Church Statement - LBGTQ concert - is this sincere?

[Kenngo1969]

Johnnie Cakester:

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints hasn't "taken such a harsh stance against the LGBTQ community."  Why in the world would it support an event such as this if that were so?  Again, your position seems, to me, simply to be evidence that the Church of Jesus Christ cannot and will not win, unless and until it disavows its teachings on chastity and on traditional marriage.  But contrary to your take on these issues, the Church of Jesus Christ doesn't believe that LGBTQ individuals should be denied housing, the opportunity to earn a living, healthcare, and other things necessary for a productive life.

 

[CV75]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

I Appreciate your thoughtful reply pogi. And I can see that you have arrived at your position honestly. We're I still a believer I would more than likely share your perspective. Please understand I understand why the church has taken such a harsh stance against the lgbtq community...I just believe strongly that they are wrong. Moves like this PR release give me hope that someday the church will claim a revelation and heal this wound. 

I’m sure you haven’t interpreted the Brethren as teaching us not to express respect and love for all God’s children, even the LGBTQ children, or to mistreat them, or to not build respectful communication, understanding and civility with them.

The Church has recognized that not all families have an ideal structure, but still supports all of them as capable of encouraging the family members to keep God’s covenants. For those that do not, she supports them foster such secular values of temporal safety and protection of the rising generation (and education, self-reliance, etc.). This is why she helps everyone and anyone in humanitarian and relief efforts, for example.

To borrow a phrase from the 60's, we're witnessing a “homosexual revolution” of sorts. A movement is not an event. If a bunch of pot-smoking, free-love hippies at Woodstock dedicated a set to raising awareness to educate Native Americans, I'm the sure the Church (assuming the locale and media environment were equal) would have supported it. (That example is not an invitation to sidetrack / derail into other social issues of the past! ).

 

Edited August 18, 2017 by CV75

[USU78]

14 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I think he had reference to my whimsical and satirical rendering of LGBTQWERTYUIOPXYZ. I have explained it was a comment on an unwieldy abbreviation that keeps growing in length.

I didn't think a member of the community would be so humor-impaired. 

QWERTY was an especially nice touch.

Mazel TUIOP!

[Johnnie Cake]

53 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

Johnnie Cakester:

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints hasn't "taken such a harsh stance against the LGBTQ community."  Why in the world would it support an event such as this if that were so?  Again, your position seems, to me, simply to be evidence that the Church of Jesus Christ cannot and will not win, unless and until it disavows its teachings on chastity and on traditional marriage.  But contrary to your take on these issues, the Church of Jesus Christ doesn't believe that LGBTQ individuals should be denied housing, the opportunity to earn a living, healthcare, and other things necessary for a productive life.

 

We must live in different worlds. And if your world is reality and its me in Lala land. Then help me understand how virtually everything the church stands for works against equality for lgbtq's. Remember in my world equal = equal. I just don't see that in yours. So which of us in living in lala  land.?

[Johnnie Cake]

At this s very moment I'm sitting on my boat in the middle of bear lake..enjoying music and a perfect afternoon...just floating...my life is amazing...I love my life 

[Tacenda]

28 minutes ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At this s very moment I'm sitting on my boat in the middle of bear lake..enjoying music and a perfect afternoon...just floating...my life is amazing...I love my life 

I don't want to know!  I so want to go to Bear Lake, I hear the lake has risen like in the old days. Lucky bum you! 

[Kenngo1969]

22 minutes ago, Johnnie Cake said:

We must live in different worlds. And if your world is reality and its me in Lala land. Then help me understand how virtually everything the church stands for works against equality for lgbtq's. Remember in my world equal = equal. I just don't see that in yours. So which of us in living in lala  land.?

I'm reasonably certain that this benefit, the support for it by members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and the support for it by the institutional Church of Jesus Christ, is occurring in the world we both inhabit, Cakester.  I'll simply use you as "Exhibit A" to prove how the Church is "danged if it does, and danged if it don't" when it comes to the LGBTQIAQWERTYIOPXYZ Community.

[stemelbow]

On ‎8‎/‎16‎/‎2017 at 8:29 AM, hope_for_things said:

I'm in shock at this statement today, because I typically expect after getting one church statement that I like (the one yesterday condemning white supremacists) that the next statement will be something I don't like.  And surprise surprise now another statement I like in support of the LGBTQ concert for Love Loud that's happening later this month.  (I will be there, can't wait!)  I would like to dissect this statement a little because I think its great, but I think it conflicts with some of the church's policies and statements by leaders in the past couple years.  

I couldn't find the actual statement on the LDS newsroom site, so I'm just quoting from the snippets in this Dnews article.  

Contradictions in the statement include the part that says "to foster a community of inclusion in which no one is mistreated because of who they are or what they believe".  The church's current policy and the rhetoric by some leaders in the past few years have mistreated people in the LGBTQ community.  Its plain mistreatment is what the church is doing.  I sincerely hope this statement is representative of a future goal/ethic, but the church really needs to look at itself first, because this is hypocritical to make this statement and then to not practice what they preach.  

Thoughts?  

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865686887/LDS-Church-issues-statement-of-support-for-LGBTQ-concert-event.html

I'd say it sincerely reflects the voice of most leaders in the Church.  There might be some who'd love to change something, word it differently, or who might even reject it outright.  But as I understand, a rule in being a GA is you have to accept the will of the majority.  That may be first discovered as a rule for the top 15, but I'd wager it also suggests that if the top 15 decide something all other GAs must abide, in spite fo their personal preferences. 

[Johnnie Cake]

1 hour ago, Tacenda said:

I don't want to know!  I so want to go to Bear Lake, I hear the lake has risen like in the old days. Lucky bum you! 

Yup..up to the tippy top...about 15 feet this year....it a beautiful cloudless day...absolutely beautiful  sipping on a few drinks the church wouldn't approve of only makes it better 😂

 

Ah sugar....ah ah honey honey....you are my candy girl...

 

Edited August 18, 2017 by Johnnie Cake

[stemelbow]

2 minutes ago, Johnnie Cake said:

Yup..up to the tippy top...about 15 feet this year....it a beautiful cloudless day...absolutely beautiful  sipping on a few drinks the church wouldn't approve of only makes it better 😂

 

I'm picturing a family affair.  That's gotta really make it sweet. 

[Johnnie Cake]

14 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

I'm reasonably certain that this benefit, the support for it by members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and the support for it by the institutional Church of Jesus Christ, is occurring in the world we both inhabit, Cakester.  I'll simply use you as "Exhibit A" to prove how the Church is "danged if it does, and danged if it don't" when it comes to the LGBTQIAQWERTYIOPXYZ Community.

Kenngo dude...that you follow scott in using your alphabet of letters to decribe a minority group exposes you.  Please try to be respectful of this minority group...you're better than this

 

Edited August 18, 2017 by Johnnie Cake

[Johnnie Cake]

1 minute ago, stemelbow said:

I'm picturing a family affair.  That's gotta really make it sweet. 

Haha...that's next week...I'm actually alone, wife is off with GFs for the wekend...so just enjoying the sun, water, weather & the day off...don't tell my clients ok

[stemelbow]

1 minute ago, Johnnie Cake said:

Haha...that's next week...I'm actually alone, wife is off with GFs for the wekend...so just enjoying the sun, water, weather & the day off...don't tell my clients ok

Well that explains why you're chiming in here.

[Johnnie Cake]

7 minutes ago, stemelbow said:

Well that explains why you're chiming in here.

Haha. Yeah guess so...had to create a hotspot off my phone...since iPad requires wifi. And literally out in the middle

Careful bro. I don't want to ruin your board reputation.. if board members know that we know each other IRL...that could work against you. 😇

Edited August 18, 2017 by Johnnie Cake

[stemelbow]

7 minutes ago, Johnnie Cake said:

Haha. Yeah guess so...had to create a hotspot off my phone...since iPad requires wifi. And literally out in the middle

Careful bro. I don't want to ruin your board reputation.. if board members know that we know each other IRL...that could work against you. 😇

nonsense.  The exact reason I hinted at it again was so people would consider me halfway credible again.  We'll see how well it redeems.

[Kenngo1969]

16 minutes ago, Johnnie Cake said:

Kenngo dude...that you follow scott in using your alphabet of letters to decribe a minority group exposes you.  Please try to be respectful of this minority group...you're better than this

 

Oh, noes!   I's been exposed!  

[Johnnie Cake]

5 minutes ago, stemelbow said:

nonsense.  The exact reason I hinted at it again was so people would consider me halfway credible again.  We'll see how well it redeems.

Haha. You've miscalculated....I'm hated here

[Johnnie Cake]

45 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

Oh, noes!   I's been exposed!  

I'm guessing you wouldn't use the N word to describe African Americans right?  So why miscaractorize this minority group?  I expect it from Scott...he is what he is...I just didn't expect it from you

 

so kenngo...didn't read your first post...but Glenn's statement in SLTrib is spot on...he and I have expressed the exact same sentiments. So glad to be on same page as Tyler Glenn...he's a rockstar...oh wait...he really is a rockstar 😜

Edited August 18, 2017 by Johnnie Cake

[stemelbow]

1 minute ago, Johnnie Cake said:

Haha. You've miscalculated....I'm hated here

Miscalculated?  Me?  story of my life.

[Kenngo1969]

And as if to verify my very first post on the thread:

http://www.sltrib.com/religion/local/2017/08/18/neon-trees-tyler-glenn-welcomes-mormon-backing-of-lgbtq-concert-but-says-pr-move-doesnt-atone-for-church-policies/

If one is determined to bite the hand that feeds him, he'd best not chomp down too hard.  

I take no pleasure in knowing that I'm a prophet.  

[rockpond]

14 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

And as if to verify my very first post on the thread:

http://www.sltrib.com/religion/local/2017/08/18/neon-trees-tyler-glenn-welcomes-mormon-backing-of-lgbtq-concert-but-says-pr-move-doesnt-atone-for-church-policies/

If one is determined to bite the hand that feeds him, he'd best not chomp down too hard.  

I take no pleasure in knowing that I'm a prophet.  

Why do you think he's biting the hand that feeds him?

[hope_for_things]

1 hour ago, stemelbow said:

I'd say it sincerely reflects the voice of most leaders in the Church.  There might be some who'd love to change something, word it differently, or who might even reject it outright.  But as I understand, a rule in being a GA is you have to accept the will of the majority.  That may be first discovered as a rule for the top 15, but I'd wager it also suggests that if the top 15 decide something all other GAs must abide, in spite fo their personal preferences. 

What exactly are you saying reflects the voice of most of the leaders, is it this week's statement about the Love Loud concert which uses very inclusive language, or is the policies of the church and other statements in the recent past which show prejudice towards the LGBT community?   

[Kenngo1969]

43 minutes ago, rockpond said:

Why do you think he's biting the hand that feeds him?

If you have to ask, I'm unlikely to be able to explain it in terms you can understand.  

[pogi]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

....I'm hated here

It's not a hate - hate though...it's more of a brotherly hate.  You are like the brother that always throws sand in your eyes when you are trying to enjoy the beach...that kind of hate.   You know, where you always want to slug him as hard as you can on the arm, but you would miss him if he wasn't around.  

[Scott Lloyd]

59 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

And as if to verify my very first post on the thread:

http://www.sltrib.com/religion/local/2017/08/18/neon-trees-tyler-glenn-welcomes-mormon-backing-of-lgbtq-concert-but-says-pr-move-doesnt-atone-for-church-policies/

If one is determined to bite the hand that feeds him, he'd best not chomp down too hard.  

I take no pleasure in knowing that I'm a prophet.  

Not to. detract in any way from your prophethood, Ken, but Glenn's vindictive reaction was painfully predictable. 

And I don't know where he gets the notion that the Church of Jesus Christ, in making the endorsement it did, was seeking to "atone" for anything. To atone means it had to have done something wrong. Not so. 

 One can only hope that Glenn doesn't say or do anything hateful toward the Church during the concert itself.