Breaking priesthood Covenant?

[Duncan]

In the 84th Section verse 41 it says

41 But whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come.

 

 

So my question is how do you break this covenant? is it through excommunication, inactivity, apathy, self righteousness? any tips?

[The Nehor]

Turning from it completely. Hard to do but if you need help draw up a pentagram and do a standard summoning ritual. The entity that arrives will walk you through it.

[flameburns623]

22 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Turning from it completely. Hard to do but if you need help draw up a pentagram and do a standard summoning ritual. The entity that arrives will walk you through it.

I don't know about "standard summoning".

My wife being Wiccan, I've been through a few of those rituals. The entities being summoned were usually friendy, benign beings, not at all intereted in doing anyone spiritua harm.

And the potluck dinners afterword were pretty good. Like something at an LDS meetinghouse. Minus green jello.

[VideoGameJunkie]

I think it refers to apostates and those like the 1/3 host in heaven who followed Lucifer.

Edited May 11, 2016 by VideoGameJunkie

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, flameburns623 said:

I don't know about "standard summoning".

My wife being Wiccan, I've been through a few of those rituals. The entities being summoned were usually friendy, benign beings, not at all intereted in doing anyone spiritua harm.

And the potluck dinners afterword were pretty good. Like something at an LDS meetinghouse. Minus green jello.

Wiccans are play acting wannabes. Hunt down a real demonologist.

[CV75]

2 hours ago, Duncan said:

In the 84th Section verse 41 it says

41 But whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come.

 

 

So my question is how do you break this covenant? is it through excommunication, inactivity, apathy, self righteousness? any tips?

I think we break it by not building up the church, magnifying our calling, not receiving the sanctification by the Spirit, and not receiving the Lord’s servants and by extension Him and His Father (see verses 32-37). But like baptism, it is not a full baptism until we receive the Gift of the Holy Ghost, so we have to altogether turn from doing these things (never repent).

[mfbukowski]

2 hours ago, Duncan said:

In the 84th Section verse 41 it says

41 But whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come.

 

 

So my question is how do you break this covenant? is it through excommunication, inactivity, apathy, self righteousness? any tips?

You mean what do we get to do before we are in REAL trouble?

[The Nehor]

11 minutes ago, mfbukowski said:

You mean what do we get to do before we are in REAL trouble?

I like to push old ladies down the stairs and eat puppies.

[CV75]

10 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I like to push old ladies down the stairs and eat puppies.

How about pushing old ladies down the stairs while eating their puppies?

[Jeanne]

1 hour ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

I think it refers to apostates and those like the 1/3 host in heaven who followed Lucifer.

VGJ, not all apostates actually turn away.  I mean, there are many things that we do not deny or hold on to.

[JLHPROF]

2 hours ago, Duncan said:

In the 84th Section verse 41 it says

41 But whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come.

 

 

So my question is how do you break this covenant? is it through excommunication, inactivity, apathy, self righteousness? any tips?

A covenant is an agreement between two parties.

It is broken by not upholding our part of the agreement.  If we can determine what we agree to do, then we know how we would break it.
(But not fulfilling the conditions of the agreement doesn't necessarily free us from that obligation - we may still have to fulfill it one day).

[hope_for_things]

3 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Turning from it completely. Hard to do but if you need help draw up a pentagram and do a standard summoning ritual. The entity that arrives will walk you through it.

Moroni?  

[Vanguard]

3 hours ago, Duncan said:

In the 84th Section verse 41 it says

41 But whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come.

 

 

So my question is how do you break this covenant? is it through excommunication, inactivity, apathy, self righteousness? any tips?

My take on it is that there is no way to know. Just as we are all individuals in God's eyes we are also endowed with individual capacities literally different from everyone else. Not receiving "forgiveness of one's sins" is not based on the behavior but rather the capacity of that particular individual to live up to to the covenant's expectations regardless of whether a "covenant" has indeed been made.

[Duncan]

do you think it's possible to be active but still breaking your part of the covenant? I mean like people who go to church but are jerks or lazy or just don't really care about the gospel or are in it for themselves and not to serve

[Vanguard]

9 minutes ago, Duncan said:

do you think it's possible to be active but still breaking your part of the covenant? I mean like people who go to church but are jerks or lazy or just don't really care about the gospel or are in it for themselves and not to serve

Absolutely! People break covenants all the time. But I thought the point of your OP was to explore covenant breaking ramifications for the afterlife?

[MDalby]

 

It is written that "all manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men" who receive me and repent; "but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven unto men." If men will not repent and come unto Christ, through the ordinances of his gospel, they cannot be redeemed from their spiritual fall, but must remain forever subject to the will of Satan and the consequent spiritual darkness or death unto which our first parents fell, subjecting all their posterity thereto, and from which none can be redeemed but by belief or faith on the name of the Only Begotten Son and obedience to the laws of God. But, thanks be to the eternal Father, through the merciful provisions of the gospel, all mankind will have the opportunity of escape, or deliverance, from this spiritual death, either in time or in eternity, for not until they are freed from the first can they become subject unto the second death, still if they repent not "they cannot be redeemed from their spiritual fall," and will continue subject to the will of Satan, the first spiritual death, so long as "they repent not, and thereby reject Christ and his gospel;" but what of those who do believe, repent of their sins, obey the gospel, enter into its covenants, receive the keys of the Priesthood and the knowledge of the truth by revelation and the gift of the Holy Ghost, and afterwards turn away wholly from that light and knowledge? They "become a law unto themselves," and "will to abide in sin;" of such it is written, "whoso breaketh this covenant, after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come." And again, "Thus saith the Lord, concerning all those who know my power, and have been made partakers thereof, and suffered themselves, through the power of the devil, to be overcome, and to deny the truth and defy my power--they are they who are the sons of perdition, of whom I say that it had been better for them never to have been born, for they are vessels of wrath, doomed to suffer the wrath of God, with the devil and his angels in eternity; concerning whom I have said there is no forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come, having denied the Holy Spirit after having received it, and having denied the Only Begotten Son of the Father--having crucified him unto themselves, and put him to an open shame."--Doc. and Cov. 76:31-35.

(Joseph F. Smith, Gospel Doctrine, pp.14-16)

[Duncan]

3 minutes ago, Vanguard said:

Absolutely! People break covenants all the time. But I thought the point of your OP was to explore covenant breaking ramifications for the afterlife?

well there too but here! how do you do it here (i'm not saying I want to do it but is it possible to break the covenant here)

[Bobbieaware]

3 hours ago, Duncan said:

In the 84th Section verse 41 it says

41 But whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come.

 

 

So my question is how do you break this covenant? is it through excommunication, inactivity, apathy, self righteousness? any tips?

The answer is very simple. Doctrine and Covenants 76 informs us that the only individuals who will not receive forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come are the sons of perdition. Therefore, when the above verse speaks of those who altogether (100%) turn away from the Lord and the sacred covenants they've made with him, it's speaking of those who commit the unpardonable sin by totally and irrevocably turning away from God while standing in the bright spiritual light of noonday. Those doomed to suffer as sons of perdition will never be forgiven because they have absolutely no desire to be forgiven.

[Duncan]

Just now, Bobbieaware said:

The answer is very simple. Doctrine and Covenants 76 informs us that the only individuals who will not receive forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come are the sons of perdition. Therefore, when the above verse speaks of those who altogether (100%) turn away from the Lord and the sacred covenants they've made with him, it's speaking of those who commit the unpardonable sin by totally and irrevocably turning away from God while standing in the bright spiritual light of noonday. Those doomed to suffer as sons of perdition will never be forgiven because they have absolutely no desire to be forgiven.

but is that an inactive MP holder though? some people don't think they've done anything wrong and just do whatever they please, or is maybe inactivity or apathy just on the road leading to be a SOP?

[VideoGameJunkie]

I think the people that need to worry are those who made temple Covenants, broke them, and then turned away and didn't want the gospel anymore and don't repent.

[Bobbieaware]

20 minutes ago, Duncan said:

but is that an inactive MP holder though? some people don't think they've done anything wrong and just do whatever they please, or is maybe inactivity or apathy just on the road leading to be a SOP?

The words "ALTOGETHER turneth therefrom" and "NO FORGIVENESS in this world nor in the world to come" clearly place the individuals spoken of in the sons of perdition category  (a.k.a. the unpardonable sin). Altogether turning away from the Lord and sacred covenants goes far beyond mere inactivity, or apathy.

[VideoGameJunkie]

2 minutes ago, Bobbieaware said:

The words "ALTOGETHER turneth therefrom" and "NO FORGIVENESS in this world nor in the world to come" clearly place the individuals spoken of in the sons of perdition category  (a.k.a. the unpardonable sin). Altogether turning away from the Lord and sacred covenants goes far beyond mere inactivity, or apathy.

What about people who put temple ordinances online and violate their sacredness on purpose? 

[JLHPROF]

1 hour ago, Duncan said:

do you think it's possible to be active but still breaking your part of the covenant? I mean like people who go to church but are jerks or lazy or just don't really care about the gospel or are in it for themselves and not to serve

Absolutely.
Most of us are still learning to keep all of our covenants perfectly.

But are there active members who break the covenant of chastity?  obedience?  sacrifice? etc.
Of course there are.  And most of us don't keep them perfectly.

[VideoGameJunkie]

1 minute ago, JLHPROF said:

Absolutely.
Most of us are still learning to keep all of our covenants perfectly.

But are there active members who break the covenant of chastity?  obedience?  sacrifice? etc.
Of course there are.  And most of us don't keep them perfectly.

And there's people who mock sacredness of temple ceremonies who secretly record sessions and put them online or those who reveal all the signs and tokens online to mock and make fun of them. So many ex members and apostates mock sacred temple rituals and Covenants and temple content on those exmormon message boards. Many do it. 

[JLHPROF]

8 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

And there's people who mock sacredness of temple ceremonies who secretly record sessions and put them online or those who reveal all the signs and tokens online to mock and make fun of them. So many ex members and apostates mock sacred temple rituals and Covenants and temple content on those exmormon message boards. Many do it. 

Hugh Nibley -
"Even though everyone may discover what goes on in the temple, and many have already revealed it, the important thing is that I do not reveal these things; they must remain sacred to me. I must preserve a zone of sanctity which cannot be violated whether or not anyone else in the room has the remotest idea what the situation really is ...No matter what happens, it will, then, always remain secret: only I know exactly the weight and force of the covenants I have made -- I and the Lord with whom I have made them -- unless I choose to reveal them. If I do not, then they are secret and sacred no matter what others may say or do. Anyone who would reveal these things has not understood them, and therefore that person has not given them away. You cannot reveal what you do not know!"