What were blue eyed people doing in Northern Israel 6,500 years ago?

[Rajah Manchou]

Unexpected results from ancient DNA study of samples taken from the Peqi'in cave in Israel.

"The outstanding results of this study are presented in a study published in Nature Communication. It shows that the people of Peqi'in have ancestry related to that of earlier ancient groups from Anatolia and Iran – and not seen in earlier peoples from the Levant. This suggests that a migration into the region, bringing people who our genetic data showed had a high rate of blue eyes that were previously rare in the region, may have triggered the development of the Chalcolithic culture."  - What were blue eyed people doing in Northern Israel 6,500 years ago?

The majority of the paternal DNA is Haplogroup T. Interesting factoid: Thomas Jefferson, and many of the earliest Spanish colonizers and Sephardic diaspora to the Americas, were Haplogroup T.

[Robert F. Smith]

That this early Levant-Chalcolithic (Ghassulian and Peqi'in) population should exhibit blue-eyes and light skin pigmentation should be no surprise, as they appear to have been of Indo-European origin.  They disappear from the area before the Bronze Age, as does the horse.  Why we don't know.

However, the continuity of haplogroup T on the Y chromosome may raise questions about the belief that they disappeared from the area.

[Rajah Manchou]

1 hour ago, Robert F. Smith said:

That this early Levant-Chalcolithic (Ghassulian and Peqi'in) population should exhibit blue-eyes and light skin pigmentation should be no surprise, as they appear to have been of Indo-European origin.  They disappear from the area before the Bronze Age, as does the horse.  Why we don't know.

However, the continuity of haplogroup T on the Y chromosome may raise questions about the belief that they disappeared from the area.

The Ghassulians seem to be an interesting bunch. As for their disappearance, I suspect the guy on the left.

[Glenn101]

1 hour ago, Rajah Manchou said:

The Ghassulians seem to be an interesting bunch. As for their disappearance, I suspect the guy on the left.

KoolAid?

 

[RevTestament]

Egyptian art from the 2nd millennium BC shows blue-eyed people working as slaves. One would presume they came from the area of the Levant - a common area from which Egypt captured its slaves. It is also possible they were some left-over Hyksos who were captured after not leaving with the rest of the Hyksos. I believe the Hittites to be an Indo-European race who had some blue-eyed people, and they apparently allied themselves with David, and inter-married with the Israelites. 

[Robert F. Smith]

3 minutes ago, RevTestament said:

Egyptian art from the 2nd millennium BC shows blue-eyed people working as slaves. One would presume they came from the area of the Levant - a common area from which Egypt captured its slaves. It is also possible they were some left-over Hyksos who were captured after not leaving with the rest of the Hyksos. I believe the Hittites to be an Indo-European race who had some blue-eyed people, and they apparently allied themselves with David, and inter-married with the Israelites. 

There were a number of Indo-European peoples in Anatolia, Syria, Gaza, and Persia in those times: Hittities, Mitannians, Philistines, etc., so your suspicions are correct.  However, modern genetic testing demonstrates that they had a very minor effect on the larger Semitic gene pool.  In Lebanon, for example, we have today a 93% match with the DNA of the ancient Canaanites/Phoenicians in that area, and scholars extend that to the general area of Canaan (including Trans-Jordan).  The upshot is that, although the people of the area generally speak Arabic, they are not Arabs.  They are the descendants of the ancient Canaanites, and their native language was basically Aramaic until modern times.  Some Maronite Christians still speak Aramaic.

[Robert F. Smith]

2 hours ago, Rajah Manchou said:

The Ghassulians seem to be an interesting bunch. As for their disappearance, I suspect the guy on the left.

These people apparently left a hoard of amazing metal artifacts at their temple at Nahal Mishmar (Ein Gedi):

                                            

[Rajah Manchou]

21 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

There were a number of Indo-European peoples in Anatolia, Syria, Gaza, and Persia in those times: Hittities, Mitannians, Philistines, etc., so your suspicions are correct.  However, modern genetic testing demonstrates that they had a very minor effect on the larger Semitic gene pool.  In Lebanon, for example, we have today a 93% match with the DNA of the ancient Canaanites/Phoenicians in that area, and scholars extend that to the general area of Canaan (including Trans-Jordan).  The upshot is that, although the people of the area generally speak Arabic, they are not Arabs.  They are the descendants of the ancient Canaanites, and their native language was basically Aramaic until modern times.  Some Maronite Christians still speak Aramaic.

What do you mean by Indo-Europeans? This Haplo T group was migratory, they come and go within 600 years.

Mysterious 6,500-year-old Culture in Israel Was Brought by Migrants, Researchers Say

"No genetic continuity was found between the population of Peki’in and the Chalcolithic population of later populations." This indicates another demographic change in the region that led to the disappearance of the Chalcolithic culture."

So where did they go? T is found in high concentrations within the Somalis of the Horn of Africa, Anteony and Antemoro of Madagascar, Lemba Jews, and East Indians.

[Rajah Manchou]

6 minutes ago, RevTestament said:

Egyptian art from the 2nd millennium BC shows blue-eyed people working as slaves. One would presume they came from the area of the Levant - a common area from which Egypt captured its slaves. It is also possible they were some left-over Hyksos who were captured after not leaving with the rest of the Hyksos. I believe the Hittites to be an Indo-European race who had some blue-eyed people, and they apparently allied themselves with David, and inter-married with the Israelites. 

1

Gutians as well:

[CV75]

They were vouguing.

[RevTestament]

5 hours ago, Rajah Manchou said:

Gutians as well:

I'm not sure about the other one, but the middle picture seems to be of  Ebih-Il, the superintendent of Mari in East Syria. The Gutians were from the mountains of western Iran. I don't know much about them, but I don't think  Ebih-Il was Gutian.

[USU78]

I always figured that, lapis being a very popular semi-precious stone in that part of the world during those times, it made an otherwise dull bust or statue more decorative.  It wasn't necessarily an artist's commentary on eye color.

Edited August 24, 2018 by USU78

[katherine the great]

It doesn't take much to spread blue eye alleles throughout a populations. It was probably considered quite exotic and attractive in existing brown eyed populations. Since the mutation probably appeared in humans around 10,000 years ago and most of those people were highly mobile, it isn't surprising at they would be present in the middle east 6 thousand years ago. From the evidence we have, the first blue eyed people were also quite dark skinned. Lighter skin and blue eyes probably did not arise in tandem.

[rongo]

12 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

 From the evidence we have, the first blue eyed people were also quite dark skinned. Lighter skin and blue eyes probably did not arise in tandem.

Why not? I thought that they are considered to both be part of selection that favored melanin-deficiency in higher latitudes with less sunlight (for vitamin D synthesis).

[katherine the great]

17 minutes ago, rongo said:

Why not? I thought that they are considered to both be part of selection that favored melanin-deficiency in higher latitudes with less sunlight (for vitamin D synthesis).

Lighter skin is most likely an adaptation to low sunlight-yes. Neanderthals also had this adaptation. The function of eye color is less clear and blue eyes may have been acted upon primarily by sexual selection.  Ancient remains that we are finding (that can be analyzed) are showing that the first blue eyed people still had dark skin. The lighter skin came about as populations of blue and brown eyed people moved into colder climates.

[Rajah Manchou]

12 hours ago, RevTestament said:

I'm not sure about the other one, but the middle picture seems to be of the superintendent of Mari in East Syria. The Gutians were from the mountains of western Iran. I don't know much about them, but I don't think  Ebih-Il was Gutian.

 

I was pointing out that, like the Egyptian art you mentioned, depictions of blue eyes were not uncommon in the 2nd millennium BC. Whether or not blue eyes were a common trait is unknown. It does seem more likely with the publication of this paper.

There has been some speculation that the Gutians who ruled over Sumer and Babylon (with a presence in and around Mari) might have had blue eyes based on an unresolved translation of the term namrum (light-colored) found in tablets describing Gutian slaves of that period. 

[katherine the great]

1 hour ago, Rajah Manchou said:

I was pointing out that, like the Egyptian art you mentioned, depictions of blue eyes were not uncommon in the 2nd millennium BC. Whether or not blue eyes were a common trait is unknown. It does seem more likely with the publication of this paper.

There has been some speculation that the Gutians who ruled over Sumer and Babylon (with a presence in and around Mari) might have had blue eyes based on an unresolved translation of the term namrum (light-colored) found in tablets describing Gutian slaves of that period. 

Just out of curiosity, why the interest in blue eyes?

[Rajah Manchou]

1 hour ago, katherine the great said:

Just out of curiosity, why the interest in blue eyes?

Not really an interest of mine. I'm more interested in Haplogroup T. Just that the article in Nature.com was titled: "What were blue eyed people doing in Northern Israel 6,500 years ago?"

IMO the blue-eye thing is their click-bait curiosity. The title distracts from the more interesting finding, that Haplogroup T was dominant (9 out of 10) in this group of Peqi'in migrants.

Edited August 25, 2018 by Rajah Manchou

[Peppermint Patty]

19 hours ago, katherine the great said:

It doesn't take much to spread blue eye alleles throughout a populations. It was probably considered quite exotic and attractive in existing brown eyed populations. Since the mutation probably appeared in humans around 10,000 years ago and most of those people were highly mobile, it isn't surprising at they would be present in the middle east 6 thousand years ago. From the evidence we have, the first blue eyed people were also quite dark skinned. Lighter skin and blue eyes probably did not arise in tandem.

I found this article about how 10,000 years ago Britons had "very dark skin and very  blue eyes" interesting.  https://www.zmescience.com/science/cheddar-man-dna-43432/

According to the article this is what the ancestors of the British looked like 10,000 years ago.

Edited August 25, 2018 by Peppermint Patty