Middle Way Mormonism

[Benjamin Seeker]

I’ve been watching the posts on By Common Consent and Wheat and Tares on Middle Way Mormonism with interest. I was wondering how board members here self identify.

[Steve J]

I read some of them, but didn’t really get a sense that a definition was agreed upon. For your quiz, I think it would be helpful to define both middle way Mormon and cafeteria mormon

 

[bluebell]

I have no idea how to label myself.  I'm not a cafeteria or middle way Mormon, but I don't know that I would be considered orthodox either.

[Benjamin Seeker]

I’ll offer some definition but welcome debate and discussion if people want to do that.

In my mind, a Middle Way member is someone who has undergone a faith transition and has a transformed view of the type of truth Mormonism offers, usually a much less literal kind. In spite of this the member still considers themselves part of the LDS tradition in some way or other, often through continued partipation in church and callings.

I think cafeteria Mormonism is the idea of picking and choosing guidelines to follow or not follow, and this can be done with or without a faith transition.

Im thinking of an orthodox Mormon as your average active calling-holding Mormon who has a testimony in the basic truth claims of Mormonism and generally subscribes to the guidelines of Mormonism.

Edited November 18, 2018 by Benjamin Seeker

[MustardSeed]

I describe myself as a liberal (compared to many) Lds who typically sees herself as a political conservative.  

[let’s roll]

I visited BCC and read a bit on middle way Mormons.  Not my cup of tea.  I don’t generally find labels to be helpful, I don’t try not to use them for myself or others.

But more to the point, while admittedly I read only a few posts/comments, everything I read was trying to define a relationship with the Church and I don’t really spend any time thinking about my relationship to the Church or trying to define it as an institution, tribe or anything else.

I believe time is better spent focusing on relationships with Deity.  I try to focus all my activities within the construct of the Church on communion with the divine.

[Duncan]

I don't know how to label myself either, i'm more of a Gun's and Roses person and I quote from the 1987 hit song, "Welcome to the Jungle"

 

you can have anything that you want just don't take it from me

 

🙂

[MustardSeed]

8 minutes ago, let’s roll said:

I visited BCC and read a bit on middle way Mormons.  Not my cup of tea.  I don’t generally find labels to be helpful, I don’t try not to use them for myself or others.

But more to the point, while admittedly I read only a few posts/comments, everything I read was trying to define a relationship with the Church and I don’t really spend any time thinking about my relationship to the Church or trying to define it as an institution, tribe or anything else.

I believe time is better spent focusing on relationships with Deity.  I try to focus all my activities within the construct of the Church on communion with the divine.

But but ..the question was about church....and we all have an identity there too.  Ask me about my relationship with God and I’ll likely be more thoughtful about that.

[Tacenda]

I'm a middle-wayer, staying on the fence or in the middle is not as horrible as we've been told, IMO. It's not prudent to just jump to either side when not ready, that would be a waste of time to explore all the options. Faith isn't always blind, nor should it be. No one gave me the information to make a proper decision when I turned eight and then the course was to get baptised, as a child I didn't know the full story, the rest of the story. I joined under false pretences, IMO. 

Also, I've always wondered how many on here that debate and are apologists for the church if they themselves were ever middle wayers that found their way back after a faith crisis. I'll bet it's more than we all think it is.

[Ouagadougou]

Apparently the term "Mormon" is a tool of Satan, but I would say that I am a "Jack Mormon" because I drink tea.  😀

[let’s roll]

31 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

But but ..the question was about church....and we all have an identity there too.  Ask me about my relationship with God and I’ll likely be more thoughtful about that.

Understood.  So if compelled to check a box, I check “Other” and say son of God/disciple of Christ.  I don’t think of the Church in any other context than in the context of my relationship with Deity.

[MustardSeed]

2 minutes ago, let’s roll said:

Understood.  So if compelled to check a box, I check “Other” and say son of God/disciple of Christ.  I don’t think of the Church in any other context than in the context of my relationship with Deity.

Ok.  Well you’re much deeper than I on this topic. 

[JLHPROF]

I am an orthodox believer.  But that's different from being a TBM.

[MustardSeed]

8 minutes ago, Ouagadougou said:

Apparently the term "Mormon" is a tool of Satan, but I would say that I am a "Jack Mormon" because I drink tea.  😀

Youre jack because tea?  That’s it? 

I try really hard to enjoy herbal tea and just can’t get there.  But as a singer do love my Throat Coat.  It’s the only tea I find that feels substantial, not sure how to describe.  

My warm drink of choice is half and half Pero and hot cocoa. 

I digress.  Ive been a rule following compliant member of the church my whole life.  But I do have my own thoughts and find myself to seem far less critical of people and their struggles and much more inclusive than it seems others are.  And I don’t share in many cultural upsets.  But I can’t bring myself to call myself a middle anything. 

And in no way orthodox or zealous.  Im not that guy. 

[MustardSeed]

14 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

I am an orthodox believer.  But that's different from being a TBM.

What’s the difference for you? 

[Benjamin Seeker]

Hmmm... I was hoping people would interpret orthodox as typical, average, conventional. Also, it seems like people don’t like labels. Surveys are hard.

[JLHPROF]

14 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

What’s the difference for you? 

Well, a quick google defines orthodox as "conforming to what is generally or traditionally accepted as right or true; established and approved."

TBM to me believes whatever the current Church position/teaching happens to be on any given topic.  They focus on the approved part even if it differs from what has been traditional or established previously.

Orthodox to me is a little less flexible and looks to the originally revealed teachings - ie the traditional/established and less concerned with the approved.

Two sides of the same coin really which is why I am a faithful member and don't consider myself a critic, even when I may disagree with the currently approved positions.

Edited November 18, 2018 by JLHPROF

[Bernard Gui]

11 minutes ago, Benjamin Seeker said:

Hmmm... I was hoping people would interpret orthodox as typical, average, conventional. Also, it seems like people don’t like labels. Surveys are hard.

Where would you put those folks who have had profound spiritual witnesses that brought them and keep them in? Is this your typical, average, conventional, Latter-day Saint??

[JLHPROF]

18 minutes ago, Benjamin Seeker said:

Hmmm... I was hoping people would interpret orthodox as typical, average, conventional. Also, it seems like people don’t like labels. Surveys are hard.

I love labels.  But I like precision.

There is a huge difference between tired, sleepy, fatigued, exhausted, drowsy etc.

And I chose orthodox even though I am not typical or average in my approach. 

[Benjamin Seeker]

3 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

Where would you put those folks who have had profound spiritual witnesses that brought them and keep them in? Is this your typical, average, conventional, Latter-day Saint??

Maybe they’re a particular subset of typical member? 

Should we also differentiate Middle Wayers who have had profound spiritual experiences before, during, and after a faith transition?

[MustardSeed]

Is our label determined by our sin or by our thoughts and attitude?  Not looking for an answer I guess.

My takeaway here is, who am I, and am I who I want to be?  I’m not who I want to be yet.

[Ouagadougou]

36 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

Youre jack because tea?  That’s it? 

I try really hard to enjoy herbal tea and just can’t get there.  But as a singer do love my Throat Coat.  It’s the only tea I find that feels substantial, not sure how to describe.  

My warm drink of choice is half and half Pero and hot cocoa. 

I digress.  Ive been a rule following compliant member of the church my whole life.  But I do have my own thoughts and find myself to seem far less critical of people and their struggles and much more inclusive than it seems others are.  And I don’t share in many cultural upsets.  But I can’t bring myself to call myself a middle anything. 

And in no way orthodox or zealous.  Im not that guy. 

I openly drink black tea, which makes some members uncomfortable. Somehow drinking soda like Pepsi and Mountain Dew is acceptable, but black tea is a straight ticket to hell (or a direct violation of the Word of Wisdom). 😀

[Bernard Gui]

24 minutes ago, Benjamin Seeker said:

Maybe they’re a particular subset of typical member? 

Should we also differentiate Middle Wayers who have had profound spiritual experiences before, during, and after a faith transition?

Maybe. This undermines your categories, seems to me.

[Benjamin Seeker]

12 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

Maybe. This undermines your categories, seems to me.

What I really wanted to see was how many middle Way type members vs. literal-believing type members are lurking here on the board. I wasn’t really worried about accurately defining all faith experiences within the church. I only through in cafeteria Mormon because that had been discussed in one of the middle Way blog posts.

Edited November 18, 2018 by Benjamin Seeker

[Benjamin Seeker]

In fact I think I’ve botched this thread. I’ll ask the moderators to close it and see if I can do a better job with the initial poll question.