Were Adam And Eve White?

[mfbukowski]

On other boards, John is an expert on Postmodernism and Semiotics, and the nature of language. He upholds the positions of Saussure over Wittgenstein, on the subtleties of the nature of signs and the symbolism in language.  I had a long debate with him about this on the trailer park and cannot link to it.

 

Over here, he suddenly has a friend who asks if Adam is really white, and he cannot handle such a complicated question and he comes here for advice because it's too hard for him to figure out.

 

Uh huh.

[mfbukowski]

I suppose the best thing I can tell my friend is that people here thought his question inappropriate. My answer yesterday was that I thought that, like me, most church members probably didn't care one way or the other. I don't think I'll tell him that some think he doesn't belong in the temple, though he might get a kick out of it. Sometimes I think he really does believe that, with enough prodding, I'll go back.

 

Anyway, sorry again for this thread. Be well.

Uh huh.

Go tell your imaginary "friend" that, and the rest, be sure to include that.

[ERayR]

On other boards, John is an expert on Postmodernism and Semiotics, and the nature of language. He upholds the positions of Saussure over Wittgenstein, on the subtleties of the nature of signs and the symbolism in language.  I had a long debate with him about this on the trailer park and cannot link to it.

 

Over here, he suddenly has a friend who asks if Adam is really white, and he cannot handle such a complicated question and he comes here for advice because it's too hard for him to figure out.

 

Uh huh.

 

You mean that John may not be without guile.  OK John?

[Zakuska]

I suspect they were Adobe Colored.

[Brian 2.0]

Nobody seems to have picked up on my point that as white they represent every color

Just another nitpicky thread.

I demand better content from you people!!!

 

Your point would probably be taken a little better if they were emanating white light (they were the source of the light) instead of light reflecting off their skin.  Using your logic it would be more ideal to have them be black as that would represent every color.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

On other boards, John is an expert on Postmodernism and Semiotics, and the nature of language. He upholds the positions of Saussure over Wittgenstein, on the subtleties of the nature of signs and the symbolism in language.  I had a long debate with him about this on the trailer park and cannot link to it.

 

Over here, he suddenly has a friend who asks if Adam is really white, and he cannot handle such a complicated question and he comes here for advice because it's too hard for him to figure out.

 

Uh huh.

Rofl. Too funny.

[KevinG]

No surprise that we will all be judged by our past utterances.

 

All of us have to combat that to an extent.

[bcuzbcuz]

Nobody seems to have picked up on my point that as white they represent every color

Just another nitpicky thread.

I demand better content from you people!!!

Others have said it but you really need to grab an old physics text and read up on white light and reflected light. Or you can try mixing a tray of water colours and see if you can paint yourself a white colour. Good luck. However, white light can be separated into a full array of colours (think rainbow).

Summa summarum, white skin (reflected light) is not made up of many colours.

[Brian 2.0]

From a purely secular position... if the church's stance is that we don't know what skin color Adam and Eve had so it's irrelevant, then it's just a poor PR and creative choice to cast white Adams & Eves for all the new versions of the temple film that will be seen across the world.

 

Anyone making a movie, or campaign of commercials, understands that casting a diverse set of actors can help people connect and identify more with the brand.  Anyone can eat a McDonald's Cheeseburger, but if McDonald's make a set of new commercials that it intends to air for years with no other alternative commercials, and they cast all 6 leads as white... someone's getting fired, because that's just a bone-headed move.

 

So if it doesn't matter what race they are... then it's just dumb they cast 6 white people.

 

Of course if those creating the films DO think that Adam and Eve were white so they cast accordingly then that dumb person doesn't exist... and it's just a wrong person in their place.

[KevinG]

From a purely secular position... if the church's stance is that we don't know what skin color Adam and Eve had so it's irrelevant, then it's just a poor PR and creative choice to cast white Adams & Eves for all the new versions of the temple film that will be seen across the world.

 

Anyone making a movie, or campaign of commercials, understands that casting a diverse set of actors can help people connect and identify more with the brand.  Anyone can eat a McDonald's Cheeseburger, but if McDonald's make a set of new commercials that it intends to air for years with no other alternative commercials, and they cast all 6 leads as white... someone's getting fired, because that's just a bone-headed move.

 

So if it doesn't matter what race they are... then it's just dumb they cast 6 white people.

 

Of course if those creating the films DO think that Adam and Eve were white so they cast accordingly then that dumb person doesn't exist... and it's just a wrong person in their place.

 

I think they cast the youngest looking Temple workers who memorized the script completely.

[The Nehor]

Everyone needs to pray and ask God to send the real Adam and Eve back down to play themselves in the film so we can end this discussion with the facts......but then again they have perfect bodies now......does that mean it would still be inaccurate?

[Calm]

Budgets and time allowing, it might be nice for Saints in other countries to hear their own language coming out of the mouths of actors who look like them.  Does anyone know if we do dubbing, closed captioning, or real language versions of the instructional films for non-English speaking countries?

My memory says that when the new films came out, there was some commentary on the increase of time even though there was no changes iirc.  This increased time was to allow for languages that take longer than English to say the same thing so it sounds like it is being dubbed.  

 

But I am pretty sure closed captioning is available when needed.

[mfbukowski]

Incidentally if you look at the new temple videos you will see that the church is moving in that direction

In A one film the actors have hair that is clearly dyed very black. I have heard some refer to them as Hispanic. In another film the blonde Eve has has bleached hair. There is at least one Asian that I can remember seeing in one of the films. So I think the church is clearly aware of the issue.

Edited August 24, 2015 by mfbukowski

[Stargazer]

What is with you people?  I thought the question a bit odd, as it was coming ultimately from a member of the Church (John's friend), but felt it was nevertheless legitimate.  Can't give a simple answer to the question?  Absolutely have to fly into a hissy fit?  Criminy.

 

Even considering that Br. Williams is more of a critic than a friend, I would have thought he rated the courtesy of at least having his question read as if it were a genuine inquiry instead of assuming that he's into full attack mode already!

 

If you can't or won't answer, at least do us the courtesy of leaving off going into full jihad over it? 

[HappyJackWagon]

Incidentally if you look at the new temple videos you will see that the church is moving in that direction

In A one film the actors have hair that is clearly dyed very black. I have heard some refer to them as Hispanic. In another film the blonde Eve has has bleached hair. There is at least one Asian that I can remember seeing in one of the films. So I think the church is clearly aware of the issue.

Come on, MF. Are you claiming they are being racially divers by dying white peoples hair different colors? If that's the case, I agree with Brian; terrible PR.

[mfbukowski]

My memory says that when the new films came out, there was some commentary on the increase of time even though there was no changes iirc. This increased time was to allow for languages that take longer than English to say the same thing so it sounds like it is being dubbed.

But I am pretty sure closed captioning is available when needed.

what headphones are requested they are available and only the films having that specific translation are shown. In LA that means that we see the oldest of the new films the most. Because so many need translation.

[Brian 2.0]

Incidentally if you look at the new temple videos you will see that the church is moving in that direction

In A one film the actors have hair that is clearly dyed very black. I have heard some refer to them as Hispanic. In another film the blonde Eve has has bleached hair. There is at least one Asian that I can remember seeing in one of the films. So I think the church is clearly aware of the issue.

 

baby steps, I guess.

 

I have to cut them some slack because I assume the pool of actors they have to choose from is fluent English-speaking temple-recommend holding actors... and I can take a stab at the racial breakdown of the group and I'm sure diversity options is slim pickings.

[jkwilliams]

On other boards, John is an expert on Postmodernism and Semiotics, and the nature of language. He upholds the positions of Saussure over Wittgenstein, on the subtleties of the nature of signs and the symbolism in language.  I had a long debate with him about this on the trailer park and cannot link to it.

 

Over here, he suddenly has a friend who asks if Adam is really white, and he cannot handle such a complicated question and he comes here for advice because it's too hard for him to figure out.

 

Uh huh.

 

Oh, brother. I have never upheld the positions of Saussure. I tried to explain to you why I thought postmodernism was a bad fit with Mormonism. That's all.

 

I didn't come here for advice. I just thought it was an interesting question. 

[jkwilliams]

Uh huh.

Go tell your imaginary "friend" that, and the rest, be sure to include that.

 

Great, now I'm lying. 

[jkwilliams]

What is with you people?  I thought the question a bit odd, as it was coming ultimately from a member of the Church (John's friend), but felt it was nevertheless legitimate.  Can't give a simple answer to the question?  Absolutely have to fly into a hissy fit?  Criminy.

 

Even considering that Br. Williams is more of a critic than a friend, I would have thought he rated the courtesy of at least having his question read as if it were a genuine inquiry instead of assuming that he's into full attack mode already!

 

If you can't or won't answer, at least do us the courtesy of leaving off going into full jihad over it? 

 

It's OK. Like I said, I've burned my share of bridges over here. Looks like too many.

[Stone holm]

Admittedly, I haven't been to the temple in about 9 years, but last I heard, the actors playing Adam and Eve were white Americans. I notice there's some controversy out there about the physical features of our earliest ancestors, who apparently came from Africa. A number of people have suggested that Adam and Eve would have been black. I wonder if having actors who are not Caucasian might be more inclusive to members around the world.

Bigger question were Adam and Eve the ancestors of the Neanderthal? Its now known that White Europeans have the greatest percentage of Neanderthal genes. One would expect that if "Eve" was the Mother of All Living, that between her and her husband they must have had all the genes for all the races or else there was a tremendous amount of mutation going on. If there was a tremendous amount of mutation going on, then it would seem that whichever race was the oldest known race -- then that would be the one which most resembled Adam and Eve. I don't know of any study which states which race was the first to appear. If we go by the Bible, then basically the races would have been established by the time of Noah. My bet is that the first interaction with the Neanderthals was pretty early on. There is some evidence that redheads which are frequently associated with northern Europe have less tolerance to sun, but a greater ability to generate Vitamin D naturally from sunlight. Thus if you were to lay down bets, and if the geneticists are right that humans came out of Africa and moved North -- then one thing would seem to be certain, Adam and Eve were probably not redheads.

[mfbukowski]

Oh, brother. I have never upheld the positions of Saussure. I tried to explain to you why I thought postmodernism was a bad fit with Mormonism. That's all.

I didn't come here for advice. I just thought it was an interesting question.

so now you never came here for advice because you could answer the question but didn't want to? Why was that?

[mfbukowski]

Oh, brother. I have never upheld the positions of Saussure. I tried to explain to you why I thought postmodernism was a bad fit with Mormonism. That's all.

I didn't come here for advice. I just thought it was an interesting question.

so now you never came here for advice because you could answer the question but didn't want to? Why was that?

[jkwilliams]

so now you never came here for advice because you could answer the question but didn't want to? Why was that?

 

Mark, it doesn't matter. Obviously I made a mistake repeating my friend's question over here. I'm sorry.

[ERayR]

Mark, it doesn't matter. Obviously I made a mistake repeating my friend's question over here. I'm sorry.

 

I sometimes find that something in my former life rises up and bites me in the b***.  Bummer.  At least for me.