Can A Person Be Saved "without" Obedience?

[Billy]

The scriptures do not specifically make tithing a thing of the past. Unless you can specifically prove me wrong, your argument fails. The operative word is specifically.

Can you show me that it was practiced in the Church after the death of Christ?

[Zakuska]

Moving on to the New Testament, we see that Jesus clearly did not do away with the tithe. In fact, He emphatically stated that it should continually be practiced (Matthew 23:23). We further see the New Testament tithe expounded in the Book of Hebrews. Recounting Abraham's tithe to Melchezidek, Hebrews chapter 7:8 draws an interesting parallel: "And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth." The word "here" in this verse is the Greek word hode and means "in this same spot." In other words, the spot where the author was standing as he wrote these words was the very spot where men (present tense) receive tithes. Since this was written roughly 35 years after Jesus' death and resurrection, it is obvious that the receiving of tithes had continued into the New Testament. Furthermore, note the latter part of the verse: "...but there he receiveth them (also present tense), of whom it is witnessed that he liveth." This could not refer to anyone but Jesus Himself.

In addition, the New Testament tithe is further underscored by numerous early church fathers:

"The Jews were constrained to a regular payment of tithes; Christians, who have liberty, assign all their possessions to the Lord, bestowing freely not the lessor portions of their property (i.e., giving no less than the tithe), since they have the hope of greater things." Irenaeus

"Tithes are required as a matter of debt, and he who has been unwilling to give them has been guilty of robbery. Whosoever, therefore, desires to secure a reward for himself . . . let him render tithes, and out of the nine parts let him seek to give alms."-Augustine

"If anyone shall not do this [pay tithes] he is convicted of defrauding and supplanting God."-Jerome (4)

http://www.james-dave.com/faq.html

1) Christ himself said it should be paid- Matt. 23:23

2) 35 years later when the book of hebrews was written, people where paying tithing

3) less than 300 years later tithing was still being paid. As well as alms (ie Fast offerings)

How much more proof do you need D. Thoma... er... Billy?

[ebeddoulos]

Can you show me that it was practiced in the Church after the death of Christ?

I did. Read. Then it is your turn to prove me wrong.

[Tanyan]

It was definatly taught after the Death of Jesus Christ, great job Zak .

[Billy]

I did. Read. Then it is your turn to prove me wrong.

Can you show me tithing being followed in the NT church from the Bible after the death of Christ?

[Tanyan]

http://www.james-dave.com/faq.html

1) Christ himself said it should be paid- Matt. 23:23

2) 35 years later when the book of hebrews was written, people where paying tithing

3) less than 300 years later tithing was still being paid. As well as alms (ie Fast offerings)

How much more proof do you need thoma... er... Billy?

In case you missed it, right here. . Tanyan LDS JEDI KNIGHT.

[Zakuska]

Can you show me tithing being followed in the NT church from the Bible after the death of Christ?

I just did.

Moving on to the New Testament, we see that Jesus clearly did not do away with the tithe. In fact, He emphatically stated that it should continually be practiced (Matthew 23:23). We further see the New Testament tithe expounded in the Book of Hebrews. Recounting Abraham's tithe to Melchezidek, Hebrews chapter 7:8 draws an interesting parallel: "And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth." The word "here" in this verse is the Greek word hode and means "in this same spot." In other words, the spot where the author was standing as he wrote these words was the very spot where men (present tense) receive tithes. Since this was written roughly 35 years after Jesus' death and resurrection, it is obvious that the receiving of tithes had continued into the New Testament. Furthermore, note the latter part of the verse: "...but there he receiveth them (also present tense), of whom it is witnessed that he liveth." This could not refer to anyone but Jesus Himself.

In addition, the New Testament tithe is further underscored by numerous early church fathers:

"The Jews were constrained to a regular payment of tithes; Christians, who have liberty, assign all their possessions to the Lord, bestowing freely not the lessor portions of their property (i.e., giving no less than the tithe), since they have the hope of greater things." Irenaeus

"Tithes are required as a matter of debt, and he who has been unwilling to give them has been guilty of robbery. Whosoever, therefore, desires to secure a reward for himself . . . let him render tithes, and out of the nine parts let him seek to give alms."-Augustine

"If anyone shall not do this [pay tithes] he is convicted of defrauding and supplanting God."-Jerome (4)

http://www.james-dave.com/faq.html

1) Christ himself said it should be paid- Matt. 23:23

2) 35 years later when the book of hebrews was written, people where paying tithing

3) less than 300 years later tithing was still being paid. As well as alms (ie Fast offerings)

That big enough for you Billy?

[Billy]

http://www.james-dave.com/faq.html

1) Christ himself said it should be paid- Matt. 23:23

Were they still under the law when Christ was still alive?

2) 35 years later when the book of hebrews was written, people where paying tithing

Hebrews Chapter 7 Is recalling the tithes that Abraham paid to Melchezidek.

8In the one case, the tenth is collected by men who die; but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living. 9One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham, 10because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor.

[Tanyan]

Zak, remember the late Gene Scott ?, he was 100 % into Tithing and did scores of .TV Programs from his Ministry on the nessecity of Tithing.

[Zakuska]

Billy, Read the greek.

8In the one case, the tenth is collected by men who die;

This is speaking in "present tense" here on earth.

but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living.

And this is speaking of Christ "Present tense" in heaven.

KJV:

8 And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/c.p...p;version=KJV#8

hōde G5602

1) here, to this place, etc.

http://cf.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon...G5602&t=kjv

Where ever hebrews was being written... Tithing was being collected there... 35 years after Christ.

[ebeddoulos]

Were they still under the law when Christ was still alive?

Hebrews Chapter 7 Is recalling the tithes that Abraham paid to Melchezidek.

8In the one case, the tenth is collected by men who die; but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living. 9One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham, 10because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor.

Billy,

It appears that either you are even less familiar with Greek than I, or you are being deliberately obtuse or you just refuse to admit that you are, yet once again, mistaken. After all you are human. Maybe this will help.

"Or look at it this way: We pay our tithes to priests who die, but Abraham paid tithes to a priest who, the Scripture says, "lives." (Hebrews 7:8 - The Message Bible)

In my copy it is on page 2188.

[Zakuska]

Billy,

It appears that either you are even less familiar with Greek than I, or you are being deliberately obtuse or you just refuse to admit that you are, yet once again, mistaken. After all you are human. Maybe this will help.

• 
  

In my copy it is on page 2188.

Thats funny... when I was younger alls I could see was the old woman.

Now all I see is the young...

[Billy]

Billy, Read the greek.

8In the one case, the tenth is collected by men who die;

This is speaking in "present tense" here on earth.

but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living.

And this is speaking of Christ "Present tense" in heaven.

I can see your point about the present tense, but the whole passage you are quoting is trying to make the point that Melchezidec is greater than the Levitical line because their ancestor Abraham paid tithes to Melchezidek, not a specific direction to the church about tithing.

6But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.

Melchezidek receives tithes from Abraham who is father of the Levitical line

7And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.

Lesser Abraham (Levi) gives tithes to greater Melchezidek

8And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

Levites receive tithes, but there Levites indirectly gave tithes to Melchezidek via Abraham.

9And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.

10For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.

[Zakuska]

Who are these men who receive tithes "HERE" in this place 35 years after Christ and die Billy? Why would there be a command to the church when it was never recended? (Matt. 23:23)

[Billy]

Who are these men who receive tithes "HERE" in this place 35 years after Christ and die Billy?

8And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

And here men that die receive tithes--Levites living at the time

but there he receiveth them--this in context is Melchezidek who received the tithes from Abraham

Remember that this letter is written to the Hebrews, who still practiced their religion as though Christ was another false prophet. Their temple was not destroyed until 70AD, and they still carried on with tithing, animal sacrifices, and the rest of their religious ceremonies. The here was the living Levites who still received tithes from the local Jewish population. The point to this whole passage (in fact the entire chapter 7) is to show them that Melchezidek, and therefore Christ was superior to their Levitical linage.

[ebeddoulos]

I can see your point about the present tense, but the whole passage you are quoting is trying to make the point that Melchezidec is greater than the Levitical line because their ancestor Abraham paid tithes to Melchezidek, not a specific direction to the church about tithing.

I agree that Paul is making the point that the Melchizedek Priesthood is superior to the Aaronic. However, it is also saying that the people at the time Paul wrote the epistle were paying tithing.

â??Now at the present time, men over whom death has power take the tenth; but then it was taken by one of whom it is witnessed that he is living.â? (Hebrews 7:8 â?? Bible In Basic English)

[Zakuska]

8And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

And here men that die receive tithes--Levites living at the time

but there he receiveth them--this in context is Melchezidek who received the tithes from Abraham

Remember that this letter is written to the Hebrews, who still practiced their religion as though Christ was another false prophet. Their temple was not destroyed until 70AD, and they still carried on with tithing, animal sacrifices, and the rest of their religious ceremonies. The here was the living Levites who still received tithes from the local Jewish population. The point to this whole passage (in fact the entire chapter 7) is to show them that Melchezidek, and therefore Christ was superior to their Levitical linage.

Aaaa... but Abraham pre-dated the Levites. And so Tithing belongs to the greater priesthood. And wasnt done away in Christ, Because even Levi payed tithing to the higher priesthood.

Looks as though they stopped and then their temple came tumbling down.

[Fig-bearing Thistle]

Fig-bearing This...,

Scripture says the following,

2Tim.1 ([7] For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind. [9] Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,)

So marriage is a Mormon commandment, not a commandment for Christ's disciples.

Marriage is not necessary to dwell with God the Father after Final Judgment.

Like I say, if we are saved by grace alone with no participation necessary on our parts, then we don't have free will.

You don't recognize marriage as a commandment. But surely there ARE some commandments that you recognize. What about "thou shalt not kill" or "thou shalt honor thy father and mother. Are any of these commandments considered "not necessary" in order to dwell with God?

[Hammer]

On the tithing issue-- wasn't it the law of consecration being lived while Christ was on the earth and shortly there after? If tithing was reinstated it would have been for the same reason's as we are paying tithing now instead of living the law of consecration (D&C 119)

[johnny]

Fig-bearing This...,

Like I say, if we are saved by grace alone with no participation necessary on our parts, then we don't have free will.

Like I said earlier, we have free will. We can participate by accepting God's grace or by not accepting God's grace.

The Book of Mormon perverts the gospel of Christ when it adds the words "after all we can do" to the gospel of Christ which says "by grace are ye saved through faith". The apostle Paul says it is a gift, not of ourselves. It is not of works (see Eph 2 below). By accepting his grace we can have eternal life in our Father's presence.

Eph.2 ([8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.)

You don't recognize marriage as a commandment.

Neither Jesus nor the apostle Paul recognized the Mormon commandment of marriage. Both Jesus and the Apostle Paul taught being unmarried for those who can accept it (see verses below). The modern revelation of Mormonism is simply not consistent with teaching of Jesus and his apostles. If we are disciples of Christ then we keep his commandments.

John.8 ([31] Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; )

Matt.19 (10] His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. [11] But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. [12] For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.)

1Cor.7 ([7] For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that [8] I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I. [9] But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn. [10] And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband: [17] But as God hath distributed to every man, as the Lord hath called every one, so let him walk. And so ordain I in all churches. [20] Let every man abide in the same calling wherein he was called. [32] But I would have you without carefulness. He that is unmarried careth for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please the Lord: [33] But he that is married careth for the things that are of the world, how he may please his wife. [34] There is difference also between a wife and a virgin. The unmarried woman careth for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit: but she that is married careth for the things of the world, how she may please her husband. )

But surely there ARE some commandments that you recognize. What about "thou shalt not kill" or "thou shalt honor thy father and mother.

The Ten Commandments are covered under Jesus' commandment which is love one another (see 1John 3 below).

John.15 ([12] This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.)

Are any of these commandments considered "not necessary" in order to dwell with God?

The Mormon command to marriage (see below) is "not necessary" to have eterna life with our Heavenly Father. If we love Jesus we keep his commandments (John 14:15) not Mormon commandments.

". . . each of us has been commanded to marry and have children so that through our own experience we can learn to be heavenly parents."

Mormon Gospel Principles Chapter 36

http://www.lds.org/library/display/0,4945,11-1-13-46,00.html

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Grace alone cannot save us. It requires a free and willing heart before God's grace has any affect at all on us.

With this statement I assume youâ??re are using "saved" in a Celestial context? Because all men have been saved from death and hell...it is a free gift.

[ebeddoulos]

The Book of Mormon perverts the gospel of Christ when it adds the words "after all we can do" to the gospel of Christ which says "by grace are ye saved through faith".

You and I have discussed this already. Repetition of inanity does not improve on your argument. All you do is put your ignorance on display by proving that you cannot comprehend either the scriptures or a dictionary. Which point you go on to prove in your latest segment:

Neither Jesus nor the apostle Paul recognized the Mormon commandment of marriage. Both Jesus and the Apostle Paul taught being unmarried for those who can accept it (see verses below). The modern revelation of Mormonism is simply not consistent with teaching of Jesus and his apostles. If we are disciples of Christ then we keep his commandments.

You talk of perversion. Judas H. Priest! What you have done to Jesus statement on marriage is truly perverted. What Jesus actually said is diametrically opposite of what you tried to make it appear he said.

Jesus said, "Moses provided for divorce as a concession to your hardheartedness, but it is not part of God's original plan. I'm holding you to the original plan, and holding you liable for adultery if you divorce your faithful wife and then marry someone else. I make an exception in cases where the spouse has committed adultery." Jesus' disciples objected, "If those are the terms of marriage, we're stuck. Why get married?" But Jesus said, "Not everyone is mature enough to live a married life. It requires a certain aptitude and grace. Marriage isn't for everyone. Some, from birth seemingly, never give marriage a thought. Others never get asked--or accepted. And some decide not to get married for kingdom reasons. But if you're capable of growing into the largeness of marriage, do it." (Matthew 19:8-12 â?? The Message â?? The Bible in Contemporary English)

Please note that it was his desciples who said, "it is not good to marry" not Jesus. Such a perversion of Christâ??s message of his affirmation of marriage makes it appear that you have deliberately made yourself into a scriptural eunuch. You poor thing. What part of DO IT do you not understand?

You also perverted Paulâ??s statement on marriage in a very similar manner. Iâ??ll give it all to you in context.

â??Now, getting down to the questions you asked in your letter to me. First, Is it a good thing to have sexual relations?
Certainly--but only within a certain context. It's good for a man to have a wife, and for a woman to have a husband. Sexual drives are strong, but marriage is strong enough to contain them and provide for a balanced and fulfilling sexual life in a world of sexual disorder. The marriage bed must be a place of mutuality--the husband seeking to satisfy his wife, the wife seeking to satisfy her husband. Marriage is not a place to "stand up for your rights." Marriage is a decision to serve the other, whether in bed or out. Abstaining from sex is permissible for a period of time if you both agree to it, and if it's for the purposes of prayer and fasting--but only for such times. Then come back together again. Satan has an ingenious way of tempting us when we least expect it. I'm not, understand, commanding these periods of abstinence--only providing my best counsel if you should choose them.
Sometimes I wish everyone were single like me--a simpler life in many ways! But celibacy is not for everyone any more than marriage is. God gives the gift of the single life to some, the gift of the married life to others.
I do, though, tell the unmarried and widows that singleness might well be the best thing for them, as it has been for me. But if they can't manage their desires and emotions, they should by all means go ahead and get married. The difficulties of marriage are preferable by far to a sexually tortured life as a single.
And if you are married, stay married. This is the Master's command, not mine. If a wife should leave her husband, she must either remain single or else come back and make things right with him. And a husband has no right to get rid of his wife.
For the rest of you who are in mixed marriages--Christian married to nonChristian--we have no explicit command from the Master. So this is what you must do. If you are a man with a wife who is not a believer but who still wants to live with you, hold on to her. If you are a woman with a husband who is not a believer but he wants to live with you, hold on to him. The unbelieving husband shares to an extent in the holiness of his wife, and the unbelieving wife is likewise touched by the holiness of her husband. Otherwise, your children would be left out; as it is, they also are included in the spiritual purposes of God.
On the other hand, if the unbelieving spouse walks out, you've got to let him or her go. You don't have to hold on desperately. God has called us to make the best of it, as peacefully as we can. You never know, wife: The way you handle this might bring your husband not only back to you but to God. You never know, husband: The way you handle this might bring your wife not only back to you but to God.
And don't be wishing you were someplace else or with someone else. Where you are right now is God's place for you. Live and obey and love and believe right there. God, not your marital status, defines your life. Don't think I'm being harder on you than on the others. I give this same counsel in all the churches.â? (Corinthians 7:1-17 â?? The Message â?? The Bible in Contemporary English)

Just in case you still somehow managed to miss it, Paul is reaffirming marriage, from the heart to the bedroom, from the difficulties to the blessings.

Go blow the dust off your Bible, open it up and prayerfully read it so that next time you might actually get something right.

You are now dismissed. Run along.

[Lightbearer]

Like I said earlier, we have free will. We can participate by accepting God's grace or by not accepting God's grace.

The question is what constitutes accepting God's grace? Is it a matter of just confessing with our lips that Jesus is the Christ? Is it having faith in Jesus Christ which motivates us to action? Is it repenting of our sins? Or is it being baptized by those with the authority to do so and entering into a covenant with God that we will endure in faith unto the end? Is it living after the manner of the world or following Christ by keeping His commandments? Is it accepting His servants, for example can you reject Paul or Peter or James or John and still be following Jesus? Is anything we do that happens to be good accounted to us as righteous? Is it possible to fall away from this state of grace? If not then why did both Jesus and the apostles warn us against such?

The Book of Mormon perverts the gospel of Christ when it adds the words "after all we can do" to the gospel of Christ which says "by grace are ye saved through faith". The apostle Paul says it is a gift, not of ourselves. It is not of works (see Eph 2 below). By accepting his grace we can have eternal life in our Father's presence.

Eph.2 ([8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.)

How is stating the same thing that James said "Faith without works is dead" perverting the Gospel? Consider the following:

(2 Peter 3:13-17) "Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness. Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless. And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness."

It is easy to misunderstand the writings of Paul, and if we are in a state of grace in which all our good works are really being done by God like some sort of divine puppet-master then who is pulling the strings after we are "saved" and then we sin? If indeed we have no control over our righteous acts then why does Peter admonish the Saints not to be led away with the error of the wicked and fall from your own stedfastness? It makes no sense at all, we either have agency and can choose good or evil or we do not and God "does it all" in which case it would make God the one responsible for sin. This cannot be instead the truth of the Gospel is that we can choose good over evil. Nobody in the LDS Church is teaching that we can do it by our good works alone... that is not possible. The Book of Mormon teaches that we are saved by the grace of Christ through faith and obedience to His Gospel. The Jews were in a state of apostasy and so tried to justify rejecting Christ by saying they could keep the commandments of Jehovah while rejecting Jesus who was Jehovah who gave them the law, and be justified. Without the atonement this justification is not possible, the purpose of the law was to teach them obedience and faith in the Messiah, they lost sight of the purpose of the law and it became a "law unto itself" which is not what it was for. Christ did not come to nullify the need for obedience, but to offer the means whereby we could become obedient and righteous through the shedding of His blood. Through the covenant of baptism we promise to take upon us the name of Christ, we become His disciples, His followers, and we also promise to always remember Him (something the Jews forgot) and His atonement in the sacrifice of His flesh and blood. We further promise to keep His commandments, meaning to "live by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God." This is important to remember because His apostles and prophets are those He has called to teach His commandments, so it follows that if Joseph Smith did have the First Vision and received the Book of Mormon from God as we claim and testify that he did, then we must obey his teachings as he receives them from God.

Neither Jesus nor the apostle Paul recognized the Mormon commandment of marriage. Both Jesus and the Apostle Paul taught being unmarried for those who can accept it (see verses below). The modern revelation of Mormonism is simply not consistent with teaching of Jesus and his apostles. If we are disciples of Christ then we keep his commandments.

John.8 ([31] Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; )

Matt.19 (10] His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. [11] But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. [12] For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.)

1Cor.7 ([7] For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that [8] I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I. [9] But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn. [10] And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband: [17] But as God hath distributed to every man, as the Lord hath called every one, so let him walk. And so ordain I in all churches. [20] Let every man abide in the same calling wherein he was called. [32] But I would have you without carefulness. He that is unmarried careth for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please the Lord: [33] But he that is married careth for the things that are of the world, how he may please his wife. [34] There is difference also between a wife and a virgin. The unmarried woman careth for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit: but she that is married careth for the things of the world, how she may please her husband. )

I submit that you are in error, Jesus did not teach against marriage, in fact the passage you quote is about divorce and the Law of Moses:

(Matthew 19:3-9) "The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery."

Amazing what happens when you read a scripture in the context it is given. As for Paul to the Corinthians he was giving counsel to those who were called to the ministry at that time, and it was specific to those cases. In fact he even informed Timothy that there would be some in the last days that would forbid to marry:

(1 Timothy 4:1-3) "Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.

So it seems that Paul nor Jesus were against marriage, in fact Jesus first recorded miracle was at a wedding feast.

The Ten Commandments are covered under Jesus' commandment which is love one another (see 1John 3 below).

Absolutely correct, and what will we "do" if we love one another? Let us read from the scripture you suggested:

(1 John 3:1-10) "Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure. Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him. Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother."

I think that sums it up very much for the OP, we cannot be saved without obedience.

[johnny]

ebeddoulos,

You and I have discussed this already. Repetition of inanity does not improve on your argument. All you do is put your ignorance on display by proving that you cannot comprehend either the scriptures or a dictionary. Which point you go on to prove in your latest segment:

Since you are able to comprehend scripture, please display where I am not consistent with scripture.

Please back up your empty words.

Just in case you still somehow managed to miss it, Paul is reaffirming marriage, from the heart to the bedroom, from the difficulties to the blessings.

Paul is reaffirming marriage, just as he is affirming being unmarried for those who accept this calling of being unmarried for the kingdom of God,.

[ebeddoulos]

ebeddoulos,

Since you are able to comprehend scripture, please display where I am not consistent with scripture.

Please back up your empty words.

Thank you for proving my point that you fail to comprehend scripture, dictionary and now it seems my simple posts. I already have here and here.