A Simple Question For Latter-Day Saint Friends

[FormerLDS]

Your question is ambiguous, and I could answer it both Yes and No.

 

1. Yes, because I have eternal, that is, never-ending existence, as a creature of Heavenly Father.

 

2. No, because I have not yet been granted Eternal life, that is, the life that God leads.

 

I voted Yes, though, because of sense 1, and my hope of sense 2.

 

1. You have defined the LDS concept of "Immortality" not "Eternal Life".  Look it up some time.

2. Agreed [according to LDS theology]

[FormerLDS]

Based on this scripture, do YOU think that faithful LDS have eternal life now?  Do we need to believe that we have eternal life now for us to have it through eternity?  Does it really matter if we believe that we have eternal life now or not?  What seems significant to our eternal life is that we believe in and follow God.  Whether I believe that I have eternal life NOW does not change that fact.   

 

Pogi, I can only say there was a time as an active member of good standing I too thought I had eternal life.  No one can answer this question for you. 

[T-Shirt]

Former, just so we are all on the same page, in your opinion, what does this mean?:

 

"Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood"

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

According to the words of the Savior Himself, one could easily demonstrate that His "eternal life" is given right now, before the final resurrection.

 

"Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day." John 6:54

OK so anyone that takes the sacrament ie, eating his flesh and blood as the apostles did has eternal life? Again you still don't actually have eternal life until the judgement. You literally only have the promise of it.

 

 

So lets cut to the chase. Can you lose your eternal life once you have it?

[pogi]

Pogi, I can only say there was a time as an active member of good standing I too thought I had eternal life.  No one can answer this question for you. 

 

Isn't the reason that you believe that you have eternal life based on the scriptures which state that if you believe in God, then you have eternal life?  If that is all that is required according to you, you should be able to answer that question for anybody who professes to believe in God.

It is a rather simple equation.  Belief in God = eternal life.  

 

You still haven's answered my question of - does it matter if I believe that I have eternal life so long that I believe in and follow God?   

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

Former, just so we are all on the same page, in your opinion, what does this mean?:

 

"Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood"

Good call, best to get the definition out so we are on the same page.

[FormerLDS]

Former, just so we are all on the same page, in your opinion, what does this mean?:

 

"Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood"

 

In my opinion, it is the body of Jesus Christ taken in the moment one believes.

 

"Behold , I stand at the door, and knock : if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." Rev 3:20

[FormerLDS]

OK so anyone that takes the sacrament ie, eating his flesh and blood as the apostles did has eternal life? Again you still don't actually have eternal life until the judgement. You literally only have the promise of it.

 

 

So lets cut to the chase. Can you lose your eternal life once you have it?

 

Latter-day Saints partake of the sacrament, but, according to LDS theology, do not have "eternal life" until "after the final resurrection".  How then could "flesh and blood" be the sacrament?   

 

I have never seen any indication that one can lose eternal life.  That would be "mortal life".  Consider John 10:28  "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish , neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand."

[ERMD]

I'm going to waste some time by saying that participating in this thread is a waste of time.

 

Out!

[Okrahomer]

Pop into a RS or EQ meeting some time and ask 10 average members and see if 9/10 don't say "yes, I believe I have eternal life".

 

I make it a point to stop and ask every missionary I encounter this single question and I have only had one or two ever qualify what I meant by "eternal life".

 

Interesting.  So you only have anecdotal evidence.  Do you think the "statistic" might change were you to more carefully define what you mean by "eternal life"?

[FormerLDS]

Isn't the reason that you believe that you have eternal life based on the scriptures which state that if you believe in God, then you have eternal life?  If that is all that is required according to you, you should be able to answer that question for anybody who professes to believe in God.

It is a rather simple equation.  Belief in God = eternal life.  

 

You still haven's answered my question of - does it matter if I believe that I have eternal life so long that I believe in and follow God?   

 

Pogi, in your opionion, why were the rejected of the savior in Matthew 7 turned away?  Did they not believe God?  Did they not believe in Jesus Christ (they performed miracles in His name)?  I'd be willing to bet their works rivalled anything we have ever performed (cast out devils, prophesy, wonderful works, etc).  Do you really think they didn't attend church, read the scriptures with sincere intent or tithe of all they posess?

 

"21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them , I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

 

Or perhaps their faith was in worthy behavior PLUS Jesus Christ...

[FormerLDS]

Interesting.  So you only have anecdotal evidence.  Do you think the "statistic" might change were you to more carefully define what you mean by "eternal life"?

 

No, the results of this poll are publically available.

 

For clarification, by "eternal life" I mean "eternal life".  There is only one definition in LDS theology and in the Bible. 

[FormerLDS]

I'm going to waste some time by saying that participating in this thread is a waste of time.

 

Out!

 

"Everyone you will ever meet knows something you don't know."

 ---- Bill Nye

 

[Okrahomer]

No, the results of this poll are publically available.

 

For clarification, by "eternal life" I mean "eternal life".  There is only one definition in LDS theology and in the Bible. 

 

I'm curious:  have you ever conducted your "poll" among people of another faith tradition?  Do the results vary by denomination?

[pogi]

Pogi, in your opionion, why were the rejected of the savior in Matthew 7 turned away?  Did they not believe God?  Did they not believe in Jesus Christ (they performed miracles in His name)?  I'd be willing to bet their works rivalled anything we have ever performed (cast out devils, prophesy, wonderful works, etc).  Do you really think they didn't attend church, read the scriptures with sincere intent or tithe of all they posess?

 

"21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them , I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

 

Or perhaps their faith was in worthy behavior PLUS Jesus Christ...

 

According to Christ, these people were "workers of iniquity"  Perhaps they did all of this for their own glory instead of God's, making all of their "good deeds" condemnable.

 

I thought that belief alone is what grants eternal life?  Are you suggesting there is something more?  If so, then we are agreed.

Please share your thoughts on this passage.  What did they not do right?

Notice that in Matthew 7 those that were turned away, were only turned away after a final judgment.  This life is still probationary.  If there is an eternal life Now, then reason would suggest that there must be a eternal death or condemnation NOW as well.  Why then a final judgment?

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

Latter-day Saints partake of the sacrament, but, according to LDS theology, do not have "eternal life" until "after the final resurrection".  How then could "flesh and blood" be the sacrament?   

 

I have never seen any indication that one can lose eternal life.  That would be "mortal life".  Consider John 10:28  "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish , neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand."

Its called a symbol. When Christ offered the last supper were the Apostles literally eating Christ? What Christ said was that, "This bread represents my body and this wine represents my blood".

 

 

And there are plenty of indications that you can lose salvation.  Notice that the scripture says "Neither shall any man pluck" What bout God? Can he pluck them out of his own hand?

 

Paul tells us that we can lose salvation and so does Peter.

 

We could also look at the Parable of the sheep and the goats in Matthew 25. What did the sheep do that the goats didn't do?

Edited April 9, 2014 by Mola Ram Suda Ram

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

In my opinion, it is the body of Jesus Christ taken in the moment one believes.

 

"Behold , I stand at the door, and knock : if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." Rev 3:20

But that is not supported by scriptures. I do appreciate your opinion on the matter I just disagree that rev 3:20 is talking about eating Christ's flesh and blood.  I think this verse has more to do with people accepting Christ. If we do accept him we will gain more knowledge and we will also be saved.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Mola Ram Suda Ram

[thesometimesaint]

In my opinion, it is the body of Jesus Christ taken in the moment one believes.

 

"Behold , I stand at the door, and knock : if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." Rev 3:20

Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

James 2:19

[Calm]

In my opinion, it is the body of Jesus Christ taken in the moment one believes.

Remind me please. Are you the one who equates the Bible itself with Christ (since both have been called the Word of God iirc)?

And does one literally take in the body of Christ and if so, how?

If you are Catholic, literal makes sense. Not sure it does if you are not.

Edited April 9, 2014 by calmoriah

[Calm]

Latter-day Saints partake of the sacrament, but, according to LDS theology, do not have "eternal life" until "after the final resurrection".  How then could "flesh and blood" be the sacrament?   

 

So you believe the sacrament is literal and not symbolic? Do you have to partake of the sacrament to be saved in eternal life according to your belief?

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

If you are Catholic, literal makes sense. Not sure it does if you are not.

I was thinking this same thing, however Catholics typically don't say things the same way as FLDS is saying things. He sounds more Evangelical. And it has been a while and I cannot remember where he falls in to the religious side of things.

[Calm]

No, the results of this poll are publically available.

 

The poll is statistically invalid and provides us with no information beyond what choices people willing to take the poll on this message board might give.

[Calm]

 

For clarification, by "eternal life" I mean "eternal life".  There is only one definition in LDS theology and in the Bible.

So you agree that the official LDS definition is in accord with the Bible.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Hi Bill!  Trust you are doing well my friend.

Some days up, some down. But that is how it is with everyone. My mother died two weeks ago, now I have to get this house fixed up and sold. I put down a contract on a new house today.

[Calm]

I just disagree that rev 3:20 is talking about eating Christ's flesh and blood.  I think this verse has more to do with people accepting Christ. If we do accept him we will gain more knowledge and we will also be saved.

Yes, "with me" suggests we are sitting at the table by his side (feast imagery is common in the scriptures), not "on me" which might imply eating Christ's flesh and blood.