacrament worthily. This is the way we keep ourselves 'unspotted from the world' (D&C 59:9). The sacrament of the Lord’s Supper rightfully follows baptism in the repeated application of the doctrine of Christ in the progression of Latter-day Saints toward perfection."  (The Beautiful Gift of the Sacrament)

However, he precedes the previous paragraph with this one: "Let us caution, though, that 'the sacrament has not been established as a specific means of securing remission of sins.' (From James E. Talmage, Articles of Faith, 175) In other words, you cannot willfully sin Saturday night and expect to be miraculously forgiven by taking a piece of bread and drinking a little water on Sunday. Repentance is a more involved process requiring remorse and forsaking of sin. Preplanned repentance is repugnant to the Savior."

But obviously, if we have truly repented, that remission of sins is secured through partaking of the sacrament, as Elder Oaks taught.

Examining the words of the sacrament prayers, in partaking of the bread and water we are remembering (or rather, recognizing again) Christ's sacrifice of his blood and body in the act of atoning for our sins, and simultaneously committing ourselves to always remember Him and to keep His commandments. For what purpose? So that we "may always have his Spirit to be with" us.

I am reminded of D&C 121:45,46, which goes:

"Let thy bowels also be full of charity towards all men, and to the household of faith, and let virtue garnish thy thoughts unceasingly; then shall thy confidence wax strong in the presence of God; and the doctrine of the priesthood shall distil upon thy soul as the dews from heaven. The Holy Ghost shall be thy constant companion, and thy scepter an unchanging scepter of righteousness and truth; and thy dominion shall be an everlasting dominion, and without compulsory means it shall flow unto thee forever and ever." [emphasis added]

The process of repentance, including what I might say is its peak, the partaking of the sacrament, is the mechanism by which we can eventually have the Holy Ghost as our constant companion. Which is something to be desired.

In our stake over the last year of so, we have focused on emphasizing "the next ordinance" that we as members should be keeping in mind day by day. For example, after baptism, the next ordinance is confirmation and the gift of the Holy Ghost. After that, it is the temple, either for ourselves or for our kindred dead. But Elder Renlund reminds us that the next ordinance is always the sacrament of the Lord's Supper:

"Partaking of the sacrament is the next ordinance everyone needs after being confirmed a member of the Church. The sacrament is the next ordinance needed at the beginning, middle, or end of a semester at BYU. The sacrament is the next ordinance needed after triumphantly passing a test or being miserably disappointed with the result. The sacrament is the next ordinance needed after receiving the endowment or being sealed in the temple. The sacrament is the next ordinance needed after making a good choice and the next ordinance needed after making a poor choice. The sacrament is the next ordinance needed every week for the rest of our lives."  [from Lifelong Conversion, BYU Speeches September 14, 2021)

Again, MustardSeed, thanks for piquing my interest in this subject!

[Stargazer]

Nevermind. Matter resolved.

Edited April 29, 2024 by Stargazer
DispensatorMysteriorum removed his downvote to Tacenda's post

[Tacenda]

3 hours ago, Stargazer said:

Could @DispensatorMysteriorum please explain the downvote for Tacenda's question?

Doesn't bother me if they disagree, but thanks. 

[Stargazer]

31 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Doesn't bother me if they disagree, but thanks. 

Disagreement is fun! But since "dispensator mysteriorum" means "dispenser of mysteries" I would like the mystery explained. Just for fun.