Keep trying

[JAHS]

I really appreciate Yoda's attitude, but I think Elder Holland's advice is a little more realistic. 

Nelson Mandela once said “I’m no saint—that is, unless you think a saint is a sinner who keeps on trying".
Elder Dale G. quoting President Thomas S. Monson said “One of God’s greatest gifts to us is the joy of trying again, for no failure ever need be final.” Even if we’ve been a conscious, deliberate sinner or have repeatedly faced failure and disappointment, the moment we decide to try again, the Atonement of Christ can help us. And we need to remember that it is not the Holy Ghost that tells us we’re so far gone that we might as well give up." (Ensign April 2015)

The key, like Elder Holland said in his recent talk, is to keep trying. I take comfort in his counsel: 
"With the gift of the Atonement of Jesus Christ and the strength of heaven to help us, we can improve, and the great thing about the gospel is we get credit for trying, even if we don’t always succeed.
Please remember tomorrow, and all the days after that, that the Lord blesses those who want to improve, who accept the need for commandments and try to keep them, who cherish Christlike virtues and strive to the best of their ability to acquire them. If you stumble in that pursuit, so does everyone; the Savior is there to help you keep going. If you fall, summon His strength. Call out like Alma, “O Jesus, … have mercy on me.” He will help you get back up. He will help you repent, repair, fix whatever you have to fix, and keep going. Soon enough you will have the success you seek." (April 2016)

Even though we may repeat sins, the only time we really fail is when we give up trying to overcome the sin. 

 

[Ahab]

Yoda just needs to be understood in the proper context, realizing he doesn't always expound on his ideas.

When you don't give up you do what?

Try again? Well that's one way to say it.

But do you try again or only try to try again?

If you don't actually do something to try again then you're not actually doing anything, because to try without actually doing something is to not do anything. 

Or to say it another way, without doing something there is no trying.

You either do something or you don't. 

Do you say you'll try to do something? 

Just show me what you are doing, because if you don't actually do something I will think you're either not trying or not trying hard enough to actually do something about it.

If you were to say that you're going to try to stop sinning, for example, I would expect you to actually stop sinning for at least a little while, whether or not you messed up and sinned again sometime later.

So do, and if necessary do it again.

 

 

[Buckeye]

Both sets of advice are correct in certain contexts. Generally speaking, we should keep trying, and we should do. But there are times to stop trying (e.g., after hours of CPR and the person is not reviving) and there are times to put up shut up.

[Duncan]

38 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Yoda just needs to be understood in the proper context, realizing he doesn't always expound on his ideas.

When you don't give up you do what?

Try again? Well that's one way to say it.

But do you try again or only try to try again?

If you don't actually do something to try again then you're not actually doing anything, because to try without actually doing something is to not do anything. 

Or to say it another way, without doing something there is no trying.

You either do something or you don't. 

Do you say you'll try to do something? 

Just show me what you are doing, because if you don't actually do something I will think you're either not trying or not trying hard enough to actually do something about it.

If you were to say that you're going to try to stop sinning, for example, I would expect you to actually stop sinning for at least a little while, whether or not you messed up and sinned again sometime later.

So do, and if necessary do it again.

 

 

I think you should have worked for Abbott and Costello in a past life

[consiglieri]

4 hours ago, JAHS said:

Even though we may repeat sins, the only time we really fail is when we give up trying to overcome the sin. 

I would suggest that the only time we really succeed is when we give up trying to overcome the sin . . . and rely on the merits of him who is mighty to save.

 

 

EDITED TO ADD: I AM OUT OF REPLIES FOR NOW, BUT I WOULD SAY IN REPLY TO JAHS BELOW THAT HUMAN EXPERIENCE BUTTRESSED BY SCRIPTURE INDICATES STRONGLY THAT HUMAN BEINGS ARE UNABLE TO GIVE UP ALL SIN.

IF WE WERE, WE WOULD PROBABLY NOT NEED A SAVIOR.

 

Edited April 11, 2016 by consiglieri

[JAHS]

4 minutes ago, consiglieri said:

I would suggest that the only time we really succeed is when we give up trying to overcome the sin . . . and rely on the merits of him who is mighty to save.

 

 

He is the one who eventually saves us, but repentance has to come in there somewhere and that means giving up the sin. 

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, Buckeye said:

Both sets of advice are correct in certain contexts. Generally speaking, we should keep trying, and we should do. But there are times to stop trying (e.g., after hours of CPR and the person is not reviving) and there are times to put up shut up.

If a person is only trying to give CPR I would suggest they either do it or simply not do it. A person may try to give CPR while not actually doing it and that's really not going to help anybody.

If you meant the proper moves that may or may not actually achieve CPR, then yes just either do it or don't do it.  And if you do it for an hour or so and still there is no CPR then it would be best to simply stop doing it.

I suppose I am trying to say that I agree with you.

[JAHS]

1 hour ago, consiglieri said:

I would suggest that the only time we really succeed is when we give up trying to overcome the sin . . . and rely on the merits of him who is mighty to save.

 

 

EDITED TO ADD: I AM OUT OF REPLIES FOR NOW, BUT I WOULD SAY IN REPLY TO JAHS BELOW THAT HUMAN EXPERIENCE BUTTRESSED BY SCRIPTURE INDICATES STRONGLY THAT HUMAN BEINGS ARE UNABLE TO GIVE UP ALL SIN.

IF WE WERE, WE WOULD PROBABLY NOT NEED A SAVIOR.

 

Oh we would still need a savior. Someone still has to suffer and pay for the sin, repented for or not. 

[The Nehor]

4 hours ago, Ahab said:

Yoda just needs to be understood in the proper context, realizing he doesn't always expound on his ideas.

When you don't give up you do what?

Try again? Well that's one way to say it.

But do you try again or only try to try again?

If you don't actually do something to try again then you're not actually doing anything, because to try without actually doing something is to not do anything. 

Or to say it another way, without doing something there is no trying.

You either do something or you don't. 

Do you say you'll try to do something? 

Just show me what you are doing, because if you don't actually do something I will think you're either not trying or not trying hard enough to actually do something about it.

If you were to say that you're going to try to stop sinning, for example, I would expect you to actually stop sinning for at least a little while, whether or not you messed up and sinned again sometime later.

So do, and if necessary do it again.

 

 

You are trying to perform exegesis on the words of Yoda?

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

You are trying to perform exegesis on the words of Yoda?

There was no try.  I did.

[The Nehor]

3 hours ago, Ahab said:

There was no try.  I did.

I think you would have been better off going with the "do not" option.

[strappinglad]

My wife will tell you that she often finds me trying.

[mtomm]

15 hours ago, strappinglad said:

My wife will tell you that she often finds me trying.

Hehe. Nice.

[JAHS]

On 4/11/2016 at 0:48 PM, Ahab said:

So do, and if necessary do it again

Yes. This is the best attitude. It combines the positive mental attitude of Yoda, but with the counsel of Elder Holland to never give up if the first time you do it fails. We could go even one step further and follow President Kimballs's counsel:
"Do it! Do it now! Do it With a plan!"  
(Spencer W. Kimball, Teachings of Presidents of the Church: Spencer W. Kimball (2006)