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I have become a Mormon 3 weeks ago.


Dario_M

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Hey guys how are you doing. 

I just have become a mormon. I had my baptize and received the holly spirit. I am a guy btw.

SO...All nice all good you would say right. 

But the problems are beggining to start now. My missionaris (and another person of the church) wants me to also receive the priesterhood. I dont want that because i feel like i am not ready for it.

Last Sunday the Bishop called my name and told me i may walk forward to receive the Priesterhood. The church whas full of people on that moment. I said honestly that i didn't want that because i whas not ready for it and stayed on my place without moving forward. People in church don't seem to understand that. 

There is also another problem and that is that i am gay. Why can i not marry another man in the Temple? It is 2022 where are living in. 

Thank you for reading. God bless you all. ✝️✝️✝️

 

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3 minutes ago, Dario_M said:

Hey guys how are you doing. 

I just have become a mormon. I had my baptize and received the holly spirit. I am a guy btw.

SO...All nice all good you would say right. 

But the problems are beggining to start now. My missionaris (and another person of the church) wants me to also receive the priesterhood. I dont want that because i feel like i am not ready for it.

Last Sunday the Bishop called my name and told me i may walk forward to receive the Priesterhood. The church whas full of people on that moment. I said honestly that i didn't want that because i whas not ready for it and stayed on my place without moving forward. People in church don't seem to understand that. 

There is also another problem and that is that i am gay. Why can i not marry another man in the Temple? It is 2022 where are living in. 

Thank you for reading. God bless you all. ✝️✝️✝️

 

That is incredibly weird that the bishop would do that, because that's completely against how anyone receives the priesthood.  They don't receive it in a meeting that is attended by everyone in the church for one, and for two, the person who is receiving it has to first have an interview with the bishop where, among other things, they must show their desire to be ordained.

Also, did/do your missionaries or any members know that you are gay?  If yes, then I'm wondering why they baptized you without ever talking to you about the church's doctrines on same sex marriage and the temple.  

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1 minute ago, bluebell said:

That is incredibly weird that the bishop would do that, because that's completely against how anyone receives the priesthood.  They don't receive it in a meeting that is attended by everyone in the church for one, and for two, the person who is receiving it has to first have an interview with the bishop where, among other things, they must show their desire to be ordained.

Also, did/do your missionaries or any members know that you are gay?  If yes, then I'm wondering why they baptized you without ever talking to you about the church's doctrines on same sex marriage and the temple.  

Okay but i am here in Portugal. People are a bit messy here with those thinks anyway. 

And yes i did had a short intervieuw with the bishop. At first i said yes. But later i changed my mind. May i?

Sweetie i know how it all works and yes my missionaries told me all the thinks you are telling me right now but i did not wanna listen.

In another intervieuw about my baptism i lie and said what he wanted to hear (the person i had the intervieuw with about my baptizing). And he gived me the green light. 

And that is why i have received my baptazing and a day later (sunday) i received the holy ghost. So now i am a mormon.

And i ask this question about marrage in the timple for MYSELF because i find it unfair girl. 

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3 minutes ago, Dario_M said:

Okay but i am here in Portugal. People are a bit messy here with those thinks anyway. 

And yes i did had a short intervieuw with the bishop. At first i said yes. But later i changed my mind. May i?

Sweetie i know how it all works and yes my missionaries told me all the thinks you are telling me right now but i did not wanna listen.

In another intervieuw about my baptism i lie and said what he wanted to hear (the person i had the intervieuw with about my baptizing). And he gived me the green light. 

And that is why i have received my baptazing and a day later (sunday) i received the holy ghost. So now i am a mormon.

And i ask this question about marrage in the timple for MYSELF because i find it unfair girl. 

Understandable that you have questions and or find it unfair.  Many members--gay and straight--agree with you.  But for now, it is our doctrine.  And it is unlikely to ever change (though you can never say never).

And yes, you can definitely change your mind.  Having stated you were worthy of those blessings and claimed you wanted them, it would have been confusing to the members present to have you change your mind in the moment.  But still, you can always do so.  There is nothing sinful about confusing other members.  :D 

Can I ask, why did you lie in your baptismal interview?

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1 minute ago, bluebell said:

 

Can I ask, why did you lie in your baptismal interview?

 

Because i really really badly wanted to get baptized. And my missionaries told me that if i dont admit too all those comidments and would say that i am gay my baptizing would never happen. 

So that is why i have lied. I wanted my baptizing. I wanted to be saved be Jesus Christ. And i wanted to be a member of the church of Jesus Christ Of LetterDay Saints. 

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Okay, you can be gay and be a member, and it seems wisdom to hold off receiving the priesthood until you are ready.

A Temple Gay Marriage is out of place in the theology, because as one of the main purposes for temple marriage involves some sort of spiritual procreation and gender is believed to be spiritually engrained. It would seem impossible with current theology, not that we are trying to be mean or are merely old fashioned.

Perhaps you can hope and pray that a new revelation will possibly come expanding the theology. With modern revelations, there Is a chance, just don't hold your breath too long for it. Perhaps you'll change before they do.

Glad to hear you brother. I sympathize and hope you keep coming to church with us.

Edited by Pyreaux
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12 minutes ago, Pyreaux said:

Okay, you can be gay and be a member, and it seems wisdom to hold off receiving the priesthood until you are ready.

A Temple Gay Marriage is out of place in the theology, because as one of the main purposes for temple marriage involves some sort of spiritual procreation and gender is believed to be spiritually engrained. It would seem impossible with current theology, not that we are trying to be mean or are merely old fashioned.

Perhaps you can hope and pray that a new revelation will possibly come expanding the theology. With modern revelations, there Is a chance, just don't hold your breath too long for it. Perhaps you'll change before they do.

Glad to hear you brother. I sympathize and hope you keep coming to church with us.

Offcourse i do. I love the Mormon church. You guys are always so nice and understanding.

I hope that our  Prophet Russel M. Nellson will one day say that gay marrage is okay in the temple and every gay koppel would be welcome there. Then i can marry a nice guy. In the Temple. How romantic would that be. 🥰

For now...i need to have faith and hope for the futhure and have the faith that thinks will change for the better for me and i will be become feeling less lonely and differend.

Ooh lord our god...i pray you. Please hear me. In Jesus name. Amen! ✝️

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Were you confirmed with the Holy Ghost at your baptism?

They usually do that in the ward the next Sunday: baptism without confirmation is only half of the initial ordinances.  You need confirmation so that you can have the Gift of the Holy Ghost to be with you always.

And they don't usually ordain people during Sacrament meeting, but rather in Priesthood meeting.  Yes, they can ask for a sustaining vote to be ordained to the priesthood during Sacrament meeting, but they don't perform the ordinance there.

You are correct that you do not have to do what other members want you to do at the times they want you to do them.

But you should know that gay men can hold the Priesthood just like non-gay men.   And when you are ordained to the priesthood, sometimes they start out by ordaining young adult men to the Aaronic Priesthood so they can bless the Sacrament, before ordaining them to the Melchezidek Priesthood.

Just ask your Bishop and Elder's Quorum President to help you understand better before they ask you to do them publically.

 

You can do this on your own pace.   Welcome to the Kingdom (and get your confirmation tomorrow if you haven't been).

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On 12/9/2022 at 8:11 AM, Dario_M said:

Okay but i am here in Portugal. People are a bit messy here with those thinks anyway. 

And yes i did had a short intervieuw with the bishop. At first i said yes. But later i changed my mind. May i?

Sweetie i know how it all works and yes my missionaries told me all the thinks you are telling me right now but i did not wanna listen.

In another intervieuw about my baptism i lie and said what he wanted to hear (the person i had the intervieuw with about my baptizing). And he gived me the green light. 

And that is why i have received my baptazing and a day later (sunday) i received the holy ghost. So now i am a mormon.

And i ask this question about marrage in the timple for MYSELF because i find it unfair girl. 

If you received the Holy Ghost you would already know the answer to that. By the way welcome to the board and to the church.

P..S. pray until you get the answer 

Edited by rodheadlee
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On 12/9/2022 at 10:25 AM, Dario_M said:

Because i really really badly wanted to get baptized. And my missionaries told me that if i dont admit too all those comidments and would say that i am gay my baptizing would never happen. 

So that is why i have lied. I wanted my baptizing. I wanted to be saved be Jesus Christ. And i wanted to be a member of the church of Jesus Christ Of LetterDay Saints. 

Dario, I respect your decision. 

If I was in your situation, I hope I would have the courage and wisdom to rely on the mercy and grace of Jesus Christ rather than on the judgment and decisions of men. 

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5 hours ago, manol said:

Dario, I respect your decision. 

If I was in your situation, I hope I would have the courage and wisdom to rely on the mercy and grace of Jesus Christ rather than on the judgment and decisions of men. 

Amen.

And it would be best in my opinion to start in the way one desires to go and I assume for most, that is not pretending to be something one is not.  Lying in the interview does not invalidate the ordinance, but it is important to realize that lie could stand between one and efforts to feel fully at home in the Church, leading one to doubt whether one deserves blessings received, etc. I have heard stories from others who have lied in a similar situation and hid it for decades feeling shame, even though living a great life as a follower of Christ and the gospel teachings.  Carrying that mistake can get heavier with the years, sharing the truth means it can be put down and repentance if needed can become complete and they can move on, lighter at heart and soul.  

While the judgment that matters is Christ’s, the ones you lied to are your leaders in the Church and in my view, to resolve the issue you need to at least correct the ideas you gave them by lying.  Being honest with your fellowmen is one of the commandments of God, at times one of the harder ones even for good reasons of wanting to help and not hurt others or to be accepted.

Dario, it sounds like one of the reasons you are reluctant to receive the Priesthood may be the lies you told to get to that point.  Maybe in the future they could get in the way of you accepting callings and other roles which will give you opportunities to learn and have the expertise you need to help you become a better disciple of Christ.

In other words, Dario, I think you should seriously consider talking to your bishop not only about your concerns for being ready for the priesthood so he can help you get prepared in the way you need it to, but also to be up front about what happened in the interview and why and discuss how you can move forward from the place where you actually are, whatever that is.

Being gay is not a block to becoming a member of the Church (though you may run into some members who are prejudiced, there will be others that are all there for you as they would be any other sincere seeker), but there differences in expectations that if you don’t already know, it would be good for you to learn.  You don’t even have to ask the missionaries or members for additional info and in fact they may not have the most accurate understanding, but you can go here to read up on the Church’s polices and doctrine if you haven’t already.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/topics/gay?lang=eng

——-

As to calling you up to receive the Priesthood, I wonder if instead it was meant to be an announcement about it, basically presenting you to the ward though not performing the ordinance till later.  They often call young men to the stand and announce to the ward they have been found to be ready and worthy to move forward in Priesthood offices in my experience and I have been in wards that did similar things for the young women even though it was not the Priesthood they were advancing in (their Personal Progress achievements perhaps…https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/manual/young-women-personal-progress?lang=eng ).  

This was done a few years ago with an older neighbor in my ward who had been born in the faith, but had been in the military from his teen years and had become inactive (meaning not attending services and sometimes also not living church standards like the Word of Wisdom or the Law of Chastity) during his service.  He unfortunately got addicted to tobacco and couldn’t get off of it due to some significant health issues that were also a result of his military service, but after years of attending our ward off and on decided to commit himself again to a fuller fellowship.  On the day he was to be ordained a priest (normally done at 16, he was closer to 46), the bishop had him come up the pulpit to announce it was done along with a young man who was going to be ordained a teacher (14 years old normally, I think he was 21).  They were both loved by the ward and it felt like a little celebration.
 

Unless you had seen it done with others, I can see why you would assume they were going to give you the priesthood then if your bishop hadn’t been clear that it was going to be done right after the meeting.

This is referenced in the manual:

Quote

When a brother is baptized and confirmed, he is eligible to be ordained to an office in the Aaronic Priesthood if he will be at least 12 years old by the end of the year. The bishop interviews him soon after his confirmation, normally within a week. A member of the bishopric presents him in sacrament meeting so ward members can sustain his proposed ordination (see 18.10.3). He may then be ordained to the appropriate office:

Deacon, if he will turn 12 or 13 by the end of the year

Teacher, if he will turn 14 or 15 by the end of the year

Priest, if he will turn 16 or older by the end of the year; if he is 19 or older, he is also considered a prospective elder (see 38.2.9.3)

A new member is eligible to receive the Melchizedek Priesthood and be ordained an elder when he:

Is 18 or older.

Has served as a priest (no specified time is required).

Has sufficient understanding of the gospel.

Has demonstrated worthiness.

Newly baptized brethren are not ordained on the day they are baptized or confirmed. They first need to be interviewed by the bishop and sustained by ward members.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/general-handbook/38-church-policies-and-guidelines?lang=eng#title_number47

(tried to get it to come up in Dutch/Nederland, but it didn’t work; not sure if available yet…would have been nice, but your English is great, thank goodness)

Edited by Calm
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5 hours ago, manol said:

Dario, I respect your decision. 

If I was in your situation, I hope I would have the courage and wisdom to rely on the mercy and grace of Jesus Christ rather than on the judgment and decisions of men. 

Thank you so much. I just went from my church here in Meratejo. And the bishop whas allready talking about the priesterhood again. And he wanted to talk with me about it. But i kindly deneight his offer and told him i am just not ready. Alse with me being gay and everything it is just not that good of a idea. Plus i can handle the resposabity of all of that. 

And after that i wished him a nice blessed sunday. ✝️

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7 hours ago, rodheadlee said:

If you received the Holy Ghost you would already know the answer to that. By the way welcome to the board and to the church.

P..S. pray until you get the answer 

I have allready received the holy ghost. Saturday i had my baptism. And on sunda my missionaries and the bishop all put there hands on my head and gived me the holy spirit. That is just how it went. I can't make it more beaufiful then how my experience was. I dont know how you guys do it in the US. 

My mossionaries are from Idaho and Utah. But they needed to follow protecols of how the portugees people wanted thinks te happen. All tough it seems not always that logic i am totaly agree with you guys.

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57 minutes ago, Calm said:

And it would be best in my opinion to start in the way one desires to go and I assume for most, that is not pretending to be something one is not.  Lying in the interview does not invalidate the ordinance, but it is important to realize that lie could stand between one and efforts to feel fully at home in the Church, leading one to doubt whether one deserves blessings received, etc.

Dario, it sounds like one of the reasons you are reluctant to receive the Priesthood are the lies you told to get to that point.  Maybe in the future they will get in the way of you accepting callings and other roles which will give you opportunities to learn and have the expertise you need to help you become a better disciple of Christ.

In other words, Dario, I think you should seriously consider talking to your bishop not only about your concerns for being ready for the priesthood so he can help you get prepared in the way you need it to, but also be up front about what happened in the interview and why and discuss how you can move forward from the place where you actually are, whatever that is.

Being gay is not a block to becoming a member of the Church (though you may run into some members who are prejudiced, there will be others that are all there for you as they would be any other sincere seeker), but there differences in expectations that if you don’t already know, it would be good for you to learn.  You don’t even have to ask the missionaries or members for info, but you can go here to read up on the Church’s polices and doctrine.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/topics/gay?lang=eng

 

This week i am going to talk with my missionaries about all of this. All tough they allready know a lot about me. 

I dont really wanna talk to the bishop on this point. 

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8 hours ago, rpn said:

Were you confirmed with the Holy Ghost at your baptism.                        

 

 

8 hours ago, rpn said:

I allready sad it a view times now. Yes. I had my bapism on Saterday and on Sunday i reveived to holy ghost. My missionaries and the bishop smashed their hands on my head and that is how they have giving me the holy ghost. 

That is how it went with me. So i am not a half Mormon. I am just A Mormon. 

Amen.✝️

 

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I just edited my post, so you might want to reread it…I can’t remember exactly how much I added, but there is the quote and link about the process of being ordained, including the presentation and sustaining by the ward (the bishop asks them if they sustain and everyone who does raises their right hand) before it happens.

Has a picture:

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/general-handbook/30-callings-in-the-church?lang=eng

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2 hours ago, Calm said:

I just edited my post, so you might want to reread it…I can’t remember exactly how much I added, but there is the quote and link about the process of being ordained, including the presentation and sustaining by the ward (the bishop asks them if they sustain and everyone who does raises their right hand) before it happens.

Has a picture:

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/general-handbook/30-callings-in-the-church?lang=eng

Yes???? But isnt that about my priesterhood. That people can raise their hand if they think i am ready or not for the priesterhood. Because that is how we do it hear. 

But people dont need to raise their hand with my because i dont wanna receive priesterhood on the moment. 

😉

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5 hours ago, Dario_M said:

Yes???? But isnt that about my priesterhood. That people can raise their hand if they think i am ready or not for the priesterhood. Because that is how we do it hear. 

But people dont need to raise their hand with my because i dont wanna receive priesterhood on the moment. 

😉

That is part of the preparation for receiving the Priesthood.  Much like the interview where you are getting the approval of the bishop, the ward members give their approval (it means much more than that, they are also committing to support, even help you fulfill your responsibilities).  But when we talk of receiving the Priesthood, we just mean getting the ordinance, which is the blessing with the laying on of hands.  You wouldn’t get the Priesthood until this was done.

I am just responding to this part…

Quote

told me i may walk forward to receive the Priesterhood.

My guess is he used a slightly different phrasing or it’s the translation.  This sounds to us like when you got up there, he was going to ordain you right then, right there, not that you were just getting presented and the ordinance would be given to you later.  Like it was an altar call.

Either way, staying in your seat was fine…unusual, but I don’t see any issues with it.  Bishop might have been a bit embarrassed and ward members would have likely been confused as I have never heard it happening before.  People changing their mind and not showing up at all is the more common occurrence.  I like your way better.

Edited by Calm
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10 hours ago, Calm said:

Amen.

And it would be best in my opinion to start in the way one desires to go and I assume for most, that is not pretending to be something one is not.  Lying in the interview does not invalidate the ordinance, but it is important to realize that lie could stand between one and efforts to feel fully at home in the Church...

I agree that it's not straightforward.  And I don't think either choice would have been "wrong" in God's eyes. 

By any chance did you see the movie "Yentl"?  She's a young Jewish woman who more than anything desires to study the Talmud in a Yeshivah (religious school).  But her society does not allow women to do so, so she pretends to be a boy.  In my opinion @Dario_M's situation is a variation on that theme. 

Along somewhat similar lines, it was socially inappropriate and inconsiderate of Mary to let her sister Martha do all the hostessing while she sat at Jesus' feet listening to him, but apparently Jesus felt Mary had chosen well.

I get the impression that Dario also wants to sit at Jesus' feet and listen to him.

Edited by manol
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1 hour ago, manol said:

I agree that it's not straightforward.  And I don't think either choice would have been "wrong" in God's eyes. 

By any chance did you see the movie "Yentl"?  She's a young Jewish woman who more than anything desires to study the Talmud in a Yeshivah (religious school).  But her society does not allow women to do so, so she pretends to be a boy.  In my opinion @Dario_M's situation is a variation on that theme. 

Along somewhat similar lines, it was socially inappropriate and inconsiderate of Mary to let her sister Martha do all the hostessing while she sat at Jesus' feet listening to him, but apparently Jesus felt Mary had chosen well.

I get the impression that Dario also wants to sit at Jesus' feet and listen to him.

Yes that is exacly what i want. You have seen that really claver. 😉  

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