God gives special attention and help to certain people

[Johnnie Cake]

On ‎9‎/‎6‎/‎2017 at 8:11 AM, stemelbow said:

Sometimes I wonder how anyone can take Church seriously. 

In testimony meeting this past Sunday we had a few stories of God doing miraculous things for people.  The momentum started as a lady explained:

Missionary went up right after, as I recall:

The other missionary got up:

Ok. Whatever.  I really don't think God works this way, necessarily.  But ok.  I'll leave people to their assumptions.

I read this article yesterday

Was a member of the 12 assigned in advance to areas wherever tragedy has struck?  Or was this coincidence?  It feels far more likely that it's coincidence.  I could never be a 12 because I could never see myself as this important. 

Thoughts?

There are multiple random unexplainable occurrences that take place in my life literally on a daily basis.  Were I a believer, I would interpret these as miracles...but because I am not, I see them for what they are...random unexplainable occurrences. 

The reason the missionary's house did not flood was not because he was serving a mission but because his house was built at a higher elevation than other houses in his neighborhood or that his house was at a point beyond the volume of water to reach his house...do I know this for fact despite never seeing his house or neighborhood...YES...water flows and fills in lower elevations and can only go as high as the volume of water in any given area...more volume...higher elevation...lower volume lower elevation...thats just how the world works.

The Lady with the locked front door, same exact thing....this was no miracle...her husband merely left the window open...had he not, they would have broken a window to enter their house...again that's just how the world works. 

Elder Bednar sees miracle's everywhere he goes, It's his job to promote the illusion of miracles...if his premises where true, that God sends apostles to places they are most needed in times of catastrophe, then 01. I would suggest everyone avoid being in places where apostles are assigned in the future...for those are the places where terrible events are most likely to occur...but this does not happen.  literally thousands of visits have been made by apostles over the years and how many of these were timed perfectly to coincide with a catastrophe?  One the one Bednar took advantage of. 02. why haven't apostles been pre-assigned to areas where other catastrophes have occurred in the past to give tender mercies to others in need? Why? because no one can predict the future...if they could an apostle would be pre-positioned for every catastrophe that impacted every predominate LDS populated area in the world to hand out tender mercies exactly as the catastrophe occurs.  But of course this just does not happen...Elder Bednar is taking advantage of a completely random event that he happened to fall into being at the right place at the right time to take advantage of this event... Its ridiculous to believe that God pre-planned months in advance for him to be there at that particular time 

Edited September 7, 2017 by Johnnie Cake

[Marginal Gains]

12 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

I don't deny (and I don't think anyone here whose views are similar to my own would deny) that it's easy to conclude, if one only looks at evidence from this mortal Second Act alone, that life is not fair.  The thing is, we don't remember the premortal First Act, and the post-mortal Third Act hasn't happened yet.  One must consider the three-act, premortal-mortal-postmortal drama in toto before reaching any such conclusion.

Yeah I don’t disagree, but I think the general theme of the thread is the (unwitting?) disingenuousness of individuals who only look for “hits” in isolation without placing them in the proper context alongside all the “misses”. If a person is going to claim God found their car keys, they need to explain why simultaneously God didn’t stop a child being abused, or a missionary being run over or etc. And the answer isn’t that the person with the newly found car keys is somehow more special, which sometimes I feel is exactly the point they are trying to make. Perhaps to themselves?

Edited September 7, 2017 by Marginal Gains

[Storm Rider]

20 hours ago, stemelbow said:

I would continue to suggest it doesn't matter what I think.  If someone wants to attribute any old thing to God, fine by me.  It might as well be God since someone believes it.  But it certainly raises the question for some of us, it seems.  Why would God be so seemingly careless and arbitrary?  Not everyone who locks themselves out gets back in easily.     

     This is what is so strange - you admit that if someone wants to attribute blessings to God it is okay. Then you condemn God for being careless and arbitrary.  How does that logic work?  Do you see how distorted your logic is in this instance.  You admit that it is individuals' choice to attribute to God and then blame God for their choice.

I don't judge them as such. 

     I am not sure you read what you write.  Your entire thread is about condemning God. And yes, you do. You have stated that they see themselves as so important that God attends to their every need/whim.  That is what is meant by judging.

How so?    

     Easy, you began this thread stating, "Was a member of the 12 assigned in advance to areas wherever tragedy has struck?  Or was this coincidence?  It feels far more likely that it's coincidence.  I could never be a 12 because I could never see myself as this important. Someone that is full of pride sees themselves as important.  Did you intend to mean something else.  What then if not that the apostles view themselves as "this important"?

ok.  Not sure that really addresses the issue, but ok. 

     The purpose is that even though ...oh forget it. It does not matter.

Sounds good.  I figure I wouldn't for a couple of reasons.  One as I mentioned--I simply can't see myself pretending to be that important.  And I simply don't follow the rules enough in the Church to work my way up the latter.  Too many of the rules are arbitrary and useless.  Plus at this point its like a 1 in a couple of million chance, it seems.  It's really unlikely.  I'd wager going forward the push with continue to be more outside the US to make it to the top 15, so perhaps with that, my chances would even get smaller.  But even throwing out the chances business, I have little desire to work my way up. 

     This is just a repeat that if someone thinks, an apostle for example, that their being in a certain place when the need is great is by God's direction then they are full of pride or at least seeing themselves as so important God would actually work through them.  I don't get it - I see it as being so humble that an apostle who dedicates himself to service to God actually has faith that God is working through him.  First you blame God and excuse people for thinking they have been blest and then you go back to condemning individuals who have the temerity to think God would use them to achieve his objectives.  So who is wrong, God or humans?   You have condemned them both, but you don't see yourself as that important.  Seems to me you have set yourself pretty high on the pole as you judge that little twits below you.

 

[Kenngo1969]

I was searching for something unrelated, and I happened upon this address/article by Elder D. Todd Christofferson from 2012.  I think it might have relevance to this discussion: https://www.lds.org/ensign/2012/01/recognizing-gods-hand-in-our-daily-blessings?lang=eng

[Johnnie Cake]

It is a miracle.... Pictures of the Missionaries home saved from the flood is on the news...  It's true...his home was the only home in his neighborhood not ravaged by flood waters

 

[Kenngo1969]

9 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

I don't deny (and I don't think anyone here whose views are similar to my own would deny) that it's easy to conclude, if one only looks at evidence from this mortal Second Act alone, that life is not fair.  The thing is, we don't remember the premortal First Act, and the post-mortal Third Act hasn't happened yet.  One must consider the three-act, premortal-mortal-postmortal drama in toto before reaching any such conclusion.

 

8 hours ago, Marginal Gains said:

Yeah I don’t disagree, but I think the general theme of the thread is the (unwitting?) disingenuousness of individuals who only look for “hits” in isolation without placing them in the proper context alongside all the “misses”. If a person is going to claim God found their car keys, they need to explain why simultaneously God didn’t stop a child being abused, or a missionary being run over or etc. And the answer isn’t that the person with the newly found car keys is somehow more special, which sometimes I feel is exactly the point they are trying to make. Perhaps to themselves?

One reason why God doesn't intervene to prevent all of the "bad" stuff from happening is His commitment to the free will of His children.  Another reason why He doesn't so intervene is because that would obviate the need to have faith in Him.  (If I were absolutely certain God would answer all my prayers in exactly the way I wanted Him to, there would be no need for me to have faith in Him.)  Another reason why He doesn't so intervene is because the evil that certain members of humankind perpetrate upon their fellows will stand as a testimony against them and will condemn them at the judgment.  (God will not be mocked.)  Another reason why He doesn't so intervene is because this is, by nature and by design, a fallen world in which we all, to a greater or lesser extent, must learn to deal with (to put it very mildly, in many cases, I realize) less-than-ideal circumstances.  Another reason why He doesn't intervene is because to do so would circumvent His (perhaps-unfathomable, at least to the mortal mind, anyway) larger purposes.  Another potential reason why He might not intervene is because whatever else He is or is not, He is also a Sovereign.  And so on.

I have no need to explain why, in specific cases, God did or did not intervene in a certain circumstance, or why He chose to intervene in a certain way in a certain circumstance (or chose not to). I don't know why God, apparently, chose not to intervene before I had two failed hip reconstructions (with all of the attendant physical consequences ensuing); I'm exceedingly grateful, however, that He chose to intervene by guiding a surgeon's hand in three consecutive subsequent operations: It's entirely possible that I would not be walking at all today, let alone being able to do so relatively free of pain, if He had not.  Conversely, I don't know why God apparently has seen fit to withhold certain other blessings I have earnestly sought, but I have faith that doing so, for whatever reason, is more in line with His purposes for me.

Meanwhile, the standing of those recipients (or non-recipients) of blessings before God is between God and them; and my standing before God is between God and me.  I dunno. Perhaps the recipients of those interventions really are better than I am, but, in any case, it doesn't do any good for me, with my "toddler's" perspective (in Eternal terms) to shake my widdo fists and stomp my widdo feet at how "unfair" the Sovereign Lord of the Universe is being, or to declare, in a fit of "Spiritual Sibling Rivalry," "See?!  I always knew Heavenly Dad loves you best!"  Nor would it do any good for them to respond likewise to the blessings I have received. 

[RevTestament]

On 9/6/2017 at 8:11 AM, stemelbow said:

Sometimes I wonder how anyone can take Church seriously. 

In testimony meeting this past Sunday we had a few stories of God doing miraculous things for people.  The momentum started as a lady explained:

Missionary went up right after, as I recall:

The other missionary got up:

Ok. Whatever.  I really don't think God works this way, necessarily.  But ok.  I'll leave people to their assumptions.

I read this article yesterday

Was a member of the 12 assigned in advance to areas wherever tragedy has struck?  Or was this coincidence?  It feels far more likely that it's coincidence.  I could never be a 12 because I could never see myself as this important. 

Thoughts?

Yes. My wife is one of those special people. While working as an aide she got a blessing that said a job opportunity would come as a gift to her. That year she applied for a teaching position which opened up even though she had no education degree or teachers certificate. The school was against hiring any applicants needing an ARL, but she got hired anyway. She prays for stuff and God answers her prayers. God loves her. She just prays in simple faith.

Me - I get a hernia.... that's my "blessing" 

[Marginal Gains]

8 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

 

One reason why God doesn't intervene to prevent all of the "bad" stuff from happening is His commitment to the free will of His children.  Another reason why He doesn't so intervene is because that would obviate the need to have faith in Him.  (If I were absolutely certain God would answer all my prayers in exactly the way I wanted Him to, there would be no need for me to have faith in Him.)  Another reason why He doesn't so intervene is because the evil that certain members of humankind perpetrate upon their fellows will stand as a testimony against them and will condemn them at the judgment.  (God will not be mocked.)  Another reason why He doesn't so intervene is because this is, by nature and by design, a fallen world in which we all, to a greater or lesser extent, must learn to deal with (to put it very mildly, in many cases, I realize) less-than-ideal circumstances.  Another reason why He doesn't intervene is because to do so would circumvent His (perhaps-unfathomable, at least to the mortal mind, anyway) larger purposes.  Another potential reason why He might not intervene is because whatever else He is or is not, He is also a Sovereign.  And so on.

I have no need to explain why, in specific cases, God did or did not intervene in a certain circumstance, or why He chose to intervene in a certain way in a certain circumstance (or chose not to). I don't know why God, apparently, chose not to intervene before I had two failed hip reconstructions (with all of the attendant physical consequences ensuing); I'm exceedingly grateful, however, that He chose to intervene by guiding a surgeon's hand in three consecutive subsequent operations: It's entirely possible that I would not be walking at all today, let alone being able to do so relatively free of pain, if He had not.  Conversely, I don't know why God apparently has seen fit to withhold certain other blessings I have earnestly sought, but I have faith that doing so, for whatever reason, is more in line with His purposes for me.

Meanwhile, the standing of those recipients (or non-recipients) of blessings before God is between God and them; and my standing before God is between God and me.  I dunno. Perhaps the recipients of those interventions really are better than I am, but, in any case, it doesn't do any good for me, with my "toddler's" perspective (in Eternal terms) to shake my widdo fists and stomp my widdo feet at how "unfair" the Sovereign Lord of the Universe is being, or to declare, in a fit of "Spiritual Sibling Rivalry," "See?!  I always knew Heavenly Dad loves you best!"  Nor would it do any good for them to respond likewise to the blessings I have received. 

If God is committed to the free will of His children, and intervening negates that, He shouldn’t intervene at all, ever. The moment He intervenes, by your statement, He removes free will.

Did God guide just your surgeons hands, just his hands when operating on you, or does He guide all surgeons hands all the time regardless of wether they believe in Him or not?

Why did God remove your surgeons free will by intervening and guiding His hands?

[Kenngo1969]

2 hours ago, Marginal Gains said:

If God is committed to the free will of His children, and intervening negates that, He shouldn’t intervene at all, ever. The moment He intervenes, by your statement, He removes free will.

I don't think it removes free will for Him to intervene as suits His purposes.  It would remove free will if He always intervened.  And again, this is the Second Act.  We can't remember the First Act, and the Third Act hasn't happened yet. (Notwithstanding the fact that I was voted "Best Philosopher" of the THS Class of 1988, I lack the philosophical chops to say more than that, so I'll have to leave the philosophical defense of my position to people who are smarter than I am.  )

Quote

Did God guide just your surgeons hands, just his hands when operating on you, or does He guide all surgeons hands all the time regardless of wether they believe in Him or not?

With due respect, you need to reread the post to which you are responding.  Reread it as many times as necessary, for comprehension this time.  

Quote

Why did God remove your surgeons free will by intervening and guiding His hands?

He didn't remove His free will.  (You're seriously mischaracterizing my position if you think I believe that, absent God's intervention, this surgeon would actively have done harm to me.)  Ever hear of the Hippocratic Oath?  The fact that this sawbones (as an old law professor of mine used to call them) is a damn good surgeon didn't hurt.  And why are you ignoring all of the other reasons I mentioned in my previous post for Bad Things Happening to Good People in favor of focusing on this one?

Edited September 8, 2017 by Kenngo1969

[Marginal Gains]

11 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

I don't think it removes free will for Him to intervene as suits His purposes.  It would remove free will if He always intervened.  And again, this is the Second Act.  We can't remember the First Act, and the Third Act hasn't happened yet. (Notwithstanding the fact that I was voted "Best Philosopher" of the THS Class of 1988, I lack the philosophical chops to say more than that, so I'll have to leave the philosophical defense of my position to people who are smarter than I am.  )

With due respect, you need to reread the post to which you are responding.  Reread it as many times as necessary, for comprehension this time.  

He didn't remove His free will.  (You're seriously mischaracterizing my position if you think I believe that, absent God's intervention, this surgeon would actively have done harm to me.)  Ever hear of the Hippocratic Oath?  The fact that this sawbones (as an old law professor of mine used to call them) is a damn good surgeon didn't hurt.  And why are you ignoring all of the other reasons I mentioned in my previous post for Bad Things Happening to Good People in favor of focusing on this one?

With due respect, I’ve reread your post and comprehended it. My question still stands.

Where do I insinuate the surgeon would have actively done you harm without God’s intervention?

If God hadn’t guided your surgeons hands, would he have done a worse job?

Does your surgeon recognise that he wouldn’t have done as good a job but for God guiding his hands?

Does your surgeon do a worse job when left to operate solely relying upon his own training, experience and skill?

These are genuine questions that I think you are obligated to answer because of your claim that it was God guiding your surgeon which resulted in the outcome being better for you.

Edited September 8, 2017 by Marginal Gains

[Kenngo1969]

4 minutes ago, Marginal Gains said:

With due respect, I’ve reread your post and comprehended it. My question still stands.

However many times you have read it, nonetheless, it seems that, alas!, you still don't understand it.

Quote

Where do I insinuate the surgeon would have actively done you harm without God’s intervention?

You stated that God "removed [my surgeon's] free will by intervening and guiding his hands."

Quote

If God hadn’t guided your surgeons hands, would he have done a worse job?

 

I don't know.  I have no empirical, objective evidence for the belief that God guided my surgeon's hands.  The only evidence I have for that belief is that God told me He did so.  I know that will drive you crazy, but you'll simply have to deal with it the best you can.  

Quote

Does your surgeon recognise that he wouldn’t have done as good a job but for God guiding his hands?

I don't know.  He knows I believe that, because I have told him so.  I do know that the type of surgery he performed on me is incredibly complex.  I do know that the post-operative complication rate is very high, and that the post-operative prognosis isn't very good even when the surgery is successful (even when it is performed by the best in the field).  I do know that a high percentage of people who undergo surgical operations such as the one(s) I underwent have additional surgery to address further problems (even when it is performed by the best in the field).  All of that having been said, neither he nor anyone else has operated on me in the last 32 years.  

Quote

Does your surgeon do a worse job when left to operate solely relying upon his own training, experience and skill?

I don't know.  I do know that he keeps my file separate from those of the rest of his patients and former patients.  I think he considers my case and its outcome especially notable (see my previous paragraph).  I've never explicitly asked him if that is the case; it's simply something I have inferred from the tenor of our conversations over the years.  (And we have had a considerable number of conversations in the years since I "officially" was his patient; more than the norm, I gather, but I don't have any evidence for that, either, so sue me. )  A few years ago, we needed some medical documentation for something (a handicap parking placard/plate for a vehicle, I think it was), and my father went to visit him.  A member of the doctor's staff said, "I'll pull the file," and he said, "That won't be necessary," and signed off immediately on whatever it was.

Notwithstanding the fact that I haven't "officially" been his patient for 32 years, his memory of my case seems especially vivid.  Most doctors, and especially most surgeons (and this is not an indictment of them), if a patient were to tell them that the patient needed something (especially after that length of time), would say, "Let me get back to you after I've pulled and reviewed the file," or something similar.  Not him.

[Marginal Gains]

56 minutes ago, Marginal Gains said:

Where do I insinuate the surgeon would have actively done you harm without God’s intervention?

13 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

You stated that God "removed [my surgeon's] free will by intervening and guiding his hands."

And you think I’m the one with reading difficulties?

[Marginal Gains]

23 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

I don't know.  I have no empirical, objective evidence for the belief that God guided my surgeon's hands.  The only evidence I have for that belief is that God told me He did so.  I know that will drive you crazy, but you'll simply have to deal with it the best you can.  

I don't know.  He knows I believe that, because I have told him so.  I do know that the type of surgery he performed on me is incredibly complex.  I do know that the post-operative complication rate is very high, and that the post-operative prognosis isn't very good even when the surgery is successful (even when it is performed by the best in the field).  I do know that a high percentage of people who undergo surgical operations such as the one(s) I underwent have additional surgery to address further problems (even when it is performed by the best in the field).  All of that having been said, neither he nor anyone else has operated on me in the last 32 years.  

I don't know.  I do know that he keeps my file separate from those of the rest of his patients and former patients.  I think he considers my case and its outcome especially notable (see my previous paragraph).  I've never explicitly asked him if that is the case; it's simply something I have inferred from the tenor of our conversations over the years.  (And we have had a considerable number of conversations in the years since I "officially" was his patient; more than the norm, I gather, but I don't have any evidence for that, either, so sue me. )  A few years ago, we needed some medical documentation for something (a handicap parking placard/plate for a vehicle, I think it was), and my father went to visit him.  A member of the doctor's staff said, "I'll pull the file," and he said, "That won't be necessary," and signed off immediately on whatever it was.

Notwithstanding the fact that I haven't "officially" been his patient for 32 years, his memory of my case seems especially vivid.  Most doctors, and especially most surgeons (and this is not an indictment of them), if a patient were to tell them that the patient needed something (especially after that length of time), would say, "Let me get back to you after I've pulled and reviewed the file," or something similar.  Not him.

And that’s back to the OP, which I’ve commented on several times, but I think this best fits in response.

Quote

Yeah I don’t disagree, but I think the general theme of the thread is the (unwitting?) disingenuousness of individuals who only look for “hits” in isolation without placing them in the proper context alongside all the “misses”. If a person is going to claim God found their car keys, they need to explain why simultaneously God didn’t stop a child being abused, or a missionary being run over or etc. And the answer isn’t that the person with the newly found car keys is somehow more special, which sometimes I feel is exactly the point they are trying to make. Perhaps to themselves?

Don’t get me wrong, I’m glad your surgery went well.

But while God was guiding your surgeons hands and finding car keys, he was choosing to not keep children out of the hands of abusers.

Edited September 8, 2017 by Marginal Gains

[Atheist Mormon]

On 9/6/2017 at 9:11 AM, stemelbow said:

God gives special attention and help to certain people

Thoughts?

That is a good/positive way to look at things, if you can and ignore 65/75 % of the planets unfortunate and countless species which suffer under human population explosion. And I can't mention here about the awful things that befell on my Mormon family, people that so faithfully were serving Church ...All of sudden their lives went into pieces....And a little more; Today Kirk Cameron says in Huffington Post "Kirk Cameron: Hurricanes Are Sent By God For ‘Humility, Awe And Repentance’.....

I live in Houston.......

[Marginal Gains]

2 minutes ago, Atheist Mormon said:

That is a good/positive way to look at things, if you can and ignore 65/75 % of the planets unfortunate and countless species which suffer under human population explosion. And I can't mention here about the awful things that befell on my Mormon family, people that so faithfully were serving Church ...All of sudden their lives went into pieces....And a little more; Today Kirk Cameron says in Huffington Post "Kirk Cameron: Hurricanes Are Sent By God For ‘Humility, Awe And Repentance’.....

I live in Houston.......

Quote

Cameron recorded his video from an airport in the Orlando area as he left Florida despite the approaching category 5 message of “humility, awe and repentance.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/kirk-cameron-hurricanes_us_59b22199e4b0dfaafcf6d9a4

[rodheadlee]

On 9/6/2017 at 7:11 AM, stemelbow said:

Sometimes I wonder how anyone can take Church seriously. 

In testimony meeting this past Sunday we had a few stories of God doing miraculous things for people.  The momentum started as a lady explained:

Missionary went up right after, as I recall:

The other missionary got up:

Ok. Whatever.  I really don't think God works this way, necessarily.  But ok.  I'll leave people to their assumptions.

I read this article yesterday

Was a member of the 12 assigned in advance to areas wherever tragedy has struck?  Or was this coincidence?  It feels far more likely that it's coincidence.  I could never be a 12 because I could never see myself as this important. 

Thoughts?

I think everyone should pray that Irma changes course and goes North before it hits Florida.

[Johnnie Cake]

On ‎9‎/‎6‎/‎2017 at 8:11 AM, stemelbow said:

Sometimes I wonder how anyone can take Church seriously. 

In testimony meeting this past Sunday we had a few stories of God doing miraculous things for people.  The momentum started as a lady explained:

Missionary went up right after, as I recall:

The other missionary got up:

Ok. Whatever.  I really don't think God works this way, necessarily.  But ok.  I'll leave people to their assumptions.

I read this article yesterday

Was a member of the 12 assigned in advance to areas wherever tragedy has struck?  Or was this coincidence?  It feels far more likely that it's coincidence.  I could never be a 12 because I could never see myself as this important. 

Thoughts?

I just need to add that I find Elder Bednar's assertion that God orchestrated his schedule to put him in Virginia immediately after this shooting to be very offensive.  To assert that God would orchestrated Bednar's schedule but do nothing to avert the shooting is beyond the pale.  Bednar is making himself out to be some super special pawn in the hands of God and at the same time throwing his God under the bus by exposing the impedance of God in how he fails to interject himself in to the lives of humanity.  Elder Bednar is so full of himself...he's an embarrassment to your church.

[Kenngo1969]

What you, apparently, are missing (or downplaying, or ignoring, perhaps because it doesn't fit your [apparently] godless paradigm or what you do or do not want to believe about a God who does exist), Marginal Gains, is that I haven't told separate stories in this thread: I haven't told one story about an 11-13 year old kid whom God apparently didn't like, or toward whom He was ill-disposed, or toward whom He was, at best, apathetic, and so He allowed that 11-13 year old to suffer through two failed hip reconstructions and their painful, grueling, apparently-fruitless aftermath, on the one hand, and another story about a 14-15 year old kid whom he liked, or toward whom he was well-disposed, or toward whom (fortunately!) He was not apathetic, on the other hand, and so He blessed that 14-15 year old and the surgeon who operated on him through three subsequent successful operations.

The young man who went through all of that, the initial two failures and the subsequent three successes?  Same kid.  So my experience can't an instance of "we're back to the opening of the thread: apparently God loves some more than He loves others."

Edited September 8, 2017 by Kenngo1969
Removed repetitive phrase for clarity

[Kenngo1969]

On 9/8/2017 at 7:30 AM, Atheist Mormon said:

... I live in Houston.......

I'm sorry for what your family, and you, are going through.

[Kenngo1969]

On 9/8/2017 at 8:57 AM, Johnnie Cake said:

  Elder Bednar is so full of himself...he's an embarrassment to your church.

A few months ago, you were on here wringing your hands about the fact that notorious historical figures have had proxy ordinances performed on their behalf by members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and what an embarrassment this is for our Church (that is, yours, Johnnie Cake's, and your interlocutors' Church).

Changed your tune?  

[Atheist Mormon]

3 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

I'm sorry for what your family, and you, are going through.

Thanks Kenngo.......The house was fine just the building we work was flooded.....I was advising my son who lives in Utah that he won't get couple days heads up as we do here, if there's an earthquake in SLC.

[Kenngo1969]

11 minutes ago, Atheist Mormon said:

Thanks Kenngo.......The house was fine just the building we work was flooded.....I was advising my son who lives in Utah that he won't get couple days heads up as we do here, if there's an earthquake in SLC.

Hopefully your employer has some decent disaster contingency plans in place.  Despite the fact that I am a reprehensible, reprobate, utterly irredeemable excuse for a human being; that women, children, and small animals flee in abject terror at the mere mention of my name;  that even mere weeds utterly refuse to grow within a five-mile radius of my home; and that even my pet maggot preferred death to my continued company, I wish you and yours well.   

[Avatar4321]

I believe in a God that is personal. He responds to us personally, IED we desire Him to do so.

If we want nothing to do with Him, He tends to give us what we want.

He has blessed me many times in my life. With small things and large things.

[RevTestament]

On 9/7/2017 at 4:29 PM, Johnnie Cake said:

It is a miracle.... Pictures of the Missionaries home saved from the flood is on the news...  It's true...his home was the only home in his neighborhood not ravaged by flood waters

 

If you don't have flood insurance, this is the next best thing. My understanding is that most in Houston did not have flood insurance. That makes it a very expensive place to live right now....

[Johnnie Cake]

7 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

A few months ago, you were on here wringing your hands about the fact that notorious historical figures have had proxy ordinances performed on their behalf by members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and what an embarrassment this is for our Church (that is, yours, Johnnie Cake's, and your interlocutors' Church).

Changed your tune?  

I'm no longer a member....that said, one of the draw backs of being on a limited status is I'm also given a limited time frame to edit posts. Soon after making this post I had second thoughts, feeling it was too mean and insensitive and went back to delete it...but due to my restrictions was unable to.