The best way to live

[The Nehor]

58 minutes ago, california boy said:

Sounds like all you straight people who love kids and don't mind being pregnant for eternity have a wonderful life ahead of you. I wish you all the best.  And you get to look down upon all the rest of us from you thrones of gold and weep for those that just don't want your vision of eternity.   How could that possibly be hard to convince anyone how wonderful that will be.  What's not to like.  

God can give you complete fulfillment. I do not know how but he can.

[Bobbieaware]

2 minutes ago, pogi said:

The underlined parts are exactly what the LDS claim?  What is your deal?  I guess I am confused.  You said that it is not Biblical that God wants us to be happy, and now you are saying that Christ is the way to happiness?  Which is it?

A relationship with God and happiness are inextricably linked, but it is ultimately happiness that makes the relationship worth while for both God and man. 

Snowflake's irrational, inconsistent and illogical process of thought is what happens to the human mind when proving something wrong, at all costs, supplants critical thinking and a sincere, open-minded desire to know truth.

[pogi]

10 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

It is better to focus on being made whole through Christ and that every longing and deficiency in your soul, even the ones you do not understand, will be completely satiated and fulfilled.

Amen to that.

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, snowflake said:

I disagree, being in and nurturing and growing a family is wonderful, but the bible would not argue for this as being the primary purpose of man. You are arguing for your family above God, he comes first!

I would say biblically speaking that "Man's chief end is to glorify God, and to enjoy him forever". (Westminster catechism)

Psalm 73:

²³ Nevertheless I am continually with thee: thou hast holden me by my right hand.

²⁴ Thou shalt guide me with thy counsel, and afterward receive me to glory.

²⁵ Whom have I in heaven but thee? and there is none upon earth that I desire beside thee.

²⁶ My flesh and my heart faileth: but God is the strength of my heart, and my portion for ever.

 

You bring up a good point. Exaltation is also about living with our Father, again, learning from him and being involved in all that he does as we do the same things that he does. It won't just be watching him, though, as if we won't be able to do all that he does. And there is nobody better to learn from, either, even though our Lord and others will have already learned to do everything our Father does by also learning from him, themselves.

Just as I want a family with children to love and nurture, along with my wife as my "helpmeet", our Father (and Mother) also want us their children to love and nurture, as well. We will be involved with our ancestors just as much as our descendents.

[Gray]

39 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Our Father refers to exaltation as the greatest gift he can offer to any of us, referring to the kind of life he lives, himself. Yes it is a subjective statement, even when coming from him, but I take it that he understands all of the other options.

There are a lot of competing ideas out there about what God is actually saying. I'm sure you wouldn't find it convincing or appealing if I told God said that everyone will be single in the eternities. How would I go about convincing you to find that appealing or believe that God said it? I can't. 

[Ahab]

4 minutes ago, Gray said:

There are a lot of competing ideas out there about what God is actually saying. I'm sure you wouldn't find it convincing or appealing if I told God said that everyone will be single in the eternities. How would I go about convincing you to find that appealing or believe that God said it? I can't. 

Right, you can't. And it wouldn't make sense for our Father to want us to live a different kind of life than he does.

[Gray]

28 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Right, you can't. And it wouldn't make sense for our Father to want us to live a different kind of life than he does.

It makes sense to many people that he would, though, because most people believe that God is a very different kind of being than we are. So, it all comes  down to what you find appealing and compelling. 

Edited March 28, 2017 by Gray

[Ahab]

17 minutes ago, Gray said:

It makes sense to many people that he would, though, because most people believe that God is a very different kind of being than we are. So, it all comes  down to what you find appealing and compelling. 

No. It all comes down to which way of life is actually the best way of life. That some people think inferior ways of life are appealing and compelling only means they don't see the best way of life as the best.

[Gray]

5 minutes ago, Ahab said:

No. It all comes down to which way of life is actually the best way of life. That some people think inferior ways of life are appealing and compelling only means they don't see the best way of life as the best.

The problem is how do you show that what you think the best way of life is actually the best way of life? The answer is you can't, because "best" is totally subjective. 

[Garden Girl]

1 hour ago, snowflake said:

You are totally missing my point, Christ's teachings are to point us to him, He is the mediator, He is the way the truth and the life. He is the way to happiness "rejoice in the Lord". Are you rejoicing in him or his teachings? Glorifying Him and worshiping him forever is the purpose of man.

Jesus didn't come down so I could be happy is my point. That was not his purpose. He came down as a sacrifice for me, for us all, that we can again come into a relationship with God.   I can become happy by worshipping and loving Him. Do you see the difference?

 

 

Good morning, snowflake...

Or are you missing the point of the LDS view of happiness.... we follow the Savior's admonitions as put forth in the scriptures, including those listed above by pogi... when we read them carefully, we see that the happiness promised is the end result... is predicated on our being wise and trusting in the Lord... of rejoicing in the Lord... when we find our hope in the Lord... when we love and believe in the Lord though we can't see him... when we take care of the needy... when we find our strength in the Lord... when we show mercy on the poor... when we follow the commandments... when we have patience and endure to the end of our life... 

Our scriptures are replete throughout with teaching us to find happiness by worshiping the Lord... 2 Nephi 25:26 & 29 "And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach of Christ, we prophesy of Christ, and we write according to our prophesies, that our children may know to what source they may look for a remission of their sins."  "And now behold, I (Nephi) say unto you that the right way is to believe in Christ and deny him not; and Christ is the Holy One of Israel: wherefore ye must bow down before him, and worship him with all your might, mind, and strength, and your whole soul; and if ye do this, ye shall in nowise be cast out."

I could go on and on with numerous scriptures from throughout our canon that teach that it is through Christ that we find true and complete happiness...

GG

[Ahab]

11 minutes ago, Gray said:

The problem is how do you show that what you think the best way of life is actually the best way of life? The answer is you can't, because "best" is totally subjective. 

By listing all the things that make the best way the best and seeing what the lesser ways lack. 

It doesn't matter that some people don't like all of the best things or think that the lesser ways are better. 

Like how the best way includes being able to have full fellowship privileges with our Father and our Lord and the Holy Ghost, wherever they are, and also with our spouses and our children forever.

The most inferior way has none of that, and better ways have only some of that, with only the best way having it all.

Plus the best way is the most intelligent way, with God's glory being the highest degree of intelligence, while lesser ways are for those of lesser degrees of intelligence.

 

 

[Gray]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

By listing all the things that make the best way the best and seeing what the lesser ways lack. 

It doesn't matter that some people don't like all of the best things or think that the lesser ways are better. 

Like how the best way includes being able to have full fellowship privileges with our Father and our Lord and the Holy Ghost, wherever they are, and also with our spouses and our children forever.

The most inferior way has none of that, and better ways have only some of that, with only the best way having it all.

Plus the best way is the most intelligent way, with God's glory being the highest degree of intelligence, while lesser ways are for those of lesser degrees of intelligence.

 

 

This sounds like a list that would only be convincing to people who already share your views. There are a million different ideas about how you get to heaven, and no way to prove that any of them are right. 

[Ahab]

1 minute ago, Gray said:

This sounds like a list that would only be convincing to people who already share your views. There are a million different ideas about how you get to heaven, and no way to prove that any of them are right. 

I'm satisfied with the concept that there must needs be a "best way to live" and that every other way must needs be inferior to that way.

You should think about that for a while.

 

[Calm]

4 hours ago, Gray said:

I agree that it can change, but usually through life experience and/or just getting older. You can't make an argument to a 14 year old that lentil soup is delicious. Either they like it or they don't, but that 14 year old may get a taste for it in her 40s. 

I don't know that you can intentionally change your feelings by trying to "align" yourself with God. You can tell yourself that you should feel a certain way because God said so, but in the back of your head you'll know you really don't feel it. 

I would disagree.  Putting effort into changing attitudes can change them.  Interesting you chose food. My son started to cook for fun and suddenly he was liking more foods overnight as a teen where before he had a very limited palate. Suddenly he adored mushrooms once he was the one cooking them.  If I cook something, my daughter doesn't enjoy it as much as when my daughter-in-law does it (whether because it is different or my dial has made more numerous elaborate meals so "good food" is associated with her in my daughter's mind or it is seen as a treat or something else, the same thing can be rejected as unpleasant that is enjoyed in her dishes that week). My memory says there are studies that show when you invest in something, you become more positive towards it.  They were teaching this back when I was in college so I am assuming this is well known by now as I am not finding references this afternoon as got to get moving by 1.

Edited March 28, 2017 by Calm

[Jeanne]

This version sounds like our mortal life..hard work and worrying  I love families..but we don't have to be glued together  I would like some time with my husband and have an eternal life like the retirement we had planned...take off..visit the kids..and go again.

[Ahab]

14 minutes ago, Jeanne said:

This version sounds like our mortal life..hard work and worrying  I love families..but we don't have to be glued together  I would like some time with my husband and have an eternal life like the retirement we had planned...take off..visit the kids..and go again.

I envision that too. Like now how we're all coming here as if we're all going away to college to be tested. Meanwhile our Lord is in charge and our Father and Mother are having some sort of vacation, even though we can communicate with him/them, and he/they with us. They could be off playing on a beach somewhere for all that we know.

Edited March 28, 2017 by Ahab

[Jeanne]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

I envision that too. Like now how we're all coming here as if we're all going away to college to be tested. Meanwhile our Lord is in charge and our Father and Mother are having some sort of vacation, even though we can communicate with him/them, and he/they with us. They could be off playing on a beach somewhere for all that we know.

I hope they are!  They certainly deserve it! Of course, it would be nice if they would visit more often.

[Ahab]

2 minutes ago, Jeanne said:

I hope they are!  They certainly deserve it! Of course, it would be nice if they would visit more often.

A thousand years for us is like a day for them.  So we should let them enjoy their 1 week vacations!

[JLHPROF]

6 hours ago, snowflake said:

You are totally missing my point, Christ's teachings are to point us to him, He is the mediator, He is the way the truth and the life. He is the way to happiness "rejoice in the Lord". Are you rejoicing in him or his teachings? Glorifying Him and worshiping him forever is the purpose of man.

Jesus didn't come down so I could be happy is my point. That was not his purpose. He came down as a sacrifice for me, for us all, that we can again come into a relationship with God.   I can become happy by worshipping and loving Him. Do you see the difference?

I would want nothing to do with such a God.
If the extent of our relationship with God is to do nothing more than worship and glorify him forever I would have no respect for him.

Thank goodness that kind of God only exists in the misinterpretations of the Bible some people have.

[Ahab]

3 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

I would want nothing to do with such a God.
If the extent of our relationship with God is to do nothing more than worship and glorify him forever I would have no respect for him.

Thank goodness that kind of God only exists in the misinterpretations of the Bible some people have.

Um, think in different dimensions, bro.

The only thing snowflake said there that was wrong is that Jesus didn't come down here so that he/snowflake could be happy.

The best way to glorify and worship God is to be like him, or to at least try to be like him, and the better we do that the more we will live the best life that is possible.

 

[JLHPROF]

2 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Um, think in different dimensions, bro.

The only thing snowflake said there that was wrong is that Jesus didn't come down here so that he/snowflake could be happy.

The best way to glorify and worship God is to be like him, or to at least try to be like him, and the better we do that the more we will live the best life that is possible.

 

Do you really think God is so petty a creature that his primary purpose in creating man is to receive worship and glory for himself?
Yes, when we become like him we glorify and worship him through our actions, but he created us to become like him first and worship him second.

[Ahab]

3 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

Do you really think God is so petty a creature that his primary purpose in creating man is to receive worship and glory for himself?
Yes, when we become like him we glorify and worship him through our actions, but he created us to become like him first and worship him second.

Worship is all about emulation.

The worshipper becoming or at least trying to be like what he worships, incorporating as much of the worshipped as the worshipper can.

Our Father created us by loving his spouse and together they reproduced themselves as another individual and their desire for us is to become like them so that we can experience life and joy as they do.

Do you really think God our Father doesn't want us to become like him?

[Guest]

20 hours ago, Ahab said:

We (LDS) teach that our Father's way of life is the best kind of life that is possible, don't we. We call it eternal life, and exaltation, with its complementary and equally perfect life for women, and with it including the ability to have children forever and ever. Mothers and Fathers in love and raising their children with love while helping them to also have the possibility of the best life that is possible for our kind of being.

Occasionally we run into some of our brothers and sisters who don't think that is the best life that is possible, though. So we patiently and lovingly try to teach them and explain to them that it is, even if they don't think so. At least for a while before letting them think however they want to think, in their errors.

It's not like we can force anyone to believe us or what is right. Right?

Any thoughts or tips that might work best to explain why the best life possible is actually the best life possible, though? 

I think sometimes we just don't explain it very well, or that some people just don't understand it correctly, because in the final analysis it really is the best kind of life that is possible for any of us.

 

It is not compulsory, it is just available to those who want to strive for such a life. All life is about choice, and all may choose whatever life they wish in immortality. There are some who do not believe in divorce, but do not wish to be sealed to their spouse for all eternity. I think that what we teach, is to obey all of God's commands, that is what brings "joy". It also helps leave all options open...even in the eternities one can opt out if they like. Free will is one of the greatest gifts God has ever given in this life, I doubt he would deny it in the eternities. To do so would be against God's nature, and a violation of his own law. 

[Ahab]

4 minutes ago, Bill "Papa" Lee said:

It is not compulsory, it is just available to those who want to strive for such a life. All life is about choice, and all may choose whatever life they wish in immortality. There are some who do not believe in divorce, but do not wish to be sealed to their spouse for all eternity. I think that what we teach, is to obey all of God's commands, that is what brings "joy". It also helps leave all options open...even in the eternities one can opt out if they like. Free will is one of the greatest gifts God has ever given in this life, I doubt he would deny it in the eternities. To do so would be against God's nature, and a violation of his own law. 

Yes, of course.  If I haven't said it clearly enough yet then I will say it again now.

People are not required to live the best kind of life that is possible for people. People can choose less than the best if they want to.

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Yes, of course.  If I haven't said it clearly enough yet then I will say it again now.

People are not required to live the best kind of life that is possible for people. People can choose less than the best if they want to.

What I was trying to imply (or say) is this...

Not everyone (in or out of the Church) just won't fit into the same mold. Having said that, often our leaders (Bishops, Elders Quorum Presidents, High Priest Group Leaders) still push home teachers to convince us to push our families that it is the only thing they should want...even our own families.