Dan Reynolds - Prophet

[hope_for_things]

Last week I got to watch the Believer documentary and I also watched the LoveLoud concert (as broadcast live on Youtube this year).  And i can't shake how powerful the messages were to me.  The way Dan Reynolds has conducted himself and the messages that he's sending about how we need to treat our LGBTQ brothers and sisters have been truly inspirational. 

Another thing he did during the concert that I just found so powerful, was he talked about how he's seeing a counselor and how we should all see a counselor if we're struggling and that nobody should be ashamed of that, and how its an important resource and can help us to learn and grow.  I just loved how clear and open and breaking down of the stigmas that our society often has about really basic things like this.  I found it so refreshing.  He's not a man of sophisticated and eloquent speech, but his words speak to the regular person in such a clear and powerful way.  I was just so impressed by him and what I heard.  

The thought that came to mind is that what I'm hearing from Dan Reyolds is prophetic.  And in a time where prophesy from church leaders often seems completely absent, I was impressed that the prophetic speech I'm hearing is not coming from a religious leader, but a rock star.  I honestly feel this is true, and I wanted to share in case anyone else might have thoughts about it.  Thanks

[clarkgoble]

8 minutes ago, hope_for_things said:

And in a time where prophesy from church leaders often seems completely absent, I was impressed that the prophetic speech I'm hearing is not coming from a religious leader, but a rock star.  I honestly feel this is true, and I wanted to share in case anyone else might have thoughts about it. 

Huh? I'm not sure most Mormons would say there's no prophetic speech. But of course different people like different things I guess.

BTW - curious as to what you think of the backlash from the left to Reynolds. I confess I was pretty surprised there was such a backlash.

 

[hope_for_things]

3 minutes ago, clarkgoble said:

Huh? I'm not sure most Mormons would say there's no prophetic speech. But of course different people like different things I guess.

BTW - curious as to what you think of the backlash from the left to Reynolds. I confess I was pretty surprised there was such a backlash.

 

Well some Mormons would say prophetic speech from LDS church leaders has been lacking, so I guess thats a matter of individual perspective.  I'm a Mormon.  

Thanks for the link, I hadn't read that piece yet.  I wouldn't say its backlash, the author called it "gentle criticism".  i think it definitely would help to have more voices directly from LGBTQ individuals, and I think the incident with the restrooms was unfortunate, and a learning opportunity, but that doesn't take away from all the good accomplished. 

I don't like pure identity politics on either the left or the right, so I'm not a person who thinks a straight guy like Dan can't advocate for helping LGBTQ individuals. 

[clarkgoble]

The comments to the post were much harsher than the OP.

Didn't mean to deny your Mormonness in the other comment. I guess I'm just saying that I bet if most Mormons heard Dan Reynolds and then Elder Uchtdorf or Pres. Nelson they'd probably say the latter were acting more prophetic in counsel. 

[SouthernMo]

30 minutes ago, hope_for_things said:

Last week I got to watch the Believer documentary and I also watched the LoveLoud concert (as broadcast live on Youtube this year).  And i can't shake how powerful the messages were to me.  The way Dan Reynolds has conducted himself and the messages that he's sending about how we need to treat our LGBTQ brothers and sisters have been truly inspirational. 

Another thing he did during the concert that I just found so powerful, was he talked about how he's seeing a counselor and how we should all see a counselor if we're struggling and that nobody should be ashamed of that, and how its an important resource and can help us to learn and grow.  I just loved how clear and open and breaking down of the stigmas that our society often has about really basic things like this.  I found it so refreshing.  He's not a man of sophisticated and eloquent speech, but his words speak to the regular person in such a clear and powerful way.  I was just so impressed by him and what I heard.  

The thought that came to mind is that what I'm hearing from Dan Reyolds is prophetic.  And in a time where prophesy from church leaders often seems completely absent, I was impressed that the prophetic speech I'm hearing is not coming from a religious leader, but a rock star.  I honestly feel this is true, and I wanted to share in case anyone else might have thoughts about it.  Thanks

The word prophet is one used often, but misunderstood and misapplied in LDS Mormonism. If we use the Bible dictionary definition, i think we could call Dan Reynolds a prophet: 

“In a general sense a prophet is anyone who has a testimony of Jesus Christ by the Holy Ghost, as in Num. 11:25–29; Rev. 19:10.”

If his words move you or anyone else to do more good than listening to a talk at General Conference, how can one claim the words of church leaders are better?

Should we judge a message by the fruits of the message, or the title of the messenger?

[hope_for_things]

1 minute ago, SouthernMo said:

The word prophet is one used often, but misunderstood and misapplied in LDS Mormonism. If we use the Bible dictionary definition, i think we could call Dan Reynolds a prophet: 

“In a general sense a prophet is anyone who has a testimony of Jesus Christ by the Holy Ghost, as in Num. 11:25–29; Rev. 19:10.”

If his words move you or anyone else to do more good than listening to a talk at General Conference, how can one claim the words of church leaders are better?

Should we judge a message by the fruits of the message, or the title of the messenger?

I agree, I think the scriptural examples of prophets really support what I'm hearing from Dan.  Its correlated Mormonism that has redefined the word prophet into a church office in the priesthood, rather than a description for someone speaking with a prophetic voice.  

[Jeanne]

36 minutes ago, hope_for_things said:

Last week I got to watch the Believer documentary and I also watched the LoveLoud concert (as broadcast live on Youtube this year).  And i can't shake how powerful the messages were to me.  The way Dan Reynolds has conducted himself and the messages that he's sending about how we need to treat our LGBTQ brothers and sisters have been truly inspirational. 

Another thing he did during the concert that I just found so powerful, was he talked about how he's seeing a counselor and how we should all see a counselor if we're struggling and that nobody should be ashamed of that, and how its an important resource and can help us to learn and grow.  I just loved how clear and open and breaking down of the stigmas that our society often has about really basic things like this.  I found it so refreshing.  He's not a man of sophisticated and eloquent speech, but his words speak to the regular person in such a clear and powerful way.  I was just so impressed by him and what I heard.  

The thought that came to mind is that what I'm hearing from Dan Reyolds is prophetic.  And in a time where prophesy from church leaders often seems completely absent, I was impressed that the prophetic speech I'm hearing is not coming from a religious leader, but a rock star.  I honestly feel this is true, and I wanted to share in case anyone else might have thoughts about it.  Thanks

Dan Reynolds is a very relatable and loving human being.  I was to volunteer at the concert..but let someone from SLC take my place.  I love that he sees so clearly what others may not see..a genuine love.

[kllindley]

2 hours ago, hope_for_things said:

Last week I got to watch the Believer documentary and I also watched the LoveLoud concert (as broadcast live on Youtube this year).  And i can't shake how powerful the messages were to me.  The way Dan Reynolds has conducted himself and the messages that he's sending about how we need to treat our LGBTQ brothers and sisters have been truly inspirational. 

Another thing he did during the concert that I just found so powerful, was he talked about how he's seeing a counselor and how we should all see a counselor if we're struggling and that nobody should be ashamed of that, and how its an important resource and can help us to learn and grow.  I just loved how clear and open and breaking down of the stigmas that our society often has about really basic things like this.  I found it so refreshing.  He's not a man of sophisticated and eloquent speech, but his words speak to the regular person in such a clear and powerful way.  I was just so impressed by him and what I heard.  

The thought that came to mind is that what I'm hearing from Dan Reyolds is prophetic.  And in a time where prophesy from church leaders often seems completely absent, I was impressed that the prophetic speech I'm hearing is not coming from a religious leader, but a rock star.  I honestly feel this is true, and I wanted to share in case anyone else might have thoughts about it.  Thanks

I think the word Dan was going for is "Savior."  Clearly he still has work to do if all you got was prophetic.

[Vanguard]

2 hours ago, SouthernMo said:

The word prophet is one used often, but misunderstood and misapplied in LDS Mormonism. If we use the Bible dictionary definition, i think we could call Dan Reynolds a prophet: 

“In a general sense a prophet is anyone who has a testimony of Jesus Christ by the Holy Ghost, as in Num. 11:25–29; Rev. 19:10.”

If his words move you or anyone else to do more good than listening to a talk at General Conference, how can one claim the words of church leaders are better?

Should we judge a message by the fruits of the message, or the title of the messenger?

If it's anyone who has a "testimony of Jesus Christ by the Holy Ghost" then it's interesting Reynolds is given the title considering there must be millions who are also deserving of said title, that is, unless the poster intends to convey something else? ; )

Who made the claim the church leaders words are better? I believe the comment was an opinion that most Mormons would disagree with HFT's assessment.

Did someone judge Reynolds' message? Or are you referring to the Opie's claim that prophesy seems "completely absent" from church leadership?

Hmmmm... 

[SouthernMo]

1 minute ago, Vanguard said:

If it's anyone who has a "testimony of Jesus Christ by the Holy Ghost" then it's interesting Reynolds is given the title considering there must be millions who are also deserving of said title, that is, unless the poster intends to convey something else? ; )

Who made the claim the church leaders words are better? I believe the comment was an opinion that most Mormons would disagree with HFT's assessment.

Did someone judge Reynolds' message? Or are you referring to the Opie's claim that prophesy seems "completely absent" from church leadership?

Hmmmm... 

Yes - anyone can be a prophet. Perhaps the OP didn’t intend for me to take the definition further/wider, but I think we need to understand the teachings on what a prophet is.

No - I can’t show any quotes or evidence that LDS have said that church leaders’ words are better than Dan Reynolds. But dollars to donuts, someone on this site would say that. I’ve read some negative things about Reynolds on this board.

Is prophecy absent from the church?  It depends on how it is defined. Good advice that carries the spirit - I’ve seen plenty of it.  Teachings that are unique, new, or foretell the future - not as much.

[Vanguard]

13 minutes ago, SouthernMo said:

Yes - anyone can be a prophet. Perhaps the OP didn’t intend for me to take the definition further/wider, but I think we need to understand the teachings on what a prophet is.

No - I can’t show any quotes or evidence that LDS have said that church leaders’ words are better than Dan Reynolds. But dollars to donuts, someone on this site would say that. I’ve read some negative things about Reynolds on this board.

Is prophecy absent from the church?  It depends on how it is defined. Good advice that carries the spirit - I’ve seen plenty of it.  Teachings that are unique, new, or foretell the future - not as much.

Again, if there are millions who would fit the definition of "prophet" (according to the definition you proffered) then what's the point of making a public claim about Reynold's being one? My Christian neighbor also fits the definition. And so what?

I'm sure you're probably right - I would be one of them. There are many instances of those in leadership positions that I believe have carried more inspiring messages than Reynolds. There are also some on this site who would say negative things about the church leaders and their lack of any ability to prophesy. Did you notice the OP? What say you?

And how is Reynolds' teachings "unique, new, and [able to] foretell the future?

By the way, I love the phrase "dollars to donuts" and use it almost on a daily basis. I don't think I've ever stumbled upon another who also uses it! Regardless of where this exchange may lead, you now have my undying devotion. ; )

Edited August 3, 2018 by Vanguard

[SouthernMo]

1 minute ago, Vanguard said:

Again, if there are millions who would fit the definition of "prophet" (according to the definition you proffered) then what's the point of making a public claim about Reynold's being one? My Christian neighbor also fits the definition. And so what?

This is a good point. I don’t have a defense for the OP’s reason. My statement growing the breadth of definition of the prophet in retrospect was a true claim of my belief, but tangential.

Nope - I don’t see anything in Reynolds’ words that is prophetic in the sense of my shared definition of prophecy.

I’ll fully admit to inconsistency in my definition(s) of prophet/prophecy/prophetic. But, in my defense, i think LDS doctrine and tradition aren’t always consistent in usage either!

I hope I’m answering your questions, but also showing that they are my answers, and I’m not trying to “prove” anything.

[jbarm]

Dan Reynold's is a prophet?  Is that because he is scratching your itchy ears?

Dan loves to roll out the 'returned missionary' and active/devout Mormon tag in the many different interviews he has given since before and after the documentary was released at Sundance (sort of like the former Bishop hunger striker likes to do).  Let's take a look at his devoutness in his own actions:

• Dan has mentioned several times in interviews promoting his documentary how he was 'shamed' by the Church and BYU for having premarital sex with his girlfriend. He was apparently suspended from going to BYU for a while as a result.  He specifically points how how wrong this action was and how natural and beautiful sexual relations are between two heterosexual people, even if they are unmarried.
• Haven't heard any prophets promoting the dismantling of the law of chastity while at the same time announcing their new enlightenment for the ignorant Mormon masses.  But perhaps Dan  is part of a 'new wave' of prophets?

Here is one of the quotes mentioning this (from the 'Ellen' Show):

Quote

 

He told DeGeneres that his interest in queer advocacy work began after he was expelled from Brigham Young University after being caught having sex with his girlfriend of four years. 

“That was a really devastating moment for me ― a lot of needless shame and guilt,” he said. ....

.... “And then feeling a bit of shame in my life over something I shouldn’t have been shamed about helped me to kind of identify, to some degree, with what our LGBTQ youth face all the time within orthodox religion.”

 

 

Apparently feeling shame or guilt over sin is so passe now with the enlightened prophet Dan Reynolds.

These are Dan's own words folks, not mine.  I've been accused elsewhere of being uncharitable for bringing up these quotes, apparently because I don't agree with Dan's prophesies like his followers.

Do whatever you want as long as a pop star approves.  Yep, the secret to lasting happiness.

People who claim to have a great vision of what others should do will have their own words examined for consistency with their claimed adherence to a belief system.

jb

[USU78]

Seriously messed up.

[hope_for_things]

1 hour ago, kllindley said:

I think the word Dan was going for is "Savior."  Clearly he still has work to do if all you got was prophetic.

Can you clarify what this means?  I used the word prophetic, not Dan.  

[kllindley]

7 minutes ago, hope_for_things said:

Can you clarify what this means?  I used the word prophetic, not Dan.  

I'm saying that I believe Dan Reynolds wants to be seen as a Savior. I think he would be disappointed that you think of him as merely prophetic. 

[kllindley]

4 hours ago, hope_for_things said:

The way Dan Reynolds has conducted himself and the messages that he's sending about how we need to treat our LGBTQ brothers and sisters have been truly inspirational. 

So are you also inspired to silence any LGBT brothers and sisters who support the Church and sustain our leaders? Or just to use their stories without permission and take their words out of context?

[Tacenda]

6 hours ago, clarkgoble said:

Huh? I'm not sure most Mormons would say there's no prophetic speech. But of course different people like different things I guess.

BTW - curious as to what you think of the backlash from the left to Reynolds. I confess I was pretty surprised there was such a backlash.

 

I read the article, he wasn't saying anything about Dan or it didn't appear the backlash was aimed at Dan specifically, he was commenting and asking why it had to come from a white guy, straight, married with kids, etc. At the end he makes the comment that he was glad Dan is doing what he's doing if it can save even one life.

I went to LoveLoud, and it was a fun day/night. I was surprised at how many families attended and even saw several LDS there, some were in shorts and their garments were showing, I don't know if it was intentional or not, because it seemed to be everywhere. I don't know why I thought this, dumb thought I guess.

I stood not too far from Steve Young's wife Barb at one time and she had a tag on that said "producer", so I guess she helped produce the show. Also, the Apple owner came and spoke right before Imagine Dragons performed along with the Youngs, and it was pretty awesome what they had to say. Earlier Dan read a statement from the governer of Utah that declared July 28th "LoveLoud Day".

There were several performers, and the crowd was enormous, lots of money was made for the support of the LGBTQ crowd, and I believe the concert definitely kept some of them from taking their lives. 

ETA: Just wanted to share this older video of Barb and Steve Young, I've liked her ever since!

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by Tacenda

[Tacenda]

5 hours ago, Jeanne said:

Dan Reynolds is a very relatable and loving human being.  I was to volunteer at the concert..but let someone from SLC take my place.  I love that he sees so clearly what others may not see..a genuine love.

Oh boy, when I hadn't finished reading your comment here I about freaked out thinking you were there, and how mad I was to have missed you, lol!

[california boy]

Dan Reynolds is giving a much needed voice to a group marginalized by the Mormon Church.  A message where everyone is welcomed and loved rather than inflammatory language describing gay couples and policies against their children.  Good for him.  He is showing a new way.  Prophetic?  Possibly. Will a more welcome and inslusive message win the day?  Or will moral pronouncements about married gay couples by church leaders stay.  Let's hope we don't continue to loose more as young people follow their heart in knowing the will of God.  Time will tell.  

Here is an interesting article on this changing Mormon Culture.

How Mormon pop stars are using their music to support LGBT issues

 

[HappyJackWagon]

10 hours ago, kllindley said:

So are you also inspired to silence any LGBT brothers and sisters who support the Church and sustain our leaders? Or just to use their stories without permission and take their words out of context?

Here we go again.

So are you accusing Reynolds of misrepresenting LGBT individuals? CFR. I'd like to see examples as well as an accusation from a person who feels they were misrepresented.

@kllindley

 

[Atheist Mormon]

15 hours ago, hope_for_things said:

Last week I got to watch the Believer documentary and I also watched the LoveLoud concert (as broadcast live on Youtube this year).  And i can't shake how powerful the messages were to me.  The way Dan Reynolds has conducted himself and the messages that he's sending about how we need to treat our LGBTQ brothers and sisters have been truly inspirational. 

Another thing he did during the concert that I just found so powerful, was he talked about how he's seeing a counselor and how we should all see a counselor if we're struggling and that nobody should be ashamed of that, and how its an important resource and can help us to learn and grow.  I just loved how clear and open and breaking down of the stigmas that our society often has about really basic things like this.  I found it so refreshing.  He's not a man of sophisticated and eloquent speech, but his words speak to the regular person in such a clear and powerful way.  I was just so impressed by him and what I heard.  

The thought that came to mind is that what I'm hearing from Dan Reyolds is prophetic.  And in a time where prophesy from church leaders often seems completely absent, I was impressed that the prophetic speech I'm hearing is not coming from a religious leader, but a rock star.  I honestly feel this is true, and I wanted to share in case anyone else might have thoughts about it.  Thanks

Excuse me? For a minute I was totally lost, perhaps you were talking about something else, but it was the same HBO documentary I watched other day.... Whatever this guy does goes beyond my admiration but describing as "prophetic" is a little overkill. But I liked your post for sure.

[hope_for_things]

11 hours ago, jbarm said:

People who claim to have a great vision of what others should do will have their own words examined for consistency with their claimed adherence to a belief system.

Your disdain for Dan is clear in the uncharitable and judgy things you've said.  I'm not proclaiming we should worship Dan or put him up on a pedestal, that is what religions do to the people they venerate.  I'm saying that the words he's speaking sound prophetic and inspirational to me.  

I don't think of Prophet as a title that has to be examined for consistency, since when were scriptural prophets consistent about anything?  Biblical prophets were often highly flawed people. 

[kllindley]

44 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Here we go again.

So are you accusing Reynolds of misrepresenting LGBT individuals? CFR. I'd like to see examples as well as an accusation from a person who feels they were misrepresented.

@kllindley

 

Yeah. I'm not going to drop it. It's a serious offense. 

I accept the CFR. I have 24 hours. I'll reach out to the individuals. 

[hope_for_things]

11 hours ago, USU78 said:

Seriously messed up.

Yes, tribalism is seriously messed up.