MARS COLONIZATION -- THEOLOGICAL PROBLEM?

[Robert F. Smith]

38 minutes ago, PeterPear said:

I agree with President Joseph Fielding Smith.

Man will make it to Mars if the stagehands do a better job than NASA did.

😏..............................................................................

Hey, Pete, here's another Hollywood hoax for you:

 

Naturally, everything is a hoax.  It just has to be.  Right?

 

[rodheadlee]

8 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

I don't see that the worlds he mentions need go beyond our solar system, but of course I could be wrong.  One day we will all learn the glorious truth.

 

8 hours ago, JAHS said:

As I mentioned earlier past prophets in our dispensation have said Jesus is the redeemer for all the worlds (earths) created by Him.  God said "And worlds without number have I created;" I do assume he is talking about all the worlds in our multibillion galaxy universe that He created.  Other Gods created other universes with their own saviors.
Of course we don't know any of this for sure, but to me anyway this makes the best sense.

I was thinking it went by Galaxy. Each Galaxy has it's own Heavenly Father.

[CV75]

17 hours ago, Ahab said:

Uh, yeah, well, there may not be a hurry, technically, but there is something kinda nice about being among those who are resurrected first and called up to meet our Lord as he returns rather than among those who have to wait until the 1000 years have come to an end.

And Astro-Boy could hopefully just go back to Alpha CentaurI sometime a little later, and faster.

You got a point there!

[thesometimesaint]

On 2/22/2017 at 10:11 AM, waveslider said:

It isn't so much atavistic as it is repeating cycles that have shown to be just like clock work, if you care to go back and study the natural patterns of the Sun and the effects it causes upon all the planets within our solar system. It is no more atavistic than the 11 year solar cycles that most people are at least aware of. John L. Casey, policy advisor to the White House and Congress, Senior Field Engineer on the Space Shuttle Program and consultant to NASA, and CEO of the International Earthquake and Volcano Prediction Center has already started the clock. You can read about it in his newest book: https://play.google.com/store/books/details?id=r2bWDQAAQBAJ&source=productsearch&utm_source=HA_Desktop_US&utm_medium=SEM&utm_campaign=PLA&pcampaignid=MKTAD0930BO1&gclid=CIDwxIympNICFfAYfgodzMMA2Q&gclsrc=ds

If you don't care to purchase the book you might just want to watch the interview about it for free: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTJCY6M-3fY

Or you can even look at all the revelations for the end times and see many of the very same things that sound science is also predicting here, although the revelations aren't giving such specific dates.

 

John L. Casey is a well known crank.

[Ahab]

17 hours ago, JAHS said:

As I mentioned earlier past prophets in our dispensation have said Jesus is the redeemer for all the worlds (earths) created by Him.  God said "And worlds without number have I created;" I do assume he is talking about all the worlds in our multibillion galaxy universe that He created.  Other Gods created other universes with their own saviors.
Of course we don't know any of this for sure, but to me anyway this makes the best sense.

It makes more sense to me that each of us have a galaxy than the entire universe to govern, with each of us working together to try to minimize galactic crashes.  Sometimes it might be fun, if the mingling isn't too catastrophic, but sometimes it would probably be very annoying to have your or another galaxy keep crashing into mine.

Of  course we'll probably start out with just one planet with maybe a moon or two, and then upggrade to having a solar system with maybe a nebula or two, gradually creating more and solar systems and stuff until we have a galaxy with more and more solar systems and stuff.

In my mind I can only imagine that there is only one universe, the one place where every other place is.

[JAHS]

43 minutes ago, Ahab said:

It makes more sense to me that each of us have a galaxy than the entire universe to govern, with each of us working together to try to minimize galactic crashes.  Sometimes it might be fun, if the mingling isn't too catastrophic, but sometimes it would probably be very annoying to have your or another galaxy keep crashing into mine.

Of  course we'll probably start out with just one planet with maybe a moon or two, and then upggrade to having a solar system with maybe a nebula or two, gradually creating more and solar systems and stuff until we have a galaxy with more and more solar systems and stuff.

In my mind I can only imagine that there is only one universe, the one place where every other place is.

I say universe because I have read so many things church leaders have said regarding the creation of the universe by God:

So God, enthroned upon the pinnacle of his omniscience and omnipotence has the universe, with all his creations, in his presence, and this is his omnipresence; but that does not put him in his creations, does not make them a part of himself. With the instruments of God's influence, power, and authority, with the instrumentalities by and through which he performs his works, and governs and controls the multiplicity of his creations, we are not now concerned. BEHOLD THE LAMB OF GOD   by J. Reuben Clark

He is our Heavenly Father; he is also our God, and the Maker and upholder of all things in heaven and on earth. He sends forth his counsels and extends his providences to all living. He is the Supreme Controller of the universe.  Brigham Young  Jan. 8, 1865, JD11:41

Elder Joseph Fielding Smith
The presiding authority in the Universe is, God the Father, his Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost. . . . (Man, His Origin and Destiny, pp. 50-53) TLDP:243

Everywhere in nature is the evidence of cause and effect; on every side is the demonstration of means adapted to end. But such adaptations, says a thoughtful writer, "indicate contrivance for a given purpose, and contrivance is the evidence of intelligence, and intelligence is the attribute of mind, and the intelligent mind that built the stupendous universe is God."
ARTICLES OF FAITH  by James E. Talmage

Let us, to begin with, understand the concept that God Almighty created and upholds all things. When we say all things, we speak of the universe. There is nothing exempt.  Let us get a concept instilled in our minds that God is omnipotent; that he is above all things; that the very universe itself is his creation and is subject to him; that he upholds, preserves, and governs it.  WRITINGS OF BRUCE R. MCCONKIE  by Bruce R. McConkie

Some might argue that when some people say universe they mean our galaxy, but I have seen many writings where when they say universe they definitely mean universe.
These other universes must somehow exist outside our own universe in a different time and place.  

[Ahab]

33 minutes ago, JAHS said:

I say universe because I have read so many things church leaders have said regarding the creation of the universe by God:

So God, enthroned upon the pinnacle of his omniscience and omnipotence has the universe, with all his creations, in his presence, and this is his omnipresence; but that does not put him in his creations, does not make them a part of himself. With the instruments of God's influence, power, and authority, with the instrumentalities by and through which he performs his works, and governs and controls the multiplicity of his creations, we are not now concerned. BEHOLD THE LAMB OF GOD   by J. Reuben Clark

He is our Heavenly Father; he is also our God, and the Maker and upholder of all things in heaven and on earth. He sends forth his counsels and extends his providences to all living. He is the Supreme Controller of the universe.  Brigham Young  Jan. 8, 1865, JD11:41

Elder Joseph Fielding Smith
The presiding authority in the Universe is, God the Father, his Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost. . . . (Man, His Origin and Destiny, pp. 50-53) TLDP:243

Everywhere in nature is the evidence of cause and effect; on every side is the demonstration of means adapted to end. But such adaptations, says a thoughtful writer, "indicate contrivance for a given purpose, and contrivance is the evidence of intelligence, and intelligence is the attribute of mind, and the intelligent mind that built the stupendous universe is God."
ARTICLES OF FAITH  by James E. Talmage

Let us, to begin with, understand the concept that God Almighty created and upholds all things. When we say all things, we speak of the universe. There is nothing exempt.  Let us get a concept instilled in our minds that God is omnipotent; that he is above all things; that the very universe itself is his creation and is subject to him; that he upholds, preserves, and governs it.  WRITINGS OF BRUCE R. MCCONKIE  by Bruce R. McConkie

Some might argue that when some people say universe they mean our galaxy, but I have seen many writings where when they say universe they definitely mean universe.
These other universes must somehow exist outside our own universe in a different time and place.  

I know God or the kind of being we refer to as God rules everywhere with no exemptions, and each person who is God and fully glorified works together everywhere every one of them is.  I'm just thinking that each person reigns and governs in a specific galaxy, specifically, and the entire universe, generally, rather than every single one of them reigning over the entire universe or in the same solar system specifically.  

Like how I expect to cover a specific region with my own creations while you and others have your own other specific areas to cover, with all of us working together sometimes in the same area but usually we stay in our own areas.

Kinda hard to explain, and not very important that you agree with me now.

Edited February 24, 2017 by Ahab

[The Nehor]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

It makes more sense to me that each of us have a galaxy than the entire universe to govern, with each of us working together to try to minimize galactic crashes.  Sometimes it might be fun, if the mingling isn't too catastrophic, but sometimes it would probably be very annoying to have your or another galaxy keep crashing into mine.

If you are right (which I doubt) I just found a way to be annoying for all eternity. Amusing myself playing galactic bumper cars.

[notHagoth7]

On 2/20/2017 at 10:08 PM, Robert F. Smith said:

Humans have already been to the Moon, and NASA plans a manned mission to Mars for the 2030s.  Now the United Arab Emirates have proposed placing a permanent colony on Mars by 2117, and Elon Musk seems to be on the same wavelength.  Does this pose any problem for LDS theology, or for any other religious belief system?...

Nope. We just gotta insist that if we also colonize the moon, they gotta dress like Quakers...at least on Moon Pioneer Day.

Interesting that Quakers abhor war...and according to the never-to-be-questioned Gospel of Star Trek, reaching beyond earth helps mankind to become more peaceful and benevolent....

So if we allow for a moment that the early attempted slights at Joseph's reputation regarding the moon had any inkling of truth, perhaps Joseph instead saw a glimpse of the future. A peaceful future.

Edited February 24, 2017 by notHagoth7

[notHagoth7]

On 2/20/2017 at 10:08 PM, Robert F. Smith said:

Humans have already been to the Moon, and NASA plans a manned mission to Mars..does this pose any problem for LDS theology, or for any other religious belief system?...

On second thought, yes. The temple recommend question on honesty might need to be tweaked a wee bit to allow for space piracy...

...and occasional smuggling...especially if jello casserole is outlawed.

http://www.businessinsider.com/space-pirate-law-international-waters-2015-10

Edited February 24, 2017 by notHagoth7

[Robert F. Smith]

9 minutes ago, notHagoth7 said:

 

I loved "Firefly."

[notHagoth7]

2 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

I loved "Firefly."

You've warmed my raisin-sized heart. :0)

 

[Ahab]

12 hours ago, The Nehor said:

If you are right (which I doubt) I just found a way to be annoying for all eternity. Amusing myself playing galactic bumper cars.

It will always be true that you will always be able to find a new way to be annoying.

And I will always be able to live with that.

[thesometimesaint]

16 hours ago, Ahab said:

It makes more sense to me that each of us have a galaxy than the entire universe to govern, with each of us working together to try to minimize galactic crashes.  Sometimes it might be fun, if the mingling isn't too catastrophic, but sometimes it would probably be very annoying to have your or another galaxy keep crashing into mine.

Of  course we'll probably start out with just one planet with maybe a moon or two, and then upggrade to having a solar system with maybe a nebula or two, gradually creating more and solar systems and stuff until we have a galaxy with more and more solar systems and stuff.

In my mind I can only imagine that there is only one universe, the one place where every other place is.

Galaxies crash into each other all the time  Right now our galaxy is headed for the Andromeda galaxy. It will be a fantastic star show in about another 4 billion earth years.

SEE

 

[Ahab]

12 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said:

Galaxies crash into each other all the time  Right now our galaxy is headed for the Andromeda galaxy. It will be a fantastic star show in about another 4 billion earth years.

SEE

 

There you go, The Nehor.  Someone who can teach you how to do it.

[waveslider]

23 hours ago, thesometimesaint said:

John L. Casey is a well known crank.

I'm not sure what you mean by crank, but so far the rate of his predictions coming true is over 80%, While the Global warming predictions have all failed for nearly 20 years with 0% correct predictions in all that time.

[thesometimesaint]

33 minutes ago, waveslider said:

I'm not sure what you mean by crank, but so far the rate of his predictions coming true is over 80%, While the Global warming predictions have all failed for nearly 20 years with 0% correct predictions in all that time.

John L. Casey has no peer reviewed papers on climatology published in any scientific journal.

SEE http://environmentalforest.blogspot.com/2015/01/john-l-casey-and-climate-denial.html

Global Warming is happening faster than predicted.

SEE http://www.voanews.com/a/who-global-warming-happening-faster-than-predicted/3429127.html

SEE http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-24345/climate-change-is-happening-faster-than-we-thought-according-to-scientists.html

Edited February 24, 2017 by thesometimesaint

[PeterPear]

On 2/22/2017 at 11:34 PM, Robert F. Smith said:

Hey, Pete, here's another Hollywood hoax for you:

 

Naturally, everything is a hoax.  It just has to be.  Right?

 

Why don't you ask Scott Grissom, son of Astronaut "Gus" Grissom who publicly stated in 1999 his family's (including his Mother's) belief that his Father was deliberately killed in the Apollo 1 "accident" when the three astronauts were placed in the capsule with compressed pure oxygen caught hot enough to burn aluminum metal effectively incinerating the men leaving only their powdered bones, similar to a cremation. Then NASA claimed it was an accident stating they didn't know jow this could have occurred. Gus Grissom was born in 1926, a Korean War Vet and would have been 90 years old.

His son, Scott Grissom is an airline pilot and in his late 50's or early 60s.

The "accident" occured after "Gus" Grissom held an unapproved news conference with reporters where he hung a large lemon - taken from a tree in the backyard of his Florida home - in front of a NASA emblem claiming NASA was cleary a decade out before being able to accomplish a lunar landing.

But you believe Man landed on the moon because you saw it on a black and white TV, as did I, in 1969. But Man hasn't returned since despite talk back then about future Moon Colonies.

And now you disagree with President Joseph Fielding Smith and are positing Man can land on and inhabit Mars and speculating whether or not Missionaries should be sent so Mars-Earthlings can be baptized by immersion on the surface of Mars [ ha ha ha! ] and asking ridiculous questions about whether or not the Gospel or the Atonement would cover Children born to Mars-Earthlings - and now you're accusing me of not be grounded in reality.

Since NASA dumped all its Apollo images and transcripts onto the internet around 2009 or so, why don't you verify what you believed happen in 1969-1972.

I only brought this up to point out your premise is incorrect, and your speculation belongs to a sci-fi novel written by Isaac Asimov.

Go to minute 8 in this video if 10 mins are too long for you. Assuming you're a Mormon interested in Truth.

 

Edited February 24, 2017 by PeterPear
science changed to sci-fi & added link to video

[rodheadlee]

8 hours ago, PeterPear said:

Why don't you ask Scott Grissom, son of Astronaut "Gus" Grissom who publicly stated in 1999 his family's (including his Mother's) belief that his Father was deliberately killed in the Apollo 1 "accident" when the three astronauts were placed in the capsule with compressed pure oxygen caught hot enough to burn aluminum metal effectively incinerating the men leaving only their powdered bones, similar to a cremation. Then NASA claimed it was an accident stating they didn't know jow this could have occurred. Gus Grissom was born in 1926, a Korean War Vet and would have been 90 years old.

His son, Scott Grissom is an airline pilot and in his late 50's or early 60s.

The "accident" occured after "Gus" Grissom held an unapproved news conference with reporters where he hung a large lemon - taken from a tree in the backyard of his Florida home - in front of a NASA emblem claiming NASA was cleary a decade out before being able to accomplish a lunar landing.

But you believe Man landed on the moon because you saw it on a black and white TV, as did I, in 1969. But Man hasn't returned since despite talk back then about future Moon Colonies.

And now you disagree with President Joseph Fielding Smith and are positing Man can land on and inhabit Mars and speculating whether or not Missionaries should be sent so Mars-Earthlings can be baptized by immersion on the surface of Mars [ ha ha ha! ] and asking ridiculous questions about whether or not the Gospel or the Atonement would cover Children born to Mars-Earthlings - and now you're accusing me of not be grounded in reality.

Since NASA dumped all its Apollo images and transcripts onto the internet around 2009 or so, why don't you verify what you believed happen in 1969-1972.

I only brought this up to point out your premise is incorrect, and your speculation belongs to a sci-fi novel written by Isaac Asimov.

Go to minute 8 in this video if 10 mins are too long for you. Assuming you're a Mormon interested in Truth.

 

You're not serious.I guess this is all fake too.

 

http://www.skyandtelescope.com/observing/celestial-objects-to-watch/moon/how-to-see-all-six-apollo-moon-landing-sites/

 

 

[Robert F. Smith]

9 hours ago, PeterPear said:

Why don't you ask Scott Grissom, son of Astronaut "Gus" Grissom who publicly stated in 1999 his family's (including his Mother's) belief that his Father was deliberately killed in the Apollo 1 "accident" when the three astronauts were placed in the capsule with compressed pure oxygen caught hot enough to burn aluminum metal effectively incinerating the men leaving only their powdered bones, .................................................

"Gus" Grissom held an unapproved news conference with reporters where he hung a large lemon - taken from a tree in the backyard of his Florida home - in front of a NASA emblem claiming NASA was cleary a decade out before being able to accomplish a lunar landing.

But you believe Man landed on the moon because you saw it on a black and white TV, as did I, in 1969. But Man hasn't returned since despite talk back then about future Moon Colonies.

And now you disagree with President Joseph Fielding Smith and are positing Man can land on and inhabit Mars and speculating whether or not Missionaries should be sent so Mars-Earthlings can be baptized by immersion on the surface of Mars [ ha ha ha! ] and asking ridiculous questions about whether or not the Gospel or the Atonement would cover Children born to Mars-Earthlings - and now you're accusing me of not be grounded in reality.

Since NASA dumped all its Apollo images and transcripts onto the internet around 2009 or so, why don't you verify what you believed happen in 1969-1972.

I only brought this up to point out your premise is incorrect, and your speculation belongs to a sci-fi novel written by Isaac Asimov.

Go to minute 8 in this video if 10 mins are too long for you. Assuming you're a Mormon interested in Truth.......................................................

I said:   "Naturally, everything is a hoax.  It just has to be.  Right?"

What part of that is the "premise"?

 

 

[notHagoth7]

4 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

I said:   "Naturally, everything is a hoax.  It just has to be.  Right?"

What part of that is the "premise"?

 

 

The Saturn 5 rocket was instead full of jello salad. Evrrybody knows It. It is a maxim. A new "Article of Disbelief."

[PeterPear]

10 hours ago, rodheadlee said:

You're not serious.I guess this is all fake too.

 

http://www.skyandtelescope.com/observing/celestial-objects-to-watch/moon/how-to-see-all-six-apollo-moon-landing-sites/

 

 

NASA confirms NASA. Got it.

[PeterPear]

8 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

I said:   "Naturally, everything is a hoax.  It just has to be.  Right?"

What part of that is the "premise"?

 

 

The premise you stated in your very first post and as the OP of this thread; your first sentence:

"Humans have already been to the Moon, and NASA plans a manned mission to Mars for the 2030s."

[PeterPear]

3 hours ago, notHagoth7 said:

The Saturn 5 rocket was instead full of jello salad. Evrrybody knows It. It is a maxim. A new "Article of Disbelief."

I'm not disputing the existence of the Saturn V rocket, or astronauts orbited the Earth, or that Neil Tyson can do the Chicken Dance. It's the moon landings being disputed, which was the premise of the OP that man has been on the moon and plans on going to and colonizing Mars in 2030, then the Church will rocket missionaries to the Martian surface. LOL!

Edited February 25, 2017 by PeterPear
Typo

[PeterPear]

I provided 3 videos of actual NASA footage and the rest of you provided a Neil Tyson video & some Capricorn movie clips. Yeah,  I'm really convinced we'll be going to Mars and missionary work will be needed there.

Hey Robert Smith. What's next? A journey to the Center of the Earth? 😄